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mmathew Offline OP
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Not just the thuds of the keys, the metronome also drives the wife crazy sometimes. So I like to plug the digital metronome in to the DP through the line-in. This now introduces a static/buzz/hiss like (white?) noise when I use headphones. I don't believe I hear it from the speakers though.

I tried cleaning the contacts, tried a couple of different cables, even arranged them in such a way as to have as minimal surface contact as possible. While results varied re: level of noise, the noise is still there.

Any suggestions for a good 3.5mm > 3.5mm cable that works well for you?


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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Using line-in can cause ground loops. There's a built-in metronome in the N1X, isn't it good enough?


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Hello,

Your description makes me fear that another cable may not solve your noise issue, but I can't be sure from 4,120-ish miles away.

In any case, the shorter the cable, the lesser the chances of noise.

Did you try plugging your headphones directly into the metronome's output, to see if the noise is already present there? If so, a different metronome may help you out--hopefully.

Just guessing, in case it may help you.

Cheers,

HZ

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Hello,

Originally Posted by CyberGene
Using line-in can cause ground loops.

Yes, nasty stuff those ground loops, lurking in dark, unexpected corners waiting out their opportunities to get at us. Bleh!

However, a ground loop can only occur if the metronome would be plugged into a mains outlet and/or connected to other equipment than just @mmathew's piano. If it is standalone and battery-powered, it shouldn't/couldn't give groundloop problems.

Cheers,

HZ

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mmathew Offline OP
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Using line-in can cause ground loops. There's a built-in metronome in the N1X, isn't it good enough?

I got quite used to my BOSS DB-60 metronome, which lets me quickly program the rhythm of the classical pieces I am studying. Nothing complicated at all for intermediates and advanced - but for me, the rhythm trainer helps. Now I know the N1X and most if not all DPs, provide some built in rhythms, and they can be a little cumbersome to select and recall. I prefer the BOSS that lets me program and play loops to match different parts of the same piece.

That said, once I have learnt the notes and rhythm, I don't rely on the BOSS; I switch to the N1X's built in metronome, counting just the quarter notes (mostly).


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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mmathew Offline OP
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Originally Posted by HZPiano
Did you try plugging your headphones directly into the metronome's output, to see if the noise is already present there? If so, a different metronome may help you out--hopefully.

HZ

It's definitely the cable. No noise at all if I connect the headphones to the metronome. As clean as a beat. I tried with a Korg KDM-3 - same result - noise only when using the cable.

If I can't find a solution -

- I'll have to try using some of the inbuilt rhythms
- Learn to count using "the usual" suarter note beats
or - I guess I'll have to put the effort to count myself, in my head :-|

The last one hurt my confidence so bad I couldn't learn anything for a while.


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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Originally Posted by mmathew
I guess I'll have to put the effort to count myself, in my head :-|

The last one hurt my confidence so bad I couldn't learn anything for a while.

You count in your foot, not in your head. Your head is busy doing more important things than counting. smile


"I think it's the excitement only a free man can feel; a free man at the start of a long journey, whose conclusion is uncertain." -- Morgan Freeman's character, "Red", in The Shawshank Redemption
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Hosa makes good cables at reasonable prices. I use Hosa a lot. This is $10 for 3 feet.
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...nterconnect-rean-3.5-mm-trs-to-same-3-ft

One of Monoprice's premium cables for $7
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=34573

Rapco is $18 and seems to have fancy connectors (but not the premium branded ones)
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...-trs-male-to-3.5mm-trs-male-cable-3-foot

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Originally Posted by mmathew
It's definitely the cable. No noise at all if I connect the headphones to the metronome.

Or it's the audio input itself. In which case a better cable doesn't help.

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Hello,

I was silly enough to take a peek in the DB-60 manual fer ya, in there it says '*Do not connect any other device to this jack'. So maybe, just maybe it doesn't work well into a line input. Yet, because it's quite common to use the headphone outs of phones, mp3-like players etc. into line level inputs, I'd say it shouldn't be too naughty an act to still do so with the metronome as well.

So we figured it is not a ground loop, the noise is not present with headphones directly connected to the metronome, and if one of the nice cables suggested by @newer player doesn't do the trick, chances are that @clothearednincompo is right about the N1X's line input. Which you may be able to verify with another sound source (of the sorts mentioned above) played at no or low volume into the same line input using the same nice cable.

Should none of this work out... it's on to @SeaDrive's remarks 😉.

Cheers and happy tempi,

HZ

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Hello,

Here's yet another thought:

Assuming the N1X line input has its own volume/level control (technically: input gain control), if you have to crank that up significantly beyond halfway/twothirds to get a usable level, then the output power of the metronome is simply too low to be used this way and then that may well be the culprit regarding your noise issue.

If a more moderate gain setting gives you a usable level, then all in my previous comment still applies.

Cheers and happy tempi,

HZ

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I don't see how an analog cable can create hiss. This is probably a case of non matched impedances; and probably the metronome outputs in mono and the cable is stereo... Try using the same cable to connect the output of any standalone music stereo device (phone, ipod, whatever) and check if the signal is now clear. If it is, then the cable is ok (my bet) and the metronome does not output at 5v or uses a mono connector.

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mmathew Offline OP
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Originally Posted by SeaDrive
Originally Posted by mmathew
I guess I'll have to put the effort to count myself, in my head :-|

The last one hurt my confidence so bad I couldn't learn anything for a while.

You count in your foot, not in your head. Your head is busy doing more important things than counting. smile

Hard enough to just get my right foot to pedal correctly. But I'll try. I keep my left foot like a prop as I lean forward, will have to try it out. Wow, so much demands on limbs and senses - overwhelming, but I guess after the initial push and struggle it becomes easier.

Originally Posted by newer player
Hosa makes good cables at reasonable prices. I use Hosa a lot. This is $10 for 3 feet.
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...nterconnect-rean-3.5-mm-trs-to-same-3-ft

One of Monoprice's premium cables for $7
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=34573

Rapco is $18 and seems to have fancy connectors (but not the premium branded ones)
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/de...-trs-male-to-3.5mm-trs-male-cable-3-foot
Thank you newer; having spent thousands on a DP - I'm not going to spare a relatively negligible expense - I'm going to try these out in addition to improving self-counting.


Originally Posted by clothearednincompo
Originally Posted by mmathew
It's definitely the cable. No noise at all if I connect the headphones to the metronome.

Or it's the audio input itself. In which case a better cable doesn't help.

You mean the jack on the DP? Or the sound of the metronome itself?


Originally Posted by HZPiano
Hello,

Here's yet another thought:

Assuming the N1X line input has its own volume/level control

HZ

The N1X doesn't have a line in volume control :-(


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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Originally Posted by vagfilm
I don't see how an analog cable can create hiss. This is probably a case of non matched impedances; and probably the metronome outputs in mono and the cable is stereo... Try using the same cable to connect the output of any standalone music stereo device (phone, ipod, whatever) and check if the signal is now clear. If it is, then the cable is ok (my bet) and the metronome does not output at 5v or uses a mono connector.

The metronome's manual says:

Connector: PHONES Jack (Stereo miniature phone type).

The cable is stereo - I don't know if there is a 3.5mm mono cable. The N1X manual says (AUX IN - Stereo mini.)

I haven't tried connecting my phone. Let me see if I can find the silly lightning to 3.5mm short cable which I know is lying around somewhere.

But this actually gives me an idea. If I can find a metronome app that can do everything the BOSS does, and if I can play that sound over bluetooth - that'll be a cool solution! thx @vagfilm!


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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Hello @mmathew,

Hope you have seen both my posts of this morning (see above).

Regarding:

Originally Posted by mmathew
The metronome's manual says:

Connector: PHONES Jack (Stereo miniature phone type).

The cable is stereo - I don't know if there is a 3.5mm mono cable. The N1X manual says (AUX IN - Stereo mini.)

This is why I went to check the DB-60 manual, to see if that output would be a mono or stereo jack. Since it's stereo, that definitely is the cable type you want, with 3.5mm stereo jacks on both ends.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

HZ

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BTW, when you connect headphones directly to the Boss, do you hear the "beeps" on both sides (left and right ear)?

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Originally Posted by HZPiano
Hello @mmathew,

Hope you have seen both my posts of this morning (see above).

Regarding:

Originally Posted by mmathew
The metronome's manual says:

Connector: PHONES Jack (Stereo miniature phone type).

The cable is stereo - I don't know if there is a 3.5mm mono cable. The N1X manual says (AUX IN - Stereo mini.)

This is why I went to check the DB-60 manual, to see if that output would be a mono or stereo jack. Since it's stereo, that definitely is the cable type you want, with 3.5mm stereo jacks on both ends.

Hope this helps.

Cheers,

HZ

Thank you HZ!

Originally Posted by vagfilm
BTW, when you connect headphones directly to the Boss, do you hear the "beeps" on both sides (left and right ear)?
Yes I hear the beeps on both sides!


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
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If it is a ground loop, you may be able to solve the problem with an inexpensive ($10-15) ground loop isolator. Search Amazon for "ground loop isolator".

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Originally Posted by hes
If it is a ground loop, you may be able to solve the problem with an inexpensive ($10-15) ground loop isolator. Search Amazon for "ground loop isolator".

Hello,

@hes, Nice to know these devices can so easily be obtained and in such a large variety! There is a caveat, though: not many of these deliver as promised without introducing other problems such as sound quality degradation (not the end of the world in the case of metronome beeps/clicks, of course).

And to prevent confusion: in @mmathew's case it is definitely not a ground loop that causes his noise issue.

Cheers,

HZ

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HZ is correct. Battery operated devices will not suffer from ground loop.

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