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I was brought up in a non-musical family. However, we were not completely music illiterate. My father listened to recordings of Haydn, Mozart & Beethoven on LPs or the radio and had an appreciation for Classical music. Just that nobody at home really got into playing an instrument until somebody in the family started guitar lessons in the Classical style. Someone else started taking violin lessons before I got into music.

The attitude in my family has always been we need to start music early to get somewhere. Someone used to tell me to take music appreciation classes at a local conservatory including the history of Classical music, opera, symphonies, etc. to get a deeper appreciation for music. I picked up piano playing and got myself a teacher. Between passively studying the history of music and playing a Bach fugue, it's music appreciation at a different level. Adult learners get into music not because we want to pursue a career as a musician. It's a time filler but something that can be a stress relief especially watching the news on the pandemic everyday. People are spending more time at home in front of the screen. Playing music is a healthy alternative.

Many of kids would spend a lot of time in front of the screen. As adult learners we pay for our lessons and practice regularly. I don't think any of my teacher's students have entered a piano competition or even gave a recital somewhere. Being able to play a few songs is enough of a motivation to keep going. Before the lockdown I played seasonal songs at Christmas gatherings.

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Originally Posted by macbruins
Originally Posted by zonzi
It is now your turn: you should answer the question what your daughters should still learn from piano lessons.
Originally Posted by zonzi
I mean the teachers' objectives makes sense when someone knows the results, but it doesn't make sense at the moment of execution. It is hard to motivate the student. As parent, the only motivation I can tell is learn to do something difficult...
For my kids, I wish they have fun practicing and playing like they did. They loved messing with songs like “I Wish You A Merry Christmas” or “Do Rei Mi”. I want to get them that feeling again.

For myself, I want them to continue partly out of pride. My wife and I signed them up to fill some free time, but they did much better than we expected. Elizabeth’s teacher used to ask to enter her into competitions every month, thinking she would do very well. We declined because we just wanted her to have fun.

And I don’t want them to waste the time they already invested. A few years of lessons, hours of practices per week, add up to a lot of playdates they had to miss.
If your objective is your daughters can reproduce independently the songs like “I Wish You A Merry Christmas” or “Do Rei Mi”, the investment objective has been accomplished with success already.
If you ask their piano teacher put much more resource to that, it is similar to ask university professor put more time to teach 1+1=2... In this case you should find a "primary school teacher", leave them in the happy primary school until one day they are annoyed.
If you want just put more Bargaining chips to have a bigger win on this project, I am afraid it will lead most likely to a total loss. You should deploy better your money/resource but especially allocate better your daughters' time, or adapt "stop loss" strategy.

Last edited by zonzi; 04/28/21 07:55 AM.

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Originally Posted by macbruins
How did you find the music outside your lessons?

My wife did ask the teacher to help, but it didn’t work out.

This is a bit vague. Did you ask the teacher a general question, that you want to play an additional piece, but she didn't give you any because she already assigns a lot? Did you ask for a specific style, genre, occasion, etc.? Did you bring in a piece (or send a link) to ask if the level would be suitable? If my students show me something they want to play, I can easily tell them yes this is good to try now or no you should wait because of level.

Originally Posted by macbruins
For my kids, I wish they have fun practicing and playing like they did. They loved messing with songs like “I Wish You A Merry Christmas” or “Do Rei Mi”. I want to get them that feeling again.

For myself, I want them to continue partly out of pride. My wife and I signed them up to fill some free time, but they did much better than we expected. Elizabeth’s teacher used to ask to enter her into competitions every month, thinking she would do very well. We declined because we just wanted her to have fun.

And I don’t want them to waste the time they already invested. A few years of lessons, hours of practices per week, add up to a lot of playdates they had to miss.

1. "They loved messing with" - do they not "mess with" songs like those anymore? Why not?

2. I didn't see this while I was writing but see above, fun and competition are not mutually exclusive. If you do well, you'll probably enjoy it (yes I know there can be exceptions such as when there is continued external pressure) or be satisfied with the feeling of accomplishment even if you don't have a desire to do it again. (Note: I don't push my students to competitions for various reasons but some ask to take specific auditions so I help them prepare. The other things I require, I view as core to the curriculum/learning/education of a young musician, but I don't personally include competitions in that category.)

What makes competitive soccer more acceptable than competitive piano? (She "wanted soccer" but you declined piano competition on her behalf?) Surely there is hard work involved in training/drilling for soccer.

3. Sunk cost. You spent the time and gained the experience. Is it not a valuable life skill to have dedicated consistent discipline to a serious pursuit? If you (adult) had a hobby when you were younger but did not keep it up, does that take away from the enjoyment (of both process and results, perhaps) that you had when you were doing it? The effort you spent learning calculus or chemistry or whatever, even if you don't call on that knowledge anymore, you still went through the learning and thinking process. If your college major was different from the field you work in, it still wasn't wasted. The time has passed but it had its use.

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I've read your responses but I think you are barking up the wrong tree. Piano will never be super-emotional. It's not like a singer singing r & b music. You can alter things stylistically but in the end, it's up to your daughters to feel the music within its own parameters.

I do agree that there should be an emotional connection to lessons themselves. Do the girls go independently into the lesson or is a parent always present? If you want them to develop a friendship of sorts with the teacher, it is necessary that the parent not be present.

Also, if you want them to have "wow" factor, you will be better off having them compete, as the teacher suggested.

Personally, I don't think your girls will continue if they are complaining about anything in the lessons, or you are for that matter. I adored my piano teachers and all the work they gave me, never complaining, only arguing about some finer points. I would ask the girls to cut down their other activities because it isn't just the four hours they need to practice. They also need the boredom that leads to the desire to practice.

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Originally Posted by Candywoman
... Piano will never be super-emotional. It's not like a singer singing r & b music. You can alter things stylistically but in the end, it's up to your daughters to feel the music within its own parameters.

....
I think The classic music expresses sometimes very sophisticated/implicit emotions, which requires some time and some particular events to understand (or don't). It is quite aesthetically stable over the time. We still remember Bach, Beethoven... after several centuries.

some r&bs express a more explicit and instantaneous impulsive emotion, which could be reacted immediately. It could be aesthetically very unstable over the time. How many artists do we still remember one decade ago?

That's the life, someone thinks the life is a sprint; someone thinks the life is a marathon....


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Originally Posted by zonzi
Originally Posted by Candywoman
... Piano will never be super-emotional. It's not like a singer singing r & b music. You can alter things stylistically but in the end, it's up to your daughters to feel the music within its own parameters.

....
I think The classic music expresses sometimes very sophisticated/implicit emotions, which requires some time and some particular events to understand (or don't). It is quite aesthetically stable over the time. We still remember Bach, Beethoven... after several centuries.

some r&bs express a more explicit and instantaneous impulsive emotion, which could be reacted immediately. It could be aesthetically very unstable over the time. How many artists do we still remember one decade ago?

That's the life, someone thinks the life is a sprint; someone thinks the life is a marathon....

Some years ago I read Music through the Eyes of Faith by Harold Best, at the suggestion of someone in the Boston Symphony I was corresponding with.

It suggested that music falls on a continuum between shallow and profound, and listening falls on a continuum between intensely engaged and in the background. Sorry i don't remember the specific terms. Nor what I had for breakfast. But i digress.

At any rate, the idea was that you have to balance the two. Very profound or intricate music just does not work as background noise, nor does shallow fluff music reward an intense listening focus.


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Originally Posted by Iaroslav Vasiliev
This kind of "mechanical" teachers may only be met on the lowest levels of music education. They are good at teaching basic skills, but they can't teach music. It may be that your daughters are ready for a more advanced teacher. IMO.
It is annoying how many people do not realize this. Watch a masterclass by a concert pianist, such as Bolet. Does your teacher at least partly refer to the kinds of things mentioned there? If not, it's likely that they are teaching purely mechanically, and it is not the best idea. The OP mentioned that their children were able to pick up the dynamics by listening to them or by instinct rather than by looking at the score, and that is perfectly natural as well once your ear develops.

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Originally Posted by ranjit
Originally Posted by Iaroslav Vasiliev
This kind of "mechanical" teachers may only be met on the lowest levels of music education. They are good at teaching basic skills, but they can't teach music. It may be that your daughters are ready for a more advanced teacher. IMO.
It is annoying how many people do not realize this. Watch a masterclass by a concert pianist, such as Bolet. Does your teacher at least partly refer to the kinds of things mentioned there? If not, it's likely that they are teaching purely mechanically, and it is not the best idea. The OP mentioned that their children were able to pick up the dynamics by listening to them or by instinct rather than by looking at the score, and that is perfectly natural as well once your ear develops.

If finding such a teacher is important, what books should we find with this teacher? Should this person be strictly Suzuki?


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No, you should look more closely at how a teacher teaches, not at what the books are called. How a teacher uses the materials, communicates information, what else is being taught that isn't explicitly printed in a book, etc. are all more substantive ways to evaluate teaching.

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Originally Posted by macbruins
The fact is that classical music is over most people's heads, including my kids. When my wife and I watch classical music performances on YouTube, our kids can’t get past the first 10 minutes. When they play classical music for their friends or our relatives, kids stare blankly and adults offer polite praises. Then they ask for the music they know. This steers Elizabeth and Vivian toward popular music.

So the questions I am trying to answer are, when push comes to shove, is it better to continue piano lessons with popular music, or no lessons at all? And how do I move my kids away from that point in the first place?

Hi macbruins. I can give you my opinion as a piano player and parent of 9 year old twins who are taking piano lessons.

First as a player, I took lessons from age 8 to about 13 with the neighborhood piano teacher. I later played at church and throughout high school. My lessons consisted of the Schaum and Thompson method books, plus songs I brought to the teacher that I wanted to play. I had one year of classical-only lessons at age 17 with a second teacher that was classically trained. She helped me enter the state music teacher's association piano competition which I won that year. After high school, I did not play regularly, and then not at all from my 30s onward.

At age 52, when my kids started lessons, I began playing again, and am now hooked. Piano has become the main focus of my life outside of work, and I am very glad to have a serious interest that will occupy me and bring me joy for the rest of my life. I learned the basics and how to read music from my first teacher, and that was enough for me to continue on by myself as I do today. But I wish I'd had a more serious teacher at first that would have taught me better technique, scales, drills, how to practice, etc. I find myself now having to catch up in that department. So, there is something to be said for a teacher who will give you a good foundation. That is valuable especially in the beginning.

I am not a big fan of classical music, and struggle to find classical pieces I like enough to take the time to learn. I have about 5 in my repertoire. Although most of the pieces in my more advanced method books were classical, the pieces that I retained from my youth are a few ragtimes and a boogie woogie that I chose to learn. I am glad my teacher let me learn those. So to answer your question 'is it better to continue with pop music or not at all,' definitely continue with pop music if that will keep your kids playing. I don't think it's the style of music so much as the instruction your teacher gives. Pop and jazz teachers can also lay a good technical foundation for your kids.

That being said, pop and jazz teachers for kids are hard to find. If I had to do it all over again, I wish I would have had a jazz piano teacher. I wish I understood piano chords and theory the way jazz musicians can. It is so cumbersome to try to learn that now. It would be so freeing to be able to play improvisationally. This is something I feel is sorely missing from the piano instruction we give children. Although sight reading is an important skill, to truly understand music you need to be able to think of it in terms of chords and progressions like guitar players do. Most guitar players can join in a jam session by knowing the key of the song, and follow a lead sheet. Sadly most pianists, after 8 years of piano lessons, cannot do so.

Sorry for the long-winded post. I guess my point is, it's good to have a few years of standard piano instruction under your kids' belts so they can learn to sight read. After that, if they actually have an interest in music like it seems your kids do, find a teacher that can help them both technically and musically. As an adult I took a few lessons from a local blues improv teacher who also had children as students. I think having had a teacher like that as a child could have helped me a lot, and enabled me to go so much further as an adult. So my $.02 is if this teacher isn't helping to enhance your children's love of music, look around for another teacher, perhaps one that advertises jazz and blues instruction.

Good luck. However things turn out for my kids, my hope is that when they get older, piano will bring as much joy to their lives as it does to mine. Of all the things my parents gave me, piano lessons are what I cherish most. I hope we can pass that gift onto our kids as well.


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Originally Posted by mostlystrings
... uses the materials, communicates information, what else is being taught that isn't explicitly printed in a book, etc. are all more substantive ways to evaluate teaching.

Right, exactly as you said. So what "materials" or "book"(s) does this teacher should have used or learned from? Think of it as way to narrow down the choices.


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Originally Posted by Emery Wang
Although most of the pieces in my more advanced method books were classical, the pieces that I retained from my youth are a few ragtimes and a boogie woogie that I chose to learn. I am glad my teacher let me learn those.

I really, really don't understand this mentality.

What's to stop you - or any other student - learning (or having a go at) whatever you fancy, with the skills you have acquired from learning with your teacher (or indeed, by yourself from YT or whatever)? Why does anyone need the approval of his teacher to play anything? Did you have to get permission from your English teacher when you were a kid to read a story book that your teacher didn't ask you to read?

I encourage all my students to 'branch out' as much as they like, have a go at playing stuff they've heard elsewhere - by ear (or otherwise), as well as improvise - and if they want my help, I'm there for them, though I would still continue to teach them what they need to make progress, along classical lines.

When I was a student, every music student I knew (not just pianists, but also violinists, singers etc) tried out stuff on their instruments that their teachers never taught them, whether it was pop, folk, even rock & punk. Most of us never told our teachers. I certainly never did, and I was trying to play by ear not just pop songs but also hymns that we sang at morning school assemblies (which I was fascinated by, as it was all new to me, coming from a non-Christian country).

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Pop and jazz teachers can also lay a good technical foundation for your kids.
I disagree.

That kind of music is based on RH melody and LH chords, and uses lop-sided skills - fine if all the student wants to play is pop & jazz but useless for any classical, let alone polyphonic stuff by Bach et al.
If a student only wants to learn to play pop on the piano, I'd advise him to learn by himself rather than get a teacher. There are plenty of YT videos as well as online stuff for that.

The fully-written-out pop arrangements in various books (e.g. by Hal Leonard) are all over-written in an attempt to make them "pianistic", but they sound nothing like the original songs, and most students - if pop is their main focus - would be much better advised to learn to play from lead sheets and improvise around the given chords instead. And why not sing as well?



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Most guitar players can join in a jam session by knowing the key of the song, and follow a lead sheet. Sadly most pianists, after 8 years of piano lessons, cannot do so.
I don't know how you were taught, but that too is totally foreign to me. I teach theory alongside practical, just like I was taught when I was a student. Each complements the other, and I never teach theory beyond what the student would require for his level, otherwise it becomes a pointless academic exercise rather than being of practical use.

I was never taught to play from lead sheets, yet I had no problem playing from one (the first time was in front of an audience in a bar, in fact - accompanying the singing of pop songs), simply because I knew theory and chords. How does a guitar player know how to play chords? Well, he memorizes them.....


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Originally Posted by dogperson
Is your teacher using a method book series? If yes, the series will often sell companion books of additional music at the same level. If they are in a level 2 book, look for other level 1 or 2 books.
This is a great idea! Thank you. My 8-year-old is on both Faber level 3 and Keith Snell level 3. The 11-year-old is on Faber level 5 and Keith Snell level 5. I took a quick look and saw many Faber books with popular/holiday music. In his demo videos, many arrangements seem short, probably perfect for extra-curricular work.

Originally Posted by dogperson
You weren’t able to get your teacher to help you choose music at an appropriate level? Take the first page or so …
That was what my wife and I tried, and we chose poorly; the teacher thought the pieces were not appropriate. And she didn’t want to spend time searching.

I can see her point. Her time with my kids are limited. Since I don’t know music, letting me choose is like throwing darts blindfolded. Using your analogy, I am still bumbling in the dark ages. But your book suggestion is a good idea.

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Originally Posted by Candywoman
I've read your responses but I think you are barking up the wrong tree. Piano will never be super-emotional...
Another teacher suggested some great activities and I will try them. I didn’t know such opportunities existed. (I really don’t know much about music. I think I started “listening” to music only after seeing the movie “Amadeus.”)

Originally Posted by Candywoman
I do agree that there should be an emotional connection to lessons themselves. Do the girls go independently into the lesson...
The teacher came to my house until last March, and over Zoom since. The girls love their teacher and can’t wait for their lessons every week. They just don’t want to practice. That is the reason I believe their interests in music/piano start to wane.

You could be onto something. This pause of in-person lessons may be factor.
Originally Posted by Candywoman
Personally, I don't think your girls will continue if they are complaining about anything in the lessons, or you are for that matter. I adored my piano teachers and all the work they gave me, never complaining, only arguing about some finer points.
Thank you for this. It helps me set my expectations.

I think you are very fortunate. My wife and I literally never met anyone who described piano lessons as pleasant. Those who studied would say politely they wished they could play better but complained their parents pushed too hard. Parents with kids taking lessons now would say “kids don’t know anything and learning piano teaches hard work and good for college applications.”

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You can think and rethink and overthink this (and any issue that you encounter while raising your kids) but at some point, if you decide that what you are doing isn't working, then you need to change something.

Talk to the teacher.
Or find a new teacher,
Or switch instruments
Or change direction (Gymnastics? Computer Club? Chess Club? Costume Design? Astronomy?)
The world is so full of a number of things
I'm sure we should all be as happy as kings. -Robert Louis Stevenson
Poetry?
Raft building?
Fiction writing?
Athletics?
Landscaping?
Architecture?
Visual Arts?
Egyptology?


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As for piano lessons being "pleasant," I'm not sure that pleasant is the right word, but I LOVE my lessons. Of course, I'm far from a kid and I am a big fan of good teaching (in every field), and I also have no expectation of... well... anything, and my teacher is brilliant. So there is always much for me to gain in my weekly lesson.

As for parenting a kid, I led her to as many waters as we could reasonably manage. Sometimes she drank; sometimes she pushed back, and sometimes she flat out refused. Sometimes she practiced and sometimes she didn't. And then she grew up, and now she is a cardio-thoracic surgeon, so *shrug* I dunno. That's that. Seems like she's doing ok.

That's what kids do. They find their way and grow up.
What parents do is fret along the way, and we do our best, but kids do what they do anyway.

The best advice I ever got was "enjoy the ride!"


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Originally Posted by mostlystrings
Start with programs and performances that are designed "for families"... Tom & Jerry had a similar episode "Cat Concerto" and there are a number of these old animations that you can start with.
Thank you very much for your time. You gave me a lot of useful information to think about.

This suggestion is excellent. I didn’t know symphonies have kid-friendly programs. I’ll get on their mailing lists.

We saw “Cat Concerto” a while ago. I showed it to them again, but half way I switched to an orchestra performance. My kids never reacted to an orchestra as they did this time. They remembered bits from the cartoon, and recognized portions used in other animations. Thank you.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
Do you view piano as "this is part of your education, something that is as important as math or reading, that you continue...
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
3. Sunk cost.
You asked why soccer is more acceptable. Thinking about that question clarified a few things in my mind. Musical education is important. For the long term, I want my kids to appreciate the magic of Mozart and Bach. I want them to wow laypeople like me but not necessarily experts like you. I want them to use music/piano as a bridge to other people. Therefore, in the short term, I want them to stay interested in music. But this must be balanced with other activities, especially schoolwork. In a few years, they can chart they own paths.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
I'm seeing an equating of "dynamics" with "emotion", which I think is overly simplistic.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
If she has an idea of what she wants to do with the piece (play it more artistically or something) but needs help with the physical execution, she should ask that specifically.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
Let It Go has a vocal component...
This is where my lack of musical background becomes an obstacle, and I wish their teacher could help more. When my kids say something like, “I want to make it scary” or “I want it sounds like the playground,” I can’t offer any help or directions. So often the ideas were just dropped.

My kids clearly know terms like “phrasing”, “major chord”, “diminuendo”, etc but can’t apply them. They need to be told something like “crescendo to here then back down”. Even with dynamic marks, their playing is mechanical. If you assign them new music, and ask “give me an example of phrasing when you play” or “how does that chord make you feel”, they can’t answer.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
"They loved messing with" - do they not "mess with" songs like those anymore? Why not?
This is an example of “messing with songs”: For the 2019 winter recital, Vivian, my 8-year-old, wanted to play “We Wish You A Christmas”. So I showed her several YouTube videos, including the old Hershey’s Kisses commercial. Both kids loved it and wanted to imitate the bell sound. They changed the octaves, played with pedals, tried to make the music happy/scary/dreaming, etc. After showing what they did to the teacher, my wife asked if kids can learn more about what they did. (e.g. Why is this scary?) The teacher said that would come much later.

I think my kids stopped messing with songs because mom & dad can’t help them. Often their attempts were unsuccessful. Eventually, it wasn’t fun anymore.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
If the teacher moves on quickly but you want to work on the piece more, what's stopping you from continuing to work on it or asking the teacher another question about the piece?
They don’t want to practice more than they must. The conversation goes like this:

Me: why don’t you spend more time on xxx so you’ll be better?
Kids: but teacher wants me to practice yyy.
Me: You can practice xxx on your own.
Kids: But I already practiced piano today/I haven’t finished homework/I’ll do it tomorrow/…

Thus my search for ways to encourage them but not forcing them to practice.
Originally Posted by mostlystrings
This is a bit vague. Did you ask the teacher a general question… I can easily tell them yes this is good to try now or no you should wait because of level.
My wife and I tried a few times with different approaches.

First time, probably two years ago, we asked whether popular music can be included in lessons, because we noticed relatives or kids’ friends would ask. The teacher brought a Faber book, used one song, and stopped. Most recently Vivian wanted to learn “Let It Go.” We found some arrangements online and send the teacher a few pictures. Nothing really happened, so we just bought Dan Coates’s book from Amazon, and Vivian managed to learn it herself.

Originally Posted by mostlystrings
Mainstream audiences (think nationally televised talent shows) are notoriously wow'ed …
This here is just to make sure we use the word “wow” similarly. My family watches very little “entertainment” TV, never any talent shows, although I keep watching reruns of “Murder, She Wrote.”

When I use “wow”, I’m referring to scenarios like these: When my kids’ little cousins come over, they play “Frosty The Snowman” and the cousins sing along. When grandma says “I like ‘Sound of Music’”, they play “Edelweiss”. If they sit down at pianos in a mall, their “Sound of Silence” draw a few amazed glances. When they meet new friends in college, they can accompany their friends’ singing.

Originally Posted by mostlystrings
What makes competitive soccer more acceptable than competitive piano? (She "wanted soccer" but you declined piano competition on her behalf?) Surely there is hard work involved in training/drilling for soccer.
I keep this last because competitive soccer isn’t as competitive as you think.

In my area, kids’ soccer is divided into 4 tiers. Top tier is like the Major League. Second tier is like the minor league. The third tier is like college teams. Good players in the third tier are promoted to the first two. First tier players play for soccer scholarships. These are the competitive tiers. Players need invitations to join. They are expected to attend all practice sessions. The fourth tier is like the neighborhood pickup game. Anyone can join. Practices aren’t required. Coaches try to give equal play time to every kid.

Elizabeth played in tier 4 teams and was always the worst, every year. Coaches benched her when the games were close, but she played happily and gave her best. By the end of the third year, she caught on. Because like piano some kids lost interests over time. Teams got smaller and game-day-no-shows were common. She realized she got more play time when her coach had to keep her in. So she decided to get better, and try for the more serious tier 3. Because even if she doesn’t make the cut, she won’t be the worst anymore. As you can see, this is a very low bar.

Piano is almost the opposite. Elizabeth’s teacher thought she was one of her best, and with more practices could win competitions. But she would compete against other teachers’ best. The bar is much higher.

Elizabeth isn’t musically gifted. She learns fast but music doesn’t come to her intuitively. If in a few years she decides to compete, I will support her then.

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Originally Posted by bennevis
That kind of music is based on RH melody and LH chords, and uses lop-sided skills - fine if all the student wants to play is pop & jazz but useless for any classical, let alone polyphonic stuff by Bach et al.
I learned so much here.

I noticed that in pop song videos one hand usually moves in a simple pattern. I assumed this was to simplify the technique to get more viewers.

Now you pointed out the reason, I can see this in even more places, including books and online music sheets. And I understand why classical instructions are superior. Even the simpler ones for my kids (for example Bach Solfeggietto) need both hands to move in complex ways.

I wish I knew this earlier.

Originally Posted by bennevis
I teach theory alongside practical, just like I was taught when I was a student. Each complements the other, and I never teach theory beyond what the student would require for his level, otherwise it becomes a pointless academic exercise rather than being of practical use.
Can you elaborate a bit on how you teach music theory? My kids get some theory homework in a book. Their teacher usually spends 5-10 minutes going over the pages.

Should there be practical examples or demonstrations too?

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Originally Posted by malkin
...and now she is a cardio-thoracic surgeon, so *shrug* I dunno. That's that. Seems like she's doing ok.

I hope I will do as good a job as you. That's quite an achievement, for you and for her.

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Originally Posted by josh_sounds
Right, exactly as you said. So what "materials" or "book"(s) does this teacher should have used or learned from? Think of it as way to narrow down the choices.

Yeah so once you've "narrowed down" by books, you still have to sift through teaching styles. Suzuki can be a very polarizing divide and on either "side" you'll have better or worse teachers, as well as better or worse teachers *for you*. Two "Suzuki teachers" can use the books but in different ways and might even use other materials too. Suzuki has a training and registration system; if you haven't taken any training, are you a "Suzuki teacher" or "teacher who uses Suzuki books"? And if you're like me - I use what I learned official in training and incorporate things that I learned or discovered elsewhere - are you a "teacher" or a "Suzuki teacher"? Suzuki isn't the answer for the OP; if josh_sounds is looking for a teacher, then it depends on who you're talking to and what they're saying/showing about the journey they will lead you on and how that lines up with where you want to go.

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