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Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D

Posted By: Gabriel Hikaru

Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/14/18 04:24 PM

Embertone just released a new sampled Steinway.

Early bird discount is 10% off.


Link: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/14/18 04:37 PM

Thank you for the information. I've had too many bad experiences with Kontakt Instruments but this one sounds nice. Also I like the way they market and sell it. You can buy a Standard and a Lite version. And then you can buy individual mics for the Standard version for 15$ each, and there's a complete bundle with all mics. Might give this one a go. Although I have to say, the upper notes sound a bit tinny? Edit: the upper few octaves don't sound like a Steinway to me at all. If anything, it reminds me of the Bechstein Digital. What do you think about the demos? The interface looks super stylish though.
Posted By: newer player

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/14/18 05:19 PM

So the list pricing (excluding any discounts) scheme seems to be as follows:

$39 Lite (can't add mics, 12 velocities per note)
$99 Full (+$15 extra per mic position, 36 velocities per note, una corda, memory purging...)
$175 Full + all mics

The first two options seem to include AKG C414 close mics only.

Optional mics:
Close, Wide, Hammer, Room, Binaural head

"This is a Kontakt Player instrument, meaning that you do not need to own the full version of Kontakt to use it"
Posted By: Gabriel Hikaru

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/14/18 05:24 PM

Honestly, I'm not so sure how much I like the sound. It does sounds nice, but it doesn't sound exactly like a typical Steinway. On the other hand. Production Voices Concert Grand Compact sounds very much like the Steinways I've played in real life, so I'm still waiting for the full version.

I do like the low entry barrier to Embertone's Steinway though. It's cheaper than a lot of virtual pianos.
Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/14/18 11:11 PM

Do they really have just four demos, two of which have a lot of other nonsense mixed in and another one of which has rather a lot of reverb, leaving essentially one demo? Or have I missed some somewhere?
Posted By: puremusic

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/15/18 11:49 AM

They're supposed to update the site with more demos soon.
Posted By: bsntn99

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/15/18 03:43 PM

Here's the VI-Control thread which will give you more info and the developer is active on.

https://vi-control.net/community/th...955-steinway-d.72492/page-2#post-4244282

Wanted to add the intro pricing available for ~next 2 weeks.

Lite - $34
Full - $89
Full/all mics - $149
Posted By: bsntn99

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 04:17 PM

Demos for the individual mic perspectives and a really nice walk-through video for both the full and lite versions. Lite version demo is near the end of the video. Note this is a Kontakt Player compatible library, so you do not need the full version.

https://vi-control.net/community/threads/embertone-releases-walker-1955-steinway-d.72492/page-6
Posted By: DeskDesign

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 06:09 PM

Lovely tone!
Not a fan of the high's.
Bass register seems a tad constrained, but I'm guessing that's the instrument.
Overall it makes a good impression though, I might go for this one sooner or later.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 06:38 PM

Embertone Steinway D vs new incoming Production voices Steinway D ? Ah, can`t wait to compare. One point taken from Embertone because there is no half pedal.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 06:50 PM

Bought the full version. It does have a lovely tone with depth. It sounds organic and you can hear all the mechanical tinkles when you play soft velocites. Bass is balanced, not thunderous like Ivory American D but it's enough. It's a very different piano from Ivory. It has character and "dirt".

BUT, here's my problem with it:

I'm not happy with the playability at all. When i play it, i feel that there's a disconnection from it, it's like i'm playing it through someone else's hands (as creepy as that sounds). It feels like latency but technically it's not because i'm playing it on 128 buffer and 2 ms which is the setting i use for all my pianos and they all feel just perfect with this setting.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 09:10 PM

Just magical. Best sampled Steinway in my book.
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=YLhZz80yOZY
Posted By: -Jay-

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I'm not happy with the playability at all. When i play it, i feel that there's a disconnection from it, it's like i'm playing it through someone else's hands (as creepy as that sounds). It feels like latency but technically it's not because i'm playing it on 128 buffer and 2 ms which is the setting i use for all my pianos and they all feel just perfect with this setting.


I really like the tone of this piano. From what you have written its similar to my experience with the Piano In Blue library which I purchased a few years ago. Its also the reason I wasn't interested in the follow up CinePiano and the recent Light and Sound Steinway despite all of them sounding very nice.

Just out of interest, which audio interface are you using ?
Posted By: Erard

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 09:24 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I'm not happy with the playability at all. When i play it, i feel that there's a disconnection from it, it's like i'm playing it through someone else's hands (as creepy as that sounds). It feels like latency but technically it's not because i'm playing it on 128 buffer and 2 ms which is the setting i use for all my pianos and they all feel just perfect with this setting.

It does sound like latency the way you describe it...

Can you try using the 64 samples buffer just to see if the connection is better, even if you may have some pops and clicks?
If it's better, then it's possibly an added latency in the VSTi - if not, then it's something else - and we can exclude a built-in latency within the plugin itself.
Hope this makes sense.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by Jay017
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I'm not happy with the playability at all. When i play it, i feel that there's a disconnection from it, it's like i'm playing it through someone else's hands (as creepy as that sounds). It feels like latency but technically it's not because i'm playing it on 128 buffer and 2 ms which is the setting i use for all my pianos and they all feel just perfect with this setting.


I really like the tone of this piano. From what you have written its similar to my experience with the Piano In Blue library which I purchased a few years ago. Its also the reason I wasn't interested in the follow up CinePiano and the recent Light and Sound Steinway despite all of them sounding very nice.

Just out of interest, which audio interface are you using ?

I'm using Focusrite 18i20, 48 KHZ 24 bit 128 buffer 2 ms. I used to play with 64 buffer, but with my newly acquired VSL CFX i had to go up to 128 and i kept it that way hence it didn't bother me at all.

It seems that you know exactly what i mean. It's hard to describe really. But i think it's psychological to be honest, it's all head games, maybe because the sound of those pianos is not pensive enough in the mid ranges so we get that impression. I don't know.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/18/18 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by Erard
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I'm not happy with the playability at all. When i play it, i feel that there's a disconnection from it, it's like i'm playing it through someone else's hands (as creepy as that sounds). It feels like latency but technically it's not because i'm playing it on 128 buffer and 2 ms which is the setting i use for all my pianos and they all feel just perfect with this setting.

It does sound like latency the way you describe it...

Can you try using the 64 samples buffer just to see if the connection is better, even if you may have some pops and clicks?
If it's better, then it's possibly an added latency in the VSTi - if not, then it's something else - and we can exclude a built-in latency within the plugin itself.
Hope this makes sense.

I played again on 128 and on 64. it's not as bad as before anymore (that's why i think it's mainly in my head) BUT it's still not as "immediate" as all other libraries i have ( Keyscape C7, Ivory ACD, VSL CFX, Ravenscroft, Garritan CFX etc).

I think it's the tone of the piano in the mid ranges that is giving me that impression. I don't know.

Alex from Embertone seems to play it at 512 buffer and 10 ms. I wish i can do the same but for me anything above 128 starts to bother me (delay wise).
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 01:22 AM

I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 06:33 AM

Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

I have 2 Samsung Evo 850 SSD in my system. They run every single piano like a dream.

Anyway, I no longe feel disconnected. Turned out it was an issue with the volume since the default patches are too low for me. So I raised the volume in kontakt to around +1.4 and everything is fine now.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 07:54 AM

Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

Do you feel that half pedal is missing a lot ? This is my main concern, still thinking what to do.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

Ah.... once again a new piano library comes out and it's the next best thing after sliced bread.
After some really bad choices i made in the past, reading far to many forums and reviews i really have to be more carefull..... althaugh it's difficult at times.
You claim 'it's way ahead as sampled Steinways goes', but you will probably make the same remarks next week/month when Production Voices will release their full fledged Steinway libraries..
You seem to really like both the Bechstein vst and The Wavesfactory Mercury a lot, but i still have to hear something online to my liking.
There are only two libraries i really liked hearing the online examples and video's.. those are the Garritan CFX full and the CinePiano (btw a Steinway )
Both purchases didn't dissapoint..... to the contrary !
And those other libraries take to much space on my SSD, but cost me to much money to delete them all..for now that is...
I like what i hear from the rare PV Steinway examples.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 04:11 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.

I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 04:20 PM

I bought it, and my first impression is that I'm not satisfied with it at all. Haven't spent much time with it and already some things are bothering me. There's this one note that is sticking out really badly, B4. Feels like something is wrong with it, it's considerably more tinny or metallic, and also louder. I tried making a demo of it:

https://instaud.io/2kLt

My playing isn't that even in the clip and I think you can still hear it.
I would say that this is very noticeable, I could hear it after a minute or so of playing. Why does the developer not notice this?

The other thing that bothered me was that repedaling was extremely unforgiving and basically non existent. A lot of other pianos that don't feature repedaling are also annoying to play but here, I noticed it straight away.

Also I got some pretty bad CPU overload with this. Kontakt would frequently give me a red symbol in the CPU status screen, and I'd get cutouts. The only other pianos that ever gave me issues with CPU in a similar manner are the Bechstein Digital and the VSL CFX.

So yeah, I have only spent a few minutes with this and still need to give it some more time, but my first impression is definitely not good.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 04:55 PM

Oh man, you just catch me at my door, I was ready to go into bank to put my money for it, before I leave I read your post and now what ? On every site I read only good things for this piano. What version you bought it ?
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 05:02 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Oh man, you just catch me at my door, I was ready to go into bank to put my money for it, before I leave I read your post and now what ? On every site I read only good things for this piano. What version you have it ?


Hi, oh I'm sorry about that. If you are in doubt, then just disregard what I said. I tend to notice things that a lot of other people don't care about at all. I also wonder why nobody else in this thread mentioned that note that sticks out. Perhaps it isn't that much of a big deal? To me it is, but seems like it isn't to a lot of others. Anyway, I'd love to hear your opinion on it once you buy it.
Posted By: newer player

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.


For clarity purposes, are these sound observations related only to the Compact version? Do you have contrasting comments for the full version?
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by newer player
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.


For clarity purposes, are these sound observations related only to the Compact version? Do you have contrasting comments for the full version?

Even one mic position should be enough to hear basic sound of piano and bring some conclusions, If it`s not good then there is a big risk to put money on it. Full version comes next month.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Oh man, you just catch me at my door, I was ready to go into bank to put my money for it, before I leave I read your post and now what ? On every site I read only good things for this piano. What version you have it ?


Hi, oh I'm sorry about that. If you are in doubt, then just disregard what I said. I tend to notice things that a lot of other people don't care about at all. I also wonder why nobody else in this thread mentioned that note that sticks out. Perhaps it isn't that much of a big deal? To me it is, but seems like it isn't to a lot of others. Anyway, I'd love to hear your opinion on it once you buy it.

For this day you made it, I take my shoes off smile frown
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 06:04 PM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba


Also I got some pretty bad CPU overload with this. Kontakt would frequently give me a red symbol in the CPU status screen, and I'd get cutouts. The only other pianos that ever gave me issues with CPU in a similar manner are the Bechstein Digital and the VSL CFX.


Some things to help regarding CPU overload and cut-offs:

- Make sure multi-core option is ON in Kontakt and choose your number.
- Set "killing voices" to disabled
- Batch re-save.
- Increase the number of max voices in kontakt. It's set to only 100 voices which is too low for such a massive piano with so many release samples. I would say set it around 400. This will depend on your playing style, you can set it lower if you want. Just play your most "demanding" piece and see how many voices you're maxing out and set it accordingly.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 06:07 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

Ah.... once again a new piano library comes out and it's the next best thing after sliced bread.
After some really bad choices i made in the past, reading far to many forums and reviews i really have to be more carefull..... althaugh it's difficult at times.
You claim 'it's way ahead as sampled Steinways goes', but you will probably make the same remarks next week/month when Production Voices will release their full fledged Steinway libraries..
You seem to really like both the Bechstein vst and The Wavesfactory Mercury a lot, but i still have to hear something online to my liking.
There are only two libraries i really liked hearing the online examples and video's.. those are the Garritan CFX full and the CinePiano (btw a Steinway )
Both purchases didn't dissapoint..... to the contrary !
And those other libraries take to much space on my SSD, but cost me to much money to delete them all..for now that is...
I like what i hear from the rare PV Steinway examples.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.


In my experience as an actual user of way too many piano libraries, BechsteinDigital is the best sampled Bechstein, and Wavesfactory Mercury is the best sampled Fazioli.
As such, this Embertone Walker 1955 is the best sampled Steinway I know.
Will the ProductionVoices one beat this? We'll have to see. I do love their Yamaha, though, and find it much better than the Garritan CFX, although I will join you on the CinePiano. That's a special one as well and very, very good. A character piano in Piano-in-Blue style.
Yet, as for now, with all six mic settings, the Embertone rules.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by Fleer

In my experience as an actual user of way too many piano libraries, BechsteinDigital is the best sampled Bechstein, and Wavesfactory Mercury is the best sampled Fazioli.

From all the current top brands, modern Bechsteins seem to have abbandoned their unique character, so present in the Bechstein golden era of the past., ... the most.
In the eighties the company was almost bankrupt and the brand name went through some incarnations behind the scenes.
The modern Bechstein sounds like a modern and dominant grand piano and nothing like the defuse and romantic character and sometimes accompagnied by weird overtones that were exemplary in older Bechsteins.
The Bechstein vst sounds bright and somewhat cold and has a timbre that i do not classify as classic Bechstein like, more Zimmermann' ish !!!!
That alone is enough to dismiss the Bechstein vst as the best Bechstein virtual piano ever.

I personally think Fazioli has upper harmonics without to much character..... very clean.
That doesn't mean i do not like a Fazioli in real life, because i do, but likewise with Bösendorfer, the real ones are difficult to capture in a sampling session and seem to loose more than Steinways and Yamahas when sampled.
Quote

As such, this Embertone Walker 1955 is the best sampled Steinway I know.
Will the ProductionVoices one beat this? We'll have to see. I do love their Yamaha, though, and find it much better than the Garritan CFX, although I will join you on the CinePiano. That's a special one as well and very, very good. A character piano in Piano-in-Blue style.
Yet, as for now, with all six mic settings, the Embertone rules.

I do not think the PV C7 is much better than the Garritan CFX...the PV C7 is very well sampled indeed, but the sampled grand is a C7 in all it's plunkyness at times.
The CFX is a much, much better grand piano and i cannot fault Garritan for not capturing the sound, warmth and overall character of the CFX in the Abbey Road studio.
To the contrary and i am not alone here.

But you are entitled to your opinions and taste of course and please share your opinion.
But what i try to tell is that their is no best vst , because we all want something different.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 07:17 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.

I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.

Should check this. Thanks, tdwctdwc.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 07:50 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.

I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.

Ahhh.... thanks ! But i am of the opinion too that even the most basic settings and mic perspectives should sound good the least.

I still have the Sonic Couture Hammersmith pro (50+ gb) on my drive without ever using it. The sampled Steinway isn't a top quality Steinway which is a pity , because SC does a beautifull job with other vst's.
And there's the Ravenscroft..... i still cannot believe why i ever bought that one.
It sounds dull and never inspires me to play.
And i have deleted some libraries allready.
The Garritan CFX and CinePiano give me every bit of satisfaction.... so i really don't need anything else.
But....... a really authentic sounding, playable, woody and numerous mic option Steinway is always wellcome.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.

I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.

Ahhh.... thanks ! But i am of the opinion too that even the most basic settings and mic perspectives should sound good the least.

I still have the Sonic Couture Hammersmith pro (50+ gb) on my drive without ever using it. The sampled Steinway isn't a top quality Steinway which is a pity , because SC does a beautifull job with other vst's.
And there's the Ravenscroft..... i still cannot believe why i ever bought that one.
It sounds dull and never inspires me to play.
And i have deleted some libraries allready.
The Garritan CFX and CinePiano give me every bit of satisfaction.... so i really don't need anything else.
But....... a really authentic sounding, playable, woody and numerous mic option Steinway is always wellcome.



You've your hands full already. Stick with what you got and make some music. I remember when i had nothing but a Korg Kronos back in 2011, i ended up making an album. Now it's been long overdue for me to make another one because i'm jumping from one piano library to another to find a "signature piano sound" for the next album.

I think in choosing a library, you really have to make sure it has enough velocity layers, that's first and foremost, then you move to choose if you like the tone. We're lucky enough nowadays to be offered such advanced technology in sampled piano.

With that said: if you force me right now at this very minute to choose one piano and stick with it and go record an album, it would be one of those (See ? still i cannot choose only one! we're spoiled!):

- Keyscape C7
- Ivory American D
- The new Embertone Steinway. No i'm not saying this because it's new. The Una corda samples are the best i've heard period and it's just a joy to play with 36 velocities. My runs never sounded so good as they do now thanks to the amount of details this piano has.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 08:38 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Fleer
I find it’s eminently playable (and I do have those other libraries) on a medium Mac (i7 2.6GHz) but of course an SSD would be preferable for such a detailed grand.
As sampled Steinways go, it’s way ahead. A product of sheer love.

I will safe some real space on my SSD for the gold version of PV Steinway and remove every library i do not like in the process.

I wouldn't be so in a hurry for that if i were you. I wasn't impressed with the Compact version which i own(ed) before deleting it 2 days later. The piano sounds dull, gray and has no character. But to be fair, the compact version is only one mic perspective. Still, proceed with caution.

Ahhh.... thanks ! But i am of the opinion too that even the most basic settings and mic perspectives should sound good the least.

I still have the Sonic Couture Hammersmith pro (50+ gb) on my drive without ever using it. The sampled Steinway isn't a top quality Steinway which is a pity , because SC does a beautifull job with other vst's.
And there's the Ravenscroft..... i still cannot believe why i ever bought that one.
It sounds dull and never inspires me to play.
And i have deleted some libraries allready.
The Garritan CFX and CinePiano give me every bit of satisfaction.... so i really don't need anything else.
But....... a really authentic sounding, playable, woody and numerous mic option Steinway is always wellcome.



You've your hands full already. Stick with what you got and make some music. I remember when i had nothing but a Korg Kronos back in 2011, i ended up making an album. Now it's been long overdue for me to make another one because i'm jumping from one piano library to another to find a "signature piano sound" for the next album.

I think in choosing a library, you really have to make sure it has enough velocity layers, that's first and foremost, then you move to choose if you like the tone. We're lucky enough nowadays to be offered such advanced technology in sampled piano.

With that said: if you force me right now at this very minute to choose one piano and stick with it and go record an album, it would be one of those (See ? still i cannot choose only one! we're spoiled!):

- Keyscape C7
- Ivory American D
- The new Embertone Steinway. No i'm not saying this because it's new. The Una corda samples are the best i've heard period and it's just a joy to play with 36 velocities. My runs never sounded so good as they do now thanks to the amount of details this piano has.

All extremely valid points !!!

and making music instead of reading about the next best vst is of course the most important one......
Sadly it didn't prevent me to buy the extremely new ( 1 hour ) Soundiron's hyperion strings micro, because it was only €34,-
ha

Now i am going to play and download will have to wait untill tomorrow.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/19/18 10:03 PM

Let’s not forget all of us are different.
Some are musicians, some were trained to be, some are hobbyists.
We all have a very subjective perspective on things. And music.
De gustibus disputandum est.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 02:56 AM

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=HgG8kYeUzJY
Watch, listen and weep.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 07:16 AM

It sounds great for most part ! I really like the added extra’s like staccato samples.
But i hear some minor tuning flaws and the piano seems to be a bit dry.
And i mean not in a dry/wet room/reverb kinda way, but ‘dry’ in what is to be expected in an older piano.
I have dialed in a superb rich tone in my CinePiano and i wonder if this 1955 Steinway can produce the same lush sounding individual notes.

It’s a steal however for that price and i recently bought Embertone’s Joshua Bell violin ....... what an outstanding solo violin that is......but it was not cheap at all for a solo violin vst.
Extraordinary that Embertone uses such a different pricetag for this one.
Posted By: napilopez

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 03:20 PM

This one is so close to being perfect for me, and it's an absolute steal at $35-39 for the lite version. But - keeping in mind I'm a beginner with very limited playing ability - it has a few big flaws keeping it from reaching its potential. My impressions so far:

I love the staccato and repedalling samples. The attack just feels very realistic. It's among the few VSTs that I feel don't sound too pristine (how I feel about the CFX Lite, as much as others like it.) or generic.

My favorite sampled library is the Ravenscroft, though the new Steingraeber in Pianoteq is currently my favorite overall. I could see myself preferring the embertone to either, but I have to big problems with it.

First, there's no sympathetic resonance (or silent key resonance). Since I'm still so new to playing, a lot of the fun I get out playing piano is simply listening to the resonances on big chords. The lack of sympathetic resonance makes it sound a little stale on big chords, so that's pretty disappointing.

Thankfully Embertone said on another forum that it's possible to addwith scripting and is something they are "seriously considering." It still seems like a really basic aspect for a modern piano library to include by default, but what do I know. Hopefully it doesn't take too long for that to happen.

Two: I'm having trouble with dynamic range, mostly regarding timbre. The timbre barely seems to change when I play forte vs piano the way it does on other VSTs (or you know, a real piano).

I'm using the lite version, which only has 12 velocity layers compared to 36 in the full version, but according to Embertone's explainer video, the overall 'feel' should remain the same even when using fewer velocities, especially since even the full defaults to 18 layers.

Yet the 12 layers on the Lite hardly seems better than my PX-560's built in 4-layer samples in this respect. This is my first VST using Kontakt Player so I don't know if I'm doing something wrong, but I've tried messing with the dynamic range curve in the instrument to little success. Perhaps it just needs more tweaking but I haven't had such trouble with any other VSTs.

So my impression right now is that the piano is impeccably sampled, but could be better scripted.

For now, I'll be sticking to the Steingraeber PTQ and Ravenscroft, with a little CFX thrown in. But despite my negativity, I still think it's a fantastic deal with a lot of potential to get better.
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 04:39 PM

So am I the only one who feels bothered by that B4 that's sticking out? Seems like nobody else cares. It bothers me greatly.

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba


Also I got some pretty bad CPU overload with this. Kontakt would frequently give me a red symbol in the CPU status screen, and I'd get cutouts. The only other pianos that ever gave me issues with CPU in a similar manner are the Bechstein Digital and the VSL CFX.


Some things to help regarding CPU overload and cut-offs:

- Make sure multi-core option is ON in Kontakt and choose your number.
- Set "killing voices" to disabled
- Batch re-save.
- Increase the number of max voices in kontakt. It's set to only 100 voices which is too low for such a massive piano with so many release samples. I would say set it around 400. This will depend on your playing style, you can set it lower if you want. Just play your most "demanding" piece and see how many voices you're maxing out and set it accordingly.


Thank you for these. I have multi-core enabled and killing voices disabled. What is Batch re-saving exactly? And I usually always increase the number of voices in Kontakt, most instruments have a way too low setting there.

About the rest of the discussion, I've been a big fan of Garritan's CFX, but I have to admit that its tone begins to bother me sometimes. It feels cold and clinical for the lack of a better description, as if it is a little bit soulless. So I can see the appeal of the Embertone instrument, but it feels rushed to me, and definitely doesn't deliver when it comes to repedaling. And that B4 ruins the entire experience all by itself. I also struggle with configuring the velocity and sensitivity setting to get the touch to feel 'right'. That's always the biggest problem for me when trying out a new piano VST. Looks like people enjoyed the Cinepiano but karvala gave me a bad review of that so I'm hesitant to actually buy it. I also don't care much about the ProductionVoices Steinway anymore since the SFZ version didn't satisfy me either. Let's see if mr. Chapman improves the scripting for the Kontakt version.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 05:10 PM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
So am I the only one who feels bothered by that B4 that's sticking out? Seems like nobody else cares. It bothers me greatly.

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba


Also I got some pretty bad CPU overload with this. Kontakt would frequently give me a red symbol in the CPU status screen, and I'd get cutouts. The only other pianos that ever gave me issues with CPU in a similar manner are the Bechstein Digital and the VSL CFX.


Some things to help regarding CPU overload and cut-offs:

- Make sure multi-core option is ON in Kontakt and choose your number.
- Set "killing voices" to disabled
- Batch re-save.
- Increase the number of max voices in kontakt. It's set to only 100 voices which is too low for such a massive piano with so many release samples. I would say set it around 400. This will depend on your playing style, you can set it lower if you want. Just play your most "demanding" piece and see how many voices you're maxing out and set it accordingly.


Thank you for these. I have multi-core enabled and killing voices disabled. What is Batch re-saving exactly? And I usually always increase the number of voices in Kontakt, most instruments have a way too low setting there.

About the rest of the discussion, I've been a big fan of Garritan's CFX, but I have to admit that its tone begins to bother me sometimes. It feels cold and clinical for the lack of a better description, as if it is a little bit soulless. So I can see the appeal of the Embertone instrument, but it feels rushed to me, and definitely doesn't deliver when it comes to repedaling. And that B4 ruins the entire experience all by itself. I also struggle with configuring the velocity and sensitivity setting to get the touch to feel 'right'. That's always the biggest problem for me when trying out a new piano VST. Looks like people enjoyed the Cinepiano but karvala gave me a bad review of that so I'm hesitant to actually buy it. I also don't care much about the ProductionVoices Steinway anymore since the SFZ version didn't satisfy me either. Let's see if mr. Chapman improves the scripting for the Kontakt version.

Batch re-save dramatically speeds up load-up times for your libraries in kontakt and sometimes may fix some issues with performance as well. It's in the drop-down menu of the "save" tab in kontakt. After you choose it, it asks you to locate your library folder (in your case it will be the Walker Steinway folder). Choose the folder and it will batch re-save the library. Now you can load it up again.

Some tips regarding the piano:
- Try to play on the "Classical performance" preset. That preset has velocity curve and sensitivity settings reset to a straight line. See if that works better for you.

- Are you sure you're not purging the "sans-pedal" samples by mistake? Doing so will result in a very "stringy" thin sound hence you're technically playing just the pedal down samples.

- Try the Una Corda. This for me is the best thing about this library. It may lessens the effect you're hearing about that B note that's bothering you but still has some attack if you push it. I'm having a hard time NOT playing Una-Corda when i launch it.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 06:26 PM

Ok, my first impression : Very natural piano sound, but at first I have a problem to feel connection with it similar to some users here, so first thing I do I use external Valhalla room reverbe (Vienna hall from tips and tricks) to make it more loud and clear, then I was a little disappointed with dynamics, so I turn on all switches on Sweetening but the most important was to use linear velocity on dynamic scaling and volume scaling (put that horizontal track under to non existent), of course max 36 velocities, I also put sample start to zero. Now it is much better. Last but not least, you need it close mics or should I say you need it all to feel this piano and set a sound like you wish.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 09:04 PM

Combine the default (main) mics with the Close ones. And die.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/20/18 09:06 PM

Originally Posted by Fleer
Combine the default (main) mics with the Close ones. And die.

Haha, I use room mics and close with valhalla room and I am in heaven. I delete all my libraries. I keep only Pianoteq (Steingraeber) and this beauty.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 04:09 AM

I’m with you, judge, I’m with you.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 07:16 AM

Originally Posted by Fleer
I’m with you, judge, I’m with you.

Fleer, listen this sound and then use Embertone Stainway, use above combination and change a little horizontal settings in velocity and volume scaling to be more percussive and they sound the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wx0jkZdQwN8
Posted By: stamkorg

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 07:27 AM

Originally Posted by pianistje

I have dialed in a superb rich tone in my CinePiano


Hello pianistje,

Please can you give me 2 informations:

- How is the playability on the CinePiano? Especially the velocity response, do you feel velocity jumps?

- How is the pedaling? Is there a half pedal function or is it on/off? If there is half pedaling, is it effective and progressive enough to be usefull?

Thanks

SK
Posted By: MacMacMac

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 08:54 AM

I think I'm having another GAS attack here!
So ... there are five microphone positions to choose from.
I doubt I'll need all of them, so I'll just pick one (or two) to save money.
But which one?
  • Close
  • Wide
  • Hammer
  • Room
  • Binaural
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by stamkorg
Originally Posted by pianistje

I have dialed in a superb rich tone in my CinePiano


Hello pianistje,

Please can you give me 2 informations:

- How is the playability on the CinePiano? Especially the velocity response, do you feel velocity jumps?

Hi stamkorg. It is very playable to me , but....... a few bass notes are indeed jumpy when digging into my Kawai keybed.
However i was looking for the ultimate pop piano, that doesn't sound like someone put nails into the hammerheads, because some self proclaimed studio authority has once claimed that pop piano's need to sound tacky, shrill, bright and anything but warm and lush. Therefor all rock and pop piano programms sound god awfull on every digital piano..... both hardware and software.
The CinePiano ( after some peronal tweaks) sounds way and i mean way better than all of my other libraries by comparison.
Every other day i load my piano's to see if i am fooling myself....... but no i absolutely dig the sound.
Somehow brightness, warmth , fullness and 'cutting through a mix' seem to be present in abbundance without distorting one of the mentioned aspects.

But my sole reference is the ultimate pop piano that needs to be much more than some intro riff or other simplyfied piano part that many think a pop piano is all about.
Quote


- How is the pedaling? Is there a half pedal function or is it on/off? If there is half pedaling, is it effective and progressive enough to be usefull?

Thanks

SK

The pedalling is present but less functional than the Garritan CFX for instance.....,,
I am sorry, but i cannot be more specific because i do not know what level is acceptable to you.

Good luck with it !!
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by MacMacMac
I think I'm having another GAS attack here!
So ... there are five microphone positions to choose from.
I doubt I'll need all of them, so I'll just pick one (or two) to save money.
But which one?
  • Close
  • Wide
  • Hammer
  • Room
  • Binaural

Eh, I only recommend what will I do insted of you. I love classical music, so for me Close is a must and Room also. Default mics are equivalent to Room but closer. Matter of preference. Hammer is equivalent for Close but with little distance and more attack and wood. Good for pop, rock but also to give more body to piano. Binaural sounds good with headphones and Wide give lots of air and stereo both from player perspective. Tough call. I say go for close first.
Posted By: MacMacMac

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 10:23 AM

Yes, it's a tough call. Before you posted I was leaning toward binaural (since I mostly use headphones) and close, since I can always add room/reverb in Kontakt. So I'm still undecided.

More puzzling ... the web site says that this library prefers Kontakt 5.7. But I have 5.5
It states that it will work with 5.4 and above, but unless you use 5.7 you won't be able to load this piano into Kontakt's "Libraries" tab. You'd instead have to open it with Kontakt's file browser. Annoying.

I could do what I do with other pianos. I load them all (six of them) and them save them as a "multi". Whenever I start Kontakt I just load that multi, and all of the pianos are available. No need to invoke the "libraries" on the left side of Kontakt.

But I wonder: Will I have to load this piano twice? Once for, say, the binaural mic, and a second time for the close mic? I hope not.

Otherwise this becomes a disk space issue, because when you save a multi the entire library gets copied to the multi. That is, when using my existing six-piano multi, Kontakt is accessing copies of the six pianos, and not the originally installed folders. That doubles the storage requirement!
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 10:34 AM

Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Yes, it's a tough call. Before you posted I was leaning toward binaural (since I mostly use headphones) and close, since I can always add room/reverb in Kontakt. So I'm still undecided.

More puzzling ... the web site says that this library prefers Kontakt 5.7. But I have 5.5
It states that it will work with 5.4 and above, but unless you use 5.7 you won't be able to load this piano into Kontakt's "Libraries" tab. You'd instead have to open it with Kontakt's file browser. Annoying.

I could do what I do with other pianos. I load them all (six of them) and them save them as a "multi". Whenever I start Kontakt I just load that multi, and all of the pianos are available. No need to invoke the "libraries" on the left side of Kontakt.

But I wonder: Will I have to load this piano twice? Once for, say, the binaural mic, and a second time for the close mic? I hope not.

Otherwise this becomes a disk space issue, because when you save a multi the entire library gets copied to the multi. That is, when using my existing six-piano multi, Kontakt is accessing copies of the six pianos, and not the originally installed folders. That doubles the storage requirement!

Why not use Kontakt in some DAW, say Reaper, load whatever you want and save as preset ? I alway do that.
Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 10:52 AM

Originally Posted by stamkorg
Originally Posted by pianistje

I have dialed in a superb rich tone in my CinePiano


Hello pianistje,

Please can you give me 2 informations:

- How is the playability on the CinePiano? Especially the velocity response, do you feel velocity jumps?

- How is the pedaling? Is there a half pedal function or is it on/off? If there is half pedaling, is it effective and progressive enough to be usefull?

Thanks

SK


I'll stick in an opinion as well if you want (and disregard it if you don't!).

- Playability: to me, awful. of 30+ libraries I have, it's second only to the Waves Grand Rhapsody in lack of playability. It's not so much that the amplitude jumps across velocity layers, although it does, it's that the timbre changes are *extreme* between adjacent layers around the middle of the velocity. It goes from being very bright to an almost una corda sound on a knife-edge.

- There is no half-pedal support; it's on-off only. The developers confirmed this to me as well.

The piano does have a nice tone when it's loud, and if you were playing largely in one velocity zone, I could certainly see the attraction, hence it has a lot of potential as a pop piano. But for classical, forget it. You could scarcely do worse in my view.
Posted By: stamkorg

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 11:52 AM

pianistje, karvala,

Thank you for your comments.

If there is no half pedal, it is not for me.
I can't understand how you can make a new virtual piano that sounds so beautifull today without this function.
As Karvala said, for some classical pieces, you need a subtil pedaling.
Posted By: MacMacMac

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 12:04 PM

I can live with this.
Originally Posted by karvala
There is no half-pedal support; it's on-off only. The developers confirmed this to me as well
I realize that there's benefit to continuous pedaling. But I'm just not yet good enough to take advantage of it.

But this is a real problem:
Originally Posted by karvala
It's not so much that the amplitude jumps across velocity layers, although it does, it's that the timbre changes are *extreme* between adjacent layers around the middle of the velocity. It goes from being very bright to an almost una corda sound on a knife-edge.
This failing is Beano for my G.A.S.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by MacMacMac
I can live with this.
Originally Posted by karvala
There is no half-pedal support; it's on-off only. The developers confirmed this to me as well
I realize that there's benefit to continuous pedaling. But I'm just not yet good enough to take advantage of it.

But this is a real problem:
Originally Posted by karvala
It's not so much that the amplitude jumps across velocity layers, although it does, it's that the timbre changes are *extreme* between adjacent layers around the middle of the velocity. It goes from being very bright to an almost una corda sound on a knife-edge.
This failing is Beano for my G.A.S.

Mac they are talking about Cinepiano from Cinesamples.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 12:36 PM

Originally Posted by karvala


- Playability: to me, awful. of 30+ libraries I have, it's second only to the Waves Grand Rhapsody in lack of playability. It's not so much that the amplitude jumps across velocity layers, although it does, it's that the timbre changes are *extreme* between adjacent layers around the middle of the velocity. It goes from being very bright to an almost una corda sound on a knife-edge.

I had the Waves Grand Rhapsody and you are right it was unplayable......have deleted it.
What controler do you use and what mic settings for the CinePiano ? Because it seems we’re discussing an intirely different library...... .
Quote

The piano does have a nice tone when it's loud, and if you were playing largely in one velocity zone, I could certainly see the attraction, hence it has a lot of potential as a pop piano. But for classical, forget it. You could scarcely do worse in my view.

Sorry but compared to the Hammersmith and American D the tone is heavenly.
For me it’s not a ‘nice’ tone, but so much better than the two Steinways mentioned.

I agree it’s not a classical piano, but not a single vst is.
I never understood the need for people to have a digital that somewhat mimicks a real grand all the way.
There are so many options nowadays in many places to play and practice on a real grand if people for whatever reason cannot practice on an acoustic grand/upright.
Sure playing at home is a big plus, but do people really look for a controler and computer to sound like the real thing ?
Even the most beloved vst receives lukewarm reactions within a few years.
Some people over at VI control don’t like the playability of the Embertone allready.
It shows we are all looking for something really different in a vst.

For me the purpose of a vst is not to mimick the real thing but make an utterly convincing impression in whatever recording or composition.
I understand that because i do not use vst’s as a classical replacement, it’s easy talking from my perspective.
Posted By: MacMacMac

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 12:44 PM

Oops.
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Mac they are talking about Cinepiano from Cinesamples.
I was interested in the Embertone Steinway. I guess the thread has weaved elsewhere.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 01:27 PM

Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Oops.
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Mac they are talking about Cinepiano from Cinesamples.
I was interested in the Embertone Steinway. I guess the thread has weaved elsewhere.

Sorry ! I will not talk about another piano again in this dedicated Embertone topic !
Posted By: -Jay-

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 02:11 PM

I purposely have tried to avoid purchasing more piano libraries this year. CinePiano, Light and Sound Steinway C and VSL CFX were all very tempting based on the initial forum reviews, hype and sound demos but I think I made the correct decision to wait. Well definitely in regards to the first two piano libraries mentioned as both have had bad reviews in regards to playability from experienced users on here and other audio forums. I purchased the previous piano library from CineSamples (Piano In Blue) a few years ago and my opinion was similar to what Karvala said above. The velocity response is strange and even worse there is some latency within the actual samples that I have to increase the attack/start time as a workaround which further negatively impacts the overall tone. Its a useful library for film scoring/production/MIDI composition but for live playing it is useless.

The two piano libraries I use the most are Garritan CFX Concert Grand (Full) which I purchased around six months ago and Galaxy Vintage D. Both are excellent in their own way. I actually prefer the tone of Vintage D if I'm being honest but its just a shame it lacks proper release samples/control as it sounds a bit staccato and digital at times. CFX is best for playability.

Now back on topic, this Embertone piano library. I'm very tempted to purchase this. It could be a replacement for Galaxy Vintage D which I've being using for many years. It also sounds like it has a lot of character which is one of my criticisms regarding Garritan CFX which can sound slightly boring. The sound demos that I have heard so far of the AKG default mics and Neumann U87 close mics sound excellent and very detailed. The Una Corda samples sound beautiful also and are the best I've heard from a piano library.

Can anyone confirm the playability is comparable to Garritan CFX?

Ill post a full review if I decide to purchase this.








Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 07:47 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje

I had the Waves Grand Rhapsody and you are right it was unplayable......have deleted it.
What controler do you use and what mic settings for the CinePiano ? Because it seems we’re discussing an intirely different library......


I'm using a CA67 as the controller, and listening through HD650 headphones (amp-driven) in case that's also relevant. I have played with some different velocity curve settings, dynamics ranges, 'character' settings, but I can't find anything that doesn't have this unfortunate knife-edge timbre change. I just played again with the main/default instrument on the default settings, and it had this effect. If you have suggested settings, I'd certainly be happy to try them.

Originally Posted by pianistje

Sorry but compared to the Hammersmith and American D the tone is heavenly.
For me it’s not a ‘nice’ tone, but so much better than the two Steinways mentioned.


I don't own the Hammersmith. The American D certainly has issues with its tone, so I don't disagree. None of the existing Steinways are without issues in that regard, which is why it's a shame this Embertone hasn't been better received.

Originally Posted by pianistje

I agree it’s not a classical piano, but not a single vst is.
I never understood the need for people to have a digital that somewhat mimicks a real grand all the way.
There are so many options nowadays in many places to play and practice on a real grand if people for whatever reason cannot practice on an acoustic grand/upright.
Sure playing at home is a big plus, but do people really look for a controler and computer to sound like the real thing ?
Even the most beloved vst receives lukewarm reactions within a few years.
Some people over at VI control don’t like the playability of the Embertone allready.
It shows we are all looking for something really different in a vst.

For me the purpose of a vst is not to mimick the real thing but make an utterly convincing impression in whatever recording or composition.
I understand that because i do not use vst’s as a classical replacement, it’s easy talking from my perspective.


You'd be surprised; I think most piano VST sales are to people who are looking to use it as a replacement. Options vary; I use to play a range of acoustic grands, and I still have an acoustic upright, but I also have neighbours and family who are not too keen on noise, and other options to play are surprisingly limited where I live. Most DPs, and presumably all hybrids, are sold as acoustic replacements and all of them have sound inferior to the best VSTs, so many people are looking for piano VSTs to imitate acoustic pianos.

Sounding and feeling like the real thing is an incredibly difficult thing to do, hence the lukewarm reception that most get. I've also noticed in my own experience at least, that while some VSTs are clearly better than others in terms of acting as an acoustic replacement, it also depends heavily on the repertoire. I haven't yet found one VST that is clearly the best even for a subset of classical repertoire. In fact the one (and only!) concession I would make to Pianoteq is that it's versatility in that regard is at least as good as any sampled piano, and possibly better.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 09:05 PM

Originally Posted by karvala
[quote=pianistje]
I'm using a CA67 as the controller, and listening through HD650 headphones (amp-driven) in case that's also relevant. I have played with some different velocity curve settings, dynamics ranges, 'character' settings, but I can't find anything that doesn't have this unfortunate knife-edge timbre change. I just played again with the main/default instrument on the default settings, and it had this effect. If you have suggested settings, I'd certainly be happy to try

I am using my trusty Kawai MP8 ( althaugh i cleaned and regulated it to some extent last year )
Also using the same Sennheiser HD650 into my RME input.

I will carefully read the rest of your post later,..... i deleted all other piano's bar the CinePiano and Garritan CFX full,...... downloading the full Embertone with all mic perspectives as we speak (175 GB)......
I hope it will give me the same amount of satisfaction as Fleer and sloba......

I will reply later....... thank you for your lenghty reply !
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/21/18 10:39 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by karvala
[quote=pianistje]
I'm using a CA67 as the controller, and listening through HD650 headphones (amp-driven) in case that's also relevant. I have played with some different velocity curve settings, dynamics ranges, 'character' settings, but I can't find anything that doesn't have this unfortunate knife-edge timbre change. I just played again with the main/default instrument on the default settings, and it had this effect. If you have suggested settings, I'd certainly be happy to try

I am using my trusty Kawai MP8 ( althaugh i cleaned and regulated it to some extent last year )
Also using the same Sennheiser HD650 into my RME input.

I will carefully read the rest of your post later,..... i deleted all other piano's bar the CinePiano and Garritan CFX full,...... downloading the full Embertone with all mic perspectives as we speak (175 GB)......
I hope it will give me the same amount of satisfaction as Fleer and sloba......

I will reply later....... thank you for your lenghty reply !



Just be patient in the beginning, go to Response tab first and make linear on volume scaling. Piano needs little tweaking but after that its heaven. There is no makeup on sound. You will hear Steinway with resonance as recordings from Horowitz. Some people are not ready to hear that on digital piano. They want clean and perfect sound. This sound is closest to old Steinway from concert halls as it gets.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/22/18 02:39 PM

Still only 50% loaded from the entire 175GB.
Had to manually repeat downloading when it freezed from time to time.
During the night and half of the day when i was at work only 29% was downloaded. Now i have to look every 15 minutes to see of yet another lock up occurs.

Really frustrating, but i won’t go in the alternative directions as suggested over at VI control.

I will report in a few days when hopefully the entire library is on my SSD.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/22/18 02:48 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Still only 50% loaded from the entire 175GB.
Had to manually repeat downloading when it freezed from time to time.
During the night and half of the day when i was at work only 29% was downloaded. Now i have to look every 15 minutes to see of yet another lock up occurs.

Really frustrating, but i won’t go in the alternative directions as suggested over at VI control.

I will report in a few days when hopefully the entire library is on my SSD.

In settings go with - Download only and single connection - don`t do nothing till its finished then manually extract if you don`t want more troubles with Continuata
Posted By: Osho

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/22/18 07:33 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by pianistje
Still only 50% loaded from the entire 175GB.
Had to manually repeat downloading when it freezed from time to time.
During the night and half of the day when i was at work only 29% was downloaded. Now i have to look every 15 minutes to see of yet another lock up occurs.

Really frustrating, but i won’t go in the alternative directions as suggested over at VI control.

I will report in a few days when hopefully the entire library is on my SSD.

In settings go with - Download only and single connection - don`t do nothing till its finished then manually extract if you don`t want more troubles with Continuata

I bought this and plan to play with this over the weekend - will report back.

Continuata Connect is probably the worst piece of download-install software I have ever seen. I did "Download only" and downloaded all the files. How do I install this now?

Thanks,
Osho
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/22/18 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by Osho
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by pianistje
Still only 50% loaded from the entire 175GB.
Had to manually repeat downloading when it freezed from time to time.
During the night and half of the day when i was at work only 29% was downloaded. Now i have to look every 15 minutes to see of yet another lock up occurs.

Really frustrating, but i won’t go in the alternative directions as suggested over at VI control.

I will report in a few days when hopefully the entire library is on my SSD.

In settings go with - Download only and single connection - don`t do nothing till its finished then manually extract if you don`t want more troubles with Continuata

I bought this and plan to play with this over the weekend - will report back.

Continuata Connect is probably the worst piece of download-install software I have ever seen. I did "Download only" and downloaded all the files. How do I install this now?

Thanks,
Osho

Every zip file contain one independent file. There are six mics (BRC, AKG, OKT, etc , extract them to folder Sample) The smallest one contains basic folder structure. It is simple. Open any of them (zip) and you will see where it goes. In the end the structure looks like this
- Documentation (folder)
- Instruments (folder)
- Multis (folder)
- Samples (folder)
- Snapshots (folder)
- Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt
- Walker 1955 Steinway D. nkc
- Walker 1955 Steinway D.nkr
Posted By: -Jay-

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/22/18 11:13 PM

Originally Posted by Osho

I bought this and plan to play with this over the weekend - will report back.

Thanks,
Osho


Originally Posted by pianistje


I will report in a few days when hopefully the entire library is on my SSD.


I look forward to reading more reviews. I think I'm going to purchase this library also this weekend so once downloaded/installed I will also report back. I'm particularly interested in how this will compare to Galaxy Vintage D which has being one of my favourite piano libraries for years now.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/23/18 12:05 AM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by Fleer
I’m with you, judge, I’m with you.

Fleer, listen this sound and then use Embertone Stainway, use above combination and change a little horizontal settings in velocity and volume scaling to be more percussive and they sound the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wx0jkZdQwN8

Simply amazing, slobajudge.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/23/18 02:21 AM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Still only 50% loaded from the entire 175GB.
Had to manually repeat downloading when it freezed from time to time.
During the night and half of the day when i was at work only 29% was downloaded. Now i have to look every 15 minutes to see of yet another lock up occurs.

Really frustrating, but i won’t go in the alternative directions as suggested over at VI control.

Wasn’t necessary for me. I just let Continuata do its job. Once or twice it halted, so I resumed. All went well for me, though I know Continuata is no walk in the park.
Enjoy that wonderful Walker, little pianist!
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/28/18 06:26 AM

Originally Posted by Fleer
Originally Posted by pianistje
Still only 50% loaded from the entire 175GB.
Had to manually repeat downloading when it freezed from time to time.
During the night and half of the day when i was at work only 29% was downloaded. Now i have to look every 15 minutes to see of yet another lock up occurs.

Really frustrating, but i won’t go in the alternative directions as suggested over at VI control.

Wasn’t necessary for me. I just let Continuata do its job. Once or twice it halted, so I resumed. All went well for me, though I know Continuata is no walk in the park.
Enjoy that wonderful Walker, little pianist!

Good catch (pianistje= little pianist).... but actually it is very difficult to translate properly....


Finally after some really frustrating days i was able to play the thing at last.
It seemed the ‘wide mics’ did not load as files, but after some helpdesk intervention ( saw my screenshot files) and a new wide mic download code i fnally had a chance to play for some brief moments/an hour.

I like it a lot, it is what i expected the Hammersmith to be, but failed on so many accounts.
No glitches or pops and some really nice perspectives like my fovourite ,..the close hammer mics.
Still to early to give more details, but i am glad i removed a few libraries that are simply not good enough to my ears.

Compared to the CinePiano it is more nuanced and playable , but the Steinway itself is an older one and exhibits some ‘quirks’ soundwise that reveal it’s from 1955.
A good thing, because now i will continue to use both for different purposes.

All in all a very happy user with this one ,!!!!!
Thanks everyone in this topic promoting the Embertone.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/30/18 08:52 AM

Some additional thoughts......
Unlike other users ,i feel this library is more about very strong mic perspectives as stand alone options, than a mix an match palette of perspectives like in other libraries to get the most out of their potential.
Under my fingers it feels great and the nuances are gorgious.

The only thing i regret is that you can slightly hear the decaying quality of the sampled Steinway in some registers.
The Hammersmith was all about that and therefor sounded terrible to me.
Walker D gives a characterfull impression, but lacks the full bodyness you experience behind a fairly new Steinway D concert grand on one of the better stages out there.

Without getting into to much detail, a concert grand has to indure up to 35.000 kg overall tension.
After many decades it has a certain concequence soundwise.
Therefor many older grands sound dead..... not only due to bad strings etc. but a soundboard that has flattened to much over time and lacks proper soundboard pressure ( sounds misleading ). The position of the bridge is a tiny bit higher in new grands (warped soundboard pushing the bridge a bit more upwards ), due to this specific shape of the soundboard when fabricated ......it looses it’s initial shape over time ever so slightly and the soundboard pressure ( difference in height between bridge and the strings end pin ) drops.... affecting the overall tone.

Being Dutch i try to withdraw from specific jargon, because in English i have no idea what most things mean on that specific level....... sorry for any mistake....





Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/30/18 09:12 AM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Some additional thoughts......
Unlike other users ,i feel this library is more about very strong mic perspectives as stand alone options, than a mix an match palette of perspectives like in other libraries to get the most out of their potential.
Under my fingers it feels great and the nuances are gorgious.

Agree, no more then 2 mics at the same time but thats more then enough.

Originally Posted by pianistje
The only thing i regret is that you can slightly hear the decaying quality of the sampled Steinway in some registers.

Don`t bother me at all. Do you try all mics positions ?
Originally Posted by pianistje
Walker D gives a characterfull impression, but lacks the full bodyness you experience behind a fairly new Steinway D concert grand on one of the better stages out there.

There are very small number of pianos vsts that I dont have, but Emberton is for sure among the best for bodyness, but like all others it will never grow to acoustic Steinway, unfortunately.

Originally Posted by pianistje
Without getting into to much detail, a concert grand has to indure up to 35.000 kg overall tension.After many decades it has a certain concequence soundwise. Therefor many older grands sound dead..... not only due to bad strings etc. but a soundboard that has flattened to much over time and lacks proper soundboard pressure ( sounds misleading ). The position of the bridge is a tiny bit higher in new grands (warped soundboard pushing the bridge a bit more upwards ), due to this specific shape of the soundboard when fabricated ......it looses it’s initial shape over time ever so slightly and the soundboard pressure ( difference in height between bridge and the strings end pin ) drops.... affecting the overall tone.

I always found lots of charm in old pianos. smile
Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/30/18 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Without getting into to much detail, a concert grand has to indure up to 35.000 kg overall tension.
After many decades it has a certain concequence soundwise.
Therefor many older grands sound dead..... not only due to bad strings etc. but a soundboard that has flattened to much over time and lacks proper soundboard pressure ( sounds misleading ). The position of the bridge is a tiny bit higher in new grands (warped soundboard pushing the bridge a bit more upwards ), due to this specific shape of the soundboard when fabricated ......it looses it’s initial shape over time ever so slightly and the soundboard pressure ( difference in height between bridge and the strings end pin ) drops.... affecting the overall tone


Very good description, and one of the consequences of this, which I assume is present in the Embertone (I don't own it unfortunately; it's certainly present in other 1950s and earlier piano VSTs) is a more rapid release decay. The difference in sustained resonance between a modern Steinway and a regularly-used 1950s Steinway can be huge. There are advantages and disadvantages to both; you actually get a greater clarity on the older instruments which can be very desirable for some repertoire, so it all depends what you want to play with it.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/30/18 11:26 PM

Originally Posted by karvala


Very good description, and one of the consequences of this, which I assume is present in the Embertone (I don't own it unfortunately; it's certainly present in other 1950s and earlier piano VSTs) is a more rapid release decay. The difference in sustained resonance between a modern Steinway and a regularly-used 1950s Steinway can be huge. There are advantages and disadvantages to both; you actually get a greater clarity on the older instruments which can be very desirable for some repertoire, so it all depends what you want to play with it.

Yes , very accurate summary !!!!
Don't expect the Embertone to sound like a brand new Steinway D.... it doesn't.

The rare soundbytes from the upcoming concert grand from PV could be indicational that it does have a different sound.
I initially feared PV's pricetag would provide an extreme disadvantage compared to the Embertone Steinway.
But if their Steinway D is more 'new' than it is in fact a different instrument than the Walker 1955.

Not that i have any intention whatsover to buy another monster piano library
grin
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/01/18 10:56 PM

But you will smile
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 08:00 AM

Originally Posted by Jay017
I purposely have tried to avoid purchasing more piano libraries this year. CinePiano, Light and Sound Steinway C and VSL CFX were all very tempting based on the initial forum reviews, hype and sound demos but I think I made the correct decision to wait. Well definitely in regards to the first two piano libraries mentioned as both have had bad reviews in regards to playability from experienced users on here and other audio forums. I purchased the previous piano library from CineSamples (Piano In Blue) a few years ago and my opinion was similar to what Karvala said above. The velocity response is strange and even worse there is some latency within the actual samples that I have to increase the attack/start time as a workaround which further negatively impacts the overall tone. Its a useful library for film scoring/production/MIDI composition but for live playing it is useless.

The two piano libraries I use the most are Garritan CFX Concert Grand (Full) which I purchased around six months ago and Galaxy Vintage D. Both are excellent in their own way. I actually prefer the tone of Vintage D if I'm being honest but its just a shame it lacks proper release samples/control as it sounds a bit staccato and digital at times. CFX is best for playability.


That latency you experience with some libraries rings so familiar with me as well and that's my only beef with the Embertone Steinway even though i've been an active endorser of it since its release. And that's exactly why i decided to come back to the Garritan CFX which is still unmatched for me in terms of playability.

Posted By: MacMacMac

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 08:15 AM

Me too. NO INTENTION WHATSOEVER.
Originally Posted by pianistje
Not that i have any intention whatsover to buy another monster piano library.
Originally Posted by Fleer
But you will. smile
Will not buy.
Must resist.
Must resist.
Must resist.
Must resist.
Must resist. frown
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by Jay017
I purposely have tried to avoid purchasing more piano libraries this year. CinePiano, Light and Sound Steinway C and VSL CFX were all very tempting based on the initial forum reviews, hype and sound demos but I think I made the correct decision to wait. Well definitely in regards to the first two piano libraries mentioned as both have had bad reviews in regards to playability from experienced users on here and other audio forums. I purchased the previous piano library from CineSamples (Piano In Blue) a few years ago and my opinion was similar to what Karvala said above. The velocity response is strange and even worse there is some latency within the actual samples that I have to increase the attack/start time as a workaround which further negatively impacts the overall tone. Its a useful library for film scoring/production/MIDI composition but for live playing it is useless.

The two piano libraries I use the most are Garritan CFX Concert Grand (Full) which I purchased around six months ago and Galaxy Vintage D. Both are excellent in their own way. I actually prefer the tone of Vintage D if I'm being honest but its just a shame it lacks proper release samples/control as it sounds a bit staccato and digital at times. CFX is best for playability.


That latency you experience with some libraries rings so familiar with me as well and that's my only beef with the Embertone Steinway even though i've been an active endorser of it since its release. And that's exactly why i decided to come back to the Garritan CFX which is still unmatched for me in terms of playability.


Garritan CFX is really playable and sounds very sweet in digital shape, I like it despite the fact that acoustic Yamaha cfx sounds a little different, but Emberton has so authentic sound from vintage Stainway D that I forgive them any quirks.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by Jay017
I purposely have tried to avoid purchasing more piano libraries this year. CinePiano, Light and Sound Steinway C and VSL CFX were all very tempting based on the initial forum reviews, hype and sound demos but I think I made the correct decision to wait. Well definitely in regards to the first two piano libraries mentioned as both have had bad reviews in regards to playability from experienced users on here and other audio forums. I purchased the previous piano library from CineSamples (Piano In Blue) a few years ago and my opinion was similar to what Karvala said above. The velocity response is strange and even worse there is some latency within the actual samples that I have to increase the attack/start time as a workaround which further negatively impacts the overall tone. Its a useful library for film scoring/production/MIDI composition but for live playing it is useless.

The two piano libraries I use the most are Garritan CFX Concert Grand (Full) which I purchased around six months ago and Galaxy Vintage D. Both are excellent in their own way. I actually prefer the tone of Vintage D if I'm being honest but its just a shame it lacks proper release samples/control as it sounds a bit staccato and digital at times. CFX is best for playability.


That latency you experience with some libraries rings so familiar with me as well and that's my only beef with the Embertone Steinway even though i've been an active endorser of it since its release. And that's exactly why i decided to come back to the Garritan CFX which is still unmatched for me in terms of playability.


Garritan CFX is really playable and sounds very sweet in digital shape, I like it despite the fact that acoustic Yamaha cfx sounds a little different, but Emberton has so authentic sound from vintage Stainway D that I forgive them any quirks.

It would be interesting if there's a video somewhere on Youtube showcasing the sound of that Abbey Road CFX played live to compare it to Garritan's interpretation. I'm guessing it's a unique sounding CFX, different than other CFXs (?). Garritan mentions in the CFX promo video the Abbey Road head engineer had other pianos at his disposal to choose from and he chose that particular CFX at the end. I wonder if those "other pianos" were different brands or were all CFXs.

Here it is, i found the video where they talk about their decision: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sulGpl58lJg
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 11:14 AM

Garritan engineers really do excellent job to clean the sound, fantastic job to make this piano playable and I like it very much. I also have VSL CFX and that piano has more realistic sound but I am not satisfied with top notes and their body. With Garritan everything is very good but the feedback from sound is not acoustic feel like I am receive from Emberton. Anyway, both are excellent products.
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 11:42 AM

I honestly don't understand why this VST is getting so much praise here. Sure, the sound is great, but the playability is garbage IMHO. The notes sticking out are really bad in my opinion, and some of the notes are also slightly out of tune. Repedaling simply doesn't work at all. When it comes to repedaling. this is among the harshest piano VST I've ever played, perhaps the Addictive Keys Steinway was a bit harsher, but I constantly have disappearing notes etc, it completely sucks. This is significant to me because they explicitly advertise repedaling as a feature. Also there's some bad samples. Try hitting E2 very loudly, there is a snap sound in it. Why do they not notice that at all? I noticed these flaws within a few minutes of playing it. Always blows my mind how developers spend so much time and effort sampling the pianos but then shipping their products with such avoidable flaws. At least Embertone doesn't call it "the Bugatti Veyron of virtual instruments" lol. Anyway, I don't want to take away your enjoyment of it, if you can tolerate these flaws in order to enjoy the sound, then I envy you, and all the power to you. But I can't play this for more than a few minutes. Really infuriating too because the sound is definitely nice, but not like this.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 12:24 PM

I was constantly disappointing with all sample libraries because of the nature of technology itself, thats why I love Pianoteq as instrument the most. But I also love authentic sound and I learn to live with flaws of samples except if its too much. I dont think about this piano that playability is sucks. Truth is, minority of acoustic pianos also are in top condition and most of them play and sound with flaws. Even with that lots of people love that imperfection and slightly out of tunes notes. Problem with out of tune notes in Emberton is so small that is not worth to discuss and this is part of charm of that vintage piano. Anyway there will be update for Emberton, its not a bad idea for you to send them your opinion about some flaws to fix it. In the meantime I will I enjoy in part that this piano shines the most and that is sound. Despite some flaws this piano is very playable.
Posted By: angmyu

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 02:12 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
I was constantly disappointing with all sample libraries because of the nature of technology itself, thats why I love Pianoteq as instrument the most.


Those who put pianoteq above sample libraries usually used to tell about the incompleteness of sample libraries. But like the sample libraries, Pianoteq is also technically incomplete, and neither is fundamentally close to acoustic piano. There are technical advantages of modeling piano in detail, but the most important thing in playing the piano is sound after all. Pianoteq is still a long way from there. While Pianoteq continues to evolve, I think they need to change the sound module itself to overcome the sound of the sampling libraries.

However, I have seen a lot of discussions about comparisons about them in several forums, and that is undetermined. Eventually, the instrument that someone think is good is better one.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 02:45 PM

Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Me too. NO INTENTION WHATSOEVER.
Originally Posted by pianistje
Not that i have any intention whatsover to buy another monster piano library.
Originally Posted by Fleer
But you will. smile
Will not buy.
Must resist.
Must resist.
Must resist.
Must resist.
Must resist. frown

We are a bit pathetic ,.... aren’t we ?
grin
Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/02/18 08:50 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by Jay017
I purposely have tried to avoid purchasing more piano libraries this year. CinePiano, Light and Sound Steinway C and VSL CFX were all very tempting based on the initial forum reviews, hype and sound demos but I think I made the correct decision to wait. Well definitely in regards to the first two piano libraries mentioned as both have had bad reviews in regards to playability from experienced users on here and other audio forums. I purchased the previous piano library from CineSamples (Piano In Blue) a few years ago and my opinion was similar to what Karvala said above. The velocity response is strange and even worse there is some latency within the actual samples that I have to increase the attack/start time as a workaround which further negatively impacts the overall tone. Its a useful library for film scoring/production/MIDI composition but for live playing it is useless.

The two piano libraries I use the most are Garritan CFX Concert Grand (Full) which I purchased around six months ago and Galaxy Vintage D. Both are excellent in their own way. I actually prefer the tone of Vintage D if I'm being honest but its just a shame it lacks proper release samples/control as it sounds a bit staccato and digital at times. CFX is best for playability.


That latency you experience with some libraries rings so familiar with me as well and that's my only beef with the Embertone Steinway even though i've been an active endorser of it since its release. And that's exactly why i decided to come back to the Garritan CFX which is still unmatched for me in terms of playability.


Garritan CFX is really playable and sounds very sweet in digital shape, I like it despite the fact that acoustic Yamaha cfx sounds a little different, but Emberton has so authentic sound from vintage Stainway D that I forgive them any quirks.

It would be interesting if there's a video somewhere on Youtube showcasing the sound of that Abbey Road CFX played live to compare it to Garritan's interpretation. I'm guessing it's a unique sounding CFX, different than other CFXs (?). Garritan mentions in the CFX promo video the Abbey Road head engineer had other pianos at his disposal to choose from and he chose that particular CFX at the end. I wonder if those "other pianos" were different brands or were all CFXs.

Here it is, i found the video where they talk about their decision: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sulGpl58lJg


To me, the Garritan CFX is not a bad representation of the acoustic instrument, and it's clearly a particularly fine individual instrument, but it sounds a little too light. The VSL CFX, in spite of some flaws, is in my view a better representation of a CFX from a purely sonic perspective. Both are actually very good VSTs; the Garritan is possibly more versatile and slightly more playable, but VSL have really nailed the CFX timbre and it's perhaps a more realistic playing experience.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/14/18 03:39 PM

Update for Embertone Steinway D is coming, it will include also half pedal. From VI control, Embertone:

`An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.`
Posted By: -Jay-

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/14/18 05:12 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Update for Embertone Steinway D is coming, it will include also half pedal. From VI control, Embertone:

`An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.`


This sounds promising. If the update is received well and the reviews are good, i might purchase the library. One question i have is in regards to the multiple mic positions. Is there any way to link them together so that when you change settings in one Kontakt instance it affects the other. It would seems like good idea to avoid phase issues to ensure all the samples are playing back at the same time also.
Posted By: -Jay-

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/14/18 06:16 PM

Also another question, is there an upgrade from the lite version?
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/14/18 09:19 PM

As far as I know they will fix multi mics patch. Till then I use two mic position at the same time in Kontakt but I set up them separately. There is no problem with that, everything works fine. I think that now it is also possible to upgrade from the lite version but better to check with them because it is not an option earlier.
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/14/18 10:03 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Update for Embertone Steinway D is coming, it will include also half pedal. From VI control, Embertone:

`An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half-pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.`



It is a very positive attitude to customers' feedback and requests! I'm a half step away from buying it.

I'm so excited by this instrument and fell in love from the very first time I heard how it sounds. For a long time I was looking for a replacement for Imperfect Samples' pianos which has great tone but not as good at playability. Now I think I found it! Great job, Embertone!

Can anyone please explain what is different in this samples that make them so alive: No compression, added reverb, or some another processing? I spent two hours on tweaking my VSTis to make them sound similar but I couldn't.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/14/18 10:42 PM

Originally Posted by Max_Forte
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Update for Embertone Steinway D is coming, it will include also half pedal. From VI control, Embertone:

`An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half-pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.`



It is a very positive attitude to customers' feedback and requests! I'm a half step away from buying it.

I'm so excited by this instrument and fell in love from the very first time I heard how it sounds. For a long time I was looking for a replacement for Imperfect Samples' pianos which has great tone but not as good at playability. Now I think I found it! Great job, Embertone!

Can anyone please explain what is different in this samples that make them so alive: No compression, added reverb, or some another processing? I spent two hours on tweaking my VSTis to make them sound similar but I couldn't.

Embertone is well known for almost fanatic approach in deep sampling instruments. They just record real resonance of the piano and there is no difference compare to sound you hear from some youtube videos where people play acoustic Steinway D from the close position. It is obvious they put a lot of effort to record piano from small distance with lots of details and lots of velocity levels with minimum processing in production (if at all).
Posted By: Aves

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/30/18 10:06 PM

So I just downloaded the full 175gb (with all mic positions) but i'm not sure how to continue with the install.
The purchase email says the following: "The Connect app will download, fix and extract your library so that it's ready for you to add to Kontakt." however I ended up with 194 ZIP files and I'm not sure where I have to extract which files. The Connect app immediately closes after I open it with the status message 'Installing..' after every file.
The brief included documentation is not really helping me further (refering to the “main” samples folder which I don't have yet).
I'll send an email to their support tomorrow, but maybe someone here had the same issue and the answer can be of help for others as well.
----

Oh and BTW, I think they changed the pricing of the full library + all mics from $175 to $149. smile
Which imo makes more sense to me than the previous pricing (when buying the full set was actually $1 more expensive than buying all mic's separately)
Posted By: Aves

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 07/31/18 11:48 AM

Nevermind, just unzip with the option 'extract here' and it will find the corresponding directories automatically.
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/08/18 09:52 PM

To all Happy users of this beautiful piano: What do you think about it after the end of the honeymoon?

As you may know, Production Voices just released their Concert Grand instrument. Can't decide which of them should I pick....

Can you get "DRY" sound of it? Don't get me wrong, it sounds beautiful, but sometimes we need the totally dry piano.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/08/18 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by Max_Forte
To all Happy users of this beautiful piano: What do you think about it after the end of the honeymoon?

As you may know, Production Voices just released their Concert Grand instrument. Can't decide which of them should I pick....

Can you get "DRY" sound of it? Don't get me wrong, it sounds beautiful, but sometimes we need the totally dry piano.

I still think that Emberton Steinway is the most realistic sounding vst piano sample at the moment. I still keeping my Pianoteq with me as different technology but I erase all others. No vst piano sound can compare with Emberton Steinway. Even Garritan CFX which I like very much sound flat and boring compare to ES and the same with VSL CFX. The both are fantastic pianos but money wasted. Emberton informed today that update is ready very soon which bring half pedal and bugs fixed, and I cant wait to update it. I dont need another piano, frankly speaking I cant imagine that some new piano will be better. I don`t use dry sound, because I mainly play classical music. On the other hand, new Production voices Steinway has some advanced stuff implemented, it is probably excellent piano but I don`t like the demos I hear. Maybe I will buy it some other time.I will first wait what people who already have ES have to say about it. Emberton Steinway still inspired me to play it a lot. It has everything I expect to hear the same way as I play acoustic piano. I am sorry that I have no money at the moment to bring Yamaha Avant grand or Kawai Novus in my house to enjoy maximum as possible together with ES.
Posted By: angmyu

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/08/18 11:26 PM

I have a lite version. I want to use the full version very much.
Lite is good enough, but there are some drawbacks. I think Full version is another class that complements this.
I hope they will discount ES on Black Friday.

Originally Posted by slobajudge
I will first wait what people who already have ES have to say about it.


Unfortunately, many people seem to be thinking the same thing as you. Two days have passed since its release, but no reviews have been posted anywhere!
I guess most people who purchased ES seem to be worried about their wallets:)
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 03:40 AM

Still deeply in love with the Embertone, not only for its sound and playability, but also for its Kontakt Player NKS compatibility.
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 08:21 AM

slobajudge
angmyu
Fleer

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts!

The only concern to me is that Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D, according to demos I heard, sounds distant. It is great for dreamy, cinematic, romantic etc playing. But how do you find it for other genres, styles? Can you get a "Ringing" tone of it when it is necessary?
Posted By: Aves

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by Max_Forte
To all Happy users of this beautiful piano: What do you think about it after the end of the honeymoon?

As you may know, Production Voices just released their Concert Grand instrument. Can't decide which of them should I pick....

Can you get "DRY" sound of it? Don't get me wrong, it sounds beautiful, but sometimes we need the totally dry piano.


I would wait for the reception of the pedaling update. For me , this piano has unfortunately been un-playable in the current state
There is something really off with the repedaling / catch pedaling, notes keep disappearing. I have to look further into it, but I will wait until the update which will come one of these days I heard from the guys at Embertone.
I will write a more thorough review afterwards.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 08:47 AM

Originally Posted by Max_Forte
slobajudge
angmyu
Fleer

Thank you all for sharing your thoughts!

The only concern to me is that Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D, according to demos I heard, sounds distant. It is great for dreamy, cinematic, romantic etc playing. But how do you find it for other genres, styles? Can you get a "Ringing" tone of it when it is necessary?

Combination of main mics plus close mics is fantastic and piano can`t be more close then that. Earlier in this topic I put a video link of acoustic Steinway and the sound is the same as this combination, more then I mention in that post. If you like sound from video you will love Embertone. Decrease reverb to make it more present. Overall, all mics except room mics are relatively close. I like binaural mics also from player perspective and this is the same feeling as acoustic distance. I cant help you with other styles because I play only classical music.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 08:56 AM

Originally Posted by Aves
I would wait for the reception of the pedaling update. For me , this piano has unfortunately been un-playable in the current state
There is something really off with the repedaling / catch pedaling, notes keep disappearing. I have to look further into it, but I will wait until the update which will come one of these days I heard from the guys at Embertone.
I will write a more thorough review afterwards.


Every time I hear it I forgive them bugs but expecting from them to resolve that. The main problem for me is missing half pedal to control resonance. Compare to other pianos vst, this sound much more realistic and piano really need that half pedal. As I see notes sometimes disappearing only if I hold pedal longer, so this is not something that bothers me much, because I always try to use pedal only when is really necessary, but of course it need to be fixed. I hope that update will be address all of that. Other then this, piano is very playable.
Posted By: pold

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 11:45 AM

It sounds great, but so quiet, I need to increase the volume on the earphones. It sounds always distant on the demos because they need to address the volume issue of this vst.
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/09/18 09:34 PM

slobajudge
Can you please compare tone and playabillity of Walker Steinway D to VSL CFX Or Garritan CFX which I believe you own.

Thoughts of all owners are welcome.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/10/18 09:00 AM

Yes, I own all three and all three are the best pianos samples at the moment. Details and personal preferences choose one vs the other and without self testing my words doesn`t mean much. Now as I said that, for me Emberton has more realistic piano acoustic sound and more alive vs the other two pianos and the moment you start playing it is obvious. Power of his samples are in the next level despite the fact that you will play with one and maximum two mics. No reason for more but you can mix them all if you load them separately till update resolve multi patch. About playability, without update Emberton has bugs with pedal, multi patch and missing half pedal. As such it is not playable as other two pianos. They working perfect. VSL till now has lots of updates at least ten and Garritan has also one big update with half pedal. I also hope that Emberton will fix problems and update is a matter of days. Emberton is very playable in general but need that update to work in the level of other two. Yeah, I know, till you have it all you will torture yourself and after that your wallet will ask some questions smile
Posted By: wolfgangmeister

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 05:03 AM

Back in Mid-June we heard:
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Update for Embertone Steinway D is coming, it will include also half pedal. From VI control, Embertone:

`An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.`

And then in Early August:
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by Aves
I would wait for the reception of the pedaling update. For me , this piano has unfortunately been un-playable in the current state
There is something really off with the repedaling / catch pedaling, notes keep disappearing. I have to look further into it, but I will wait until the update which will come one of these days I heard from the guys at Embertone.
I will write a more thorough review afterwards.


Every time I hear it I forgive them bugs but expecting from them to resolve that. The main problem for me is missing half pedal to control resonance. Compare to other pianos vst, this sound much more realistic and piano really need that half pedal. As I see notes sometimes disappearing only if I hold pedal longer, so this is not something that bothers me much, because I always try to use pedal only when is really necessary, but of course it need to be fixed. I hope that update will be address all of that. Other then this, piano is very playable.

Has Embertone released an update yet for their Walker 1955 Steinway D VSTi yet? It sounded like the update that was promised was pending a month ago... and this thread has gone quiet for almost three weeks now. Has anyone received it? I'm afraid that without such a half-pedaling/re-pedaling update, it's playability and use across the complete range of Classical music (pianissimo to fortissimo; Mozart to Liszt) will be limited. I am very happy with PianoTeq v6.2.2 playability and especially with the Steingraeber & Sohne model sound. I was just looking for one high quality sampled instrument to purchase as an alternative. Garritan CFX Full appears to be the most playable... but is actually starting to lag in sampled technology, Production Voices Concert Grand is more ready for prime-time... but I question the selection of the newer Steinway D "Road Warrior" instrument they actually sampled, and Embertone is the sweetest I've heard... but has some unacceptable deficiencies that would prevent me from purchasing it.

When it is ready, I would like to re-hear the Gluck-Sgambatti and Liszt MIDI recordings we evaluated on another "Steinway D Concert Grand" thread again on the Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D, as an interesting comparison of how this instrument has progressed since initial release.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 06:35 AM

Update is close but not yet. This is Embertones message from yesterday in VI control forum:

``Hey gang,

I am monitoring this thread!! I would suggest those with performance issues reach out to us directly. Our tech support guru, Nick, is extremely detailed compiling everyone's issues, so we can probably identify what's going on pretty quickly.

Our half pedaling script-work is done! There is only one (extremely time consuming but) minor issue left, which you will notice (and probably chuckle about) when the update comes through.

Thanks and talk soon!``
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 08:18 AM

At least guys are still in touch and following the dedicated thread. Nobody is perfect: Sometimes we overestimate our capabilities and underestimate the problem.
Let them do their work smile

Good luck Embertone! thumb
Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 11:04 AM

Originally Posted by wolfgangmeister
Back in Mid-June we heard:
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Update for Embertone Steinway D is coming, it will include also half pedal. From VI control, Embertone:

`An update for everyone- we are releasing more documentation at the beginning of next week. And also, we’ve been hard at work creating an instrument update that includes additional features, most notably, half pedaling. It sounds and feels great! We hope to have an update ready within a week or two.`

And then in Early August:
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by Aves
I would wait for the reception of the pedaling update. For me , this piano has unfortunately been un-playable in the current state
There is something really off with the repedaling / catch pedaling, notes keep disappearing. I have to look further into it, but I will wait until the update which will come one of these days I heard from the guys at Embertone.
I will write a more thorough review afterwards.


Every time I hear it I forgive them bugs but expecting from them to resolve that. The main problem for me is missing half pedal to control resonance. Compare to other pianos vst, this sound much more realistic and piano really need that half pedal. As I see notes sometimes disappearing only if I hold pedal longer, so this is not something that bothers me much, because I always try to use pedal only when is really necessary, but of course it need to be fixed. I hope that update will be address all of that. Other then this, piano is very playable.

Has Embertone released an update yet for their Walker 1955 Steinway D VSTi yet? It sounded like the update that was promised was pending a month ago... and this thread has gone quiet for almost three weeks now. Has anyone received it? I'm afraid that without such a half-pedaling/re-pedaling update, it's playability and use across the complete range of Classical music (pianissimo to fortissimo; Mozart to Liszt) will be limited. I am very happy with PianoTeq v6.2.2 playability and especially with the Steingraeber & Sohne model sound. I was just looking for one high quality sampled instrument to purchase as an alternative. Garritan CFX Full appears to be the most playable... but is actually starting to lag in sampled technology, Production Voices Concert Grand is more ready for prime-time... but I question the selection of the newer Steinway D "Road Warrior" instrument they actually sampled, and Embertone is the sweetest I've heard... but has some unacceptable deficiencies that would prevent me from purchasing it.

When it is ready, I would like to re-hear the Gluck-Sgambatti and Liszt MIDI recordings we evaluated on another "Steinway D Concert Grand" thread again on the Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D, as an interesting comparison of how this instrument has progressed since initial release.


Have you tried the VSL CFX? Much better instrument than the Road Warrior (LOL) Steinway D, much better sampled, and infinitely more playable. Not without its flaws, but the closest to playing an acoustic instrument of sampled instruments that I've experienced, with suitable configuration. Unfortunately, also substantially more expensive for the full version, but worth it if you want just one definitive instrument and you're not convinced by the Garritan CFX (which in my view is its only serious competitor at present). Also worth noting that they kept their promise of updates; they released about five or six updates in the first couple of months which substantially improved it.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 01:42 PM

Originally Posted by karvala

Have you tried the VSL CFX? Much better instrument than the Road Warrior (LOL) Steinway D, much better sampled, and infinitely more playable. Not without its flaws, but the closest to playing an acoustic instrument of sampled instruments that I've experienced, with suitable configuration. Unfortunately, also substantially more expensive for the full version, but worth it if you want just one definitive instrument and you're not convinced by the Garritan CFX (which in my view is its only serious competitor at present). Also worth noting that they kept their promise of updates; they released about five or six updates in the first couple of months which substantially improved it.

If you compare VSL CFX to Emberton, at the moment without update technically yes, its working better. Much better sampled ? No. VSL doesn`t have that resonance and has weak upper register and I hate that. It has more realistic sound than Garritan though but Garritan has more even and pleasant sound.
Posted By: karvala

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 03:28 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by karvala

Have you tried the VSL CFX? Much better instrument than the Road Warrior (LOL) Steinway D, much better sampled, and infinitely more playable. Not without its flaws, but the closest to playing an acoustic instrument of sampled instruments that I've experienced, with suitable configuration. Unfortunately, also substantially more expensive for the full version, but worth it if you want just one definitive instrument and you're not convinced by the Garritan CFX (which in my view is its only serious competitor at present). Also worth noting that they kept their promise of updates; they released about five or six updates in the first couple of months which substantially improved it.

If you compare VSL CFX to Emberton, at the moment without update technically yes, its working better. Much better sampled ? No. VSL doesn`t have that resonance and has weak upper register and I hate that. It has more realistic sound than Garritan though but Garritan has more even and pleasant sound.


Well, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. The sampling of the VSL CFX was a lot more even than the Embertone from what I've heard, with better post-processing in my view. A lot better than the PV Concert Grand Steinway as well. With the surround mics, it has huge resonance; if anything, too much. Weak upper registers? Yes, that's true to an extent, though not nearly as weak as the PV Concert Grand, and the weakness can be fixed by simple per-note amplitude editing; takes less than 5 minutes and sounds fine afterwards.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by karvala
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by karvala

Have you tried the VSL CFX? Much better instrument than the Road Warrior (LOL) Steinway D, much better sampled, and infinitely more playable. Not without its flaws, but the closest to playing an acoustic instrument of sampled instruments that I've experienced, with suitable configuration. Unfortunately, also substantially more expensive for the full version, but worth it if you want just one definitive instrument and you're not convinced by the Garritan CFX (which in my view is its only serious competitor at present). Also worth noting that they kept their promise of updates; they released about five or six updates in the first couple of months which substantially improved it.

If you compare VSL CFX to Emberton, at the moment without update technically yes, its working better. Much better sampled ? No. VSL doesn`t have that resonance and has weak upper register and I hate that. It has more realistic sound than Garritan though but Garritan has more even and pleasant sound.


Well, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. The sampling of the VSL CFX was a lot more even than the Embertone from what I've heard, with better post-processing in my view. A lot better than the PV Concert Grand Steinway as well. With the surround mics, it has huge resonance; if anything, too much. Weak upper registers? Yes, that's true to an extent, though not nearly as weak as the PV Concert Grand, and the weakness can be fixed by simple per-note amplitude editing; takes less than 5 minutes and sounds fine afterwards.

VSL CFX with one mic sound awful. You must fire up at least four to make it sound like piano. Compare that to only one binaural mic in Embertone without surround and VSL failed.
Posted By: upbeat

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 04:47 PM

Do you think the Lite version is worth it? Or is it Full or nothing in your opinion?
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 05:58 PM

Originally Posted by upbeat
Do you think the Lite version is worth it? Or is it Full or nothing in your opinion?

For 39 $ you will not find better, but I don`t know their policy for upgrade to full. Anyway you need more options for the sound, I recommend full version. People who like this piano have different opinions what mics they like and most of them combine two mics except binaural. It sounds fantastic solo with headphones and little bit distant. Main plus close mics are fantastic, for others wide plus hammer misc, etc. I suggest you to wait for update, it will resolve also multi mics patch.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 07:12 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by karvala
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by karvala

Have you tried the VSL CFX? Much better instrument than the Road Warrior (LOL) Steinway D, much better sampled, and infinitely more playable. Not without its flaws, but the closest to playing an acoustic instrument of sampled instruments that I've experienced, with suitable configuration. Unfortunately, also substantially more expensive for the full version, but worth it if you want just one definitive instrument and you're not convinced by the Garritan CFX (which in my view is its only serious competitor at present). Also worth noting that they kept their promise of updates; they released about five or six updates in the first couple of months which substantially improved it.

If you compare VSL CFX to Emberton, at the moment without update technically yes, its working better. Much better sampled ? No. VSL doesn`t have that resonance and has weak upper register and I hate that. It has more realistic sound than Garritan though but Garritan has more even and pleasant sound.


Well, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. The sampling of the VSL CFX was a lot more even than the Embertone from what I've heard, with better post-processing in my view. A lot better than the PV Concert Grand Steinway as well. With the surround mics, it has huge resonance; if anything, too much. Weak upper registers? Yes, that's true to an extent, though not nearly as weak as the PV Concert Grand, and the weakness can be fixed by simple per-note amplitude editing; takes less than 5 minutes and sounds fine afterwards.

VSL CFX with one mic sound awful. You must fire up at least four to make it sound like piano. Compare that to only one binaural mic in Embertone without surround and VSL failed.

LOL you and your love for Embertone. I will not get into details about the quirks i have with Embertone's Steinway but i will amicably say that you are absolutely wrong about what you said about VSL CFX.

First of all, VSL CFX to me is the closest experience you will get to playing a real vivid organic sounding piano. Those thousands of release samples per key pay off at the end and that's what makes it a step above any piano vst for me.

Second of all, the mic-ing concept in VSL CFX is totally different than Embertone. The mics in the VSL CFX were purposely positioned to work together and complete each other, unlike Embertone which were placed in traditional perspective positions that we're used to with every piano vst and its cousin.

As Karvala mentioned, the thin upper registers can easily be pumped in 30 seconds in the edit page. It's the same feature Pianoteq Pro has and it's even better scripted than Pianoteq.

Glad you love Embertone piano. For you it's the best. For me, it's not as i find the VSL CFX vastly superior.

The bottom line is let's all enjoy our choices and make music:)
Posted By: wolfgangmeister

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 07:19 PM

Originally Posted by karvala
Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by karvala

Have you tried the VSL CFX? Much better instrument than the Road Warrior (LOL) Steinway D, much better sampled, and infinitely more playable. Not without its flaws, but the closest to playing an acoustic instrument of sampled instruments that I've experienced, with suitable configuration. Unfortunately, also substantially more expensive for the full version, but worth it if you want just one definitive instrument and you're not convinced by the Garritan CFX (which in my view is its only serious competitor at present). Also worth noting that they kept their promise of updates; they released about five or six updates in the first couple of months which substantially improved it.

If you compare VSL CFX to Emberton, at the moment without update technically yes, its working better. Much better sampled ? No. VSL doesn`t have that resonance and has weak upper register and I hate that. It has more realistic sound than Garritan though but Garritan has more even and pleasant sound.


Well, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one. The sampling of the VSL CFX was a lot more even than the Embertone from what I've heard, with better post-processing in my view. A lot better than the PV Concert Grand Steinway as well. With the surround mics, it has huge resonance; if anything, too much. Weak upper registers? Yes, that's true to an extent, though not nearly as weak as the PV Concert Grand, and the weakness can be fixed by simple per-note amplitude editing; takes less than 5 minutes and sounds fine afterwards.

Thanks for the info on VSL CFX... I had not tried or considered it. Wow - I guess it wasn't until today that I realized that this is the same "Synchon Stage Vienna" crew that produced the famous analog "compare" of their Hamburg Steinway D, Bosendorfer CEUS 290 Imperial and Yamaha CFX Enspire Concert Grands, featuring pianist Stefan Mendl. Very nice set of pianos to record and sample; each offering some benefits that the others do not. It looks like they may have made use of the Yamaha CFX Concert Grand Enspire's system to develop so many and different types of samples, similar to what I recently discovered what Embertone did in using the "Live Performance LX" Walker 1955 Steinway D - which is the same "RePerformance" piano used by Zenph to reproduce legendary recordings of Sergei Rachmaninoff, Glenn Gould and Oscar Peterson.

The VSL CFX is a nice sounding instrument from the demos, but a bit expensive for even the Standard Library... also makes me wonder if they will ever sample their Hamburg Steinway D or re-sample the Bosendorfer Imperial? For the money though, if Embertone gets the half-pedaling/re-pedaling right on their "Walker 1955 Steinway D Full version", this virtual instrument may yet end up being a bargain for what it offers...

Synchron Stage Vienna Concert Grand comparison: (includes the new Yamaha CFX Enspire instrument used to produce the "VSL Synchron CFX")
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2GYYV8JSqM

Dr. John Walker's Zenph Studios RePerformance of Rachmaninoff: (utilizes the instrument used to produce the "Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D")
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRZ01GhrJss&list=PLrRdDOgKd0iVHqZuQqBpyWUtI0lBKY1Hq

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by upbeat
Do you think the Lite version is worth it? Or is it Full or nothing in your opinion?

For 39 $ you will not find better, but I don`t know their policy for upgrade to full. Anyway you need more options for the sound, I recommend full version. People who like this piano have different opinions what mics they like and most of them combine two mics except binaural. It sounds fantastic solo with headphones and little bit distant. Main plus close mics are fantastic, for others wide plus hammer misc, etc. I suggest you to wait for update, it will resolve also multi mics patch.

P.S. Although value priced, my opinion is that the "Lite" version gives up too much with reduced number of max velocity levels (36 --> 12) and no una-corda pedal support.... kind of like the Ravenscroft 275 iOS version I purchased for my iPhone.
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 07:59 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc


Glad you love Embertone piano. For you it's the best. For me, it's not as i find the VSL CFX vastly superior.

The bottom line is let's all enjoy our choices and make music:)


May I claim the diplomatic middle ground and say that they both suck lol

Seriously though, with the updates that the VSL CFX has been getting I should probably give it another chance. The release samples that you mentioned ended up ruining it for me actually, because I would get weird sound effects in the release samples frequently, and only related to certain notes. Ruined the immersion for me. I will say though that it feels very alive, and the dynamic range blew my mind every time I played it. I'm very curious whether Embertone will fix the issues of the Walker, because as far as tone goes, I'd prefer it over any CFX any day. When I can actually enjoy it for more than five seconds without getting pops and crackles and being disturbed by out of tune or too sharp notes, then it sounds like candy. Sweet like sugar.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 08:25 PM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc


Glad you love Embertone piano. For you it's the best. For me, it's not as i find the VSL CFX vastly superior.

The bottom line is let's all enjoy our choices and make music:)


May I claim the diplomatic middle ground and say that they both suck lol

Seriously though, with the updates that the VSL CFX has been getting I should probably give it another chance. The release samples that you mentioned ended up ruining it for me actually, because I would get weird sound effects in the release samples frequently, and only related to certain notes. Ruined the immersion for me. I will say though that it feels very alive, and the dynamic range blew my mind every time I played it. I'm very curious whether Embertone will fix the issues of the Walker, because as far as tone goes, I'd prefer it over any CFX any day. When I can actually enjoy it for more than five seconds without getting pops and crackles and being disturbed by out of tune or too sharp notes, then it sounds like candy. Sweet like sugar.

Wow how diplomatic. Hats off.

They added a knob with the latest update to tone down the volume of the release samples and it completely solved the weird artifacts that everyone was complaining about.

Ironically, i was one of the people who gave up on it before the updates started rolling. I even deleted it fron my SSD. And trust me, i wouldn't be showering my bouquets of praises now if i didn't think the updates made it near perfection for me. And i'm one of the pickiest you'll see on here.

Pops and crackles...umm..well...SSD is actually listed as a requirement on the VSL CFX spec sheet. I run it with no problems on my system.

Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 09:10 PM

I think I didn't see the knob yet, but I know there's a numerical setting that you can do in one of the deeper hidden menues somewhere. Someone, can't remember who it was, advised me on the settings in the VSL CFX thread, but I must admit I barely remember anything about it. But it's there's an actual knob now, then I should check it out. Even though, if that means you have to turn down all release samples just so the faulty ones aren't bothersome anymore, then that is not an elegant solution if you ask me. It's similar to the issues that the Grandeur has and that can be "fixed" by turning off sympathetic resonance or release samples (thankfully there was another solution later on).

I do have the Embertone installed on an SSD. I tested it again and it looks like I have to crank up my sample size settings in the ASIO driver. Then it drastically improved, but introduced more lag and there was still some crackles left. Looking forward to what the update brings to the table.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 09:28 PM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
I think I didn't see the knob yet, but I know there's a numerical setting that you can do in one of the deeper hidden menues somewhere. Someone, can't remember who it was, advised me on the settings in the VSL CFX thread, but I must admit I barely remember anything about it. But it's there's an actual knob now, then I should check it out. Even though, if that means you have to turn down all release samples just so the faulty ones aren't bothersome anymore, then that is not an elegant solution if you ask me. It's similar to the issues that the Grandeur has and that can be "fixed" by turning off sympathetic resonance or release samples (thankfully there was another solution later on).

I do have the Embertone installed on an SSD. I tested it again and it looks like I have to crank up my sample size settings in the ASIO driver. Then it drastically improved, but introduced more lag and there was still some crackles left. Looking forward to what the update brings to the table.

I take back the "knob" word, it's not a knob but as you said, it's a numeric value that you can control with your mouse, that's correct.

It's not hidden anywhere, it's actually on the "edit" page, which is the first thing you see on top of the main GUI when you open it and you can get there by clicking on the "edit" word.

It does not turn down the release samples all the way, unless you want it to (that would be a value of -80). I set to -6 and it's game over, problem solved. I wouldn't be happy playing with no release samples anyway (i'm picky, remember?).

The edit page on the VSL CFX is far deeper than what's available on the Grandeur. I would say that the closest thing to it in terms of tweakability is the one in Pianoteq Pro.
Posted By: sorrownightingale

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 10:12 PM

I can not comment on the Embertone because I have not tried it, but the VST CFX is the best piano vst right now. My piano teacher, who was the pianist of the Symphony where I live, - previously no piano vst convinced her -, then last Friday she came to my house and I put the Vsl CFX in Cubase with the patch made and published by Karvala -modifying the RS LEVEL in -5 to not have the commented problem of the Release Samples-, midi velocity curve modified by midiflow in the Yamaha NU1 and Sonarworks to balance the acoustics of my room ... she played several pieces among which are the Bach's partitas and she said that without problem could study with that piano!!.So, the VSL CFX works for me and I'm very happy about this!!!.Comment that she is a teacher at the Conservatory and is playing piano acoustic all day and at home has a Yamaha Grand G2 5'7''
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/29/18 11:01 PM

Originally Posted by wolfgangmeister
Dr. John Walker's Zenph Studios RePerformance of Rachmaninoff: (utilizes the instrument used to produce the "Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D")
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRZ01GhrJss&list=PLrRdDOgKd0iVHqZuQqBpyWUtI0lBKY1Hq


Just to mention: On January 2015 "Zenph" was bought by “Steinway & Sons” and thanks to Zenph's technology we have some incredible performances in "Steinway Spirio" library now!

Pieces played by:
George Gershwin
Duke Ellington
Arturo Benedetti Michelangeli
Claudio Arrau


Just to name a few.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/30/18 05:21 AM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
LOL you and your love for Embertone. I will not get into details about the quirks i have with Embertone's Steinway but i will amicably say that you are absolutely wrong about what you said about VSL CFX.

First of all, VSL CFX to me is the closest experience you will get to playing a real vivid organic sounding piano. Those thousands of release samples per key pay off at the end and that's what makes it a step above any piano vst for me.

Second of all, the mic-ing concept in VSL CFX is totally different than Embertone. The mics in the VSL CFX were purposely positioned to work together and complete each other, unlike Embertone which were placed in traditional perspective positions that we're used to with every piano vst and its cousin.

As Karvala mentioned, the thin upper registers can easily be pumped in 30 seconds in the edit page. It's the same feature Pianoteq Pro has and it's even better scripted than Pianoteq.

Glad you love Embertone piano. For you it's the best. For me, it's not as i find the VSL CFX vastly superior.

The bottom line is let's all enjoy our choices and make music:)

I also think that VSL CFX is among the best samples piano. I say that many times. But sound can`t be compared to Emberton, who has much more realistic sound. But ok, I am glad that you love VSL CFX. After couple of years we finally have some new pianos to talk about and that`s good. I agree, lets all enjoy our choices and make music smile
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/31/18 01:32 AM

Can’t wait to get my hands on that Embertone Walker update. Come to mama!
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 08/31/18 05:07 AM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
LOL you and your love for Embertone. I will not get into details about the quirks i have with Embertone's Steinway but i will amicably say that you are absolutely wrong about what you said about VSL CFX.

First of all, VSL CFX to me is the closest experience you will get to playing a real vivid organic sounding piano. Those thousands of release samples per key pay off at the end and that's what makes it a step above any piano vst for me.
Second of all, the mic-ing concept in VSL CFX is totally different than Embertone. The mics in the VSL CFX were purposely positioned to work together and complete each other, unlike Embertone which were placed in traditional perspective positions that we're used to with every piano vst and its cousin.

As Karvala mentioned, the thin upper registers can easily be pumped in 30 seconds in the edit page. It's the same feature Pianoteq Pro has and it's even better scripted than Pianoteq.

Glad you love Embertone piano. For you it's the best. For me, it's not as i find the VSL CFX vastly superior.

The bottom line is let's all enjoy our choices and make music:)

I also think that VSL CFX is among the best samples piano. I say that many times. But sound can`t be compared to Emberton, who has much more realistic sound. But ok, I am glad that you love VSL CFX. After couple of years we finally have some new pianos to talk about and that`s good. I agree, lets all enjoy our choices and make music smile

You’re doing it again. That’s your opinion about Embertone having a more realistic sound. My opinion is the opposite, I think the vsl cfx does.

With that said, I like to thank you for respecting other people’s preferences and choices, that’s the spirit. Thumbs up.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 02:52 AM

Let’s just agree that people express their opinion when posting in threads, while at the same time respecting others’ unless proven otherwise. It’s simpler that way.
Posted By: MacMacMac

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 03:08 AM

Does anyone think otherwise?
Originally Posted by Fleer
Let’s just agree that people express their opinion when posting in threads ...
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Does anyone think otherwise?
Originally Posted by Fleer
Let’s just agree that people express their opinion when posting in threads ...

Funny thing is that when you dig up older posts about the best piano vst around the www, we enter an alternative universe at times.
How some people rave about a certain vst and fully ignore it when their next ‘ultimate’ vst comes around. ( Ivory on top of everything)
I have done the same , therefor we should take any comment with a grain of salt at times.

Example .... i use an HX3 hammond clone, considered one of the best.
Over time it received many updates and thus ‘improvements’.
The initial product reviews were stellar even when the HX3 product was still called ‘HOAX’’.
After at least a dozen updates and the related forum comments, one would assume that the current product is at least in another league compared to the first one’s
I stopped updating after a while because it was a pain altogether and the extreme hype after each and every update was totally wasted on me..... iow i couldn’t care less about 10% more authentic percussion when you listened to it in isolation with €400,- + headphones.

Comparing a Steinway to a Yamaha is also impossible.....the differences in sound are large in my opinion.
I for one choose sound above playability and the behaviour of the total piano playing experience.
Of course it has to play at a certain level without latency, cracks or other huge distractions.
But i prefer a superb tone over acurate pedal behaviour and i get the feeling that some forum members feel the opposite.

Ps Kontakt ,out of nowhere , cannot find the Embertone since yesterday.
The routing path and everything seem accurate and Kontakt should have no reason to ‘Library content not found’ messages ..grrrrr......
Out of nowhere without running any updates whatsoever ( didn’t even played the Embertone yesterday) it can’t find the Embertone.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 12:56 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Does anyone think otherwise?
Originally Posted by Fleer
Let’s just agree that people express their opinion when posting in threads ...

Funny thing is that when you dig up older posts about the best piano vst around the www, we enter an alternative universe at times.
How some people rave about a certain vst and fully ignore it when their next ‘ultimate’ vst comes around. ( Ivory on top of everything)
I have done the same , therefor we should take any comment with a grain of salt at times.


Totally irrelevant and has nothing to do with what you quoted the post above for, which is respecting people's opinions when it comes to tastes instead of claiming facts without adding the magic word afterwards which is: "in my opinion". That is all i was amicably saying to Slobajudge.

And regarding moving on to other vsts when new ones come out: So what? what's wrong with that? We're all in the pursuit of perfection in terms of piano sample libraries.

And if you're referring to me regarding Ivory American Grand, Yes i did say a while i go that it's the best piano vst at the moment but that was during the time when VSL CFX had tons of bugs and issues, so now the VSL CFX is my go-to piano. Sue me?
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 01:19 PM

I have checked out the latest update for the VSL CFX and my first impression is that it runs a lot smoother than the initial release version. After spending some time doing edits to the individual note edit pages I could also (kind of) balance out the weaker upper octaves, and by making changes to those numerical setting things, those stupid release sounds have gotten bearable. It's actually pretty fun to play now. I have come to dislike the sound of it though. It sounds even colder and more lifeless than the Garritan CFX to me now, and the sound quality doesn't satisfy me anymore, although I find it hard to pinpoint why that is. I'm considering upgrading to the full version because apparently the additional mics greatly improve the sound. But then I am not sure if I want to sink more money into this, and also I still don't want to support this kind of customer treatment regarding drm and dongles.

I am really curious now though - if they ever sample their Steinway with this engine, and then refine it similarly to how they refined this one, then that could be one heck of a piano VST. Let's hope it doesn't take them another ten years to release that.
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
I have checked out the latest update for the VSL CFX and my first impression is that it runs a lot smoother than the initial release version. After spending some time doing edits to the individual note edit pages I could also (kind of) balance out the weaker upper octaves, and by making changes to those numerical setting things, those stupid release sounds have gotten bearable. It's actually pretty fun to play now. I have come to dislike the sound of it though. It sounds even colder and more lifeless than the Garritan CFX to me now, and the sound quality doesn't satisfy me anymore, although I find it hard to pinpoint why that is. I'm considering upgrading to the full version because apparently the additional mics greatly improve the sound. But then I am not sure if I want to sink more money into this, and also I still don't want to support this kind of customer treatment regarding drm and dongles.

I am really curious now though - if they ever sample their Steinway with this engine, and then refine it similarly to how they refined this one, then that could be one heck of a piano VST. Let's hope it doesn't take them another ten years to release that.

Ironically, the setting that i use in the VSL CFX relies on the standard version and it sounds full and vivid to me. I couldn't be happier. So go figure.

I can send you my preset if you like to try it.

And yes, i think the Synchron Steinway is coming i believe. They're in love with that stage. They just released a new Synchron strings library today.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 01:30 PM

Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Does anyone think otherwise?
Originally Posted by Fleer
Let’s just agree that people express their opinion when posting in threads ...

Funny thing is that when you dig up older posts about the best piano vst around the www, we enter an alternative universe at times.
How some people rave about a certain vst and fully ignore it when their next ‘ultimate’ vst comes around. ( Ivory on top of everything)
I have done the same , therefor we should take any comment with a grain of salti at times.


Totally irrelevant and has nothing to do with what you quoted the post above for, which is respecting people's opinions when it comes to tastes instead of claiming facts without adding the magic word afterwards which is: "in my opinion". That is all i was amicably saying to Slobajudge.

And regarding moving on to other vsts when new ones come out: So what? what's wrong with that? We're all in the pursuit of perfection in terms of piano sample libraries.

And if you're referring to me regarding Ivory American Grand, Yes i did say a while i go that it's the best piano vst at the moment but that was during the time when VSL CFX had tons of bugs and issues, so now the VSL CFX is my go-to piano. Sue me?

Don't overreact please,...... i have no idea whatsoever what you wrote about Ivory piano's.... don't even know what you currently use apart from the VSL/CFX.

I like to read all over the web about vst's because it's fun and people's opinion change over time.
I have also claimed that the first years the Garritan CFX was my holy grail piano vst, but i don't really warm to the CFX sound at the moment.
And the CFX rendering from VSL sounds even more 'cold' than the Garritan that has still some warmth.
Good for you that you like it very much,..... please continue to enjoy your vst !
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/01/18 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by tdwctdwc
Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by MacMacMac
Does anyone think otherwise?
Originally Posted by Fleer
Let’s just agree that people express their opinion when posting in threads ...

Funny thing is that when you dig up older posts about the best piano vst around the www, we enter an alternative universe at times.
How some people rave about a certain vst and fully ignore it when their next ‘ultimate’ vst comes around. ( Ivory on top of everything)
I have done the same , therefor we should take any comment with a grain of salti at times.


Totally irrelevant and has nothing to do with what you quoted the post above for, which is respecting people's opinions when it comes to tastes instead of claiming facts without adding the magic word afterwards which is: "in my opinion". That is all i was amicably saying to Slobajudge.

And regarding moving on to other vsts when new ones come out: So what? what's wrong with that? We're all in the pursuit of perfection in terms of piano sample libraries.

And if you're referring to me regarding Ivory American Grand, Yes i did say a while i go that it's the best piano vst at the moment but that was during the time when VSL CFX had tons of bugs and issues, so now the VSL CFX is my go-to piano. Sue me?

Don't overreact please,...... i have no idea whatsoever what you wrote about Ivory piano's.... don't even know what you currently use apart from the VSL/CFX.

I like to read all over the web about vst's because it's fun and people's opinion change over time.
I have also claimed that the first years the Garritan CFX was my holy grail piano vst, but i don't really warm to the CFX sound at the moment.
And the CFX rendering from VSL sounds even more 'cold' than the Garritan that has still some warmth.
Good for you that you like it very much,..... please continue to enjoy your vst !

Ahhh i see. Fair enough then, my apologies.

And thank you very much. I will indeed continue to enjoy my lovely amazing VSL CFX.
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/02/18 08:54 AM

Do to some 'Steinway' brand related issues i had to rename "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt" in the folder.

After launching native access and kontakt the Embertone is on full display again.
Pffff....luckily someone posted this over at the VI control forum.
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/02/18 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Do to some 'Steinway' brand related issues i had to rename "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt" to "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt" in the folder.

After launching native access and kontakt the Embertone is on full display again.
Pffff....luckily someone posted this over at the VI control forum.


Uh oh... WHY would they do that and choose this one name out of everything they could have chosen?? They'll run into trouble with Synthogy because of their "American Concert D" product name.

Also, tdwctdwc, thank you for your offer. Can you perhaps make a screenshot of your microphone mixing screen? I'm just using the default player perspective mixing. Have the room mics disabled because they add this very IMHO unpleasant room reverb to the sound. But perhaps you could make it work better?
Posted By: RobR

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/02/18 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

Also, tdwctdwc, thank you for your offer. Can you perhaps make a screenshot of your microphone mixing screen? I'm just using the default player perspective mixing. Have the room mics disabled because they add this very IMHO unpleasant room reverb to the sound. But perhaps you could make it work better?

My setting has the "Decca Tree player preset" mics untouched hence most of the work is done in the edit page and volume levels etc. Due to the graphic GUI nature of the edit page, it won't be any help to post a screenshot. That's why i offered to send you the preset file as it is. Feel free to pm me.
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/03/18 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

Uh oh... WHY would they do that and choose this one name out of everything they could have chosen?? They'll run into trouble with Synthogy because of their "American Concert D" product name.

Nah, “concert” is a general (Steinway) denominator, like ProductionVoices Concert Grand.
Posted By: Nor

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/03/18 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by Fleer
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

Uh oh... WHY would they do that and choose this one name out of everything they could have chosen?? They'll run into trouble with Synthogy because of their "American Concert D" product name.

Nah, “concert” is a general (Steinway) denominator, like ProductionVoices Concert Grand.


I don't think so, read here:

https://www.garritan.com/products/cfx-concert-grand-virtual-piano/

CFX is a YAMAHA and they named it a Concert piano too...
Posted By: stamkorg

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/03/18 08:40 AM

The sound of this Embertone is gorgeous.
If they add the half pedal and if it works well, this could be my next purchase and a reference for the next 10 years.

Does anybody compared it to the Vintage D about playability (response to velocity, homogeneity and continuity of the tone with the increase of velocity played...)?

Thanks

SK
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/04/18 03:55 AM

Originally Posted by Nor
Originally Posted by Fleer
Originally Posted by Grazilerimba

Uh oh... WHY would they do that and choose this one name out of everything they could have chosen?? They'll run into trouble with Synthogy because of their "American Concert D" product name.

Nah, “concert” is a general (Steinway) denominator, like ProductionVoices Concert Grand.


I don't think so, read here:

https://www.garritan.com/products/cfx-concert-grand-virtual-piano/

CFX is a YAMAHA and they named it a Concert piano too...

Which is what I meant to say, and why I put Steinway between brackets wink
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/13/18 10:28 PM

Is there any news about the update? If not, then I suppose they will release it after October 1 - the release date of Kontakt 6.

The huge advantage of this library is that it's "Kontakt Player" compatible so Embertone can implement all new features in Kontakt 6 without any need to think about those who are on the previous paid versions and don't want upgrade now. "Production Voices" have to understand how important is it!

And what about your impressions now? Do you still feel the same excitement of this piano?
Posted By: Frédéric L

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/14/18 04:47 AM

@Max_Forte : I don’t think Kontakt and Kontakt Player can cohabit, then if someone have paid for Kontakt 5 (as I do), he will have to pay for Kontakt 6 or install Kontakt Player 6 (and disinstall Kontakt 5) to use libraries designed for the newest Kontakt.
Posted By: Max_Forte

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/14/18 10:23 AM

Originally Posted by Frédéric L
@Max_Forte : I don’t think Kontakt and Kontakt Player can cohabit, then if someone have paid for Kontakt 5 (as I do), he will have to pay for Kontakt 6 or install Kontakt Player 6 (and disinstall Kontakt 5) to use libraries designed for the newest Kontakt.


I had a similar setup in the past. I believe they were "Kontakt 3" and "Kontakt 4 Player". Worked well.
Posted By: Alex C

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/29/18 04:29 PM

Just purchased the Embertone Walker piano, mainly for the extensive una corda samples, which my beloved Garritan CFX doesn't have. Now I'm contemplating to buy the close mic (U87) perspective. However, did anyone notice, when you switch off 'tone' (sweetening section), the piano actually sounds warmer and closer? Not sure if I really need that close mic perspective ...
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 09/29/18 07:15 PM

Originally Posted by Alex C
Just purchased the Embertone Walker piano, mainly for the extensive una corda samples, which my beloved Garritan CFX doesn't have. Now I'm contemplating to buy the close mic (U87) perspective. However, did anyone notice, when you switch off 'tone' (sweetening section), the piano actually sounds warmer and closer? Not sure if I really need that close mic perspective ...

When you switch off Sweetening (all three) you get piano as it recorded without processing. I have full piano with all mics and from time to time I change and combine different mics. Sometimes I love combination with two mics and sometimes solo with different ones. So, not much help for you, only if you take all mics you will have peace smile
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/21/18 09:26 PM

Is anyone else having problems in Kontakt ever since they renamed this to Concert D? It didn't show in the side tab anymore so I opened Native Access where it showed that it was uninstalled despite having been installed earlier. But the name was now changed to Walker 1955 Concert D. Installing it in Native Access made it show up in Kontakt again, but now it is searching for "Walker 1955 Concert D.nicnt" but can't find it. That's because my file is still called "Walker 1955 Steinway D.nicnt". Should I just rename the files or can I break something with that? Would I have to rename every single file, also in the samples folders, and replace the string "Steinway" with "Concert"?

Also what's with the update, didn't they want to release it in July or something, and didn't they claim they just had a tiny little annoyance to get rid of which shouldn't take much more time?
Posted By: pianistje

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/21/18 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by Alex C
Just purchased the Embertone Walker piano, mainly for the extensive una corda samples, which my beloved Garritan CFX doesn't have. Now I'm contemplating to buy the close mic (U87) perspective. However, did anyone notice, when you switch off 'tone' (sweetening section), the piano actually sounds warmer and closer? Not sure if I really need that close mic perspective ...

I have the full package too and also many other vst's incl. the Garritan CFX full.
My personal absolute favourite is the hammer close mike.
And althaugh many combinations sound awesome , the hammer close mike produces that unique sound i favour above all other settings.
At first it sounded a bit thin in isolation, but the transparency, wooden hammer sound and gorgious sustain makes it the ideal piano for any mix i throw it in.
Without much further processing (a bit decreasing the bass eq) it is exactly what i need.
It is absolutely wonderfull how it maintains every aspect of the Walker 1955 without dominating to much with conflicting frequencies.

Again, by far my personal favourite after a couple of months playing around.
Posted By: Alex C

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/22/18 04:30 PM

Originally Posted by pianistje
Originally Posted by Alex C
Just purchased the Embertone Walker piano, mainly for the extensive una corda samples, which my beloved Garritan CFX doesn't have. Now I'm contemplating to buy the close mic (U87) perspective. However, did anyone notice, when you switch off 'tone' (sweetening section), the piano actually sounds warmer and closer? Not sure if I really need that close mic perspective ...

I have the full package too and also many other vst's incl. the Garritan CFX full.
My personal absolute favourite is the hammer close mike.
And althaugh many combinations sound awesome , the hammer close mike produces that unique sound i favour above all other settings.
At first it sounded a bit thin in isolation, but the transparency, wooden hammer sound and gorgious sustain makes it the ideal piano for any mix i throw it in.
Without much further processing (a bit decreasing the bass eq) it is exactly what i need.
It is absolutely wonderfull how it maintains every aspect of the Walker 1955 without dominating to much with conflicting frequencies.

Again, by far my personal favourite after a couple of months playing around.



Well, this morning I ordered the close mic perspective to start with, but Chrome's 'auto-fill' wrote a faulty email address so I never received the code. I wrote Embertone to tell them about it, but based on experience, it could take a very long time before they respond.
Posted By: wolfgangmeister

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/24/18 02:56 PM

Just a note for those interested, as part of a Black Friday weekend sale, the entire suite of Embertone's Walker 1955 Concert D - w/ full (all 6 mic) perspectives is available for 20% off the normal price; i.e. $119.20 USD today (Saturday, November 24th). I just purchased it!

https://embertone.com/instruments/instruments.html

I've been waiting to pull the trigger for the updated release that addresses the 1/2 pedaling and re-pedaling issue... which is very important to me, as I am using my virtual instruments for silent practice on my Mason & Hamlin BB 7' acoustic grand, with ProRecord MIDI and the built in QuietTime mute rail. But I had not seen it available for this price since it's introduction. Any news on the updated release? Last I saw:
https://vi-control.net/community/threads/embertone-releases-walker-1955-steinway-d.72492/page-23

Quote
Embertone Releases: Walker 1955 Steinway 'D' - October 29th post:

...the legal concerns we had, along with the unexpected complexity of the half pedaling update (mostly to do with very small issues that popped up after the update was “complete”), combined with my moving to a new house with my family, has caused the few months delay. It is so close now, I’m just trying to lock down consistency between all the mics, squash a few more sample issues, and we’ll be ready to go!...

And... we do not work in Earth days, we work on a Mercurian calendar/schedule smile

Sorry everyone and thanks!!

Alex

I am adding this to my PianoTeq 6.3 Standard (Steingraeber E-272, Ant.Petrof 275, Grotrian Concert Royal, Bluthner Model One, Grand K2, Hamburg Steinway B, Hamburg Steinway D) and Garritan (Yamaha) CFX Full collection of virtual instruments. Should be fun to compare playability vs. acoustic sound emulation of the various packages!
Posted By: pianoten

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/24/18 03:47 PM

You have almost the same Instruments as me laugh
Yesterday, I bought the emberton too. Sadly I can't install it but if I figure it out it will be alot of fun!
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/24/18 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by wolfgangmeister

I've been waiting to pull the trigger for the updated release that addresses the 1/2 pedaling and re-pedaling issue... which is very important to me, as I am using my virtual instruments for silent practice on my Mason & Hamlin BB 7' acoustic grand, with ProRecord MIDI and the built in QuietTime mute rail. But I had not seen it available for this price since it's introduction. Any news on the updated release?

About update for Emberton Steinway, the last information from Emberton in VI control forum is: `We are extremely delayed updating our Concert D... but it really is just on the threshold. I want to convey my disappointment that it's not ready yet, and say with confidence that it will be finished and ready before the holidays. If anyone is particularly antsy and needing the half pedal improvements of the piano, please PM me. I can get you a beta patch.`
On my email I receive the message that update will be very soon.
I have a question for you Wolfgangmeister about silent function in acoustic pianos. Do you feel any problems when you play in silent mode, like hard action, key motion range are decreased, problems with tuning etc ? Some people said that is bad to have that on piano and some have opposite opinion. Thank you.
Posted By: wolfgangmeister

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/24/18 06:06 PM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
About update for Emberton Steinway, the last information from Emberton in VI control forum is: `We are extremely delayed updating our Concert D... but it really is just on the threshold. I want to convey my disappointment that it's not ready yet, and say with confidence that it will be finished and ready before the holidays. If anyone is particularly antsy and needing the half pedal improvements of the piano, please PM me. I can get you a beta patch.`
On my email I receive the message that update will be very soon.
Thank you slobajudge relative to the Embertone update - I may PM Alex for the half pedal improvements beta patch, as this was the reason why I had not bought the package, due to the experiment we made with my MIDI recording of the Gluck-Sgambati Melody a few months back.
Originally Posted by slobajudge
I have a question for you Wolfgangmeister about silent function in acoustic pianos. Do you feel any problems when you play in silent mode, like hard action, key motion range are decreased, problems with tuning etc ? Some people said that is bad to have that on piano and some have opposite opinion. Thank you.
Relative to PianoDisc Quiet Time 'silent mode', when a piano is properly regulated, the only difference that I perceive when I play silently (and softly) is in a very small reduction in hammer 'let off' distance (~1/16 inch) when it is in 'escapement'. The two mute bars need to carefully set to be very close and right below to where the hammers just barely miss touching the strings. When the bass mute bar and treble/mid section bass mute bars are adjusted properly as part of a well-regulated action, there is no increase in stiffness to the action, key motion range is virtually identical and the player only feels a very slight perceivable difference in the 'let off' distance when playing quietly.

BTW, there is absolutely NO difference in the piano's tuning... I have seen people say this and it makes no sense! The mute bars only stop the hammers just before they strike the strings. In fact, I have taken my headphones off and if I listen carefully as I place my head very close to the piano (ala 'Beethoven' in the movie "Immortal Beloved"), I can actually 'hear' the resonance of the strings being 'played very quietly' due to the proximity of the hammer to the string, especially when the sustain pedal is down. All in all, it is very similar to the feeling that one gets when playing a Kawai Novus NV-10 or Yamaha AvantGrand Nx hybrid digital instrument - and it is a nice experience when paired with a high quality software Virtual Instrument. In my case, I have a WNG carbon-fiber/composite action installed in my M&H, which is also one of my favorite acoustic piano actions to play.
Originally Posted by pianoten
You have almost the same Instruments as me laugh
Yesterday, I bought the emberton too. Sadly I can't install it but if I figure it out it will be alot of fun!
Congratulations pianoten - as soon as I download all the Embertone files, I will let you know how I make out. Did you download Native Instruments 'Native Access' and free 'Kontakt Player 6' first? These are required to use the Embertone VI...
Posted By: sullivang

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/25/18 02:01 AM

Demos sound very good! In one review though, it was mentioned that it doesn't crossfade to the pedal-down samples, when the pedal is depressed *after* the notes are played - is this included in the upcoming update?

Greg
Posted By: Alex C

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/25/18 07:03 AM

Now that I have the close mic perspective I must conclude that I prefer the standard mix version, at least when it comes to the Una Corda samples (which is my favorite aspect of the Walker). I guess you really do need every mic position in order to get 'your' sound. And even then I fear you might not be able to top the main version. Grrrr!
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/25/18 07:19 AM

Originally Posted by wolfgangmeister
Relative to PianoDisc Quiet Time 'silent mode', when a piano is properly regulated, the only difference that I perceive when I play silently (and softly) is in a very small reduction in hammer 'let off' distance (~1/16 inch) when it is in 'escapement'. The two mute bars need to carefully set to be very close and right below to where the hammers just barely miss touching the strings. When the bass mute bar and treble/mid section bass mute bars are adjusted properly as part of a well-regulated action, there is no increase in stiffness to the action, key motion range is virtually identical and the player only feels a very slight perceivable difference in the 'let off' distance when playing quietly.

BTW, there is absolutely NO difference in the piano's tuning... I have seen people say this and it makes no sense! The mute bars only stop the hammers just before they strike the strings. In fact, I have taken my headphones off and if I listen carefully as I place my head very close to the piano (ala 'Beethoven' in the movie "Immortal Beloved"), I can actually 'hear' the resonance of the strings being 'played very quietly' due to the proximity of the hammer to the string, especially when the sustain pedal is down. All in all, it is very similar to the feeling that one gets when playing a Kawai Novus NV-10 or Yamaha AvantGrand Nx hybrid digital instrument - and it is a nice experience when paired with a high quality software Virtual Instrument. In my case, I have a WNG carbon-fiber/composite action installed in my M&H, which is also one of my favorite acoustic piano actions to play.

Thank you for detail answer. Between Novus or Avant grand I choose acoustic with silent mode this has more sense for me, and btw lucky you, that piano with WNG action you have is beautiful.
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/25/18 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by Alex C
Now that I have the close mic perspective I must conclude that I prefer the standard mix version, at least when it comes to the Una Corda samples (which is my favorite aspect of the Walker). I guess you really do need every mic position in order to get 'your' sound. And even then I fear you might not be able to top the main version. Grrrr!

Depends, you really need all mics to find your sound like you said, but mix close and main at the same time, that mix is beautiful. When you have all mics you will change opinion from time to time and use different settings. Room position alone is excellent for classical music, I play a lot with it, but now I use main plus hammer mics to achieve more closer and character piano sound similar to sound in video I post in similar thread, another example is something like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn_4p1K4Aew&start_radio=1&list=RDTn_4p1K4Aew
Posted By: Alex C

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/25/18 09:55 AM

Originally Posted by slobajudge
Originally Posted by Alex C
Now that I have the close mic perspective I must conclude that I prefer the standard mix version, at least when it comes to the Una Corda samples (which is my favorite aspect of the Walker). I guess you really do need every mic position in order to get 'your' sound. And even then I fear you might not be able to top the main version. Grrrr!

Depends, you really need all mics to find your sound like you said, but mix close and main at the same time, that mix is beautiful. When you have all mics you will change opinion from time to time and use different settings. Room position alone is excellent for classical music, I play a lot with it, but now I use main plus hammer mics to achieve more closer and character piano sound similar to sound in video I post in similar thread, another example is something like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tn_4p1K4Aew&start_radio=1&list=RDTn_4p1K4Aew


Do you combine the main 'default' mix with one of the individual mic perspectives? Isn't that asking for phase issues since the main mix is a mix of all the mic positions? In some libraries that offer different mic perspectives it's even impossible to select the main mix perspective together with one of the other individual mic perspectives.

Edit: I spoke too soon. It seems that none of the mic perspectives of the main perspective are used for any of the other mic perspectives. Interesting!

Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/25/18 10:39 AM

Yes, as far as I know the main mic are default AKG mics. You can combine them with other perspectives. In promised update Emberton will give us working multi patch. Till that happening we can use individual mics alone or more of them load separately in the same channel to achieve similar effect.
Posted By: kokatla

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/27/18 04:41 PM

Before you go drop $100 on this thing you might want to read my experience with this company. A month or so ago I picked up the full version of the concert D because it sounded decent in some online demos.

After paying I went to install it and got constant errors. The support was responsive but when it finally was installed the latency in kontakt was unbearable.(yes they use kontakt so be prepared for that) To contrast I use ravenscroft and their sample player had near zero latency so this was not just some hardware specific issue on my end.

Also, the quality of the samples was worse than I expected based on the demos i had heard. Note I was using this as a VST to use during practice sessions with my VPC1 controller, at least that was the plan.

So after an email chain 16 emails long of installation issue back and forth, constant Kontakt player issues and being overall unimpressed with sound quality and the 0.5s latency on every key press, I decided it was not worth $114 and asked for a refund.

Their reply was that there were no refunds and I could sell it second hand. Well if you look at the sales page you will see it is extremely vague. Also, not one single mention of a no return policy.

You can put two and two together here easily and figure out they leave that out on purpose because they know it will detract sales. Obviously this is unacceptable to me so I open a case with paypal.

Embertone then goes to great lengths at this point to try to fight this case and discredit me to keep the money for a software i have not touched since the day it was bought. PayPal ends up sided with them and I am out $114, the cost of the main vst and a mic pack.

Obviously my experience has been terrible with this company and I know musicians like myself dont have a ton of money lying around. To just throw $114 in the gutter is painful and I don't want anyone to go through what I did.

Similar products like garritan cfx (which i found was a much higher quality product) believe in their software and offer 30 day return policy right on their website. If you buy anything from embertone and end up having ANY issues with it, just realize you are out your money.

To top it off they now seem to sell the lite version for only $10 dollars so so much for reselling this to someone second hand to recoup my investment (which I would never want to do anyway given my issues with it.)
Posted By: bsntn99

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/27/18 04:53 PM

If you are getting 0.5 seconds or 500 ms of latency, then there is something else wrong in your system. I just measured the inherent latency of Lite version and there is only ~10 ms of internal latency to the plugin. Make sure you have the sample start set to the 12 o'clock position to get it down to ~3 ms. The other 490 ms of latency is in your set up. Make sure you have the latest ASIO driver installed and working. Here is a guide for optimal settings in Kontakt and checking latency.

https://support.native-instruments....I-Optimize-the-Performance-of-KONTAKT-5-

As far as sound, it's a subjective thing. I don't find it objectionable and find it has a warm clear tone typical of Steinways. I have Ravenscroft as well and Ravenscroft is bit smoother with layer transitions and has better pedalling behavior for at least right now. I would suggest people try the Lite version first to see if it works for them and then upgrade to Full later.
Posted By: Wolfram

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/28/18 01:48 PM

Hi,

maybe someone can help me with installation. I bought the Walker 1955 Steinway D a few days ago but I didn't get the software running yet. Its my first Kontakt based piano and so it is possible that I am doing something terribly wrong. Here is what I did.

After buying the license I downloaded the full package with their "connect" Software and copied the files to the PowerBook (OS X 10.11) where I want to use the Piano.

At this laptop I installed NativeAccess, downloaded Kontakt Player and registered the Piano with the serial number. The registration was confirmed in NativeAccess.

After starting the Kontakt Player I tried to Add the Library but all i get is that the "Library content is not found" and that the .nicnt file could not be found. But its exactly at the place where it is assumed,- I checked it many times.

In the last three days I tried a lot of things but nothing helped. Today I made a complete fresh install of my Mac, but again with the same result. I contacted Embertone but didn't get an answer yet. Maybe someone can give me a hint, since I am getting more and more frustrated.

Thanks, Wolfram
Posted By: bsntn99

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/28/18 03:45 PM

This should help, see post #370 ...

https://vi-control.net/community/th...55-steinway-d.72492/page-19#post-4275110
Posted By: Wolfram

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/28/18 04:02 PM

Originally Posted by bsntn99


Thank you so much!
Never would guess that I had to manually rename the searched file. Googled a lot in the last days but didn't find this solution.
Thanks again and a nice evening from Cologne!
Posted By: sullivang

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 11/28/18 09:56 PM

@Grazilerimba
Re the notes that stand out, I listened to your recording a while ago (can't find it again at the moment) - I think I can hear what you are talking about, but I'm not sure how much of it is due to your playing style - just wondering whether you could make the simplest possible recording that demonstrates the problem - e.g - a simple scale run, playing all notes as evenly as possible. Some of the playing seemed unnecessarily complex - too many notes.

Greg.
Posted By: bsntn99

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/15/18 05:05 AM

Just saw the webpage was updated to show half pedal and silent key strikes in the interface, so must be getting close to release.
Posted By: pianoten

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/15/18 11:37 AM

In my opinion embertone is not worth it. It is literally unplayable. Not because some notes stick out but because notes constantly start to disappear or end spontaneously
Posted By: Alex C

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/15/18 01:08 PM

I have that problem too. Odd that Embertone never bothered to fix that.
Posted By: bsntn99

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/15/18 04:37 PM

Notes dropping off suddenly is related to polyphony settings and voice stealing. Check out the link below. Make sure voice stealing is turned off in the engine and try to increase the number of voices (see #8) in the instrument header to see if this helps.

https://support.native-instruments....I-Optimize-the-Performance-of-KONTAKT-5-

It is possible that there is some enforcement of polyphony within the script per note or sample group, but I would try to play with the settings in the link first.
Posted By: Osho

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/15/18 07:33 PM

Originally Posted by pianoten
In my opinion embertone is not worth it. It is literally unplayable. Not because some notes stick out but because notes constantly start to disappear or end spontaneously

I play it everyway and do not hear any notes start to disappear or end spontaneously. I have set the # of voices pretty high at 1000.

Osho
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/15/18 08:35 PM

Originally Posted by Osho
Originally Posted by pianoten
In my opinion embertone is not worth it. It is literally unplayable. Not because some notes stick out but because notes constantly start to disappear or end spontaneously

I play it everyway and do not hear any notes start to disappear or end spontaneously. I have set the # of voices pretty high at 1000.

Osho

Same here, also playing every day and no problems. Still my favorite sample piano.
Posted By: puremusic

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/16/18 05:48 AM

I've always had problems with the Embertone, gives me a popping noise after each note. Have a top flight system here, play a lot of Kontakt instruments, it's the only one that gives me trouble. Glad at least I only got the light version on sale, only wasted a little money.
Posted By: angmyu

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/16/18 06:02 AM

Originally Posted by puremusic
I've always had problems with the Embertone, gives me a popping noise after each note. Have a top flight system here, play a lot of Kontakt instruments, it's the only one that gives me trouble. Glad at least I only got the light version on sale, only wasted a little money.


weird. I have no problem, too. It seems not exactly an Embertone problem. And upgrading to full version is not a waste of money at all I think.
Posted By: Alex C

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/16/18 06:29 AM

Originally Posted by Osho
Originally Posted by pianoten
In my opinion embertone is not worth it. It is literally unplayable. Not because some notes stick out but because notes constantly start to disappear or end spontaneously

I play it everyway and do not hear any notes start to disappear or end spontaneously. I have set the # of voices pretty high at 1000.


That could be it! Mine was set at 100 voices. Just increased it to 200. Thanks!
Posted By: pianoten

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/16/18 01:14 PM

I will try it out later. I switched voice stealing to 'steal any' but didnt had time to try it out... Maybe that will do it
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/17/18 04:19 AM

Best vst Steinway in my book of many.
Posted By: pianoten

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/17/18 02:23 PM

Sadyl I still cant recommend this vst... I increased the voices (to 500) and deactivated voice stealing but it seems like it is incredible hard to "catch the pedal". Notes just dont sustain even if you press the pedal. So imho you shouldn't get it.

I uploaded a comparison of a few vst's so you can check it out yourself:

https://soundcloud.com/pianoten/sets/vst-comparison

For example just take the first note of the piece "Nyaruko san" or take a closer look in "Wings of piano" after 1:33 min. It might seem like its not a big deal but if you play it yourself its just not satisfying to play and its not a hardware thing (played on Ryzen R7 2700x, 16gb cl14 ram with optimized subtimings, 1tb ssd, gtx 1080ti and focusrite scarlett 2i4(i think) interface)

Greetings
Posted By: Fleer

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/17/18 05:40 PM

Strange indeed. Just listened and compared myself. Not having this problem at all.
Posted By: Aves

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/18/18 04:50 PM

Originally Posted by pianoten
Sadyl I still cant recommend this vst... I increased the voices (to 500) and deactivated voice stealing but it seems like it is incredible hard to "catch the pedal". Notes just dont sustain even if you press the pedal. So imho you shouldn't get it.



I have the same problem, just like in your soundcloud comparisons. Really hope the update (if it ever comes) will fix it, otherwise the piano is useless just like you said.
I'm wondering if the problem is related to continuous vs on/off pedals.

Fleer, do you have a continous or an on/off pedal? And how about you pianoten?
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/18/18 07:46 PM

About Embertone Steinway, beside this forum I suggest that anyone who wants to know more about it read posts also in VI Control forum. All details, problems, updates etc, are there in chronology order.
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/19/18 11:55 PM

@sullivang, sorry for not responding to your post sooner, I'll try to make a better recording sometime soon. The thing about the notes sticking out is that, if you just play a scale, it might not be too noticeable. But once you start playing and try to actually make melodies stand out and try to shape the sound of the melodies, it becomes noticeable that certain keys won't respond in the same manner and are either too harsh or too soft.

I played this instrument again to compare it to the VSL Steinway and gotta say, in my honest personal opinion, the playability of this is not good at all. Even after doing a velocity curve to help tailor it to my DP, it just doesn't feel natural, and the notest that stick out in one way or another are just too many. The developers have been promising an update for about five or so months now, always saying "it's just a small thing, should come VERY SOON", but it never happens. They advertised features that were missing in the final product, and so on, and so forth. I don't like this instrument and don't understand how people can say it's playable. Ok, it sounds great, like someone pouring syrup into your ears and slapping a waffle on it with twenty grams of sugar on top. (Seriously, the sustain resonace is very unique). But the programming is not good, it doesn't work as advertised, doesn't get fixed, and has some problems that I believe can't be easily fixed (like the notes that stand out). Let's hope the developers surprise me.
Posted By: angmyu

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/20/18 02:23 AM

Originally Posted by Grazilerimba
The developers have been promising an update for about five or so months now, always saying "it's just a small thing, should come VERY SOON", but it never happens.


Frankly speaking, I don't understand why they always say VERY SOON. If it would take so long, they shouldn't have kept many people waiting. And the developer will appear in the long run and say, 'I was so busy with other works and I just checked out your complaints! An update that will surprise you will be released VERY SOON :)'

It's the only good thing the webpage was updated to show half pedal and silent key strikes in the interface.
Posted By: sullivang

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 12/20/18 04:00 AM

Grazilerimba: Ok, fair enough. Maybe the best way to demonstrate the problem, then, would be to find the simplest passage possible, and then play that passage on a well behaved VST, and then on the Embertone, so that we know how you want it to sound. Or maybe it's not worth the hassle. ;^)

Greg.
Posted By: newer player

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 02/14/19 10:20 PM

This week, VI-control forums reporting on new update (in beta form)

"Hello! You are receiving this message because you requested the BETA patch for the Walker 1955 Concert D. We apologize for the wait! We just shared two zip files with you... those are the instruments with the half pedaling feature completed! This version is almost a full 1.1 update. However, in the coming weeks the following features will be added: (1) a new sustain resonance sample set will be added! (2) a minor graphical glitch will be fixed (3) full NKS re-integration. New presets to match all the new features of the 1.1 update."


https://vi-control.net/community/th...55-steinway-d.72492/page-30#post-4353187
Posted By: PaoloT

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 05/14/19 04:38 PM

Has anybody received other betas, and can keep us up-to-date with the new release?

Paolo
Posted By: slobajudge

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 05/14/19 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by PaoloT
Has anybody received other betas, and can keep us up-to-date with the new release?

Paolo

As far as I know, there is only one beta patch and nothing new on the horizon yet. No single word from Embertone. Last thing was something like `We dont want to give you new excuses why update is still no finished yet` so my conlusion is `it will be done in some moment in time...` Hmm, that sounds very inspiring, I can dance with that smile
Posted By: Grazilerimba

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 05/18/19 09:29 AM

I'm honestly surprised people are still waiting for them to release the patch. Although I do understand, if you have found "your" piano VST that really speaks to you and that you enjoy playing a lot, that you want to support the developers and get updates for it. But yeah as I have repeatedly said, this company doesn't deserve to be supported. They mislead their customers and then lied to them later, and then they simply do nothing as they keep lying to everyone who asks them about it, promising updates "very soon" that never materialize. F##k Embertone
Posted By: nax

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/03/19 03:19 PM

I asked via email and they said they are still working on the update, but have many projects at the same time. I just think it was bad communication to let people think it would be a fast update.

I bought it because it has a very unique sound.
However, I have to agree with what was said earlier. There are sometimes issues with sustain. It feels a bit like a Pianoteq demo, where some notes won't work. Hopefully they are working on those issues as well. I still think it was a good decision to add it to my VST list since most other piano VST instruments sound just too perfect and cold without a soul.
Posted By: newer player

Re: Embertone Walker 1955 Steinway D - 06/03/19 04:04 PM

These updates are getting on a year so you just need to reset expectations and move on.

Be thankful this was an inexpensive lesson from The School of Hard Knocks.
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