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Since Corona prevents me from visiting my local piano dealer (he carries Yamaha, Schimmel and Sauter), I try to make use of people’s knowledge in this forum.

I am interested in the particular characteristics of upright pianos from this brand. Are they similar in sound? Or rather different? I know that some people might find it hard to talk about brands, rather then about specific models. But quite often brands have a certain direction in terms of their tonal qualities.

Of course I tired to find sound examples on youtube. But maybe some people here know better where to find recordings of those to brands.

In terms of their build quality, I expect them to be in the same league. Am I right?

Thank you in advance for every tip.

P.S. I have a Schimmel 130T. This is my point of reference.

Last edited by zeitlos; 02/18/21 05:08 PM.
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Since you mentioned that you have a Schimmel and also mentioned Sauter, I assume you are only considering the SE line of Seiler (German) instead of the ED line of Seiler (Samick factory in Indonesia)?

Just to get that question out of the way right away.


I do music stuffs
Yep, I have a YouTube channel!

Current:
1998 PETROF Model IV Chippendale
LEGO Grand Piano (IDEAS 031|21323)
YAMAHA PSR-520

Past:
2017 Charles Walter 1500 in semi-polish ebony
1991 Kawai 602-M Console in Oak
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zeitlos Offline OP
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Yes, you are right. smile

I really tried to find sound examples on youtube for both brands. But well, not that much to find. For a couple of weeks now I’ve been waiting for local stores to reopen again. But we all know we need patience right now. So maybe I can get some first ideas here.

Last edited by zeitlos; 02/18/21 05:18 PM.
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You should wait to try them out yourself. No YouTube recording is going to be definitive enough to make a good decision since what you hear is dependent on your speakers, the recording equipment used, and what, if anything, was mixed into the recording. Posters opinions are just that. Now add in the real difficulty to describe tone and touch even by experts.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 02/18/21 05:27 PM.
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Of course I won’t make a decision, not even a bad one based on Youtube or posts. smile As soon as I can go to the piano stores, I will. However, I’m curious about Sauter and Seiler pianos. Maybe someone here has experience and is willing to share it. I’m okay with personal opinions. smile That’s what Internet forums are about smile

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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
You should wait to try them out yourself. No YouTube recording is going to be definitive enough to make a good decision. Posters opinions are just that. Now add in the real difficulty to describe tone and touch even by experts.
The poster is in Germany, and I believe they are locked down very tightly (for who knows how long) to the point where the OP literally cannot try any pianos in person, period. It's a tough time.

There is a video on YouTube of a German Seiler upright vs the ED one. The salesperson says they sound the same and you can't tell the difference, but I commented that it's bull, and you can hear an incredible difference and much better experience with the SE Seiler, even with their crappy microphone in a vibrant salesfloor.

So, you can listen online and get a "ballpark" experience. But beyond that, ya, pianoloverus is totally right, of course.


I do music stuffs
Yep, I have a YouTube channel!

Current:
1998 PETROF Model IV Chippendale
LEGO Grand Piano (IDEAS 031|21323)
YAMAHA PSR-520

Past:
2017 Charles Walter 1500 in semi-polish ebony
1991 Kawai 602-M Console in Oak
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Originally Posted by SonatainfSharp
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
You should wait to try them out yourself. No YouTube recording is going to be definitive enough to make a good decision. Posters opinions are just that. Now add in the real difficulty to describe tone and touch even by experts.
The poster is in Germany, and I believe they are locked down very tightly (for who knows how long) to the point where the OP literally cannot try any pianos in person, period. It's a tough time.
That's why I suggested he wait.

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zeitlos Offline OP
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What I found of course: This Seiler here indeed sounds brighter to me than I’m used to from my Schimmel. Not sure, if it’s the recording, the model etc. Or maybe current production Seiler are a bit brighter in general than those from other brands?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGN3l-6ZcII

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Originally Posted by SonatainfSharp
There is a video on YouTube of a German Seiler upright vs the ED one. The salesperson says they sound the same and you can't tell the difference, but I commented that it's bull, and you can hear an incredible difference and much better experience with the SE Seiler, even with their crappy microphone in a vibrant salesfloor.

Thank you! I will try to find it on Youtube and listen to it.

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If you want to try the Schimmel Konzert 132 here is one in Reimeling in Bavaria I believe., Besides they may sell Sauter or Seiler as well....
Sorry I mean Riemeling


https://www.klaviano.com/pianos-for-sale/schimmel/schimmel-k132.html

Last edited by Lady Bird; 02/18/21 07:57 PM. Reason: spelling
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Originally Posted by SonatainfSharp
Since you mentioned that you have a Schimmel and also mentioned Sauter, I assume you are only considering the SE line of Seiler (German) instead of the ED line of Seiler (Samick factory in Indonesia)?

Just to get that question out of the way right away.

Sonatain
I believe I read you were had decided to buy a Seiler grand. Is that still your plan ? Just interested ! (in anything piano )

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Originally Posted by Lady Bird
Originally Posted by SonatainfSharp
Since you mentioned that you have a Schimmel and also mentioned Sauter, I assume you are only considering the SE line of Seiler (German) instead of the ED line of Seiler (Samick factory in Indonesia)?

Just to get that question out of the way right away.

Sonatain
I believe I read you were had decided to buy a Seiler grand. Is that still your plan ? Just interested ! (in anything piano )
I was going to buy an ED Seiler grand, but something came up with the house this weekend, and as a homeowner, sometimes that takes a huge bite out of your budget. So, ya...I don't know. It might end up being a brand new SE Seiler upright instead---waaay less money, and honestly, an SE upright could arguably be better than an ED grand, but maybe I am just saying that to make myself feel better. (I am still open to a grand piano, but for the same price it would have to be something that started out high quality and is now quite used; based on how much I play, a heavily used grand in the same price range might not last that long. We will see. I hate piano shopping so much.)


I do music stuffs
Yep, I have a YouTube channel!

Current:
1998 PETROF Model IV Chippendale
LEGO Grand Piano (IDEAS 031|21323)
YAMAHA PSR-520

Past:
2017 Charles Walter 1500 in semi-polish ebony
1991 Kawai 602-M Console in Oak
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,296
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by SonatainfSharp
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
You should wait to try them out yourself. No YouTube recording is going to be definitive enough to make a good decision. Posters opinions are just that. Now add in the real difficulty to describe tone and touch even by experts.
The poster is in Germany, and I believe they are locked down very tightly (for who knows how long) to the point where the OP literally cannot try any pianos in person, period. It's a tough time.
That's why I suggested he wait.
Wait to buy, of course! But they are just information-gathering/opinion-gathering/window-shopping via the forum for now. ::shrug::


I do music stuffs
Yep, I have a YouTube channel!

Current:
1998 PETROF Model IV Chippendale
LEGO Grand Piano (IDEAS 031|21323)
YAMAHA PSR-520

Past:
2017 Charles Walter 1500 in semi-polish ebony
1991 Kawai 602-M Console in Oak
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 1,296
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Originally Posted by zeitlos
Originally Posted by SonatainfSharp
There is a video on YouTube of a German Seiler upright vs the ED one. The salesperson says they sound the same and you can't tell the difference, but I commented that it's bull, and you can hear an incredible difference and much better experience with the SE Seiler, even with their crappy microphone in a vibrant salesfloor.

Thank you! I will try to find it on Youtube and listen to it.
I went through my comment history going back before the time I know I watched the video, and the video is gone. Perhaps the piano(s) sold, and the guy took the video down. It was a store's channel.


I do music stuffs
Yep, I have a YouTube channel!

Current:
1998 PETROF Model IV Chippendale
LEGO Grand Piano (IDEAS 031|21323)
YAMAHA PSR-520

Past:
2017 Charles Walter 1500 in semi-polish ebony
1991 Kawai 602-M Console in Oak
Joined: Aug 2018
Posts: 6,676
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SonatainfSharp,
Well I am sure you will find the right piano when the time comes.
We have our own home , but it is rather old.(made in the 50's
wood Canadian house) and yes when things come up, they do take a big chunk of money. I remember when we had to replace the heating system. Then there was the time when a water pipe broke.Fortunatly my old Kawai grand was not affected. It also missed my old U1., But the hard wood floors had to be replaced ! 😕
But of course these things come first.
Seiler ( ED) make very nice grands I believe. I have not tried them but have tried the uprights. (was impressed) At times I miss my old grand piano , but a good upright can nice too.

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zeitlos Offline OP
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Thank you "Lady Bird": I will surely also try to play a Schimmel K132. I'm curious to find out where it differs in comparison to my 130T.

Let's see, maybe someone who knows Sauter and Seiler uprights alike can comment on those two brands characteristics.

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Originally Posted by zeitlos
Thank you "Lady Bird": I will surely also try to play a Schimmel K132. I'm curious to find out where it differs in comparison to my 130T.

Let's see, maybe someone who knows Sauter and Seiler uprights alike can comment on those two brands characteristics.
IMPO Seiler is sweeter. Sauter is also sweet, but you cannot find candies or jellies there. When playing Beethoven on Sauter, I hear the sound of a man with firm belief who never swerves no matter what other people say, and he is always full of confidence to change everybody's mind! ha

When I play a grand and move on to an upright of the same brand, it sometimes makes me disappointed and miserable:"Do they share the same workmanship or same idea of art?" Fortunately this never happens on these premium German uprights from my unforgettable experiences.

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What you said about the quality being in both the grands and the uprights is something I have experienced as well aesop.
The ones I am talking of are the Schimmel K132 and one of the medium sized Konzert model grands. I have no doubt this is the same with Classic Schimmel models. (from what I have heard from a proffesional member of PW.)
With Sauter I have played a number of the upright models and grands in Vancouver and in Europe. So yes both the uprights and grands are exquisite.

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My experience with modern Seiler is rather limited .I am sure they are all very well made. Even those not made in Germany.


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