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Hi.
I am a normal pianist, my kind of music is absolutely modern, but having studied piano in youth, of course I do not dislike classic music.

For a time i want enter in the classic music colosseum and being face to face with the lions, you all, very expert of music for ask to the lions how much far I am by a good performance.
I know that every great pianist play the classic as he wants, with his own performance, and not having recording of the "Monster Compositor" every music can be interpreted differently.

But a bad interpretation is recognized fast.... this is mine



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It is played correctly. Well, from a tempo perspective, there are many pro pianists who are playing it that slow. So you are within the range.

I personally think it is way too slow. The piece is marked andantino and not largo. And i think it works better that way.

Now, if you want to play it that slowly, you need to make more variation in touch. The beat 2 and 3 are too marked and accented when they should be less accented. And you put too much rubato between beat 3 and the beat 1 of next bar, so it slows down even more the piece and breaks the flow. You can certainly slightly extend that half note on beat 1 but very slightly. It must sound natural.

There is no arppegiation at 41s. I dont think it adds anything to the simplicity of the piece to do that.

But all in all, you just need to work out some accentuation issues and you could get a very nice version.


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A good version by Cortot:



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Originally Posted by Sidokar
It is played correctly. Well, from a tempo perspective, there are many pro pianists who are playing it that slow. So you are within the range.

I personally think it is way too slow. The piece is marked andantino and not largo. And i think it works better that way.

Now, if you want to play it that slowly, you need to make more variation in touch. The beat 2 and 3 are too marked and accented when they should be less accented. And you put too much rubato between beat 3 and the beat 1 of next bar, so it slows down even more the piece and breaks the flow. You can certainly slightly extend that half note on beat 1 but very slightly. It must sound natural.

There is no arppegiation at 41s. I dont think it adds anything to the simplicity of the piece to do that.

But all in all, you just need to work out some accentuation issues and you could get a very nice version.
Thanks for you deep review!
I know that there is not apregiation in the sheet but i heard it in some video by a professional pianist and i like it. And as you said some one play it slow and i like.
Of course, the fact that I like doesn't means that it is correct anyway, but the advantage to be a hobbyst pianist is the freedom of execution.

Naturally, your puntualization about my error is absolutely correct, and i thank you again


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Originally Posted by Sidokar
A good version by Cortot:


Thanks for your feedback, decisely i don't like this speed.
Of course with some hour more of training i can reach that speed but then i play a music that i don't like!


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Originally Posted by Giko Gomez
Thanks for your feedback, decisely i don't like this speed.
Of course with some hour more of training i can reach that speed but then i play a music that i don't like!

Sure, well you are the player so you choose how you want to play it. Musically though it is more difficult to play slowly. Playing a little faster, is maybe more difficult initially but it allows to smooth out the tempo; when playing slowly one can hear every little default in the accentuation. But of course that is not a reason to play it one way or another. Just a side remark.


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Tempo is, to a degree, a personal, artistic choice, and for me the OP's rendition is too slow, and I find the Cortot version too fast - I repeat: for my taste.

What I find lacking because of the tempo of the OP's version is movement towards the beat. The fact that the first beat of those measures that begin with half-notes are slightly delayed contributes to this lack of momentum. Even in a slow tempo, there should be a sense of direction, of forward movement. Delaying the first beat of the measure that ends the phrase seems to defeat this.

Added to this (or perhaps it's just another way of saying the same thing) there seems to be a lack of a sense of where each phrase is going.

I think that there is potential here for a good performance and while that observation may be considered "good" only by my standard, I think that there is room here for an interpretation that might have broader appeal. In this performance there is a magical mood created in the final two measures; if that could be achieved and maintained throughout, I would really like such a performance, albeit at a shade faster tempo, but surely not as fast as Cortot's. I do not like the arpeggiated chord referred to; it jars, and seems out of character with the piece.

What I look for in this Prelude, and which Cortot does not achieve either, is a combination of gentle, refined elegance with a touch of nostalgia. That's a lot to ask from such a short work but therein lies the genius of Chopin and the artistry of those who can really bring it off.

Just one man's opinion, of course.

Thank you for sharing; it gives food for thought.

Regards,


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Originally Posted by Sidokar
Originally Posted by Giko Gomez
Thanks for your feedback, decisely i don't like this speed.
Of course with some hour more of training i can reach that speed but then i play a music that i don't like!

Sure, well you are the player so you choose how you want to play it. Musically though it is more difficult to play slowly. Playing a little faster, is maybe more difficult initially but it allows to smooth out the tempo; when playing slowly one can hear every little default in the accentuation. But of course that is not a reason to play it one way or another. Just a side remark.


Yes i agree, for ex the first movement of the moonlight sonate LVB is slow, not for this easy, even a little error, or a note too loud or too soft, can be heard


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Originally Posted by BruceD
Tempo is, to a degree, a personal, artistic choice, and for me the OP's rendition is too slow, and I find the Cortot version too fast - I repeat: for my taste.

What I find lacking because of the tempo of the OP's version is movement towards the beat. The fact that the first beat of those measures that begin with half-notes are slightly delayed contributes to this lack of momentum. Even in a slow tempo, there should be a sense of direction, of forward movement. Delaying the first beat of the measure that ends the phrase seems to defeat this.

Added to this (or perhaps it's just another way of saying the same thing) there seems to be a lack of a sense of where each phrase is going.

I think that there is potential here for a good performance and while that observation may be considered "good" only by my standard, I think that there is room here for an interpretation that might have broader appeal. In this performance there is a magical mood created in the final two measures; if that could be achieved and maintained throughout, I would really like such a performance, albeit at a shade faster tempo, but surely not as fast as Cortot's. I do not like the arpeggiated chord referred to; it jars, and seems out of character with the piece.

What I look for in this Prelude, and which Cortot does not achieve either, is a combination of gentle, refined elegance with a touch of nostalgia. That's a lot to ask from such a short work but therein lies the genius of Chopin and the artistry of those who can really bring it off.

Just one man's opinion, of course.

Thank you for sharing; it gives food for thought.

Regards,
Thanks really much. Chopin is one of the most difficult to interpretate. I know, as no professional pianist, to be far by perfection and your review helps.
I will study it again (the regording is time ago and now i forget the piece) and I will apply what you said. Also a middle way speed between my performance and the too fast piece by Cortot.

I will find also the slow performance on youtube that i liked so much and i was inspirated to it. If i find out it again i will post here. This performance has also the rallentando in the first measure after the 2 chords


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The issue with these old recordings is that the lack of harmonics impacts how one perceive the mood of the piece. Still i like the Cortot for its phrasing.

Another version, modern this time, at about the same tempo but in a different style.



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I think in this piece whenever you see the three repeated chords (from the 2nd beat of the current bar to the 1st beat of the next bar), it is effective to play each repeated chord softer than the previous one, creating an effect of gradually "fading in the distance". (The only exception would be on bar 11 where you actually have a crescendo.)
Of course you should do it to various extents each time, otherwise it would sound formulaic. And note that this does NOT come with a slowing down each time.
You can hear the above in both the Cortot and the Cho versions.
What you are doing right now is the opposite (no fading effect, and you are slowing down instead).


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Originally Posted by Rubens
I think in this piece whenever you see the three repeated chords (from the 2nd beat of the current bar to the 1st beat of the next bar), it is effective to play each repeated chord softer than the previous one, creating an effect of gradually "fading in the distance". (The only exception would be on bar 11 where you actually have a crescendo.)
Of course you should do it to various extents each time, otherwise it would sound formulaic. And note that this does NOT come with a slowing down each time.
You can hear the above in both the Cortot and the Cho versions.
What you are doing right now is the opposite (no fading effect, and you are slowing down instead).


I agree with your suggestion of the playing of the three successive chords. While I agree that there is no decrescendo from the first to the third chord in the OP's recording, I do hear that the third chord is softer than the two previous ones, but there is no gradation from the first to the third; the first and second seem to be of equal volume.

Regards,


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Originally Posted by Giko Gomez
I will find also the slow performance on youtube that i liked so much and i was inspirated to it. If i find out it again i will post here. This performance has also the rallentando in the first measure after the 2 chords

I don't know whether this is the one, but she's a pro who plays at a rather slow tempo and arpeggiates that chord:



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I can't say that I like the Valentina Igoshina performance. There is so much rubato that some of the measure have four full beats. It may be "artistic licence," but it just bogs down. Those three chords we have talked about are not at the same tempo as the measures that don't have those three chords. And for me the arpeggiated chord is just not acceptable, spoiling the whole character of that phrase.

Oh well, we can't all have the same taste or music would become too boring.

Regards,


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I know what you mean Bruce, but her explanation is very engaging. In almost all cases I find performances of this piece too slow and with insufficient tonal expression. Valentina was too slow for me, but she certainly plays with expression and care as to her touch.


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Originally Posted by Rubens
I think in this piece whenever you see the three repeated chords (from the 2nd beat of the current bar to the 1st beat of the next bar), it is effective to play each repeated chord softer than the previous one, creating an effect of gradually "fading in the distance". (The only exception would be on bar 11 where you actually have a crescendo.)
Of course you should do it to various extents each time, otherwise it would sound formulaic. And note that this does NOT come with a slowing down each time.
You can hear the above in both the Cortot and the Cho versions.
What you are doing right now is the opposite (no fading effect, and you are slowing down instead).
i get the issue, I'm studying this piece again, then i know the sheet at memory i will focus on the execution


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Originally Posted by JaneF
Originally Posted by Giko Gomez
I will find also the slow performance on youtube that i liked so much and i was inspirated to it. If i find out it again i will post here. This performance has also the rallentando in the first measure after the 2 chords

I don't know whether this is the one, but she's a pro who plays at a rather slow tempo and arpeggiates that chord:


Is not her, she arpeggiates very bad (in my opinion) the chord because the last note is too separate.
Anyway, already 2 that arpeggiate.... the mine (that i dont found yet) and her! She also separate the last chord as me, even if with more speed


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Originally Posted by BruceD
I can't say that I like the Valentina Igoshina performance. There is so much rubato that some of the measure have four full beats. It may be "artistic licence," but it just bogs down. Those three chords we have talked about are not at the same tempo as the measures that don't have those three chords. And for me the arpeggiated chord is just not acceptable, spoiling the whole character of that phrase.

Oh well, we can't all have the same taste or music would become too boring.

Regards,


I agree with you (as i wrote in other reply) about the arpeggio. As she play, the last note seems not part of the chord


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What i remember is that the slow and arpeggiating player was a man, seemed a serious player because he had a complete orchestra around him and much public


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This one fits the description


Soli Chopin gloria
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