2022 our 25th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
47 members (Carey, AndrewJCW, David Boyce, CharlesXX, Adem, CasualPianist123, 17 invisible), 383 guests, and 256 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
E
Estella Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
E
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
I just ordered a Sauter Masterclass 130 from the official dealer in Hong Kong. I was offered to choose from the two brand new ones in their inventory. But upon testing, these two both sound notably different from the one on display. Both are brighter, and not as sweet and mellow with nice singing tone, as the one on display. And even the two brand new ones sound different from each other too, with one much brighter than the other. The sales person says that the difference was because those are brand new and with time they will sound more like the one on display.
I wonder if that will be the case? Anyone has experience on this? Thank you so much!

Joined: May 2006
Posts: 7,489
7000 Post Club Member
Offline
7000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 7,489
I would only take the display model and not the ones you don’t like as much.


Pianist, teacher, apprentice technician, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 2,316
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 2,316
They probably are just slightly out of tune with each other.People sometimes do not realize a piano has unisons that are slightly out of tune and think it's the pianos tone.Its difficult to believe all these MC Sauter models floating around like this.It must be a different model, surely? Are there Bechstein Concert 8's floating around there too?

Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 70
A
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
A
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 70
My Sauter upright was pretty bright when it first arrived a few years ago, but now the sound is much more mellow and warmer. She sings so beautifully now I tear when my teacher plays a piece I love (I'm sure it's also because he plays well haha). If you don't wish to wait for a few years then take the display model.

Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 7,194
G
7000 Post Club Member
Offline
7000 Post Club Member
G
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 7,194
Is it common for new pianos to mellow after use? Understandable that the tone will change with settling and use, but I had always heard that typically new hammers are soft and will compact/groove with use, becoming brighter rather than mellower (and that the una corda becomes more effective/noticeable because of it).


Bosendorfer D214VC ENPro
Past: Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11, Kawai NV-10
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 70
A
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
A
Joined: Aug 2013
Posts: 70
Originally Posted by Athdara
My Sauter upright was pretty bright when it first arrived a few years ago, but now the sound is much more mellow and warmer. She sings so beautifully now I tear when my teacher plays a piece I love (I'm sure it's also because he plays well haha). If you don't wish to wait for a few years then take the display model.

forgot to add: I did get it voiced once, about a year or two after it arrived so it'll be mellower, but back then, even after voicing, the sound was still.. a little stiff.

Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
E
Estella Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
E
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
Thank you so much for sharing your experience. It is certainly very helpful to know. May I ask which part of the world do you live? Do you generally have more humid or dry climate?

Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 2,316
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 2,316
Originally Posted by Estella
I just ordered a Sauter Masterclass 130 from the official dealer in Hong Kong. I was offered to choose from the two brand new ones in their inventory. But upon testing, these two both sound notably different from the one on display. Both are brighter, and not as sweet and mellow with nice singing tone, as the one on display. And even the two brand new ones sound different from each other too, with one much brighter than the other. The sales person says that the difference was because those are brand new and with time they will sound more like the one on display.
I wonder if that will be the case? Anyone has experience on this? Thank you so much!
I just looked online Why did you not order a Bosendorfer 130 or a Steinway 130 from the Hong Kong dealer.You may have been happier,or not?

Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 559
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 559
The dealer's room may be acoustically less reflective than the inventory room. Hard surfaces such as windows and hard floors accentuate brightness more than a room with carpet, furnishings and drapes etc.

Last edited by TBell; 05/15/22 12:34 AM. Reason: edit
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
E
Estella Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
E
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
A Bosendorfer or Steinway upright is more than twice the price of Sauter MC130 in Hong Kong:)

Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 789
J
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
J
Joined: Sep 2011
Posts: 789
I imagine that the stock pianos have not yet been properly voiced and regulated. In any case, whichever you choose, the piano will need to be properly voiced for the space in which you are going to put it. I recently moved house and had to voice both my Sauters for their new positions. Different-sized rooms, differently shaped rooms, furnishings can all make a difference to the sound that you hear.


Sauter Alpha 160, Yamaha N3 Avant Grand, Sauter Studio Upright (1974)
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
E
Estella Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
E
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
I see. Thanks for the insight! The dealer tuned the new pianos before letting me to test and choose. They did mention that they will perform three more tuning during the first year after delivery. Would that make the piano sound warmer and mellower?

I am pretty sure they are the same model. The dealer has two on stock and the display has been there since 2018. Bernstein is sold at a different seller in HK.

Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 2,316
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 2,316
[quote=Estella]A Bosendorfer or Steinway upright is more than twice the price of Sauter MC130 in Hong Kong:)
[/quote Estrella]

Here in the US a Sauter MC130 is 64K while a Bosendorfer
130 is 89K in Brand Profiles.The dealer you bought from is Tom Lee Music who supplie Sauter, Yamaha, Bosendorfer and Steinway uprights and grands in a number of branches in Hong Kong.

I have tried a Sauter Delta here and I have heard someone playing a well tuned Sauter upright.Neither were really bright at all and had a definite tonal relationship with each other. I have also tried a Bluthner grand which was really a great deal brighter than what I expected from that instrument. I really believe the answer lies in voicing your room.Have drapes, bookshelves, puctures and a full length carpet for such a powerful instrument. Keep the piano away from corners of the room.Stand the piano 5 to 6 inches away from the wall.Best wishes I am sure it will work out well.Tre

Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 3,440
S
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 3,440
In western Europe, the Sauter MC 130 starts at 26k euros before negotiation, the Bosendorfer is 47k, the K132 is within the same range of price. One usually gets around 10% off that list price.

I havent played the MC but i did try several of the Sauter new uprights and indeed they are definitely on the bright side. Though it is different from the way a Yamaha can be bright. I would describe their sound as silvery which does bring some vivacity to the music. I would think the MC130 should be warmer though with the increased size, but it certainly must have a common character with the other uprights. The Bluthner upright can also have a certain brilliancy but they are more balanced and dont have the silvery character of the Sauter.

You can reduce the brightness by damping the room, but I would definitely pick the model which you like rather than the factory ones.


Blüthner model 6
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 33,029
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 33,029
All the speculation about how the pianos the OP doesn't prefer might change with voicing the piano, voicing the room, time(this normally makes the piano brighter, not mellower), etc. seem irrelevant. Why not just take the Sauter that he preferred that wasn't so bright?

Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,033
W
4000 Post Club Member
Offline
4000 Post Club Member
W
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 4,033
... and so say all of us.


Ian Russell
Schiedmayer & Soehne, 1925 Model 14, 140cm
Ibach, 1905 F-IV, 235cm
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 3,440
S
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 3,440
Originally Posted by Sidokar
I would describe their sound as silvery which does bring some vivacity to the music. I would think the MC130 should be warmer though with the increased size, but it certainly must have a common character with the other uprights.

The video below is fairly close to what I experienced when I played a 122 Sauter (dont remember exactly which model). What is bright can mean different things for different people. Some pianos lack harmonic complexity and are rather bland, others may have a somehow harsh sound which rings (potentially due to hammers), others have a treble that is unpleasant and overpresent.

The 122 Sauter has a good balance though definitely on the clear side; the bass and mid bass is less warm and less present than in a Bechstein and it is quite articulate. The sound is smooth without harshness and the treble integrates well with the rest of the range; it is just that overall it has this "silvery" character, with a clear tonal range which brings a lot of vivacity to the music.



Blüthner model 6
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
E
Estella Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
E
Joined: May 2022
Posts: 9
Thank you so much for all your suggestions and insights. They are so helpful. The floor model has been on display for four years at a place with busy traffic in HK, so it is indeed a bit tricky. I guess I will trust the quality of Sauter and credibility of the dealer, and take one of the factory models.

Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,384
D
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
D
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 3,384
Originally Posted by terminaldegree
I would only take the display model and not the ones you don’t like as much.

I agree. Buy a piano for what it is now, not for what it might become. The latter approach is risky.

Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 93
S
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
S
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 93
Hi Estella, I am quite sure it will be fine. Sauter is a quality piano. I had similar experience with my Seiler upright, you might even like a little brighter sound in the long run, use it and tune every 6 months to start with.

Page 1 of 7 1 2 3 4 5 6 7

Moderated by  Ken Knapp, Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
Piano Buyer - Read the Articles, Explore the website
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Immediate Job Opening
by TimM_980 - 08/15/22 01:41 AM
Twist and Shout!
by That Guy - 08/14/22 09:38 PM
Losing control of the tempo
by Sam S - 08/14/22 06:26 PM
Upgrade to Kawai GM-10 baby grand or large upright
by Hartstrings - 08/14/22 06:19 PM
Disconnecting pedal rods
by skern49 - 08/14/22 05:35 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
What's Hot!!
FREE June Newsletter is Here!
--------------------
Forums RULES, Terms of Service & HELP
(updated 06/06/2022)
-------------------
Music Store Going Out of Business Sale!
---------------------
Mr. PianoWorld's Original Composition
---------------------
Sell Your Piano on our world famous Piano Forums!
---------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums43
Topics214,399
Posts3,216,352
Members106,085
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers

Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | MapleStreetMusicShop.com - Our store in Cornish Maine


© copyright 1997 - 2022 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5