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I will be relocating from the US to Europe shortly, and I need to figure out what to do with my Kawai Novus NV10.

If I move it to Europe, is it OK for it to be handled by regular movers? I still need to figure out if my movers will be willing to move it, depending on their size/weight/value limitations. Also, once in Europe, I think it should be working with a voltage transformator, but I'm not sure if the frequency difference (50 vs 60 Hz) can cause an issue?

Another option, is for me to resell it here and buy another one in Europe. What would be a fair resale price (bought new on Sept 2018) on the second-hand market, and where would be a good place to find potential buyers (in NY area) ? Note I'm not a professional, I'm just requesting for advice, so not trying to "advertise" my good. Maybe there is a section for that in this forum?

What do you think would be the most advisable way to handle this situation?

Thx!

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Shipping cost, insurance, plus any import duties and VAT might make this a uneconomical. VAT rates in Europe are typically ~20% but application varies by country.

The Novus rarely comes to market used. I think there was a guy on PianoBuyer from Newer Hampshire selling a Novus last autumn; search my posts as I may have quoted that firm ask price. For reference, you can also look at the AvantGrand ask prices, many of which I posted here. I don't think your warranty transfers so that reduces value somewhat.

Also, asset values are significantly lower than they were in 2019 and there are probably not many buyers with liquidity. In light of these issues, paying to export might be the only realistic option. Only way to know if you can sell and finding a clearing price in current environment is to try.

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What country are you moving to?

A power converter should be fine but UK has a different plug then the rest of the European countries.

You don’t pay VAT for used products that you already payed VAT for in your country.

Might be expensive to move so might be a good option to send and rebuy if you get a good deals. Depend on country it might be smart to check the currency and how the $ is valued in relation to local currency.

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Hello JasperK,

Originally Posted by JasperK
If I move it to Europe, is it OK for it to be handled by regular movers? I still need to figure out if my movers will be willing to move it, depending on their size/weight/value limitations.

Assuming that you no longer have the original carton box and packaging that the NV10 was shipped in, I believe it should be okay for the piano to be handled by "regular" movers, although they would need to treat the instrument as if it were an acoustic upright or grand piano - this may incur a separate cost.

Originally Posted by JasperK
Also, once in Europe, I think it should be working with a voltage transformator, but I'm not sure if the frequency difference (50 vs 60 Hz) can cause an issue?

Yes, a voltage converter will definitely be required. I do not believe the frequency difference will be an issue, however I'm afraid I am not an expert on such matters.

If you are able to sell the instrument for a good price, and then purchase another NV10 in Europe (either new or second hand, if you're able to find one), I believe this might be the best option.

Do you intend to remain in Europe for the foreseeable future?

Best of luck with your move!

Kind regards,
James
x


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I agree with Boboulus re the VAT.

There may be exceptions for import duties since you are moving to a country in a Europe with your piano (eg. via immigration) rather than importing something into a country that you already live in. So you will want to check with the country’s customs office that you’re moving to.


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You should be able to move your stuff tax-free assuming you have permanent residence. there could be a limit though, so check UK policy.

I would also check with Kawai directly if they could offer something like replacing the power block from 110/60 to 220/50. Some of the dealers in UK can also be able to help with that. Send an email to Bonners.

Transformer delivering enough watts would be ... large. it's not a 50W iphone or something.

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No large transformer needed. The power consumption is only 60 watts.
Originally Posted by Sebastian FL
Transformer delivering enough watts would be ... large. it's not a 50W iphone or something.

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Have you called local Kawai stores and asked if they would want to buy it? Call a few stores for the best deal. You won’t get a price close to what you paid for it anyway, and so add in the loss as a portion of the cost of moving. You may even be surprised at the price of a new NV10 in Europe. IIRC, prices are lower in Europe. You avoid all the hassle and get to buy a new piano! yippie



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FWIW, I live in NYC and looking to upgrade from my Roland DP-603, and would consider a second-hand NV10. Feel free to message me.

Last edited by digpiano; 04/29/20 04:19 PM.

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WIN WIN



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Hello everyone,

Thank you all for your replies.

To clarify, I'm moving back to my home country (France), so yes, I will remain there for the foreseeable future. My company is paying for the move, and I'm still trying to figure out if the hired moving company will be authorized to add it to my container alongsode my regular furniture. Pianos are excluded from the deal, but this piano being an hybrid it's not clear for now how what will classify it as. Does the Novus cross the line enough to be considered a piano, I'm not sure. I think the matter with pianos is the sheer weight, the strings, the metallic frame etc. This doesn't apply to the Novus.

Additionally, is there any particular instructions as to how to handle the main body? Can the main body be put on the sides, upside down, toppled, etc, or does it require to remain upside up? How fragile are the mechanical parts (hammer, keys, action,...)? Do the action / hammers need to be latched to avoid for them to fly up in all directions during transfer?

I haven't called any store yet, still trying to figure out if the move is worth the hassle and the stress.

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Since you bought the NV-10 used, the first owner already took the big hit. If this piano is in the same condition as when you it brought home, your loss may be minimal since it's still a current and well-sought-after model. After having moved many times, I've learned sometimes it's better to let things go. Hang on to things you can't replace, liquidate the rest and start fresh once you've settled into your new place.
May I asked where in France you're moving to?

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I bought it new, so I will be the one to take he big hit wink
I'm not very good at moving sentimentally, but I get your point. I think what upsets me the most is that I will be without a piano for 3 months, the time I find a new place, buy a new piano, wait for delivery. I will be relocating to Paris (harder to find a suitable place but easier to get a new piano quickly...).

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Rent or buy a digital for the period without. There are some nice portables, including a French one you should support

https://pianodevoyage.com/

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Would you be able to go back to where you bought the NV10 for packaging advice and possibly specialized packing boxes?

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Jasper congratulations on your move to Paris, a city I love and a place I'd love to live if it weren't so expensive.

If you could pay a bit extra to your company to move the piano with your belongings, that might be the best route forward for you. The voltage won't be an issue with the appropriate adaptor.

If you can't do that, sell the Novus NV10 in the USA before you leave. The retail price of the NV10 is so much more in the USA than it is in Europe, and you may even find that you can sell it for a high enough price that allows you to buy a new one in France. I'm sure the last I checked the NV10 was something like $16,000 in the USA and under €10,000 in Europe so you know it seems almost a no-brainer unless there's some sentimental reason to keep that particular NV10. Instead of waiting for a piano for 3 months you could also call ahead to one of the piano shops, I think they're all located near Gare St. Lazare in Paris, and rent an upright for a few months or even have a Kawai CN-whatever it is now sent to your apartment and have it unboxed and ready for you to use on your arrival.

Good luck! I envy you, I'm kind of champing at the bit to get back to Europe but I have another four semesters to go before I'm Dr. Fleetwood.


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Originally Posted by Joseph Fleetwood
I'm sure the last I checked the NV10 was something like $16,000 in the USA and under €10,000 in Europe so you know it seems almost a no-brainer unless there's some sentimental reason to keep that particular NV10.

A little lower in EU, yes. But not that much of a difference. From the latest reports, in the US anything under $10k is a great deal (there are some reports of $9xxx delivered), with a number of sales in the 10-11k range. In Europe, it looks like the NV-10 sells for about 8800EUR including VAT, which is about $9500.


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I guess one deciding aspect for me will be to know how fragile the action is and if it's prone to damage during handling and transit, if the main body allows to be turned upside down, this kind of things..
I would be grateful if anyone should share some knowledge on this.
Thx!

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I don't know how pianos are moved globally.

New consumer goods typically are boxed, palletised, and containerised at the factory. There is some engineering behind this to minimise damages and costs. So shipping a bunch of pianos from a Japanese factory wrapped up in this steel container to the US is a relatively safe proposition.

The boat rides can get very hot and humid so some goods, especially fresh foods, utilise refrigerated containers. I would imagine expensive goods also use the temp controlled option but don't know about pianos. I should remember but don't.

Shipping small parcels is more challenging as you can imagine.

As noted above you should use a mover that specializes in international piano moves, door-to-door, and provides a generous insurance scheme.

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I'm a month late... but perhaps you haven't moved yet... you moved with your piano and use an adapter... or someone else with the same question finds this thread in the future. For power, your best bet is to check with the Kawai directly. Unless Kawai has changed their power supplies, it might not be an issue at all. The CA-95 is easily changed over from USA to EU power. There isn't a switch on the outside, but you can open up the power supply and swap it over manually. A technician changed mine over after I moved from the USA to Switzerland. It took about 5 minutes. Kawai Global was quick to respond to my question, and tremendously helpful. Mad props to Kawai... they even offered to walk me through it if I wanted/needed to do it myself after I moved!


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