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I can’t hear anything unusual either. Maybe I don’t know what to listen for. BTW, I would have thought that was an acoustic piano in the recording.

Can you find a demo model in a store and confirm whether it doesn’t exhibit what you hear?


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We don't have all the same ears...

Globally I am not fond of the sound. And there's this resonance.

The more I hear the piano, the more I have the feeling of hearing an mp3 record. There's exactly what we can hear when hearing a sound format with loss.

Never mind. I bought it for the keyboard. I knew the sound was bad.
But I thought that it was no so bad.

I always think there's a lot of harmonics and it's rich compared to my ES8.

But it is so artificial...

Last edited by BachToTheFuture; 02/29/20 03:14 PM.

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Originally Posted by BachToTheFuture
We don't have all the same ears...


That may be it. Or it could be that recordings don't capture well what you hear live (I've certainly experienced this, I recently reported a similar issue to Kawai that half of the folks here couldn't hear on a recording, but in my case Kawai is fixing it with a forthcoming firmware update). After all, if your family hears it too, it's probably not just you wink


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Originally Posted by N1X-Guy

Would anyone know the following - - - Music editing aside, will the best (most acoustically realistic) N1X recording be achieved using MIDI (and a quality VST from the likes of Synthology or Garritan) or just using native Audio (using my Steinberg UR22 audio interface box) as exported from N1X?


This is an excellent important question that I’ve wondered about as well. Is there a quality difference comparing a wav file recorded directly from the N1X via USB stick vs a MIDI file converted to audio?

Originally Posted by Frédéric L
The N1X supports audio over USB. Then instead of converting to analog then back to digital, a direct digital record would certainly be prefered. You can also record a WAV file on a USB drive.


So for the highest audio quality the best route is to record a wav file directly to a USB stick?


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BachToTheFuture, I think it’s important to establish whether what you hear is a defect or is the normal sound that you simply don’t like. The first one is something that dealers should, well, deal with, namely to replace/service the piano. If it’s just that you don’t like the sound, well hopefully you can return it. If you prefer the Kawai sound, then maybe a NV10 is a better option. But first try to find a demo model and determine whether it’s a defect or just sound preference. I can hardly imagine how an ES8 has richer sound with more resonances than the N1X though. IMO it’s a defect. But we can’t hear it from low quality camera recordings. And it’s not there with WAV export. I’m afraid there’s not much else we can suggest.

Last edited by CyberGene; 02/29/20 03:29 PM.

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Originally Posted by CyberGene
BachToTheFuture, I think it’s important to establish whether what you hear is a defect or is the normal sound that you simply don’t like. The first one is something that dealers should, well, deal with, namely to replace/service the piano. If it’s just that you don’t like the sound, well hopefully you can return it. If you prefer the Kawai sound, then maybe a NV10 is a better option. But first try to find a demo model and determine whether it’s a defect or just sound preference. I can hardly imagine how an ES8 has richer sound with more resonances than the N1X though. IMO it’s a defect. But we can’t hear it from low quality camera recordings. And it’s not there with WAV export. I’m afraid there’s not much else we can suggest.


Yes, I called my dealer already, I am waiting for a response, but I am afraid it won't be quick.
I just wanted to know, as you say, if all it's OK, and if the sound is correct or if there is some defect, or some tuning to do.
I noticed that the firmware is 1.0, perhaps there is some update to do.
I don't think I would go for an NV10 because I already played a CA98 and didn't like the sound (with my personal headphone too).

That doesn't stop me working the piano, I played hours today. All the scales, arpeggios, and my favorite pieces and begin to learn some others.
The keyboard is perfect and I really have the feeling playing a real piano.


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Originally Posted by Pete14
I wonder if ‘looping’ on an instrument like the N1X is kept at a minimum (not noticeable during normal playing) by sampling just enough of the original note without having to capture the entire duration of it. A concert grand note can ring forever and perhaps there’s just no need to sample it entirely.[...]
On a vintage Steinway Model D one of the longest note is C2 (about 40 seconds long!) according the samples of the Ivory 2 American Concert D. And it rings in many different and interesting ways for its entire length. But in average, on most notes, after about 15 seconds, the volume is so low that you can no longer tell if its looped or not. And the notes in the last 2-3 octaves are very short, less than 10-15 seconds in their full length.

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Originally Posted by BachToTheFuture
Here is a record with my camera : https://www.dropbox.com/s/ykpss0w112a80la/N1X_%20001.MTS?dl=0

I clearly hear the resonance ; I play repeatedly the B key, where it begins. And it is so for an octave (roughly).

(It is digitalized at 48 kHz, so no problem with Shannon ;-) )

What I hear is just a more boomy and resonant sound probably caused by the camera mic (and the natural resonances from the room). Nothing strange.

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Originally Posted by magicpiano
Originally Posted by BachToTheFuture
Here is a record with my camera : https://www.dropbox.com/s/ykpss0w112a80la/N1X_%20001.MTS?dl=0

I clearly hear the resonance ; I play repeatedly the B key, where it begins. And it is so for an octave (roughly).

(It is digitalized at 48 kHz, so no problem with Shannon ;-) )

What I hear is just a more boomy and resonant sound probably caused by the camera mic (and the natural resonances from the room). Nothing strange.


It's not the camera. I hear it with my headphone. I hear it while playing with my headphone and while hearing the camera record. It has nothing to do with some room acoustics modes.

Another thing, the more the master volume is high, the more the hi pitched sounds are of poor quality.
Exactly that you have with a cheap amplification. (headphone or direct)


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Originally Posted by BachToTheFuture
Here is a record with my camera : https://www.dropbox.com/s/ykpss0w112a80la/N1X_%20001.MTS?dl=0

I clearly hear the resonance ; I play repeatedly the B key, where it begins. And it is so for an octave (roughly).

(It is digitalized at 48 kHz, so no problem with Shannon ;-) )


It doesn't sound any different than mine. Although it seems my iPhone mic captures more stop rail thumping compared to your camera.

Here is my CFX internal sound (#1) in the same register you recorded.



It might just be that you don't like the N1X internal sound. I prefer my VST's over it. However, I could live with it if I didn't have any piano VST's.

God Bless,
David


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Try to disable the reverb and all the resonance effects you can disable (aliquot resonance, undamped string resonances, etc.). And if you have some EQ options, try to find the offending frequency range and lower it.

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I’d be interested in how this story ends. If it turns out there’s an audio amplification/chain defect, then this will be the first major problem of this type reported for the N1X. There was the soft fall hinges problem reported so far which seems to be an assembly problem with probably poor training of assembly workers (and possibly a manufacturing/design problem which allowed for the assembly workers to screw the hinges badly in the first place).

Last edited by CyberGene; 02/29/20 06:35 PM.

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As to the sound. As David said, VST-s might still have an edge which IMO holds true generally when comparing multi-GB sample libraries to digital pianos (Nords included since their samples are not that huge). I’m using Garritan CFX Lite for my latest DIY project and realize it’s still a great sound. It lacks this ultimate velocity touch response, utmost fluidity and sense of complete package, and it doesn’t have the VRM but is nevertheless a slightly more beautiful sound. Also when listening to recordings, I definitely prefer sample based VST-s. But playing the piano live: the N1X is still unbeaten.

Last edited by CyberGene; 02/29/20 06:45 PM.

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Originally Posted by CyberGene
I’d be interested in how this story ends. If it turns out there’s an audio amplification/chain defect, then this will be the first major problem of this type reported for the N1X.


Most is you guys use the on-board sound right? If there is a such a defect, wouldn't everyone hear it? I think it's much more likely at this point that there is an individual unit defect that led to an amplification issue, as opposed to a widespread design defect that affects many/all units.... Anyone can get a one-off dud, but that's very different from a more widespread major problem (or maybe that's what you meant?)


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Originally Posted by JJHLH
So for the highest audio quality the best route is to record a wav file directly to a USB stick?


You have the choice : recording directly a WAV file on a USB stick or recording digitally with a PC connected by USB. The N1X will be seen as an audio interface like the UR22 (and with the same driver). Both way are digital and should be equivalent (but I have not tested).


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Originally Posted by Frédéric L
Originally Posted by JJHLH
So for the highest audio quality the best route is to record a wav file directly to a USB stick?


You have the choice : recording directly a WAV file on a USB stick or recording digitally with a PC connected by USB. The N1X will be seen as an audio interface like the UR22 (and with the same driver). Both way are digital and should be equivalent (but I have not tested).


Thank you.

That’s what I’ve been doing but just wanted confirmation this was the proper way to get the best recording (as opposed to using MIDI). Having the built in audio interface makes it very easy.


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Thanks for the comments regarding N1X recording. I'll try recording N1X audio without an audio interface box, and instead record WAV file from N1X via USB output to computer or USB stick.

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Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by CyberGene
I’d be interested in how this story ends. If it turns out there’s an audio amplification/chain defect, then this will be the first major problem of this type reported for the N1X.


Most is you guys use the on-board sound right? If there is a such a defect, wouldn't everyone hear it? I think it's much more likely at this point that there is an individual unit defect that led to an amplification issue, as opposed to a widespread design defect that affects many/all units.... Anyone can get a one-off dud, but that's very different from a more widespread major problem (or maybe that's what you meant?)

Yeah wrote that late. Not sure what I meant 🤣 Maybe that there are not a lot of problems reported with the N1X...Should start sleeping more.


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I recorded N1X audio directly into my computer via USB today (without audio interface box) and it worked just fine with LogicProX. It didn't work as well with GarageBand, since I wasn't readily able to change record levels in GarageBand (newbie here), whereas I was able to readily change record levels in LogicProX and subsequently output the recording as an AIFF file or MP3 file. And so this forum prompted me to change my recording setup and "ditch" the audio interface box during N1X audio recording. So thanks to all who helped simplify work flow and potentially improve quality of the recorded AIFF file (AIFF basically the same as a WAV file, but AIFF is used in the Apple ecosystem).

In the future, I might experiment with N1X MIDI recording into a quality VST such as from Synthology or Garritan. Not sure that approach will provide more realistic acoustic piano sounds, but it would let me "cheat" and edit errors in my performance.... not sure I want to go there, as recording audio format pushes me to practice more and earn a better performance.

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Originally Posted by N1X-Guy
It didn't work as well with GarageBand, since I wasn't readily able to change record levels in GarageBand (newbie here), whereas I was able to readily change record levels in LogicProX

Since you're recording digitally via USB, there is no way to change the recording levels in Garageband or Logic. Even recording with an analogue interface you can't do this other than by changing the gain on the interface's preamp. It's only during playback (and rendering to AIFF/MP3) that the levels change, based on the channel fader. You can test this by recording with the fader at 0 - the incoming signal will still record but you will not hear it in the monitor.

Last edited by Smaug; 03/03/20 09:31 AM.
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