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Joined: Mar 2012
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In the Owner`s Manual for the Kawai ES 110 model the List of Temperaments has an explanation telling where they fit into musical history and why they sound different to Equal Temperament . Why some sound better in one key and worse in another . These temperaments are the ancestors that came before Equal temperament . The explanation list in the manual forms a precious document to link us to our common musical history . These old temperaments are like beautiful jigsaws where the pieces don`t really fit the Equal Temperament Jigsaw . But we cannot jumble up all the pieces in the same box and it would be a shame to throw out all the old jigsaws . Vladimir Nabokov said "Where there is Beauty there is Pity. The beauty must die ." He was a collector of butterflies . They had died but remained beautiful in his collection .

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I forgot to mention the resonance of the Kawai ES 110. The simulated string resonances with sustain pedal depressed are very realistic especially in the top octave .

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Originally Posted by Jt2nd
I forgot to mention the resonance of the Kawai ES 110. The simulated string resonances with sustain pedal depressed are very realistic especially in the top octave .

What string resonance of the ES110? https://www.kawai-global.com/product_comparison/detail.php?n=es120,es110&ct=36

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Well, they call it "Damper Resonance" and Jt2nd wrote "string resonances with sustain pedal depressed".

Just a difference in terminology.

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I was surprised how well they sounded. seems to me the resonances all sound the same, whatever piano voice one selects, as it did for my P515, and indeed, Pianoteq.
Might be wrong about that last one, but y'know guys, sometimes i can get too fussy . . . usuallly when I have nothing better to do.


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I mentioned resonance and in the next sentence called it simulated string resonance . We all know the digitals have no actual strings. But I am taking the word of the piano demonstrator . He liked it better than the Roland which seemed to just add the same hissing sound . These pianos (not real ones ) are steadily improving .The notes sound better too with recordings .
The resonance sounds normal and pleasant if you play a real piano but on a digital we don`t need them for tuning octaves etc . One less headache .

Last edited by Jt2nd; 06/17/22 11:56 AM.
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If you look at shop adverts and technical descriptions for the Kawai ES 110 there is no mention about temperaments on this piano. You can discover music from hundreds of years ago in the original tunings . But modern sales people are only interested in Gigs . How pathetic . Billions of pounds and dollars are spent on space telescopes to find out how the universe was created millions of years ago . But in the music world anything before 1917 can be binned . The space telescopes may find "habitable planets". The closest star to Earth with a planet which might be habitable would take a one way trip of 81,000 years . But music history can all be smudged over with Equal Temperament ,as if anyone cares .

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I think it better to judge damper resonance realism on your own rather then trust a certain review comparing two DPs that failed to mention one diesnt have string resonance and one does.

Interesting to note the es120 does along with a bunch of other design parameters



Es120 versus es110


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Originally Posted by Jt2nd
If you look at shop adverts and technical descriptions for the Kawai ES 110 there is no mention about temperaments on this piano. You can discover music from hundreds of years ago in the original tunings . But modern sales people are only interested in Gigs . How pathetic . Billions of pounds and dollars are spent on space telescopes to find out how the universe was created millions of years ago . But in the music world anything before 1917 can be binned . The space telescopes may find "habitable planets". The closest star to Earth with a planet which might be habitable would take a one way trip of 81,000 years . But music history can all be smudged over with Equal Temperament ,as if anyone cares .

Well now; the ES110 possesses seven temperaments! Listed they are, on the handy single sheet Operations Guide. So you can reproduce Gothic and Tudor historics, Gregorian chants and goodness knows what else.
But woe betide you if you play them in the wrong key . . . .


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peterws Very good point about different keys . The composers must have realised what the key limits were when they composed . Writing music down on paper with a key signature is a clear indication that this should sound good if you stick to that key. A large written hint for future reference that this is not for improvisation in other keys . I have no problem with that . The composer`s date of death ( getting morbid now ) will tell you the likeliest temperaments to work best . Anyone delving into the history of music from ancient China to today should realise that the baked in difficulties are part of nature and cannot be swept away with a set of log tables . Nature is extremely complicated .You can run and you can hide ,but nature will still get you . Historical temperaments could be represented by Switzerland .All ups and downs and if you go the wrong way you might fall off a cliff. Equal temperament could be represented by Australia . Not enough big mountains and a very flat arid landscape (not totally Aussies ). Less chance of falling down a mountain . More chance of mice ,snakes and spiders .

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The big mystery to me is where do all these improvisers come from . Usually keen improvisers put things on forums and they don`t attract a lot of attention . It`s clever enough but over rated .


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