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Apologies - looking back at my posts in this thread I haven't really done much other than stoke the fire and contribute to keeping this s*** show going - I'll leave this for now as it doesn't really concern me.

What are your credentials and your name? Real scientists DO NOT post anonymous ill-designed "studies" on forums. Or perhaps you can post your study protocol? I'd love to see that based on your scrawling here.

What do you mean when you keeps saying you let it run? As if you had control of third parties?

Political slogans have no place here.

For Mr. Stuart's sake, I hope you are not actually affiliated with him in this supposed exercise and are actually what you seems like--a troll.

I will repeat as I did not receive a reply: Mr Stuart needs to personally post here.

+1

Chris,

I’m still not buying it. Your condescending replies to this thread tell me everything I need to know.

I'm right with you on that. Some of the most convoluted nonsense I've ever read.

When I saw CJM's first post I was very much put off. Frankly, I had a hard time reconciling that post with the presumed esteem of Wayne Stuart and his pianos. Their "experiment" seemed so arrogant and crass. In my first post I referred to WS as acting an ass. If he was truly involved in this "experiment" then the word hole should be added to that. My original conclusion was bad behavior on all sides and that seems to have been resoundingly confirmed. I'm with dogperson on this, I would like to hear from Wayne Stuart himself. JPS may have asked for private information with youthful enthusiasm and perhaps a touch of entitlement, but all WS had to do was respectfully decline and his reputation would have been burnished. As things stand CJM has thrown WS under the bus and sadly tarnished his reputation. The only thing that can save him is for WS to disavow this "experiment" and apologize for the tone of his email to JPS.

This thread has snowballed into absurdity. Past it, actually...

Some youtuber's ego was apparently bruised, so he outed some of the [alleged] communication from the other party on his personal youtube account, and that fight has been drug onto this website and is being fought by self-appointed proxies here. And some are squabbling about tangential issues that have arisen in the "fight" that belongs elsewhere. Now someone purports to be in cahoots with the original "offender," and because some have taken offense to his claims, they're now insisting that the original "offender" present himself here for redemption (or public shaming), when he's never uttered a public word on the subject anywhere. Not here. Not on the other site.

Have I missed anything?

This "discussion" is leading nowhere and seems to serve no purpose. It's time to shut it down, I think.

Regards,

Thanks for your posts, Retsacnal and BruceD

...my feelings from the initial post

I have been defending Wayne Stuart's right to refuse James' requested based on his dislike of James' review style. I don't shy away from this standpoint.

I am also completely disgusted by CJM's posts and his (or their) bullshit "experiment". Here's a far better research topic: how much damage did the name Stuart and Sons took after CJM's bullshit posts?

Well said, and +1 from me.

On the other hand, CJM's posts hit my biggest pet peeve, about showing off degrees, that I couldn't stop laughing seeing it.

Edit: after I posted it, the page count reduced from 9 to 6. Is there such functionality at PW by the moderator?

I started this thread as I thought it could be a bit of fun but it has recently become in incredibly bad taste. Is it legitimate for me to ask a moderator to shut it down?

It is, and it should not just be locked, but deleted. It's an embarrassment to the forum.

I agree, it has been a waste of time.

I think the only one who should be embarrassed with himself is Mr. Stuart honestly. When I viewed the video all I saw was a young man trying to explain to his viewers why he couldn't review the piano they had many times in the past asked him to review. In fact, he even called out the name of the viewer who last asked him to review a Stuart and Sons piano to thank him for his request. Also in my opinion this young man to me showed a lot more restraint and class than Stuart in the way he handled himself after receiving such an uncalled response. I felt for they guy because I felt he was genuinely excited to have the possible chance to do an amateur review of a Stuart and Son's piano. I'd like to see what a regular guy has to say rather than the so called "experts". His response was much more mature and composed than what I would expect from many of today's nineteen year olds. I don't necessarily agree with his conclusions regarding possible flaws with the Stuart and Sons piano because all it was was conjecture, but that's also partly Stuart's fault for not having a more professional communication with James. Mr. Stuart on the other hand acted inappropriate and surprisingly thoughtless in the way he responded in his email and especially for a man of his age.

At this point the image I have of a Stuart and Son's piano is a negative one. Beautiful on the outside but designed by a man with quite a few personal flaws on the inside that stain a piano I may find otherwise interesting. As there are so few Stuart and Son's pianos owned by anyone world wide (apparently only 2 here in the US) the other unfortunate observation I made this past week was that the only person I have come across who actually owns one turns out to be a confidant of Mr Stuart and an accomplice in their attempt to troll a few you tube commentators if he is honestly who he says he is. That's sad because the irony of it all is that the Mome Raths Mr. Stuart alludes to in his email is not those attempting to try one, but those who actually own one. Devoid of any modicum of talent they are attracted to bright and shiny expensive pianos only because they are bright and shiny and they have a proclivity to look down on and troll those who may not be able to afford one.

With that said, yes maybe time to close the thread.

Do we judge a S&S by Mr Steinway? Do we judge a M&H by Mr Mason? And if it was found that we didn't agree with something Mr Hamlin (is there one?) said in the past - would we not buy a M&H?

No. We would buy the piano we wish, with no reference to the personality of the manufacturer.

No. This conversation is about a non-issue. What was a PRIVATE conversation by email was disclosed, very likely illegally, by one of the parties - which he had no right to do. And - his slander of that party in a 19 minute YouTube is unconscionable.

And to access a privately owned piano was something which he shouldn't have expected anyway - not get into a childish YouTube rave.

As I said before - I would buy a Stuart and Sons piano in a heartbeat - if it was the piano I wanted.

What is legal of course depends of your country of residence. However it seems to be a common misunderstanding even in mine that it is illegal to share emails you got with a 3rd party. It is illegal in most countries to read other peoples' correspondence without permission, but if you are either the sender or receiver, it can be completely fine to share the contents of the corredpondence as long as the information is not protected by personal privacy laws, such as other person's health matters. In some cases copyright laws may apply.

What is morally right or wrong is another matter of course, but that tend to be very subjective...

I've found it a bit of fun and entertainment myself and would be happy to see it remain, but have myself avoided getting dragged into expressing opinions on the original issue, this time :-)

The attempts to defend Mr Stuart's behavior is funny. In one version of the story he purposely attempted to troll this kid's fan base in an absurd people experiment designed only to amuse himself and a copatriot, the other version you take at face value and realize he was just being a dick. You can tell a lot about a person by the way he acts when he thinks no one else is watching. Dr. Laul successfully and quite individually rebuilt the reputation of Estonia Pianos by the fine person he is and the way he carries himself. If ever there was an "expert" on many levels who rebuilt a piano company using his skills and talents it his him. If I ever read an email from Dr Laul to another individual written in this way, yes it would change my opinion of Estonia pianos. Politician's, CEOS, tv personalities are all brought down by things they have said or written in the past. That is why oftentimes they are relieved of their duties. It happens all the time and like it or not these things happen to matter. Perhaps if Mr. Stuart were to change the "format" of his email reply, I may reconsider what I think of him.

Also, there is nothing illegal with sharing an email James received from Mr. Stuart. I'm glad he did. It's just one more crass individual and the things he sells that I can cross off my list.