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Joined: Apr 2021
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Hello,

I would like to ask a question about any noise from the NV5S pedals.

I have had an NV5S for about a week now.

Apart from the other issues associated with this unit, I have noticed an increasing clicking noise from all three pedals over the last few days.

My guess is that it is the clicking of micro switches.

Especially with the damper pedal, this is annoying in the long run, with rather soft and quiet pieces of music.

With the damper pedal, the clicking can be heard when the pedal is released, with the other two, when the pedal is pressed down.

In addition, after about 10 minutes of playing, when the damper pedal is used frequently, an increasing scraping, slightly scratching noise can also be heard when it is pressed.

I know these noises from my Sauter too, but this instrument is about 40 years old, whereas the NV5S is new.

My question is whether other owners of NV5(S) could kindly give me some feedback so that I can better assess the noises I hear.

Gladly also by PM. My concern is that this does not discredit anyone, person or company.

For the sake of completeness, I didn't notice these noises when I was testing it, but it got louder and louder as the time went on due to more and more customers.

Kind regards, MBiG


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The NV5 has "micro-switch" clicking noise in the left and middle pedal. The right pedal produces a different noise, caused by actuating the damper mechanism. The latter originates mostly from inside the piano body rather than from the pedal assembly itself. Best observed with the piano turned OFF.

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Getting scared about an NV5 purchase after all these quality discussions :-/

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Originally Posted by Curt-S
Getting scared about an NV5 purchase after all these quality discussions :-/
Lol, me too smile I expect it to arrive somewhere next month. My dealer assured me that the Kawai QA is generally fine. Around 2% of the NV5's sold had issues after delivery which was resolved by properly regulating the action.
The NV5S in the store was flawless IMHO


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Thank you for this feedback.

Despite the issues I've had with the NV5(S) so far, I'm still sure that this model is probably one of the best hybrid digital pianos. The feeling conveyed by this instrument is impressively close to an analogue upright. And this is not only my opinion at home, but also that of my wife, who has also been playing uprights for many years and the NV5(S) is the second digital instrument she has ever played.

I would take into consideration that the keyboard may need to be readjusted when buying the instrument.

What I find a pity is that, especially at this price, the technical solution of the contactors (microswitches) in the pedals is not of better quality in terms of acoustics. For example, the pedals in the technical version of the MP11SE are absolutely noiseless. -> I know it is not solved with microswitches. (The damper pedal cannot, of course, be compared with the NV5(S) in terms of mechanics).

Unfortunately, the microswitches and the mechanical noise were only audible after 5 to 7 hours of use on my device. One evening, my wife asked in amazement where the clicking was coming from when she listened to me. Well, you can't find out everything when you try it out at your local dealer, especially if a defect only develops after some time.

What I would be particularly interested in regarding the damper pedal mechanism is the question of how much effort, if any, is required to adjust or repair the damper pedal on an NV5(S)? With my analogue Upright, I know exactly how to get to the mechanism and, if necessary, how to eliminate creaking with lubricant. With the NV5(S), I hope that there is a repair concept that can be carried out on site, i.e. at the customer's premises.

[Regarding the assessment of surface defects on the black, high-gloss surface, I recommend a brief inspection with a good light source, for example a good piano light, during the handover. Unfortunately, I only discovered the defect the next day when I set up the piano light. The LED on the mobile is not really good enough for assessment. If this is too meticulous for you, you don't have to do it, of course. And you will hardly notice any surface defects.]

Kind regards MBiG

Last edited by MBiG; 08/09/21 06:03 PM.

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Originally Posted by MBiG
What I would be particularly interested in regarding the damper pedal mechanism is the question of how much effort, if any, is required to adjust or repair the damper pedal on an NV5(S)? With my analogue Upright, I know exactly how to get to the mechanism and, if necessary, how to eliminate creaking with lubricant. With the NV5(S), I hope that there is a repair concept that can be carried out on site, i.e. at the customer's premises.

If it's anything like the NV-10, you can probably do it yourself. The NV-10 more or less has a full acoustic mechanism and linkage attached to the damper pedal. The only "digital" part of it is a washer bolted/welded in place that actuates a standard Kawai 3-pedal unit (mounted upside down). So if you're the type that is comfortable pulling off the front panel of an upright and digging around inside, you'll probably have no problem sussing out the workings on an NV-5S.


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Have you guys compared the sound of the nv10s to the 5s? It’s mostly price, but I’m trying to convince myself to go with the upright action 5s because of the quality of the soundboard vs the 10s upgraded speakers…

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I also have the clicking noise on the left and middle pedal. But it doesn't bother me much. The right pedal doesn't makes any noise at all.


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For the purpose of this thread, I will paste a quote from my PM correspondence with MBiG:

Originally Posted by Kawai James
Hello

Thank you for your message.

When checking the NV5/NV5S, I do recall hearing a faint microswitch-like clicking sound when close to the pedals and pushing them down with my hands.

I believe this system is the same as that used on the ATX/AURES instruments. As with all components produced in large quantities, there may be some variance in noise for these microswitches (i.e. sometimes louder, sometimes quieter).

I don't believe this should be a concern, however if you find it to be problematic, please discuss the topic with your dealer and/or Kawai Europe.

Kind regards,
James
x

Note that the NV10/NV10S does not use the same pedal input system, as noticed by Gombessa.

This is why the NV10S supports half-soft pedalling, while the NV5S does not.
https://www.kawai-global.com/product_comparison/detail.php?n=nv10s,nv5s&ct=93

Kind regards,
James
x


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Originally Posted by Curt-S
Have you guys compared the sound of the nv10s to the 5s? It’s mostly price, but I’m trying to convince myself to go with the upright action 5s because of the quality of the soundboard vs the 10s upgraded speakers…

Unfortunately no, when testing the NV5S I was only focused on the comparison with the "usual suspects" (e.g. NU1X, CA99, GP510, LX708, CLP785). The NV10S is out of the question for me for reasons of space and weight. In this price range, I would personally rather go for a K300 Aures anyway. (But this is just my opinion, i dont need the action of the NV10S. And the Aures weights of course even more then the 10S)

Last edited by MBiG; 08/10/21 06:08 AM.

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Originally Posted by Kawai James
For the purpose of this thread, I will paste a quote from my PM correspondence with MBiG:

Originally Posted by Kawai James
Hello

Thank you for your message.

When checking the NV5/NV5S, I do recall hearing a faint microswitch-like clicking sound when close to the pedals and pushing them down with my hands.

I believe this system is the same as that used on the ATX/AURES instruments. As with all components produced in large quantities, there may be some variance in noise for these microswitches (i.e. sometimes louder, sometimes quieter).

I don't believe this should be a concern, however if you find it to be problematic, please discuss the topic with your dealer and/or Kawai Europe.

Kind regards,
James
x

Note that the NV10/NV10S does not use the same pedal input system, as noticed by Gombessa.

This is why the NV10S supports half-soft pedalling, while the NV5S does not.
https://www.kawai-global.com/product_comparison/detail.php?n=nv10s,nv5s&ct=93

Kind regards,
James
x


Is half soft pedaling a common technique? Something you can’t normally do on an upright? Just curious if that’s worth considering.

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Originally Posted by Curt-S
Have you guys compared the sound of the nv10s to the 5s? It’s mostly price, but I’m trying to convince myself to go with the upright action 5s because of the quality of the soundboard vs the 10s upgraded speakers…
Yes, I did. They were next to each other. Last year I've played the NV10 and NV5, recently I played the S version of both.

Some of my thoughts, YMMV smile :
- I didn't like the sound of the original NV10, it sounded boxy and thin for me
- I immediately loved the NV5
- The NV10S didn't have the boxy sound anymore and actually sounded quite nice compared to the original NV10! I'm not sure how well my memory serves though...
- The NV5S has a very nice "grunt" especially in the lower registers, which makes it more realistic. You actually feel the sound! The NV10 definitely feels more digital because of the lack of vibrations (for me). I had a blast playing Chopins Prelude in C minor Op. 28 No. 20 on the NV5S!
- I didn't notice any differences between the NV5 and NV5S in terms of sound, but I couldn't compare directly obviously...
- The NV10 definitely plays easier but the action of the NV5 is great as well (it is still an upright of course)
- The soundstage of the NV5S could be a bit wider compared to the NV10S. But the NV5S was very close to the wall and next to other piano's while the NV10S had lots of space in the middle of the room.

The NV10S is out of the question because I don't have the space for it. The NV5S is a lovely piano that checks all the boxes for me. Both are the best hybrids I could find (yes, I have played on most of the others as well...).
The NV10S in that room/location sounded a bit better (wider soundstage) but also less realistic (no vibrations, a bit thinner). I think the NV5S is the more convincing hybrid.


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Hello,

@Pianico, Thank you for an interesting and useful post!

Cheers and happy hybrid playing,

HZ

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I own the ca99 and have found that using the soft pedal, I can't get any single notes in a chord to sing over the others. Regardless of how much pressure I apply all the notes play at a "capped" intensity of volume. There is no ability to convey subtle voicing within musical phrases. Can anyone confirm this is the same with the Nv5s, as I'm curious to know if its just a limitation of digital sound samples, or if its due to the unrealistic action of Ca99? Thanks

Last edited by InspiredByKawai; 08/10/21 02:09 PM.
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Originally Posted by InspiredByKawai
I own the ca99 and have found that using the soft pedal, I can't get any single notes in a chord to sing over the others. Regardless of how much pressure I apply all the notes play at a "capped" intensity of volume. There is no ability to convey subtle voicing within musical phrases. Can anyone confirm this is the same with the Nv5s, as I'm curious to know if its just a limitation of digital sound samples, or if its due to the unrealistic action of Ca99? Thanks

Hello,
The intensity of the soft pedal can be adjusted via the user interface. Have you already tried this?

Kind regards, MBiG


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Thanks, yes it helps a little reducing soft pedal effect but then there is minimal amount of muting which kind of defeats the purpose.

Last edited by InspiredByKawai; 08/10/21 02:50 PM.

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