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Joined: Nov 2010
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I think it is cheating, I never edit my recordings.
I rather upload something with mistakes than edit.
And I record with Pianoteq which is far more easy to edit than a WAVE file - just open MIDI file in a DAW...

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I am in the process of recording a piano/vocal classical album, and we have edits all over the place. I'm not sure if there's a single track that is just one complete take. There are pros and cons to working this way, I think, but it's true that if we waited for a perfect take, we'd still be waiting.

I don't view "cheating" as being part of the equation in any way. We are creating a product, using technology. We're not trying to fool anyone into thinking we are super-human performers. If the product is worth listening to, it's worth listening to either way.

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If i were recording i'd do several takes of the same song. Each one a complete package. I play a lot live, so i "smooth over" rather than stopping and starting over. I can punch in and punch out but as i said, i just don't. I learned how much practice it takes for me to play something live, and that's what i do. The more you do it, the better it works. Sure, as been said, nothing is perfect, but there's a close enough level that seems sort of obvious to me. Still, I could record for ten hours and hate it all. If you can like listening back to whatever you record, you are miles ahead of me.


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Let me clarify - If you record yourself for commercial purpose than I think it is not cheating, but if you record yourself to show your abilities than it is cheating.

Like in my Soundcloud page - If I'm uploading there a recording of myself playing I want to show my honest abilities so I record in one shot, it may take a lot tries but I don't want to cheat.

Last edited by hag01; 08/18/19 08:29 AM.
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Was it cheating in the early 50s when Lennie Tristano recorded this solo

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=B0XXiko6QlU

Then he played it back the tape twice as fast and his rhythm section (drums and bass) played along.

What LT got was a super-hyper-articulated solo with nuance that most people aren’t ever going to get. He definitely was recording for commercial purposes (he wanted to sell records like everything else). But he also recorded that way for artistic reasons. To get a sound that you couldn’t get any other way.

Here’s an article about the recording (and others he made in the same way).


https://www.arpjournal.com/asarpwp/...e-of-extended-studio-techniques-in-jazz/

The first few paragraphs describe the anger and shock at the time and how Atlantic even issued a disclaimer for records he made after that!

So maybe you gotta ask: Do we listen to music because we like how it sounds? Or do we listen because we’re interested first and foremost in the technical (athletic) ability of the performer?

I’ve had plenty of students who hated the way the piano sounds on the recording because for our (and their) contemporary ears, it sounds like, well, a piano part that’s been sped up! Part of that is entire overtone structure of the piano changes ... Especially, higher partials that you’d want to have in a piano recording are no longer there .... they’ve gone up an octave to where they can’t influence the sound of the piano or what we hear or what could even be recorded back in those days.

If you go over to the world of classical music, some of Elliott Carter’s first string quartets were recorded to click tracks because the tempo changes were too difficult. Now string quartets have no problem with any of that and they dont use click tracks when they record those quartets. But again, was it the sound of the piece Elliott Carter was after or the technical (athletic) ability of the performers?

Everyone can make up their own mind about how they feel or like about this stuff. I’m just pointing out some of the history behind it and some of the reactions. But my own opinion is sound wins and final product is more important than technique. But that’s me and I realise and acknowledge that not everyone feels that way ...

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Great post, Mark. Actually, Lennie recorded Line Up for himself only. what happened is that Ahmet Ertegun (Pres of Atlantic records) visited Lennie's studio, and saw a tape lying on a shelf. He asked what is was, and it was Line Up etc..this is how these historic tracks came to be released haha.

Dave Frank

Last edited by Dfrankjazz; 08/18/19 10:07 AM.
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Dave, and great story with those extra details!

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Originally Posted by Dfrankjazz
Great post, Mark. Actually, Lennie recorded Line Up for himself only. what happened is that Ahmet Ertegun (Pres of Atlantic records) visited Lennie's studio, and saw a tape lying on a shelf. He asked what is was, and it was Line Up etc..this is how these historic tracks came to be released haha.

Dave Frank


and a good thing he did it, Im still digesting and learning from this 10 years after I first transcribed it.

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