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Posted By: Aceituna Easy pieces in B major for beginners - 03/31/15 10:10 AM
Please, I am looking for pieces (2-3 Grades) in B major.
Also I'm looking for pieces in Db major and Gb major.
Any suggestion?
Bernhard recommends in pianostreet to start scales work with these three ones.
Posted By: WimPiano Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 10:41 AM
B Major is simply not in those grades.. B Major scales start at grade 4. Pieces perhaps even later.
Posted By: outo Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 10:50 AM
You can practice the scale and improvise on it, but easy pieces tend to be written in keys with less sharps, so I doubt you'll find them in the classical repertoire. Same goes for the scales starting on black keys.
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 11:17 AM
I found these ones:
https://musescore.com/user/510381/scores/657376
https://musescore.com/michaelcbro/prelude-in-b-major
https://musescore.com/michaelcbro/fugue-in-b-major
Which one do you think is the easiest?
Posted By: earlofmar Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 11:21 AM
Originally Posted by Aceituna


Which one do you think is the easiest?


difficult to say without knowing what is your experience
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 11:29 AM
I'm a beginner.
In your opinion which is the easiest one?

I found this another in Db major:
https://musescore.com/user/133213/scores/140875
Not the greatest, but they are what I used as a kid

Schaums scales and pieces in all keys books 1 and 2
Schaums around the world in all keys

Much better but higher level are

Victor lebenske Piano Miniatures
William gillock Lyric Preludes in romantic style

Much higher level
Robert vandall Preludes
Dennis alexander 24 Character Preludes



The second is easiest, but intermediate leveL. It has too many shifts and large spans for a beginner.
The first has an odd time signature (5/4) plus I thought I saw the need to bring out multiple voices in one hand.
The third also has multiple voices.

B major may be a good key signature for beginning scales. It is usually not a good one for beginning pieces. The schaum books I mentioned are one of the few sets that are at beginner level, but the are simplifies and probably transposed pieces. The other books I mentioned in my previos post are worth learning. I've played some in past recitals. The book by labenske is UK grades 3-4.
Posted By: zrtf90 Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:16 PM
Practising pieces with many black keys and scales with many black keys are very different things. Beginner's pieces will allow the hand to reach a wider range than five keys by stretching out the fingers and later by passing the thumb under the second and third fingers.

Increasing the reach by pivoting around the fourth finger is more advanced and that's where scales begin to be effective. Black key scales are easier because the fourth finger, under which the thumb passes, is raised on a black key. In C major it is not. C is therefore the hardest scale mechanically and should be the last learned.

I am strongly opposed to the way scales are frequently taught and supported by examining bodies. G, F and D majors should at least be left until the student is experienced enough to establish his own fingering for the scales - or be taught both ways.

For beginners it is better to read pieces that use fewer black keys to facilitate reading. Scales are not read but played from memory so facility and comfort is more important.

If you're a beginner stick with a wide range of repertoire for the time being. You will develop a flexible mechanism and the brain will find ergonomic movements while you sleep. When you have a flexible and versatile mechanism familiar with pivoting on the thumb alternately with 2nd and 3rd fingers you will begin to get a benefit from scale practise. Without a developed mechanism scales can put your hand in a straightjacket and hinder development unless you have a good teacher to bypass the problems and speed up the process.

Posted By: outo Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:20 PM


It depends on what you want to do with them and your personal properties. For me the first one would be the easiest. A fugue is a bit far fetched for a beginner, whatever the key.

If a beginner is prepared to take it slow and work carefully, he can definitely learn the first two. They are musically quite simple. Time signatures and keys with many sharps and flats are not difficult to play physically (for an adult with good size hands), the difficulties are more of the mental kind, so whether you struggle or not depends on how easy it is for you to grasp such things and how easy it is for you to memorize.

But does it make sense? To learn something that maybe has little musical value just because you want to start on a certain scale supposedly recommended by someone who lived 200 years ago and in a very different world? While there's so much material for us now to start on? Besides old Fred was known to never teach beginners, so what he recommended may have worked better when learning better physical technique as someone already quite familiar with the piano.

OTOH I also see a problem with the common approach of waiting so long before adding more keys. It's much harder to think of the whites and blacks as equal keys (which they are when we study music theory) when the blacks are so rarely used in the first years. I would see some value in an approach where the whole keyboard is used as soon as possible, but that may be because I am a very "holistic" type of a learner. Learning small bits and pieces and then glueing them together has never worked for me. I need to "get the big picture" first and then add details.
Posted By: Medden Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:38 PM
Just a suggestion, but why not find a piece at your desired skill level, in any key, and transpose it into B major?
Posted By: IanW Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:40 PM
The only piece I could find on the Piano Syllabus site in those keys at grade 2-3 was Franck's Poco lento no 46 in Gb major. Check it out
here.
Posted By: malkin Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:44 PM
Originally Posted by DragonPianoPlayer
Not the greatest, but they are what I used as a kid

Schaums scales and pieces in all keys books 1 and 2
Schaums around the world in all keys



These are still available:

http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/title/scales-and-pieces-in-all-keys-book-1-sheet-music/4983812
Posted By: MRC Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:47 PM
Originally Posted by zrtf90
Practising pieces with many black keys and scales with many black keys are very different things. Beginner's pieces will allow the hand to reach a wider range than five keys by stretching out the fingers and later by passing the thumb under the second and third fingers.


+1

Practice the scales in B, Gb and Db major, but don't worry about choosing pieces in these keys.
Posted By: outo Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 12:55 PM
Originally Posted by IanW
The only piece I could find on the Piano Syllabus site in those keys at grade 2-3 was Franck's Poco lento no 46 in Gb major. Check it out
here.


These short Franck organ pieces tend to be quite complicated to play with many voices and large intervals. "Unpianistic" my teacher calls them... Even if graded "just" 3, I wouldn't necessarily recommend it for a beginner without a teacher.
Posted By: IanW Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 01:07 PM
Did Franck originally write this piece for piano or organ?
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 01:43 PM
Thank you very much to all.

Originally Posted by Medden
Just a suggestion, but why not find a piece at your desired skill level, in any key, and transpose it into B major?


Maybe this is the best solution.
Posted By: MRC Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 02:10 PM
Originally Posted by IanW
Did Franck originally write this piece for piano or organ?


For organ or harmonium. It's from a collection called "l'organiste" where Franck had the project of writing a series of pieces in all major and minor keys. He started with C major, going up through the keys chromatically, but died before he had finished the series, only getting as far as Ab major.
Posted By: outo Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 02:11 PM
Originally Posted by IanW
Did Franck originally write this piece for piano or organ?


For harmonium actually.
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 02:18 PM
Minuet in G trasposed to B major:
https://musescore.com/user/131491/scores/753401

Please, any advice?
Posted By: outo Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 02:25 PM
Originally Posted by Aceituna
Minuet in G trasposed to B major:
https://musescore.com/user/131491/scores/753401

Please, any advice?

Stop obsessing about B major. Learn this in the original key first and then transpose it into every other one, studying the circle of fifths at the same time smile
I remember from Bernhard's post that B major scale is the easiest to play, that's why he teaches his students the B major scale first. It's definitely not the easiest to read. You'll be making things harder for yourself if you start learning pieces in B major or D flat major while you're not proficient with reading pieces with less sharps/flats. IMO.
Originally Posted by Aceituna
Thank you very much to all.

Originally Posted by Medden
Just a suggestion, but why not find a piece at your desired skill level, in any key, and transpose it into B major?


Maybe this is the best solution.

Transposing won't be hard. Good fingering will be the more challanging part.
Don't pick hard pieces. The value is not in spending months learning these at this stage but in getting the key under youfingers.
Posted By: JohnSprung Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 03/31/15 08:18 PM

See if you can find Addinsell's "Warsaw Concerto", and look at rehearsal mark "K". The theme there is surprisingly comfortable to play because it's in B. Try to do as much finger legato as you can on it.

Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 04:09 AM
Originally Posted by JohnSprung

See if you can find Addinsell's "Warsaw Concerto", and look at rehearsal mark "K". The theme there is surprisingly comfortable to play because it's in B. Try to do as much finger legato as you can on it.


I got it.
I don't find the "K" mark.
I'll try the passage in B.
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 04:46 AM
Originally Posted by DragonPianoPlayer
The value is not in spending months learning these at this stage but in getting the key under youfingers.

I completely agree with you.
I'm trying to set the way to do things easier.
I would like to start working on scales.
At the moment the four pieces im working on are in keys:
D
D
A minor
C

It's better to start with minors after majors are mastered.
It's better to work with C at the end of majors.

Do I start with D scale till mastered?
Posted By: outo Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 06:49 AM
Originally Posted by Aceituna
Originally Posted by DragonPianoPlayer
The value is not in spending months learning these at this stage but in getting the key under youfingers.

I completely agree with you.
I'm trying to set the way to do things easier.
I would like to start working on scales.
At the moment the four pieces im working on are in keys:
D
D
A minor
C

It's better to start with minors after majors are mastered.
It's better to work with C at the end of majors.

Do I start with D scale till mastered?


There's really no one and only good way to do anything and that's why you will get different answers from different people.

I don't think you can "master" a scale by just playing it. If you want to start working on scales I would recommend adding some theory study to it. I really struggled with the scales in the beginning because I didn't want to get back into the theory after 30 years break and forgetting everything, I just wanted to play. But after I gave in and worked out the basic theory, scales became easier and they started making sense to me as a system. Also I don't need to try to memorize fingerings by drilling anymore because I figured out the "why" behind them and I can work it out myself anytime.

I recommend you try to take some time frequently to think why you are doing what you are doing and whether it is working in your favor. Try to evoke some curiosity towards things so that you naturally want to figure out more about the structures you encounter in music. Use scales and other exercises to expand your knowledge and skill in a way that help you manage and understand your music better. IMO This is the key to fast and deep learning, not following any ready made formula.

So if you play pieces D, C and a minor, do play and study the scales in those keys. But don't just try to play the scales as fast and clean as you can, but think about what is the difference between them, how are they built and why the fingerings are the way they are. Study a little theory (how to build a major/minor scale and the circle of fifths) and before you know you can build and play any scale you want. The speed and fluency of fingers will come easier when your mind knows what to do. I think this will benefit you much more in the future than just practicing moving your fingers faster on the keyboard.

Children often learn to do first and understand what and why they are doing much later, but for adults I don't think this is the most efficient way because our minds already work differently. We are usually not able to stop our minds from analyzing what we do all the time, so it's best to use it in our advantage.
Posted By: WimPiano Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 06:54 AM
Aceituna, do you have a teacher?
What did bring you to this focus on B Major? It's a weird obsession to me..
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 07:07 AM
Originally Posted by wimpiano
Aceituna, do you have a teacher?
What did bring you to this focus on B Major? It's a weird obsession to me..


I stopped it. No worries. Im asking for advice.
I gonna start to work on D scale.
Posted By: Aceituna Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 07:13 AM
Originally Posted by outo

I recommend you try to take some time frequently to think why you are doing what you are doing and whether it is working in your favor. Try to evoke some curiosity towards things so that you naturally want to figure out more about the structures you encounter in music. Use scales and other exercises to expand your knowledge and skill in a way that help you manage and understand your music better. IMO This is the key to fast and deep learning, not following any ready made formula.

So if you play pieces D, C and a minor, do play and study the scales in those keys. But don't just try to play the scales as fast and clean as you can, but think about what is the difference between them, how are they built and why the fingerings are the way they are. Study a little theory (how to build a major/minor scale and the circle of fifths) and before you know you can build and play any scale you want. The speed and fluency of fingers will come easier when your mind knows what to do. I think this will benefit you much more in the future than just practicing moving your fingers faster on the keyboard.

Children often learn to do first and understand what and why they are doing much later, but for adults I don't think this is the most efficient way because our minds already work differently. We are usually not able to stop our minds from analyzing what we do all the time, so it's best to use it in our advantage.

I completely agree with you.
I'm studing theory.
This is the reason I want to work with scales related with the pieces I'm working on.
I think the best way for me at the moment is to start with D.
One of my goals is to play with my daughter (she plays the viola).
She is working on Suzuki method and the most of the piees are in D (as the accompaniments are).
Posted By: MRC Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/01/15 08:01 AM
Originally Posted by Aceituna
Originally Posted by DragonPianoPlayer
The value is not in spending months learning these at this stage but in getting the key under youfingers.

I completely agree with you.
I'm trying to set the way to do things easier.
I would like to start working on scales.
At the moment the four pieces im working on are in keys:
D
D
A minor
C

It's better to start with minors after majors are mastered.
It's better to work with C at the end of majors.

Do I start with D scale till mastered?


You are still mixing up scales based on particular keys and pieces in those keys. The key of a piece defines a collection of notes with certain relationships between specific notes. A scale in that key is a technical exercise where that collection of notes is put in a row. The piece and the scale both use the same collection, but they are different animals.

B major, Gb major and Db major scales are technically the easiest scales to play, because only the thumb plays on white notes while the other fingers play black notes. This almost automatically gives you a good hand position and facilitates passing the thumb under the third or fourth finger.

Pieces are a different matter. Pieces in the keys mentioned are not necessarily easier than those in other keys. Unless the piece in question is full of scale passages, there is no particular technical benefit in practising the scale that corresponds to the key of the piece.

If you have never played scales, do start with either B major, Gb major or Db major: they favour a good hand position and the fingering is obvious. But don't bother about finding pieces in those keys.
Posted By: JohnSprung Re: Easy pieces in B major for begginers - 04/03/15 06:02 PM
Originally Posted by Aceituna
Originally Posted by JohnSprung

See if you can find Addinsell's "Warsaw Concerto", and look at rehearsal mark "K". The theme there is surprisingly comfortable to play because it's in B. Try to do as much finger legato as you can on it.


I got it.
I don't find the "K" mark.
I'll try the passage in B.


I looked through the score, it's the first thing in B. How did you like it?

For fun you could transpose it to C, and see how much easier it is in B.

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