2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad) Piano Sight Reading
train piano sight reading with your iPhone or iPad
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
35 members (EB5AGV, danielp11, CyberGene, CharlesXX, desordre, clothearednincompo, Damien PG, David B, 8 invisible), 435 guests, and 581 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Hi all,

I have just got a new Kontakt (full) library which features a Fazioli F212 and really sounds wonderfully to my ears. I have just installed it and like it a lot. The Ambisonics version seems interesting and for me is a primer on a piano library.

Sound sample: Chopin - Impromptu in A flat major, Op. 29




WEB site:

Pianoforte by Audio Brewers


Enjoy!

Jose


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 306
J
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
J
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 306
This looks interesting, the Fazioli F212 is a great instrument. Here is a nice demo and interview with the CEO of Audio brewers.


"Everything should be made as simple as possible, but not simpler." - Albert Einstein
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Originally Posted by johanibraaten
This looks interesting, the Fazioli F212 is a great instrument. Here is a nice demo and interview with the CEO of Audio brewers.

Yes, I found out about this library there, yesterday. It is huge, about 50GB compressed. It has "up to 24 velocity layers" according to the creators. And were sampled manually. The sound is very warm, I like it


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 493
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 493
Not surprised EB5 has acquired another VST.

Pleasantly surprised to see a (what appears to be good) Fazioli based VST! Thanks for sharing!


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
G. K. Chesterton
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,739
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,739
Can't say I'm impressed, the Impromptu sounded muddy and hollow, though some like it that way. Not saying it's bad, but I don't see this new library bringing anything new to the table.


Me on YouTube

Casio PX-5S. Garritan CFX, Production Grand 2 Gold, Concert Grand LE, AcousticSamples C7, NI Giant, Sampletekk White Grand, Choc. Audio Steinbach, and a few more. Kontakt 5. Reaper.
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Originally Posted by TheodorN
Can't say I'm impressed, the Impromptu sounded muddy and hollow, though some like it that way. Not saying it's bad, but I don't see this new library bringing anything new to the table.

This library has plenty of settings and mics. Also, that demo is intended for Ambisonics, it seems. I am using it in stereo and still going through the settings, which are quite a bit!


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Originally Posted by mmathew
Not surprised EB5 has acquired another VST

I was very fortunate to get it in the giveaway of the presentation. At that price, could not resist thumb


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 298
H
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
H
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 298
Hello,

Originally Posted by johanibraaten
This looks interesting, the Fazioli F212 is a great instrument. Here is a nice demo and interview with the CEO of Audio brewers.

Hey! There's our Simeon again. A long video though, perhaps it can be my 'tv' for tonight 🤔.

Thanks for sharing!

Cheers,

HZ

PS Oh boy! It requires full Kontakt. To me, that is a hard brake to full Stop. May still be watching Simeon though--out of curiosity.

Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,739
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,739
I listened to the SoundCloud demos as well, and unless they were all using Ambisonics, my opinion remains the same. Maybe they weren't all muddy, but there was nothing in them that impressed me.

Last edited by TheodorN; 04/17/21 08:28 AM.

Me on YouTube

Casio PX-5S. Garritan CFX, Production Grand 2 Gold, Concert Grand LE, AcousticSamples C7, NI Giant, Sampletekk White Grand, Choc. Audio Steinbach, and a few more. Kontakt 5. Reaper.
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,673
U
1000 Post Club Member
Online Content
1000 Post Club Member
U
Joined: Dec 2018
Posts: 1,673
While interesting, requiring full kontakt is a no go for me.

And I'm happy for my bank account.

Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Originally Posted by U3piano
While interesting, requiring full kontakt is a no go for me.

And I'm happy for my bank account.

I bought, about two years ago, on a very good offer, an upgrade to Komplete 12 CE, as price was about what Kontakt 6 alone cost. I am glad I did, as it opens quite a lot of opportunities for both free and paid libraries. And, as I said on a previous message, my account is also relieved as I was so fortunate to get a free licence for this library (the moment I won it is on the Simeon video). So far, so good grin


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 298
H
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
H
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 298
Originally Posted by EB5AGV
I was so fortunate to get a free licence for this library (the moment I won it is on the Simeon video). So far, so good grin

As you are a loyal Simeon fan, congratulations are in order!

😉

Cheers,

HZ

Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 111
D
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
D
Joined: Oct 2006
Posts: 111
Newer player pointed me to this one a few weeks ago because it can be mixed down to binaural, and I think you can get head tracking to work. But it's no easier a setup than my binaural VR piano, and possibly more difficult because decoding happens in realtime.

Barrier to entry is too high for me, but interested in what others think.


1928 Mason & Hamlin Model A
Play it as a VI HERE and binaurally HERE
Yamaha PF85, Formerly Kawai KG-1D
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
After some hours playing, my experience on the Stereo version is so far good. There are some small glitches on mixer window, for example when you want to remove pedal noise and you change mics, even if the selection is not marked, the system loads and plays damper pedal samples. So you need to mark and unmark the setting again to remove it.

But, sound wise, if there is some lack of crystaline clarity, as you find on the VSL pianos, the sound is suitable for a variety of genres. The different mics are interesting and very different among some of them, as the soundboard one compared to ear or frame mics. And there are plenty of effects to work with... Is a deep library, for sure.


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Mar 2021
Posts: 440
E
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
E
Joined: Mar 2021
Posts: 440
What do they mean manually sampled. That's not going to be nearly as consistent as VSL's solenoid plunger.

Last edited by EinLudov; 04/18/21 01:13 PM.
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Originally Posted by EinLudov
What do they mean manually sampled. That's not going to be nearly as consistent as VSL's solenoid plunger.

In the Simeon Amburgey video, Alejandro Cabrera, founder of Audio Brewers, explains it. I recall he said that they tried the plunger approach but they found that it was less musical than hand playing. Anyway, it is better to check his comments directly there, I may be wrong on my words.

In my experience, I have not found inconsistencies so far.


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1
A
Junior Member
Offline
Junior Member
A
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 1
Hi there! We just found this post and want to let you know that we have issued an Update for Pianoforte's Sustain Pedal Bug.

If it wasn't for this post, we wouldn't have noticed the bug, please do not hesitate on letting us know about any bug or suggestions directly. You can reach us by Social media or by e-mail at hello@audiobrewers.com, it is thanks to bug reports that we can keep our instruments tidy, and it helps a lot to have the bugs reported directly.

---

Regarding the 'Manual Sampling' question - we Sampled Pianoforte 'by hand' (pun intended) instead of using an automation mechanism, and then manually adjusted each velocity zone to adapt to its strength against the higher/lower and neighboring zones - this might have taken us perhaps countless of more hours than using a mechanism, but ultimately, while doing our research on how best to approach sampling, we found robots simply didn't have "that something" when striking a key, there was a connection missing and the sound simply 'wasn't there'.

It might be subjective? But again, each piano contains unique characteristics in each of the keys, and the only way to find and adjust these characteristics is by having the connection the musician has to the instrument, a robot will not know a fortissimo is actually a fortissimo, but it will simply translate a pressure. I guess we took the long way, but in my years sampling instruments (and trust me, I've done way too many haha), the most valuable lesson I've learned is that nothing will ever beat the human touch. This goes both for music, but also for sampling.


This is our humble opinion and approach to music, by no means we're saying it is the correct one, it simply is what we consider the best approach regardless of it being longer and more painful (especially when there are 1:30+ minute tails!) :P

----

Regarding the questions and comparison to binaural recordings, the difference between a stereo binaural recording and an Ambisonics translation is the rotation, in a binaural recording your left/right ear will always hear exactly the same, regardless on how your head is positioned. With an Ambisonics, the sound behaves differently depending on how the rotation of your head is, so the sound arriving your ears is always precise to how it would be in real life.
You can certainly emulate rotation with plugins, but again, an emulation will perhaps not translate signals correctly as it doesn't have information on how the sonic sphere really is, but it can only guess through algorithms.
Regarding its setup, if you use a DAW it shouldn't be very difficult (our site contains a lot of documentation).

Finally, to remind you that Pianoforte also comes in Stereo, so if you don't care for Ambisonics, you still have a piano in Stereo with different Mic Positions and Mixes... and well, since you ALSO have the Ambisonics version (both come included), you are future-proof for the day you want to explore.

I hope I could answer some of the questions and if you have more, please do not hesitate!


Audio Brewers - Are You Listening?

https://www.audiobrewers.com
Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 493
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 493
Welcome Audio Brewers to PW! Glad you're here, and I hope that you stay engaged with this wonderful group here. If you don't already know, the diverse and knowledgable folk here have helped fine tune and improve major products from major manufacturers, by giving their valuable feedback - so I hope for great things to come from you folks!


A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
G. K. Chesterton
Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 493
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
Joined: Jan 2021
Posts: 493
Originally Posted by HZPiano
As you are a loyal Simeon fan, ...
😉

Cheers,

HZ

#RhetoricalQuestion
Are there really more detailed, informative, engaging and more personal videos than Simeon's? He's amazing!

Last edited by mmathew; 04/27/21 07:26 AM.

A man must love a thing very much if he practices it without any hope of fame or money, but even practice it without any hope of doing it well. Such a man must love the toils of the work more than any other man can love the rewards of it.
G. K. Chesterton
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
500 Post Club Member
OP Online Content
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Sep 2019
Posts: 560
Originally Posted by Audio Brewers
Hi there! We just found this post and want to let you know that we have issued an Update for Pianoforte's Sustain Pedal Bug.

If it wasn't for this post, we wouldn't have noticed the bug, please do not hesitate on letting us know about any bug or suggestions directly. You can reach us by Social media or by e-mail at hello@audiobrewers.com, it is thanks to bug reports that we can keep our instruments tidy, and it helps a lot to have the bugs reported directly.

---

Regarding the 'Manual Sampling' question - we Sampled Pianoforte 'by hand' (pun intended) instead of using an automation mechanism, and then manually adjusted each velocity zone to adapt to its strength against the higher/lower and neighboring zones - this might have taken us perhaps countless of more hours than using a mechanism, but ultimately, while doing our research on how best to approach sampling, we found robots simply didn't have "that something" when striking a key, there was a connection missing and the sound simply 'wasn't there'.

It might be subjective? But again, each piano contains unique characteristics in each of the keys, and the only way to find and adjust these characteristics is by having the connection the musician has to the instrument, a robot will not know a fortissimo is actually a fortissimo, but it will simply translate a pressure. I guess we took the long way, but in my years sampling instruments (and trust me, I've done way too many haha), the most valuable lesson I've learned is that nothing will ever beat the human touch. This goes both for music, but also for sampling.


This is our humble opinion and approach to music, by no means we're saying it is the correct one, it simply is what we consider the best approach regardless of it being longer and more painful (especially when there are 1:30+ minute tails!) :P

----

Regarding the questions and comparison to binaural recordings, the difference between a stereo binaural recording and an Ambisonics translation is the rotation, in a binaural recording your left/right ear will always hear exactly the same, regardless on how your head is positioned. With an Ambisonics, the sound behaves differently depending on how the rotation of your head is, so the sound arriving your ears is always precise to how it would be in real life.
You can certainly emulate rotation with plugins, but again, an emulation will perhaps not translate signals correctly as it doesn't have information on how the sonic sphere really is, but it can only guess through algorithms.
Regarding its setup, if you use a DAW it shouldn't be very difficult (our site contains a lot of documentation).

Finally, to remind you that Pianoforte also comes in Stereo, so if you don't care for Ambisonics, you still have a piano in Stereo with different Mic Positions and Mixes... and well, since you ALSO have the Ambisonics version (both come included), you are future-proof for the day you want to explore.

I hope I could answer some of the questions and if you have more, please do not hesitate!

Great news!, Yes, I posted the pedal inconsistencies, will try soon new version.

Thanks!

Jose


Yamaha U3H
Kawai VPC1
...plus some other DPs, synths, controllers and VSTs

[Linked Image]
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
Couch to Concert Hall
Couch to Concert Hall
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
cheap sponge instead of felt?
by chopin_r_us - 05/14/21 05:17 AM
First International Stretto Piano Festival
by Rhonda B - 05/14/21 04:19 AM
Kurzweil SP88X
by Micahjd - 05/14/21 02:24 AM
Steinway Sale this weekend?
by Gombessa - 05/13/21 10:41 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics206,920
Posts3,093,348
Members101,513
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers

Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | MapleStreetMusicShop.com - Our store in Cornish Maine


© copyright 1997 - 2021 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5