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#2397049 03/12/15 03:56 AM
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Hi, looking to bit a digital piano
Are there any alternatives to the Casio in its price range?
I've read that spending about 500 GBP (Casio is just over 300) gets you a far superior piano , what are people's views on this?

I'm not a complete beginner in as much as I know I'll stick with it, but not intending to do more grades or anything

paradice #2397055 03/12/15 04:12 AM
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The CDP 120 is decent for an entry level DP. The keys are a little noisy but OK, and the sound can be improved by using it as a controller to a VST or similar. If you are serious about improving and playing the PX150 or 350 are a step up in terms of the action and sounds, but as you say in money too. I would recommend a trip to a store to check them out to see if you're willing to part with the extra cash. In this range though we have something like the Kawai ES100 which would start you on a different comparison and preference decision.

paradice #2397275 03/12/15 06:09 PM
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what about the Casio 120 could be limiting?? harder to play somehow? I've not paid attention enough on the few I've tried to know what's different about them and what to look for when trying them at a shop



I've just come across the Korg SP170s, how does that compare? I see it has no USB socket, would be using it for a controller in Ableton. I already have a MIDI-USB cable, but is USB-USB connection better?


paradice #2397276 03/12/15 06:21 PM
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FWIW when I was first looking for a digital (bearing in mind, I already have an acoustic piano) I was just looking for something to augment practice, and / or be able to play / practice at times when I didn't want any noise.

I had very modest requirements - which were really, representative action, and sound that didn't offend my ears. I was initially looking at a CDP-120 or something like it, on an X-frame stand, but in the end, bought a Celviano AP-250 (well a badge-engineered version of the AP-250, sold in the UK as the AP-245 for a limited period) as it was being sold heavily discounted.

I think what I would say, is that if the leap in price between something like a CDP-120 and, say, a PX-150 (I also have a PX-150, now, for an upstairs room) isn't a step too far, then I'd recommend the Privia.

Ultimately, though, I'd say, try a few out, with a decent set of headphones, and see how you feel about the action and sound of something like a CDP-120, compared with say a PX-150.

paradice #2397293 03/12/15 07:01 PM
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I bought a brand new Casio CDP-130, the successor to the CDP-120, and I ended up selling it after two months. The action is far too light; it feels exactly like GHS. The sounds are awful, but you say you'll be using Ableton so I guess it's a non-issue. There is no half-pedal support, which is a moderate annoyance IMO.

I'd rather shell out the extra $100 USD for the PX-150. It's a big step-up and it's worth every penny.

The Korg SP-170 is the same price as the PX-150. The action doesn't get a lot of praise around here, but I enjoy it . . . it has a nice cushion at the bottom and it feels in sync with the sound. I didn't get to pay attention to the sounds enough to say whether or not I can live with them, but I'd use it with Pianoteq mainly.

The Kawai ES100 is very nice, but it's the most expensive of the bunch. It has a lighter action than the PX-150, but it feels "right". However, I think the bass samples are too strong (much louder/stronger than the rest of the keys' samples), and some people report minor problems with the pedals on the later-manufactured batches of ES100s. YMMV.

As for the cabling question: I don't think you'll hear a difference between the two kinds of MIDI cables. But I'll let an expert chime in on this.


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Dwscamel #2397308 03/12/15 08:35 PM
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I'm inclined to recommend the PX-150 over the CDP-120 also.

Dwscamel, regarding this comment:

Originally Posted by Dwscamel
some people report minor problems with the pedals on the later-manufactured batches of ES100s.


Are you referring to this:
http://www.kawai-global.com/support/es100/

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paradice #2397413 03/13/15 04:01 AM
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thanks everyone

I was kinda put off by the PX150 because of what I read on this website... http://www.ukpianos.co.uk/digital-pianos-which-brand-should-i-buy
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The privia pianos don't sound as good as the Celviano range. They're a little tinny because of their small cabinets and speakers.

although I say I'll use it for Ableton I want to use it as a normal piano most of the time, don't want to have the PC switched on, cables connected etc every time I want to use it (actually have an acoustic upright in need of repair so decided a new digital piano would be better, can practice in silence too!)

paradice #2397424 03/13/15 04:51 AM
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The cdp120 and px150 have 8 Watt spEakers. Px150 has improved Touch, keY surface, and sound processing. Not sure when they went to three sensors though. Imo useD casios are overpriced.

If you want improved speaker system look for px750 or px850.


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paradice #2397454 03/13/15 06:27 AM
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Originally Posted by paradice

I was kinda put off by the PX150 because of what I read on this website... http://www.ukpianos.co.uk/digital-pianos-which-brand-should-i-buy
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The privia pianos don't sound as good as the Celviano range. They're a little tinny because of their small cabinets and speakers.


Better speakers will produce better sound but this goes for the Celvianos also. You can plug almost any random $50 computer speakers (2.1 w/ subwoofer) and get better sound than what's built-in to any Privia or Celviano. So if you don't need the wood cabinet furniture, the difference in price can pay some for rather fancy speakers.

paradice #2397464 03/13/15 07:11 AM
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I definitely want the wooden stand for it

few things are putting me off the Casio 120 now tbh, not that I'd make full use of them but amongst other things I see it only has a sustain pedal... it's like...I'm spending £300ish anyway so may aswell spend a bit more and get something nicer. As spanishbuddha says this takes me on a different path of deciding what to buy...Kawai etc

I'm going to try some this weekend, no doubt I'll have more questions after playing a few

bit of a long shot but does anyone know of a shop in Edinburgh with a wide range? the only shop i know of is Red Dogg but they don't stock Casios...


Last edited by paradice; 03/13/15 07:33 AM.
paradice #2397494 03/13/15 09:29 AM
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What are all your must have and nice to have features? We can't give you good advice without them.

Number of sounds
Polyphony
Number of pedals
Half sustain pedal
Wooden stand
Usb vs midi connections
Line out
Metronome
Onboard recording
Is this a long term or short term solution

You can purchase a wooden stand and 3 pedal bar for the px150/350.


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paradice #2397501 03/13/15 09:44 AM
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I've just discovered this thread http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...son_of_Portable_Digital.html#Post2167459

will get back to you once I'm more familiar with the terms! smile

paradice #2397549 03/13/15 12:15 PM
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I have a CDP-120 and wish I'd spent a bit more. The keys just feel really clunky now and a couple make a loud clacking sound when press simultaneously. I play with headphones or with Pianoteq and the sound is fine, but it sounds a bit synthetic through its speakers. If you can afford something better, spend that little extra.

I'm looking forward to the day I can upgrade to a Roland F-130R. smile


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OK - after reading the guide here's what i was thinking, pretty much 'ideal world' situation here, might end up having to settle for much less depending on price

Number of sounds - not important - a good piano sound important tho
Polyphony - 240 - 120 if not stereo (not sure about this tbh, surely all are stereo??)
Number of pedals - 3
Half sustain pedal - yes 9 steps min but the more the better!
Wooden stand - yes
Usb vs midi connections - USB
Line out - yes
Metronome - no
Onboard recording - no
Is this a long term or short term solution - no intention of replacing it unless it breaks


Last edited by paradice; 03/13/15 05:02 PM.
paradice #2397644 03/13/15 05:19 PM
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OK, from the standpoint of Casio Pianos, which is what I have and am familiar with, PX350 is closest to your specs - Line in and Line out, 2 pedal inputs if you use stand alone pedals / 3 with the pedal bar. However, it only supports on / off / half pedal with the pedal bar, not multiple steps. I believe it has both USB for MIDI over USB and MIDI, and 128 polyphony. You really will only need more than 128 polyphony if you are layering sounds (playing both strings and piano at the same time).

Your plan to go test some different models out is the best one. See what you like in terms of touch and sound. Hopefully someone else will chime in with other brands that may meet your needs.


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TrevorM #2397674 03/13/15 06:08 PM
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thanks for the advice smile

I only mentioned the Casio originally as it is full size with weighted keys and the price was reasonable. I didn't realise there was so much more to them!

Originally Posted by Trevor May


I'm looking forward to the day I can upgrade to a Roland F-130R. smile


that looks very smart! had thought the real feel pianos would just be pianos, apparently not!

I see the Roland weighs 35kg whereas the CDP120 weighs 18! is it mostly the frame that makes the difference so much or the internals?

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Originally Posted by DragonPianoPlayer
OK, from the standpoint of Casio Pianos, which is what I have and am familiar with, PX350 is closest to your specs - Line in and Line out, 2 pedal inputs if you use stand alone pedals / 3 with the pedal bar. However, it only supports on / off / half pedal with the pedal bar, not multiple steps. I believe it has both USB for MIDI over USB and MIDI, and 128 polyphony. You really will only need more than 128 polyphony if you are layering sounds (playing both strings and piano at the same time). . .


+1. In order to get close to the polyphony limit, you have to hold down the pedal on the PX-350 and play with your forearms on the keys.

Think about it -- there are only 88 notes to play. If you hold down the pedal and hit a key twice, the first key-strike can be forgotten. The designers seem to handle "damper resonance" nicely, in that case.

The damper "on / off / half-pedal" was a dumb design decision, since the underlying sound generator "understands" 127 MIDI "damper pedal" levels. But that's what they did.

. Charles

PS -- I own a PX-350. Its sound generator is pretty good, its amps and loudspeakers are its weak point. I'm playing it using Pianoteq software and a PA loudspeaker -- no problems, there.


. Charles
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PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq
paradice #2397848 03/14/15 09:51 AM
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I think I have fell in love with the Roland F130R.....only 2.5x as much as what I was originally looking at shocked

is there anything negative about it?

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If you've played it, and like it, it's a perfectly reasonable choice in its price range.

I didn't like the relationship between "harshness" and "volume" -- it got harsh (more high-order partials) at a lower volume than I like. But I seem to be the only person who comments on that.

That problem wasn't present in the RD-80 -- but that's even more money!<g> And I suspect the F130R has better amps and speakers (but you should look that up).

If you fell in love with it, that's a good indication that you should get it if you can afford it.

. Charles


. Charles
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£600 will get you the latest DGX. A 3 pedal holder to suit, another £55. Give it a try. It punches above its weight IMO and is great with Pianoteq added. It takes whatever you throw at it. . .


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