2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad) Piano Sight Reading
train piano sight reading with your iPhone or iPad
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
74 members (Alex Hutor, anotherscott, ambrozy, c++, AlphaTerminus, AaronSF, Abdol, 17 invisible), 768 guests, and 517 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 542
H
hag01 Offline OP
500 Post Club Member
OP Offline
500 Post Club Member
H
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 542
What do you think is the better action from the two?

I saw many people saying how nice the Casio action, and how inferior is the Korg action, but Korg Kronos 2 for example is like five time the price of Casio PX-5S.

Maybe people expecting great action for that price, but I also understand the Korg is expansive mainly because of its features, which are best in the market for any keyboardist who play stuff like progressive rock and symphonic metal, am I right?

Just asking from curiousity, for general knowledge, I'm definitely not going to purchase a Kronos in the near future, right now I aiming for a Kawai(haven't decide what Kawai model yet).

Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,445
A
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
A
Joined: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,445
I can't help you but you bring up a fair point and perhaps this thread will bring some clarification, but the way I see it, you have to read many such posts in context ... given the price of the board.

Certainly I think that the Casio offers a nice bang for buck action, and in my case don't see any urgent need to upgrade as yet, but even at my level I already do notice that some of the more expensive actions out there feel nicer and precise to the touch in some areas.

That said, just as an another example, I never tried one as yet, I would like to try a nord 3 one day. Often people really give the fatar actions and their derivative a hard time, but price aside are some of these later variants actually any worse worse than the Casio tri sensor for piano, probably not, may be better, I don't know.

A nord 3 costs a lot obviously, so people are bound to be more critical in that price range, and rightly so. My feeling is also that once a label develops a bit of reputation it sticks around, and then perhaps they don't get as fair a judgement in the long run on music forums regardless of any improvements they bring in future iterations, whilst some other makes arguably get a more favourable bias.

Then, often, also people reviewing such things may use an MP11 or something else as a regular workhorse say, so a change in action may well throw them off a bit at first, but with time grow to like a different feeling board more too well after the review date. So who knows, let the debates commence laugh


Selftaught since June 2014.
Books: Barratt classic piano course bk 1,2,3. Humphries Piano handbook, various...
Kawai CA78, Casio AP450 & software pianos.
[Linked Image] 12x ABF recitals.
My struggles: https://soundcloud.com/alexander-borro
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 9,053
9000 Post Club Member
Offline
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 9,053
I always felt the Nord 88 2 had a nice solid-feeling but shallow keybed. Not unlike that on the Yamahas CP1, and 5. It may not have felt good on playing, who knows? because it wasn`t switched on. , ,(!) but the Korg RH3 is a long pivot key, and, heavy or not, was very pleasant to play. Imo. That was switched on!

Last edited by peterws; 01/28/17 03:33 PM.

"I am not a man. I am a free number"

"[Linked Image]"
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,069
B
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
B
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,069
Originally Posted by hag01
...and how inferior is the Korg action, but Korg Kronos 2 for example is like five time the price of Casio PX-5S.

I recently bought a Kronos 2 and I really like the action. It is quick and responsive and excellent for "classical" piano répertoire and I have no problem playing anything up to very fast even with synth sounds and also Hammond organ, etc.

And I am saying this after I tried all the top products from the other brands, including the Nord, the Yamaha CP4 and Montage 8, etc. Initially, I actually had no preference or bias at all to any brand or model and just wanted to upgrade from much older gear that I sold recently.

On the Kronos, it is the connection/response between the RH3 action and sound that I find superior. This is one of the main things that made me choose it, along with the near infinite programmability of the thing.

No DP or synth action feels the same as a real grand piano, but again I really like the RH3 action.

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,325
S
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,325
Does the Korg have a virtual pivot point, which increases the effective length of the keys? Refer time 1:30 here: https://youtu.be/ueKGD1FT6Z4

If so, does anyone else do that?

Greg.

Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,344
3000 Post Club Member
Online Content
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 3,344
I havn't understood the point of the virtual pivot point. In the video, the end of the key doesn't move (at the bottom). To me, it is at the pivot point. If a virtual pivot point was further, we would see the end of the key going a little downward.

Last edited by Frédéric L; 01/28/17 05:56 PM.

Yamaha CLP150, Bechstein Digital Grand, Garritan CFX, Ivory II pianos, Galaxy pianos, EWQL Pianos, Native-Instrument The Definitive Piano Collection, Soniccouture Hammersmith, Truekeys, Pianoteq
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,069
B
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
B
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,069
Yes, this is the RH3 action.

When I tried the top products from all brands, I didn't care much about the fancy specs and big explanations about each action type. Wooden keys, longer pivot, pseudo let-off, etc. The best way to know if it's for you is simply to try each and take your time playing. I also do the usual tests for repetition, legato/staccato, response, speed, connection with sound, etc as when I test acoustic pianos.

I especially don't believe in anything negative promoted by a brand against something else. For example, a particular one comparing two vs three sensor (per key) actions, with sound files on which you hear someone play near staccato instead of legato to promote the superiority of theirs, etc. Pretty ridiculous. The RH3 is a two sensor action, just like the other brand I had before, and I never had a problem playing legato passages with ease. So again, don't buy the specs/comparisons. Try for yourself.

Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,325
S
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,325
Yep - I guess you're right, Frederic. Damn - just another key action then. smile

Greg.

Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,627
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,627
Of course everyone has their preferences, so you must try for yourself to see what you can get out of a digital instruments action and sound engine. I'll offer my own and you can take or leave.

The Casio isn't highly grand piano like, but it is effective - moves freely, has a swinging feeling and you can play expressively on it. The RH3 is just ok, not the greatest or the worst. I prefer the action on both the ES8 and CP4 to the Kronos 8. But the Kronos is one heck of a sound engine... I wish they'd do a desktop or rack. I'll tell you what might be my least favorite action at the moment... and that's the NH on the Korg Krome 88. It's downright awful. I'd take the Casio action over it in a heart beat. That's not saying the Krome sounds bad. It's just the 88's action plays like poo.

Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 59
O
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
O
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 59
I have a Kronos 2-88. I play lots of classical piano and I like the action a lot. I've played lots of keyboards - and Personally I think the Kawai MP and VPC have better actions, and obviously the avantgrands.

But don't dwell on the price differentials. The Kronos is expensive because it is a workstation. You can create 16 track music right in the machine. It has really deep programming capability and ton of instruments. Plus karma. That's why it costs so much. It just sounds great.



Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 588
500 Post Club Member
Offline
500 Post Club Member
Joined: Apr 2015
Posts: 588
The Kronos RH3 action is one of the best allround actions available...top action for playing piano but also acceptable for fast organ and synth riffs..

However the RH3 action on the Kronos does not mimic a grand piano action. And alltough its a hammer action, its not weighted (meaning all keys action is exactly the same), and there is no keyscape...

Its not a pianists action, tough its a perfect action for piano oriented keyboardists


If you are just requiring a stagepiano, go for kawai or Roland, or even Yamaha Cp4, Korg Kronos is a beast of a whole different order..synth, piano, organ, sequencer, karma.. everything in a single box.. and then some more... its a songwriters dream.. its a keyboardists weapon for any cover band.. its the heart of your studio, but ready to take it on the road... and if you want it, its even your whole studio... its the most advanced and best sounding most expandable keyboard instrument in the world..

Last edited by Bachus; 01/29/17 03:52 PM.
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,627
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,627
I agree - the RH3 is not likely to thrill if you are a pianist and choosing the Kronos for its pianos. The Kronos does vastly more than most digital, well all digital pianos, though. Me personally, I'd get the 61k synth action and place it above a stage piano action I really liked. Eventually I hope they offer the Kronos as a desktop or rack. On the other hand... The entry point (price wise) to get the Kronos engines is about to fall with the release of the Grandstage. It will also have the RH3 action. They are also about to offer the Kronos LS in a synth action. Which might make organ/synth/keyboard players smile.

Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,960
A
5000 Post Club Member
Offline
5000 Post Club Member
A
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 5,960
Originally Posted by Bachus
The Kronos RH3 action is one of the best allround actions available...top action for playing piano but also acceptable for fast organ and synth riffs..

Yes.
Quote
However the RH3 action on the Kronos does not mimic a grand piano action. And alltough its a hammer action, its not weighted (meaning all keys action is exactly the same), and there is no keyscape...

No. It is graded. I have a Kronos and the bass keys are certainly heavier than the treble keys.

Quote
Its not a pianists action, tough its a perfect action for piano oriented keyboardists

Maybe. It's a matter of personal preference. I prefer the Korg action to the Casio and Nord actions, for example.


Quote
If you are just requiring a stagepiano, go for kawai or Roland, or even Yamaha Cp4, Korg Kronos is a beast of a whole different order..synth, piano, organ, sequencer, karma.. everything in a single box.. and then some more... its a songwriters dream.. its a keyboardists weapon for any cover band.. its the heart of your studio, but ready to take it on the road... and if you want it, its even your whole studio... its the most advanced and best sounding most expandable keyboard instrument in the world..

We agree on something! wink

Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,221
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 1,221
Don't know what the number of zones are on the RH3, but graded hammer action usually means zones - often just 4. The PHA-50 has 8 zones, the upper end Yamaha action has linear grading - no zones but incrementally weighted hammers, as does the Grand Feel II from Kawai and the Bechstein action from Casio on the new GP300/400/500


Roland HP605|Senheiser HD558|MSFT Surface Pro 4|coffee
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,069
B
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
B
Joined: Aug 2012
Posts: 1,069
Originally Posted by Goss
Don't know what the number of zones are on the RH3...

Four.


Moderated by  Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Has anyone been waiting more than six months on their piano?
by InspiredByKawai - 06/15/21 02:44 PM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics207,531
Posts3,103,926
Members101,822
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers

Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | MapleStreetMusicShop.com - Our store in Cornish Maine


© copyright 1997 - 2021 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5