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Originally Posted by entonio
Originally Posted by Suki0650
Is there any way to downgrade the firmware on th CA79 to see if some issues were actually caused by the firmware upgrade?
Thanks.

Hold on there. I don't know specifics, but in general it's not guaranteed that firmware can be downgraded. Even if you download the previous version, you may end up with a bricked piano.
If this case is known to be different, my apologies.

From what I can infer, the internal memory is completely overwritten, only the noiseless seems to write only a portion. The apk, surely can be downgraded as this is a bundle. Correct me if I'm wrong.

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It's completely wrong to judge a user interface on the basis of whether it uses a touchscreen or buttons.
Physical buttons always offer a much better experience than touchscreens - but they are much more limited. I wouldn't want a physical keyboard on my phone, but I wouldn't want the power button replaced by something on the screen.
Ideally, there would be a small number of buttons for essential functions which the player would prefer to access quickly via muscle memory, and the rest would be handled by the screen. The buttons might even be on the right while the screen would remain on the left.
Speaking of a device I know, the Roland FP-90x has a lot of buttons and the user experience with them leaves a lot to be desired. I don't think the people who design these things ever actually use them. The exact same buttons might work great of their functionality were changed.
In contrast, the Korg 01/W is a masterpiece of a button-based interface.
There is a whole branch of design called UI engineering, but most companies just don't even know it.

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I have an ebony model and I will admit I was miffed when I found out it did not turn off as advertised, but its not really a deal breaker.
Its barely visible and once I start playing I don't even see it.

By the way, contrary to stated before the Roland buttons can be hidden when playing and it makes a nice finish. and I suspect those ugly big buttons will last much longer then the screen on the CA.

I still love my CA.

Ron


Originally Posted by mmathew
Originally Posted by Pete14
The screen is tucked to the left corner (basically out of sight), and this is much better than Roland’s lazy approach which still, in this day and age, is using huge buttons/slider running from edge to edge; not tucked to the side but right in your face.


Well, Pete, it is actually important to, I suspect, a lot of people. If implemented correctly (i.e., it turns OFF), that area would provide a seamless polished look, much like the surface of a grand piano. Imagine that for buyers who went with the Ebony Polish option - it would be an amazing look! And for people who like to play in a dim environment, with dim lighting on the keys alone (this gives a very intimate experience) - that screen staying lit IS a deal breaker.

Again, an "unavailable" feature is understood and accepted by buyers before they make the purchase. A feature that doesn't work as expected is not something buyers want, from a premium piano maker like Kawai.

When one buys Kawai, they simply want the best. No compromises. It really is that - Kawai is a brand separate from the other two - in that they put everything into pianos only. In a sense, it is an exotic brand.

The CA79/CA99 has tarnished the reputation of Kawai.

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Okay, I have a proposition: let’s get rid of all buttons/sliders and touchscreen(s), and for that matter, even the volume knob!

And I’m also talking about the power on/off button; yes, that also has to go!


Everything will be controlled from our smart devices; except for volume and power on/off.

For volume we will use a ‘key’ combination: hold lower-most “A” down whilst tapping upper-most “C” for volume up, or upper-most “B” for volume down.

For power on/off: “Alexa, power piano on/off” (Alexa built-in).


That’s it; we’re done!



Who’s with me? laugh

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Originally Posted by mmathew
that area would provide a seamless polished look, much like the surface of a grand piano.

Originally Posted by entonio
Physical buttons always offer a much better experience than touchscreens - but they are much more limited. <…> Ideally, there would be a small number of buttons for essential functions which the player would prefer to access quickly via muscle memory, and the rest would be handled by the screen.

It seems that Kawai once understood this (CS11):
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Physical buttons, screen, cover for a clean and authentic look.

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Originally Posted by Pete14
Everything will be controlled from our smart devices; except for volume and power on/off.
With a Midi over Bluetooth dongle and the SmartPianist app, my N1X is near that.

The drawback : when connected, the display shows « con » and the buttons are disabled. Then all is controlled with the smart device but I can’t start the recorder or run some advanced functions (local control on/off) then I prefer to use the buttons with my manual not that faraway.


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Originally Posted by 9190


*** I LOVE IT ***


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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Originally Posted by 9190

I like it too.

I would take it a step further and have it horizontally across the board.

It would be like the FP90X but with a long cover.

I prefer buttons over touch screen.

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- Buttons on hardware.
- Touch screen on phone/smart devices.

In terms of functionality, it's admittedly impossible to offer full functionality on both. But with the above as a design principle, Kawai can strive to provide a good enough balance between the two. This would also allow Kawai to concentrate on what they do best - build quality, key action, sounds.

Alas, I think we are derailing, if not already.

So,
The call to Kawai is to release a major update to the UI and software that will help all owners. Even an acknowledgement from them will do wonders to the community, at this point.


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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...you didn’t hear the complaints?

People were complaining about the ‘cover’ making a squeaky sound when opening, and how it looked nice when closed but when opened it looked hideous; oh yeah, they also complained that the cover rattled and made rattling noises when pounding away at the Rach III!

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Originally Posted by mmathew
- Buttons on hardware.
- Touch screen on phone/smart devices.

In terms of functionality, it's admittedly impossible to offer full functionality on both. But with the above as a design principle, Kawai can strive to provide a good enough balance between the two. This would also allow Kawai to concentrate on what they do best - build quality, key action, sounds.

Alas, I think we are derailing, if not already.

So,
The call to Kawai is to release a major update to the UI and software that will help all owners. Even an acknowledgement from them will do wonders to the community, at this point.

Actually, I don't think we are derailing.

Yes short term they need to fix the UI.

But long term that cover is a good idea.

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Did you not read what I said above?

We complained about the cover, too!


Don’t you see, all we do is complain and nag about this and about that; and soon as ‘this’ or ‘that’ is corrected/changed/improved, we complain about the ‘other’!

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Well, @Pete14, if you insist:

Squeaking & rattling covers are easily fixed by owner. A drop of oil, tighten a loose screw.

The issues reported thus far re: UI and software are not fixable by owners themselves. There even are some owners asking for source code so they can go ahead and fix it on their own.


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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I know, but someone decided to fix the UI situation with a rattling cover:

“Yes short term they need to fix the UI”.
“But long term that cover is a good idea”.

I’ve been through this once, the ‘rattling cover’, and I don’t know if I can face it again!

“It squeaks, it rattles; no, it’s a rattling squeak”.


...and I don’t know if I can face it again......


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Are we all forgetting the biggest u.i problem.

Per key adjustments!

A feature that the previous models had and no longer do.

A feature Kawai James said and I quote "will be implemented with a forthcoming update" over a year ago.

But that update never came and likely never will.

Last edited by InspiredByKawai; 04/29/21 04:24 PM.
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I much prefer the look of these pedals compared to the current ca line up. More authentic and traditional upright acoustic feature which has been taken away and downgraded to the more typical cheaper looking digital pedal setup that elongates out of the base.

Last edited by InspiredByKawai; 04/29/21 04:27 PM.
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Originally Posted by Meap6
Hi James,

I too recalled you mentioned something about the backlight fix, so I went back to look for a bit. You stated the following:

Originally Posted by Kawai James
Hello ppiioottrr,

Originally Posted by ppiioottrr
1. the LCD backlight does not turn off - I wonder if Kawai can fix it or maybe they haven't envisioned a possibility to completely turn off the LCD (the greyish light is really visible in a darker room!)

Yes, this is planned for a future software update.


from this post:
https://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthr...i-ca79-ca99-owners-club.html#Post3045413

While there is no explicit promise, it certainly seemed it was on the menu for the dev team, so I can understand why Gianluca would feel cheated...

Thanks for picking out that specific post.

As you say, this is not an explicit promise, however in retrospect I ought to have perhaps phrased my response a little differently, e.g.:

Yes, this is under consideration for a future software update.

Once again, my apologies to Gianluca if he feels cheated.

Kind regards,
James
x


James, I don't want to get into controversy over the meaning of the word "promise".
When an employee of a company positively states that a feature will be implemented (and this has happened several times in the pages of this thread), users take your words very seriously.
And if, for reasons we do not know, there is a retraction of the previous claims, many users can feel cheated.
Your first affirmative answers (regarding the blacklight turn off), were accurate and left no doubt about this implementation.
Your last answer, on the other hand, hints at more than a doubt about the future implementation.
You also said that a future implementation was the ability to adjust the voicing parameters note by note.
Perhaps this implementation is also in doubt today?
In the past it was not in doubt.


I allow myself to give some advice: for the next future models, it will be better to give answers like this: "Kawai is aware of user requests, but I cannot guarantee that these will be met".

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Originally Posted by mmathew
There even are some owners asking for source code so they can go ahead and fix it on their own.

Here‘s one. If that thing wouldn’t be so expensive I’d buy another one to experiment and try it anyways. Code is always legible, group bits into 8, convert to hex, translate to assembly and there you go. If I recall correctly: the storage writer during update said 0xFFFF, that seems manageable…

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Originally Posted by mmathew
The issues reported thus far re: UI and software are not fixable by owners themselves. There even are some owners asking for source code so they can go ahead and fix it on their own.

A few people have mentioned source code. Kawai used GPL'd source and are obligated to make it available. It's at the link below. It includes build instructions. I don't know if it contains just the GPL'd code, or everything required to actually build something useful. Firmware, UI, or both? The build instructions finish with "After compilation has finished, get boot.img, misc.img, recovery.img, and system.img."

https://www.kawai-global.com/support/downloads/


Kawai CA79 (arrived Nov 28, 2020), Roland EP7-II (1993)
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