2022 our 25th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
49 members (Chompoo, Carey, AJB, AndreaH, 80k, astrotoy, AprilE, Anevsky, axomas, 9 invisible), 3,499 guests, and 259 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 2 of 2 1 2
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 1,384
1000 Post Club Member
OP Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 1,384
Ian,
I would not use ESN on bridge pins. Thats because Molybdenum is best for metal to metal friction. Thats what i use for bridge caps on my rebuilds, Great stuff. Todd Scott swears by using Sailkote on bridge pins and on the strings where it crosses over felt, when he goes to work on pianos in peoples homes. Sailkote goes on wet but it leaves a dry white film behind. Maybe its Teflon? I dont know.
Silicone is also known to have a little creeping factor, but i think this trait is what makes it more ideal for the center pin bushings, might not be good for bridge pins though.
-chris


"Where TONE is Key, and Mammoths are not extinct."

Youtube https://tinyurl.com/5aw83b73


Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,020
W
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
W
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,020
Thanks, Chris. Molybdenum sounds a much better idea. I'll try that. Interesting to hear Todd Scott thinks treating the string over the felt makes a difference. No reason why not.


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 2,412
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 2,412
As a chemist, I can by no stretch of the imagination confirm the notion that ethyl acetate is "safe on your skin". I even have doubts that is is somehow "safer" than acetone, but I would have to do some more detailed reading on comparing their toxicity mechanisms.

The obvious difference is miscibility / solubility in water (high for acetone, low for EA) and polarity (high for acetone, intermediate for EA). But that aside, both are used in nail polish removers, both are potent degreasers and volatile solvents, and as a chemist, I treat them both with equal respect.

That aside, I'd certainly keep naphtha (the main part of Chris's mix) off my skin. All petroleum distillates, even aliphatic ones, have health risks.


Autodidact interested in piano technology.
1922 49" Zimmermann, project piano.
1970 44" Ibach, daily music maker.
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 1,384
1000 Post Club Member
OP Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 1,384
By all means, take all precautions when handling these chemicals. I keep mine in a squeeze bottle that easily transfers the fluid to a hypo oiler. An 8oz bottle will probably last years for most people since so little is used when needed.

On my way to my desk, I walked past my wife's makeup station. I couldn't help but wonder how many toxic chemicals are in those products.
Chris.


"Where TONE is Key, and Mammoths are not extinct."

Youtube https://tinyurl.com/5aw83b73


Joined: Mar 2022
Posts: 627
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Mar 2022
Posts: 627
Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
By all means, take all precautions when handling these chemicals. I keep mine in a squeeze bottle that easily transfers the fluid to a hypo oiler. An 8oz bottle will probably last years for most people since so little is used when needed.

On my way to my desk, I walked past my wife's makeup station. I couldn't help but wonder how many toxic chemicals are in those products.
Chris.
I mostly use natural things 🤷‍♂️
Yes there are many bad chemicals in those products 😳

Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,210

Gold Supporter until Nov 1 2022
1000 Post Club Member
Offline

Gold Supporter until Nov 1 2022
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,210
Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
GOMBESSa,
Everything you mentioned is the same thing, a metal pin rotating or sliding against a cloth bushing

Sounds like it can be used in most of these, then? Curious, can you estimate how much of a change is possible in terms of lightening up an action by using this? Or is it less about lightening the existing friction uh==in an action and more about maintaining current levels?

Gombessa, as someone who has been experimenting on the issue of how to lighten's one action for a few years now (on my own pianos), I have found lightening the hammers to be the most effective by far. However, this assumes everything else is at the correct friction level. If you have sticking hammer shank centerpins, for example, then freeing those centers using something like Chris's solution should help a lot. It all depends on how badly the action centers are sticking. Per Bill Spurlock, these are the main sources of friction:

"The main sources of friction for actions in good adjustment are, in order of decreasing amount, the knuckle, the hammershank centerpin, wippen centerpin, key bushings, and the capstan."

Doing a swing test on your hammer shanks is pretty easy. I'm not sure how to test proper wippen centerpin friction, but hitting each pin with Chris's solution can't hurt. However, unless you have excess friction in the system, a lube job alone won't do much to lighten the feel of the action.

Last edited by Emery Wang; 05/23/22 04:42 PM.

Daily driver: Yamaha Avantgrand N1
First crush: Kawai GL10, MP11SE
Current fling: Petrof III
Foster child: 1927 Kurtzmann upright
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 1,384
1000 Post Club Member
OP Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2018
Posts: 1,384
Hi Emery,
Check this out for flange torque testing. Since this was so successful, Ive ditched the swing test for hammers and all of the gram gauges.
-chris


"Where TONE is Key, and Mammoths are not extinct."

Youtube https://tinyurl.com/5aw83b73


Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,128
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 15,128
Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
Hi Emery,
Check this out for flange torque testing. Since this was so successful, Ive ditched the swing test for hammers and all of the gram gauges.
-chris

Another great video, Chris!

That still seems like a lot of work, when you think about having to do it 88 times. smile

All the best!

Rick


Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,210

Gold Supporter until Nov 1 2022
1000 Post Club Member
Offline

Gold Supporter until Nov 1 2022
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2018
Posts: 1,210
Very cool Chris. I hope you have a lot of audiobooks!


Daily driver: Yamaha Avantgrand N1
First crush: Kawai GL10, MP11SE
Current fling: Petrof III
Foster child: 1927 Kurtzmann upright
Page 2 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Ken Knapp, Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
Piano Buyer - Read the Articles, Explore the website
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Learn to Burn!
by Dfrankjazz - 07/01/22 12:36 AM
Summer school in UK
by FarmGirl - 06/30/22 11:12 PM
Recommended tech in NYC?
by skern49 - 06/30/22 07:39 PM
UEFI / BIOS settings regarding CPU
by David Lai - 06/30/22 07:26 PM
When you play the real Rhodes...
by Rhodes74 - 06/30/22 06:23 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
What's Hot!!
FREE June Newsletter is Here!
--------------------
Forums RULES, Terms of Service & HELP
(updated 06/06/2022)
-------------------
Music Store Going Out of Business Sale!
---------------------
Mr. PianoWorld's Original Composition
---------------------
Sell Your Piano on our world famous Piano Forums!
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums43
Topics213,754
Posts3,204,571
Members105,685
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers

Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | MapleStreetMusicShop.com - Our store in Cornish Maine


© copyright 1997 - 2022 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5