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Originally Posted by danlightbulb
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
As far as I can tell this free version does not have resonance/pedal down samples. Take that into account when you make up your mind about the sound quality.

I cannot find any info on their site. Did they update the pro version of the instrument? The GUI screenshots look different. Is there some kind of changelog, did they make any changes to the scripting, or introduce fixes etc?

I wasn't sure what samples this meant when I read the information, but surely even with the wrong samples (?) the note shouldn't just immediately cut off as soon as you hit the switch on the pedal? My pedal is acting like a crude on/off switch right now.

The problem is that if I was thinking of buying a VST like this, then this issue would put me off. How do they expect to entice me to buy the full version if I have this problem in the free one? Because I have no way of knowing if this problem would be fixed in the full version. These products should be offered as full 30 day evaluations, no limitations.
Even 3 days would be enough, problem is most virtual pianos are a lottery...


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Originally Posted by Digitalguy
Originally Posted by danlightbulb
The problem is that if I was thinking of buying a VST like this, then this issue would put me off. How do they expect to entice me to buy the full version if I have this problem in the free one? Because I have no way of knowing if this problem would be fixed in the full version. These products should be offered as full 30 day evaluations, no limitations.
Even 3 days would be enough, problem is most virtual pianos are a lottery...

Well, there is one exception and that is Pianoteq. Unfortunately, I do not love its sound enough to purchase it (even though I don't dislike it as viscerally as some other people on this forum)

Other than Pianoteq, I totally agree with you and that is why I have not purchased any virtual piano. If it's important for enough people like you and me, and if enough people would stop buying, they will notice and they will switch their policies. But it sounds most people don't care about buying something that they don't like and just keep it sitting around in their computer (or so I notice reading comments from people here), so the companies get away with it.

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Thank-you that worked fine! I think I have a lot to learn.


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Originally Posted by danlightbulb
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
As far as I can tell this free version does not have resonance/pedal down samples. Take that into account when you make up your mind about the sound quality.

I cannot find any info on their site. Did they update the pro version of the instrument? The GUI screenshots look different. Is there some kind of changelog, did they make any changes to the scripting, or introduce fixes etc?

I wasn't sure what samples this meant when I read the information, but surely even with the wrong samples (?) the note shouldn't just immediately cut off as soon as you hit the switch on the pedal? My pedal is acting like a crude on/off switch right now.

The problem is that if I was thinking of buying a VST like this, then this issue would put me off. How do they expect to entice me to buy the full version if I have this problem in the free one? Because I have no way of knowing if this problem would be fixed in the full version. These products should be offered as full 30 day evaluations, no limitations.

If I understand you correctly you are talking about half pedalling. This piano does not have that, the pedal behaves like a on off switch if I remember correctly. That's not particularly nice while live performing but from my memory this is one of the more lenient pianos when it comes to that (I found it much more irritating in other libraries, but can't name one from the top of my head).

What I meant is that, while you press the pedal down, you do not hear recordings of the real piano while the pedal was pressed down, but rather a emulation of the sound.

The resonances of the pedal down samples are one of the stronger points of this piano, that's why I wanted to say to be aware of this while playing and testing this, because the sound of the full version is gonna be very different while you press the pedal down.

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Originally Posted by Del Vento
Originally Posted by Digitalguy
Originally Posted by danlightbulb
The problem is that if I was thinking of buying a VST like this, then this issue would put me off. How do they expect to entice me to buy the full version if I have this problem in the free one? Because I have no way of knowing if this problem would be fixed in the full version. These products should be offered as full 30 day evaluations, no limitations.
Even 3 days would be enough, problem is most virtual pianos are a lottery...

Well, there is one exception and that is Pianoteq. Unfortunately, I do not love its sound enough to purchase it (even though I don't dislike it as viscerally as some other people on this forum)

Other than Pianoteq, I totally agree with you and that is why I have not purchased any virtual piano. If it's important for enough people like you and me, and if enough people would stop buying, they will notice and they will switch their policies. But it sounds most people don't care about buying something that they don't like and just keep it sitting around in their computer (or so I notice reading comments from people here), so the companies get away with it.

It's not the only exeption but the best one among the few. Still not good enough for me either... I rembember some months ago, VSL offered 30 day demo licences. I only read it when it was too late. But I really wonder why, with their exhoribtiant prices, they don't offert this option to everyone... From what I have read here people speak highly of the Syncron D-274, but the same was troe for the also very expensive Vienna Imperial which I bought but didn't really like that much... So unless they do those demos again, I'll never consder buying from them again. It's a pity since with their dongle there is zero risk of piracy, so it's really stupid not to offer this possiblity....


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Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
Originally Posted by danlightbulb
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
As far as I can tell this free version does not have resonance/pedal down samples. Take that into account when you make up your mind about the sound quality.

I cannot find any info on their site. Did they update the pro version of the instrument? The GUI screenshots look different. Is there some kind of changelog, did they make any changes to the scripting, or introduce fixes etc?

I wasn't sure what samples this meant when I read the information, but surely even with the wrong samples (?) the note shouldn't just immediately cut off as soon as you hit the switch on the pedal? My pedal is acting like a crude on/off switch right now.

The problem is that if I was thinking of buying a VST like this, then this issue would put me off. How do they expect to entice me to buy the full version if I have this problem in the free one? Because I have no way of knowing if this problem would be fixed in the full version. These products should be offered as full 30 day evaluations, no limitations.

If I understand you correctly you are talking about half pedalling. This piano does not have that, the pedal behaves like a on off switch if I remember correctly. That's not particularly nice while live performing but from my memory this is one of the more lenient pianos when it comes to that (I found it much more irritating in other libraries, but can't name one from the top of my head).

What I meant is that, while you press the pedal down, you do not hear recordings of the real piano while the pedal was pressed down, but rather a emulation of the sound.

The resonances of the pedal down samples are one of the stronger points of this piano, that's why I wanted to say to be aware of this while playing and testing this, because the sound of the full version is gonna be very different while you press the pedal down.

I don't really know what half pedalling means, all I know is on my DP voices, the pedal is not just off or on, there is a tiny range where its sort of muted. It gives a bit of leniency I think if you slightly miss the pedal up timing. On this virtual piano, if I bring the pedal up a millisecond too early it just cuts off the note really abruptly (no delay or echo or nothing), which doesn't sound good when it happens.

Im not really fussed that the samples aren't different, this is more about the controlability of it.

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Just downloaded the pianoteq7 trial and the pedal behaves as I would expect, so I think the on/off behaviour of the Hammersmith (free version at least) is a limitation for me.

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Is this the best free piano VI?

Today, I really enjoyed playing the Hammersmith. Given the price, I think it is definitely worth a try. Spend a few minutes tweaking it in Kontakt also (round-robins, mechanical noise, pedaling, velocity curve..).

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Originally Posted by newer player
Is this the best free piano VI?

Today, I really enjoyed playing the Hammersmith. Given the price, I think it is definitely worth a try. Spend a few minutes tweaking it in Kontakt also (round-robins, mechanical noise, pedaling, velocity curve..).

How do you find the cut off of the note when you come off the sustain pedal?

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Pianoteq has better pedal behaviour. . .

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I imagine very many (most?) piano players- those who aren't fairly advanced classical players for whom half-pedalling is crucial- won't have a problem with the sustain pedal on this piano. It's a very well sampled (21 velocity layers) and programmed piano, It is free and runs on a free player. To complain that its pedalling behaviour isn't as good as that of several hundred dollar virtual pianos seems a bit ...inappropriate?

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Lack of half-pedaling can be swallowed, although for me it's the absolute no-go, but if it's for non-classical music is kind of OK. However re-pedaling is the one which is very important, and not just single-repedaling but also repeated ones. So, does it support re-pedaling?

Last edited by CyberGene; 12/14/20 05:53 AM.

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With this free version, the notes sounding when the pedal is pushed are sustained, but it doesn't appear to have string resonance of other strings. So over-pedalling sounds way less muddy than with the real thing, hehe.

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I am a casual player (and I don't play classic music) and I don't care too much about half-pedaling and repedaling, as long as the sustain pedal feels good to me and not too muddy


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Originally Posted by applegrove
I imagine very many (most?) piano players- those who aren't fairly advanced classical players for whom half-pedalling is crucial- won't have a problem with the sustain pedal on this piano. It's a very well sampled (21 velocity layers) and programmed piano, It is free and runs on a free player. To complain that its pedalling behaviour isn't as good as that of several hundred dollar virtual pianos seems a bit ...inappropriate?


Im not a classical player and its a problem to me. Not because I deliberately use or need half pedalling (or even know what it is technically), but just during normal play if you're using the pedal to sustain a note whilst moving your hands to a new chord or location, the abruptness of pedal cut off can end the note too soon, and the slight gap in sound this makes is noticeable. This is more true if pumping the pedal quickly in a fast passage.

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I continue to swing from one opinion to the other on this piano.

I think its influenced greatly by raw volume. If I try to play it with the volume lower, it loses all the depth and sounds very tinny. With the volume up to where a genuine acoustic would be, it sounds far better.

How much would the sound be influenced by the missing samples, i.e the string resonance? Would it sound far richer?

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Also the Pearl piano is on sale now, only 69$ with a discount if you subscribe to them for the first time. I'm now thinking about buying either Hammersmith or Pearl... sadly it seems like there are not many opinions on these so far!!


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Originally Posted by danlightbulb
I continue to swing from one opinion to the other on this piano.

I think its influenced greatly by raw volume. If I try to play it with the volume lower, it loses all the depth and sounds very tinny. With the volume up to where a genuine acoustic would be, it sounds far better.
I need to have my headphone volume set at "normal" grand levels (and velocity curves too) for set up else any VI sounds and plays odd. After set-up I might try to adjust to not blow out my ears.

- If you have the headphone amp at a very low volume, you might be playing the keys very hard, registering high midi velocities which we don't tend to use.

- If you have it at higher volumes, you might be playing the keys normally, registering normal midi velocities.

A California Jazz recording studio has a Yamaha grand which can record midi also; the engineer stated midi velocities ranged from high 50s to low 90s. These are pros and rarely hit 90 so the average player might use a smaller range. If your velocities are way out of this range, maybe adjust the headphone volume, velocity curves, etc.

I use midi-ox to troubleshoot midi; it shows velocities also so you can see if you are playing "normal" velocities.
https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/articles/how-do-i-install-and-use-midi-ox-for-windows/

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Hammersmith Pro holiday sale + extra discount $239 >> $99

Source:

https://discuss.cakewalk.com/index.php?/topic/23851-sonccouture-hammersmith-pro-for-9950/

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Hammersmith Pro demo video by Simeon Amburgey.

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