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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Gombessa] #2802795
Yesterday at 04:34 PM
Yesterday at 04:34 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,531
Sofia, Bulgaria
CyberGene Offline
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CyberGene  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,531
Sofia, Bulgaria
Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by CyberGene
And the hammer isn't detachable from the keyboard to be thrown on its own. That's a bit misleading.
[Linked Image]


Is it? I only only reference the image provided, but it looks like there is a capstan on the keystick that allows free hammer (+mock whippen) movement, at least to a similar extent as on a GF/GF2 action. So while the hammer can't escape the whippen, the entire assembly could escape the key with enough force.

You are right. I stand corrected. Unfortunately those translucent Casio models are rare and I haven’t seen one recently to check. Anyway, lack of escapement (jack and double repetition lever) changes the feel because there’s always the hammer weight through the knuckle lever that moves the key up whereas on a real piano the keys lighten up due to hammer being held by the backcheck.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: CyberGene] #2802800
Yesterday at 04:44 PM
Yesterday at 04:44 PM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 318
Murmansk, Russia
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PianoStartsAt33 Offline
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by CyberGene
And the hammer isn't detachable from the keyboard to be thrown on its own. That's a bit misleading.
[Linked Image]


Is it? I only only reference the image provided, but it looks like there is a capstan on the keystick that allows free hammer (+mock whippen) movement, at least to a similar extent as on a GF/GF2 action. So while the hammer can't escape the whippen, the entire assembly could escape the key with enough force.

You are right. I stand corrected. Unfortunately those translucent Casio models are rare and I haven’t seen one recently to check. Anyway, lack of escapement (jack and double repetition lever) changes the feel because there’s always the hammer weight through the knuckle lever that moves the key up whereas on a real piano the keys lighten up due to hammer being held by the backcheck.



We have a lot of uprights without double repetition at houses around here. Looka like Casio action is really close to them.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802802
Yesterday at 04:51 PM
Yesterday at 04:51 PM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 2,531
Sofia, Bulgaria
CyberGene Offline
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CyberGene  Offline
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Sofia, Bulgaria
Upright pianos lack double repetition lever but they still have escapement through a jack. Also a backcheck to hold the hammer after it has bounced back from the string. I believe it’s these bounce movements that create a specific feeling through the keys on real upright and grand pianos.


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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2802820
Yesterday at 05:22 PM
Yesterday at 05:22 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 678
Europe
A
arc7urus Offline
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Joined: Oct 2017
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Europe
Separating the key from the rest of the assembly is easily done on the GF2. But even if that is possible on this action then such separation is not felt on the key. It is very easy to do fast repetitions on this action, easier than on the GF2 or in any other DP hammer action I have tried, and that is likely because there is virtually no decoupling between the key and the remaining moving parts. When I tested this action it did not felt like an hammer action but instead as a very nice and heavy synth key action with an almost constant touchweight/pressure and a very fast return. It is almost the opposite of Yamaha's GrandTouch where there is a large pressure variation along the travel of the key.

These videos show the action in more detail:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Go2MX0L8PqU
https://youtu.be/omK58tFQTLc?t=410

Nevertheless, Casio states that the GPs with the Grand Hybrid are the "first DPs to include acoustic concert grand piano wooden keys and grand piano hammer mechanism": https://youtu.be/wne2ACFP1PM?t=17

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Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: PianoStartsAt33] #2802830
Yesterday at 05:41 PM
Yesterday at 05:41 PM
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 678
Europe
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arc7urus Offline
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Europe
Originally Posted by PianoStartsAt33
We have a lot of uprights without double repetition at houses around here. Looka like Casio action is really close to them.


Apart from the shape of the components, may I ask you what makes the mechanism of the Casio action so much different than GF2's and "really close" to that of an upright?

The red knuckle is a direct coupling between the black "wippen" and the "hammer". So, the whole assembly is a single system. Casio can put a dozen of coupled parts between the capstan and the hammer but that is irrelevant from a mechanical perspective. The way these parts decouple is exactly what makes an acoustic action behave like it does. And these parts do not decouple. Should we also start saying that the mechanism of the GF2 is "really close" to an acoustic action?

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: arc7urus] #2803083
11 hours ago
11 hours ago
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 457
Between Chicago and NJ, USA
Mike_Martin Offline
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Mike_Martin  Offline
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Posts: 457
Between Chicago and NJ, USA
Originally Posted by arc7urus

Hi! I own a PX-560 and I am only aware of a total of 9 official sounds/registrations released bt Casio (all of them created/submitted by you). The latest one is from October 2016. I am also only aware of a total 3 firmware updates for the PX-560 since it was released in 2015. Am I missing something? I find the PX-560 to be a great, feature-packed keyboard, but my feeling is that it was never fully supported by Casio and that Casio just missed a huge opportunity.

Cheers!


Actually one of the NAMM announcements is that we have licensed all of David Weiser's vintage keyboard presets that were originally created for the PX-5S and are converting them for the PX-560. It is a huge task but these will be released shortly after NAMM.


-Mike Martin
Casio America

Casio Music Forums
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: ElmerJFudd] #2803125
9 hours ago
9 hours ago
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 517
Virginia, USA
K
Kbeaumont Offline
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Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 517
Virginia, USA
Dave Weiser sent me some presets for my SP-6, I use them all the time.


A long long time ago, I can still remember
How that music used to make me smile....
Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Mike_Martin] #2803180
7 hours ago
7 hours ago
Joined: Oct 2017
Posts: 678
Europe
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arc7urus Offline
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Joined: Oct 2017
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Europe
Originally Posted by Mike_Martin
Originally Posted by arc7urus

Hi! I own a PX-560 and I am only aware of a total of 9 official sounds/registrations released bt Casio (all of them created/submitted by you). The latest one is from October 2016. I am also only aware of a total 3 firmware updates for the PX-560 since it was released in 2015. Am I missing something? I find the PX-560 to be a great, feature-packed keyboard, but my feeling is that it was never fully supported by Casio and that Casio just missed a huge opportunity.

Cheers!


Actually one of the NAMM announcements is that we have licensed all of David Weiser's vintage keyboard presets that were originally created for the PX-5S and are converting them for the PX-560. It is a huge task but these will be released shortly after NAMM.


Many thanks for the info and good news!

Re: Casio pre-NAMM 2019 teaser [Re: Mike_Martin] #2803181
7 hours ago
7 hours ago
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 261
Los Angeles, California
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PianoManChuck Offline
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 261
Los Angeles, California
Originally Posted by Mike_Martin

Actually one of the NAMM announcements is that we have licensed all of David Weiser's vintage keyboard presets that were originally created for the PX-5S and are converting them for the PX-560. It is a huge task but these will be released shortly after NAMM.

Excellent!


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