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Originally Posted by JoBert
The two front legs and the base (that has the pedals) are three pieces. During assembly, these three pieces are assembled first, to form a three legged "table", sort of. The main body is then put on top of this "table" and fastened in place, and electronic plugs connected between the two units.
So in reverse, you can unplug the plugs (for this you have to open a back panel) and unfasten the top, and then you have two units to transport:
The base with the two front legs still attached, and the main body.
The base+legs unit is not too heavy and should be easy to carry by two persons.
The main body however is *very* heavy. I estimate 90-100kg. In addition, it is unwieldy (not easy to grab on to) and has some protruding bits on the bottom (that go into the base when assembled) so it cannot be put down on the floor without risk of damage.
So to transport the piano in this fashion, you need a proper place to rest the main body on (without risking damage to those protruding bits) while you carry the base+legs, and you need to have at least two strong persons to carry the main body itself (unless your family is into lifting weights as a hobby, that is not something for mom+dad to carry).

TL;DR It is possible, but watch out for the bits at the bottom of the main body, and you need two people that can carry 90-100kg (in form of a big, unwieldy, difficult to grip box) between them without problems.

Thank you JoBert very much for this detailed answer, now I have a good idea and would rather think twice if I would like to move it around the house myself (with a second person).


Originally Posted by Seif Maher
Please check this post. It will give you an idea of what you need to do.

It is very heavy, and the user manual says that you should carry it from some specific points such as the corners. I highly recommend that 4 people carry it, then it will be “easy”.

Thank you Seif Maher for pointing me to your post with the illustrating photos.


Originally Posted by ˆTomLCˆ
...and I recommend you have the movers assemble it on the 2nd floor. They have the gear needed to haul a grand up those stairs. The NV10 will not be a problem for them. And of course if they drop it it's their problem. If you drop it?

Thanks ˆTomLCˆ!

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Thoughts on this :

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/ins...s-sound-system-12-000-digital-piano.html

I'm interested in buying either an N1X or NV10. I prefer the NV10 action, but have heard many reviews regarding the bad speaker system... Should i be worried about how poor it is? I wanted to run garritan cfx through one and also play the onboard sounds obviously.

Maybe the N1X has the superior sound system with the spatial (better than stereo) sampling system/speakers? Does Kawai adopt something similar in the nv10? I currently own a ca99, but if I play too loudly through it with a vst like garritan, the speakers on the ca99 distort badly... Like they can't cope with the vst.

£7500 the NV10 costs... And with that you get a great action but a sub-par speaker system... I don't understand, such a dilemna.

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Where did you get that the N1X has the superior sound system? That wasn‘t my impression from what I read here on the forum. For example iirc Tyrone wrote that he thought the NV10‘s speaker are better, but he bought the N1X because he plays 99% on headphones and liked the N1X‘s headphone sound better.

Try them out yourself, then decide.


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Originally Posted by mwf
I'm interested in buying either an N1X or NV10. I prefer the NV10 action, but have heard many reviews regarding the bad speaker system... Should i be worried about how poor it is? I wanted to run garritan cfx through one and also play the onboard sounds obviously.

Having been active in both NV-10 and N1X threads, I don't agree at all that there's any consensus that the NV-10 speakers are bad/worse. If anything, most people seem to say that they're quite excellent, and consistently better sounding than the N1X. In fact, my recollection is that most who playtest both find the NV-10 is superior for speaker output, while the N1X may be superior for headphone play due to preference for the binaural sampling. When I tested the NV-10 against the N1/N2/N3X, I absolutely found the NV-10 speakers better than the N1.

With all that said, I don't think you should be "worried" about it. Everything in the above paragraph is anecdotal, and you may agree or completely disagree with any of it. If you're choosing between the two, what you should worry about is buying sight-unseen. Try to find and play test each one and then make a decision on your own. That entirely addresses/negates what other people claim, because the sound/speaker quality is entirely an issue of user preference.

Originally Posted by mwf
Maybe the N1X has the superior sound system with the spatial (better than stereo) sampling system/speakers? Does Kawai adopt something similar in the nv10?

Kawai's Pianist Mode sound engine has multi-channel sampling, but the actual output is stereo only. It's been kind of hinted that the sound engine has the separate multichannel samples and mixes them real-time for each rendering character, but it's been a bit hard nailing down any Kawai reps on that point smile

Originally Posted by mwf
I wanted to run garritan cfx through one and also play the onboard sounds obviously.

If you want to do this through speakers, then the N1X has the advantage of a digital line-in through its built-in USB audio interface. The NV-10 has a very customizable analog line-in, but when I tried to use it with Garritan CFX, the Mac I was using generated a ground loop from the separate USB + line-in that I found distracting. This was a problem with the Mac rather than the NV-10, but in the end it still killed that effort. I did however use the NV-10 with Garritan for a long time through headphones, and really enjoyed the ease at which I could switch from headphones + VST to speakers + built in engine with storeable favorites that included all my preferences including rendering character, ambiance, touch curve, and local control settings (total control over settings for VST + built-in sounds) all just a single tap away.


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[/quote]
If you want to do this through speakers, then the N1X has the advantage of a digital line-in through its built-in USB audio interface. The NV-10 has a very customizable analog line-in, but when I tried to use it with Garritan CFX, the Mac I was using generated a ground loop from the separate USB + line-in that I found distracting. This was a problem with the Mac rather than the NV-10, but in the end it still killed that effort. I did however use the NV-10 with Garritan for a long time through headphones, and really enjoyed the ease at which I could switch from headphones + VST to speakers + built in engine with storeable favorites that included all my preferences including rendering character, ambiance, touch curve, and local control settings (total control over settings for VST + built-in sounds) all just a single tap away.[/quote]

Really appreciate the replies thank you.

With regards to playing vsts through the digital piano, currently i have a laptop hooked up to my ca99 via a steinberg ur22, so the set up is usb lead from laptop to ca99 and an audio lead from ur22 to line in socket on ca99... This i find simple and effective and almost no ground loop noise, in fact there is none at all, sometimes there is though but it dissapears or I don't notice it enough to care.

I would use this set up on the nv10 and I presume it would work exactly the same and I would have no ground loop noise. So the benefits of the n1x audio interface don't matter to me whatsoever, i already have a decent steinberg ur22 audio interface.

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Originally Posted by mwf
Thoughts on this :

https://www.diyaudio.com/forums/ins...s-sound-system-12-000-digital-piano.html

I'm interested in buying either an N1X or NV10. I prefer the NV10 action, but have heard many reviews regarding the bad speaker system... Should i be worried about how poor it is? I wanted to run garritan cfx through one and also play the onboard sounds obviously.

Maybe the N1X has the superior sound system with the spatial (better than stereo) sampling system/speakers? Does Kawai adopt something similar in the nv10? I currently own a ca99, but if I play too loudly through it with a vst like garritan, the speakers on the ca99 distort badly... Like they can't cope with the vst.

£7500 the NV10 costs... And with that you get a great action but a sub-par speaker system... I don't understand, such a dilemna.

I would prioritize the action without any hesitation. I haven’t tried the action of the N1X, but if you tried both and you prefer the NV10, go with it.

You can solve the speaker system in so many ways, but you cannot make the action feel better.


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The nv10 was released October 2018 if I'm not mistaken...

Is it risky to buy an old model tech wise? It uses outdated samples too, ones used in ca78/98, inferior to my ca99 samples. I wonder if a nv20 is planned 2021/2022...

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Originally Posted by mwf
[/quote]

With regards to playing vsts through the digital piano, currently i have a laptop hooked up to my ca99 via a steinberg ur22, so the set up is usb lead from laptop to ca99 and an audio lead from ur22 to line in socket on ca99... This i find simple and effective and almost no ground loop noise, in fact there is none at all, sometimes there is though but it dissapears or I don't notice it enough to care.

I would use this set up on the nv10 and I presume it would work exactly the same and I would have no ground loop noise. So the benefits of the n1x audio interface don't matter to me whatsoever, i already have a decent steinberg ur22 audio interface.

This is exactly what I do and it works fine. I have my headphones plugged into the piano headphone jack. Which allows me to adjust the volume from the piano also. And to use the internal sounds, I simply choose another favorite.


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Only Kawai knows when they plan refreshes. The only comparable we have is the AvantGrand, which Yamaha chose to refresh over an 8-10 year cycle. I think that due to the cost/halo image of these hybrids, we shouldn't expect a "typical" 2-3 year refresh cycle.

Originally Posted by mwf
The nv10 was released October 2018 if I'm not mistaken...

In the US, it was released Dec 2017/Jan 2018 IIRC, just before Winter NAMM.


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Wow its pretty much 3 years old then... Should this be a factor in deciding between the much newer N1X or old nv10. When was N1X released I wonder...

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When choosing a piano from among a set of candidates, decide which one feels best and sounds best.
Originally Posted by mwf
Wow its pretty much 3 years old then... Should this be a factor in deciding between the much newer N1X or old nv10. When was N1X released I wonder...
If there's a "newer" model that you like less would you buy that rather than an "older" model that you like more?

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Interesting how N1X has two 13cm speakers and complements it with another single 16cm woofer. And uses an odd number of 8cm speakers.

Whilst the NV10 relies on also 1 16cm woofer, blends the 8cm and 13cm range into four 10cm speakers, and adds 2 more tweeters for sparkle.

And if we are comparing using these set ups for general audio output, what it means is, we are doin saying the incoming external sound signals need to be reproduced in a balanced way through these two set ups. Ideally if there is another pair of like two-way hifi speakers within the piano cabinet, and the incoming sounds get played through them, and they are balanced output, that might be good.

Yamaha and kawai tuned their output setup with these are typical sets of speakers for good reason, because it's either you tune your sound input (samples, sounds processing / equalisation) or you tune your output (speaker configuration, sound board, speaker direction / dispersion). But if we want to output general audio, we would want a standard set of hifi config speakers. So those who use the piano to play orchestral music and play the piano on top of that, might do better trying to play orchestral recordings through hifi speakers, and play the piano using piano speakers. This also simulated more correct resonance because you don't want your piano cabinet to directly resonate when the tympani or other instruments play.

I have neither N1X or NV10 to compare in showrooms so I looked for you tube recordings that use mic recording, not line out. There are about 3 such you tubes that side by side compare NV10 to something else. There is some difference heard in especially the bass, and some also on the clarity/ sparkle. Less objective would be to compare non-side by side mic recorded you tubes. Or comparing such YouTubes where mic recorded N1X gets compared side by side to model X, and NV10 compared to model X, and inferring from there.

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Hi everyone - question: when you hold a note it plays forever without any decay. Is there a setting to make this more like an acoustic where the note dies off even if you're holding it down? I looked under the settings but couldn't find anything

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Originally Posted by Heddy
Hi everyone - question: when you hold a note it plays forever without any decay. Is there a setting to make this more like an acoustic where the note dies off even if you're holding it down? I looked under the settings but couldn't find anything

Huh, the NV-10 doesn't do this, at least on the acoustic piano sounds. Do you have a recording, and can you say what settings you're using?

Most DPs have exactly the opposite problem, their sustain is WAY too short. Higher DPs at least use methods such as long sampling and looping to keep the decays going more naturally. On the bass notes, a large grand may sustain a decay for over 2 minutes.


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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Hello titowsky,

You don't state where you are based, however if you have any concerns with your piano, I would certainly recommend contacting the dealer and/or Kawai distributor/subsidiary in your region for assistance.

Kind regards,
James
x

For information, I contacted per email the Kaway Service here in Germany, and precisely the same person who supported me to fix the issue I had since the beginning with the NV10 display (various lines of dead pixels). I copied also my piano dealer from Konstanz.
I attached to my communication some references to this forum reporting the same buzz/hissing issue and the following video that is very similar to what happens also on my instrument:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=youtu.be&v=m4QkOn0GXbE&app=desktop

After 4 days I did not yet get a reply, but I will keep you informed.

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Wasn’t there a bug in some of the CA-series where a note won’t decay because of a wrong sample looping?


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Dear community, my purchase of a Novus 10 is getting closer and closer and slowly I'm getting weak knees to spend so much money and if it will be the right decision... well i still stick to that instrument

And there are still three rather secondary questions that come to my mind that maybe one of you can answer:

1. Does the Novus 10 come with a keyboard dust protection cloth (Tastenläufer)?

2. Does it also simulate Overtones? I mean can one produce audible overtones (like holding down C1 without sounding it and triggering sound of C1 by playing a loud staccato on C2). I totally forget to test that during my numerous tests at the dealer.

3. Somewhere I picked up that the headphone sound of Yamaha's N1x is somewhat "better" than the Novus 10's (In general regardless of the used headphones) It has been argued that the N1x sound would be more pleasant and the headphone sound is rather not so pleasant, especially in the deeper, more pressing sounds. What do you say and is there any significant technical difference in terms of headphone (line out) sound?

Cheers Tim

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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Wasn’t there a bug in some of the CA-series where a note won’t decay because of a wrong sample looping?

Oh I hadn't heard of that issue, and needless to say I've ever encountered it. But I could see how that would be unacceptable, unless of course you were trying to play John Cage's ASLSP!

Originally Posted by timitalia
1. Does the Novus 10 come with a keyboard dust protection cloth (Tastenläufer)?

With the caveat that different countries have different accessories in the box, yes, it comes with a red felt runner for the keyboard. Based on discussions here, I'm probably one of the few people who actually use it smile

Originally Posted by timitalia
2. Are Overtones simulated as well , I mean can one produce audible overtones (like holding down C1 without sounding it and triggering sound of C1 by playing a loud staccato on C2). I totally forget to test that during my numerous tests in at the dealer.

The SK-EX Rendering Engine is ESPECIALLY good at these kinds of sympathetic resonances. You can absolutely hear the overtone you describe, not only in C1, but also up in the last octave and a half (the undamped section) as well. This latter part in particular is more noticeable in SK-EX Rendering than in the older HI-XL sample set.

The gotcha here is that in the current firmware, it's harder to get into the state of triggering the sympathetic resonance by silently holding down a key, because doing so is now unlikely to trigger a silent note-on. You can however quietly play C1, let it naturally decay out, and then strike other keys to hear the resonance.

Originally Posted by timitalia
3. Somewhere I picked up that the headphone sound of Yamaha's N1x is somewhat "better" than the Novus 10's (In general regardless of the used headphones) It has been argued that the N1x sound would be more pleasant and the headphone sound is rather not so pleasant, especially in the deeper, more pressing sounds. What do you say and is there any significant technical difference in terms of headphone (line out) sound?

That's really a matter of personal preference, and I would recommend trying each piano to see if you like the binaural CFX patch. Most people say they like it because it's "binaural" or recorded using a dummy head with microphones in the ear, so that you get a more realistic rendering of the sound "in 3d space." I think in reality, the binaural nature has little to do with the realism, and at least part of the perception comes from the use of a dummy head being naturally far-mic'd, so it records the sound of the piano at the player's perspective, rather than right above the strings. In any case, I wasn't particularly taken with the binaural CFX sample when I tested the N3X, since I was regularly using Garritan CFX and just focusing on the action, but I felt it was a fine sample and there was nothing wrong with it.

Also as when I tested the NV-10 at the shop, I brought my laptop and headphones and just played it for the action, without much care for the onboard sounds since I was using Garritan. But lately I've been playing the onboard sound exclusively and it's really just beautiful. I think Kawai and Yamaha both have excellent samples in their hybrids. Just my $0.02.


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1. Yes
2. Not sure
3. Compared to the Yamahas the Headphone Quality is "okay". It's a bit boomy and somewhat muffled where the Yamaha is more on the clear side.


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Originally Posted by timitalia
Dear community, my purchase of a Novus 10 is getting closer and closer and slowly I'm getting weak knees to spend so much money and if it will be the right decision... well i still stick to that instrument

I'll leave to others answering the more technical questions you asked, but I'll add that

1. you can buy the dust protection cloth quite inexpensively on Amazon, if it doesn't come with it (and I use it all the time on my Yamaha NU1)

2. what you are feeling is quite normal and common. I felt it every single time I made a purchase of something even mildly expensive. See Buyer's Remorse for details and don't worry :-)

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