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Posted By: WhoDwaldi 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 05/17/19 01:03 AM
In a little over a month, it's baaaaaack!

Here is a link to the piano competitors list. Kenneth Broberg jumps out (Silver in the last Cliburn). I remember Shishkin from the last Tchaikovsky.

https://tchaikovskycompetition.com/en/contestants/

Who are the people to really watch out for? I haven't been keeping up with recent competitions very much.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 05/17/19 03:39 AM
Oh my gosh! Already?! I could've swore we just did this. Oh, that was the Cliburn. Times flies.

It is an interesting list.

There's the aforementioned Broberg, but then there's Sara Daneshpour who accomplished the same feat at the last Arthur Rubinstein and then we have yet another 2nd prize winner ,Arseny Tarasevich-Nikolaev the grandson of the great Tatiana Nikolaeva, who won 2nd prize in the Cleveland International which is working hard to move into the neighborhood of the prestige of the former two competitions. So that's 3 2nd prize winners in major competitions that stick out to me.

We have the advancing wunderkind, Alexander Malofeev who I'm plenty interested to see what and how he plays. In a similar vein in my mind, we have George Harliono who's excellent playing but unconventional physical approach to the instrument made quite the impression on this forum sometime ago.

Of course we have the aforementioned Shishkin and hiding behind a mispelling, I believe we have the Canadian, Tony Yike Yang who was one of if not the youngest competitor in the Cliburn who also won a Jury Discretionary Award.

So 7 out of the 25 are familiar to me and many already seasoned vets. I'm excited to see what all the diverse and distinct personalities bring to the table!

Edit: I'm also very excited to see what people choose within the comparatively restrictive 1st round repertoire requirements that I associate with this competition. What other competition requires a Chopin Etude, a Liszt Etude and a Rachmaninoff etude?
Posted By: dumka1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 05/17/19 03:22 PM
I heard Arsenii Mun perform Tchaikovsky's 1st concerto in my town in the fall, he was pretty amazing.
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 05/19/19 03:28 PM
I'm very surprised no one here on this site has mentioned the Chinese International Piano Competition going on right now. Top prise I believe is $150,000. Alexander Malofeev and Tony Yang are competing in that as well. I've been watching Malofeev for several years and he is certainly remarkable. I'm on my iPad but when I get on my computer I'll put the YouTube site up.
Posted By: ShyPianist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 05/19/19 04:39 PM
Originally Posted by kbrod1
I'm very surprised no one here on this site has mentioned the Chinese International Piano Competition going on right now. Top prise I believe is $150,000. Alexander Malofeev and Tony Yang are competing in that as well. I've been watching Malofeev for several years and he is certainly remarkable. I'm on my iPad but when I get on my computer I'll put the YouTube site up.


I’ve been watching and thoroughly enjoying it! No spoilers please because I have four concertos still to watch!
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/16/19 06:04 PM
Almost time. Bumping the thread. 😁 Brendan usually makes an official one.

I was remiss not to thank everybody for the listening suggestions.

https://tch16.medici.tv/en/
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/17/19 04:38 PM
Is it on now? I thought it was about to start at 12:30 EST but when I went to the site it said the next performance was in 17 hours??
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/17/19 05:36 PM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Is it on now? I thought it was about to start at 12:30 EST but when I went to the site it said the next performance was in 17 hours??


Should be. They did sections of Nutcracker and Trifonov is playing Tch. Conc. No. 1 (as if we won't get enough). 🤣

They are on Central European Summer Time.

You may have to create a "guest" Medici account or sign in with Facebook.
Posted By: ElaineAllegro Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/17/19 05:44 PM
The link for the opening gala concert

https://www.medici.tv/en/concerts/16-international-tchaikovsky-competition-opening-concert/

seems a little different than the one for the competition, which does indeed start tomorrow morning (Tuesday, 6/18) at 5am here in the central US time zone.
https://tch16.medici.tv/en/piano/
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/17/19 06:08 PM
I think I'm mistaken about CEST, but that was on Fazioli's FB page.

What I saw of Trifonov was brilliant (with a few tiny ensemble issues at the end of Tchaik. No. 1--let's blame Gergiev). Much rhythmic applause. Much perspiration. 😁
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/17/19 06:14 PM
Thanks WhoDwaldi and ElaineAllegro. I thought the competition started Monday which explains why I couldn't see it haha.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 01:05 AM
Stickying this thread for now.

There are a lot of competition winners in this edition, and it looks like it's going to be a bloodbath - we've got Cliburn medalists (both the junior and big versions), Sydney, Chopin, and many others. My own prediction is that Kenny Broberg will definitely get something, as will Tarasevich-Nikolayev, hopefully Andrei Gugnin (Tchaikovsky concerti 1 AND 2 in the finals, not sure if that's ever been offered), Dmitri Shishkin, and Beisembayev.

Of course, that's even before we start talking about Alex Malofeev...this is probably going to be one of the most exciting Tchaikovsky competitions given this astronomical level.
Posted By: ElaineAllegro Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 04:35 AM
Brendan, Thanks for sticky-ing the thread and sharing your predictions.

Curious question re % female in various competitions:

As an example, the recent Cliburn Junior had 8 girls out of 24 participants (33%). At the upcoming adult amateur Piano Bridges 2019, an estimated 43% are female (based on names as photos are not available). The 2017 (non-amateur) Cliburn started with 9 female participants out of 30 total (30%). It might be helpful for context to know the M/F %s at leading conservatories.

The 2019 Tchaikovsky (piano) starts off with 2 women (Anna Geniushene and Sara Daneshpour) out of a total of of 25 participants (8%). (Have I missed any?) Other Tchaik competition instruments (violin, cello, etc.) appear to have higher percentages of female participants; don't have time to do the math now, but I can look at these and other competitions while listening to the nth rendition of Tchaik #1 over the next week or so.

Any thoughts about the reasons for the low percentage of female participants in this particular piano competition? (Just curious, not pushing an agenda...)

Thank you for reading this far!
Posted By: bennevis Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 09:40 AM
Originally Posted by ElaineAllegro
Brendan, Thanks for sticky-ing the thread and sharing your predictions.

Curious question re % female in various competitions:

As an example, the recent Cliburn Junior had 8 girls out of 24 participants (33%). At the upcoming adult amateur Piano Bridges 2019, an estimated 43% are female (based on names as photos are not available). The 2017 (non-amateur) Cliburn started with 9 female participants out of 30 total (30%). It might be helpful for context to know the M/F %s at leading conservatories.

The 2019 Tchaikovsky (piano) starts off with 2 women (Anna Geniushene and Sara Daneshpour) out of a total of of 25 participants (8%). (Have I missed any?) Other Tchaik competition instruments (violin, cello, etc.) appear to have higher percentages of female participants; don't have time to do the math now, but I can look at these and other competitions while listening to the nth rendition of Tchaik #1 over the next week or so.

Any thoughts about the reasons for the low percentage of female participants in this particular piano competition? (Just curious, not pushing an agenda...)

Thank you for reading this far!

I don't think it's a mystery - big paws. Or lack of them.

Winners in the Tchaik (and also Cliburn) tend to play Rachmaninov concertos (esp. No.3) and lots of heavyweight Russian rep. Even Ashkenazy admitted that he doesn't play all the notes in Rach concertos, especially No.3.

That's not the case for some other competitions, like the Leeds or Queen Elisabeth or Chopin (obviously), where it's a more even ratio.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 11:36 AM
Is Wu Yuchong playing a Yangtze River piano? That's what it says in big letters on the side of the piano.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 11:51 AM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Is Wu Yuchong playing a Yangtze River piano? That's what it says in big letters on the side of the piano.


I noticed that, also! I wonder how many others will choose that piano?
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 01:19 PM
Oh, I just started following the livestream and was wondering where the competition megathread was...and here we are. Good. I know a bunch of the guys participating here and will perhaps refrain on commenting on them too much. These rigidly structured first rounds - Bach P&F, Classical sonata, a handful of etudes - have become such a bore for me, but of course some people pull off creating a beautiful whole with those constraints. Konstantin Emelyanov is playing now and impressed me a great deal with the Bach C# minor P&F from Book 2, and is demonstrating what a sensitive musician he is in the Haydn sonata performed now, as well. I'm a bit partial to anyone that selects that particular prelude and fugue - easily one of my favorites out of the 48, but devilishly difficult to pull of in performance. Incidentally, as I was taking a Bach masterclass last year with Robert Levin, it seemed like this was one of his favourites, too.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 01:23 PM
Keep geeting this error. Reloading page does not help. Impossible to watch. frown

Quote
The live stream is either down or has ended.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 01:47 PM
Yemelyanov is clearly the best so far, he absolutely slayed those etudes.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 01:58 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Yemelyanov is clearly the best so far, he absolutely slayed those etudes.


Yep.

It's nerves and spotlights, but somebody PLEEZ turn on more AC in that hall! 🤣

I saw this in the comments, "The pianists have the choice between Fazoli, Steinway & Sons, Yamaha, and Yangtze River pianos." So, no Kawai?

Originally Posted by Hakki
Keep geeting this error. Reloading page does not help. Impossible to watch. frown

Quote
The live stream is either down or has ended.




It seems to help to click on "piano" on the main page and to go specifically to that competition (instead of trying to watch the live stream on the main page).

Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 02:05 PM
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi

It seems to help to click on "piano" on the main page and to go specifically to that competition (instead of trying to watch the live stream on the main page).


Thank you for the reply. Unfortunately I had tried that too but it did not help either.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 03:05 PM
I don't know anything about the Yangtze River piano, but if it's really good, it's nice to see a Chinese piano get the respect it deserves.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 04:40 PM
Excellent Beethoven from Shishkin! Hard to imagine a better performance, and the octave glissandi sounded even cleaner than scales.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 04:42 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Excellent Beethoven from Shishkin! Hard to imagine a better performance, and the octave glissandi sounded even cleaner than scales.

I was wondering what you thought of that performance since if I'm not mistaken you've played that piece.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 04:45 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Excellent Beethoven from Shishkin! Hard to imagine a better performance, and the octave glissandi sounded even cleaner than scales.


I gasped at the octave glissandi. 😁 The Waldstein can come across as rather hackneyed, but that was captivating.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 05:23 PM
Finally I am able to watch. That Yangtze River has a powerfull bass. But overall the sound is too harsh for me.
Posted By: javierstucke Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 08:14 PM
Hey everyone (new poster, longtime reader) -

Just started watching the first round replays from earlier today. Hoping to listen carefully to everyone and will be posting reactions and looking forward to reading others!

Just finished Xie Ming. I know him from NY - sweet and talented kid, and always dapper!

BEETHOVEN 31/3
I appreciate the clarity and selective pedaling. I also like his attacca transitions between movements - helped give a sense of wholeness to the work. Ultimately thought I feel he plays with too many 'punctuation marks' - so to speak - so that his phrases aren't organized). For me, Beethoven IS phrasing - it's the means through which the inner content and drama of a work is expressed. If I can't hear how you articulate and relate phrases, your Beethoven falls flat. The first movement needed a deeper sense of wonder and adventure; second movement was too caught up with LH 16ths notes - I prefer when the RH line defines the energy, so that there's an almost casual tenor singing above (and helping to shape) the active bass foot steps (which, by the way, should still be shaped - they sounded to mechanical, not human enough); third movement had its moments, but fell short of the tender nobility that I crave in this movement. The presto was too chaotic and beat-heavy. Again, faster and more pulsating music ALWAYS benefits from a large sense of line and direction. Sit tall, above the filigree, like a conductor or air-traffic controller and guide our flight. Start phrases with a kick and then be very selective about what other notes you punch (Beethoven is very clear in his accent placement), then steer us to the end of a line and show the ending with a breath of color change. You have to play movements like this from your torso/core, not your fingers.

BACH G#m Bk1
Again, I appreciate the clarity of voices - but it was too often at the expense of color. Individual voices could have more personality, The pleasure of listening to a fugue for me is picking a voice and following it on its path while peripherally sensing the other voices. Couldn't really do this.

TCHAIKOVSKY
Don't know the pieces well enough. I was underwhelmed, didn't seem idiomatic - but maybe someone heard something else in it?

CHOPIN, RACHMANINOFF, LISZT Etudes
I wish I had thirds/broken chords/leaps like that. But, in every etude it sounds like his preparation was motivated by execution than a guiding picture - I was missing the sweep and the color latent in each of these pieces. It's a cliche, but he played them too much like finger exercises - but, that's a slight against finger exercises, which should also be played with shape and imagination! Obviously nerves are a factor... that's a scary stage to step foot on...

FAZIOLI
I wonder if part of Ming's trouble was the piano. I have found Fazioli's difficult to control, unlike many Steinways, Shigeru Kawais, and the newest Yamahas. They win in the realm of clarity across register - every note speaks like an individual - but that in turn makes it hard to play legato and create smooth shapes, warmer colors, pearly lines, etc. This was part of what I felt was missing in Ming's playing, so it makes me wonder what he'd sound like on a different instrument. I've heard his Schubert big A Major sonata before in person and it was lyrical and well controlled...

Javi
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 08:54 PM
Originally Posted by javierstucke


FAZIOLI
I wonder if part of Ming's trouble was the piano. I have found Fazioli's difficult to control, unlike many Steinways, Shigeru Kawais, and the newest Yamahas. They win in the realm of clarity across register - every note speaks like an individual - but that in turn makes it hard to play legato and create smooth shapes, warmer colors, pearly lines, etc. This was part of what I felt was missing in Ming's playing, so it makes me wonder what he'd sound like on a different instrument. I've heard his Schubert big A Major sonata before in person and it was lyrical and well controlled...

Javi


Thanks for a detailled and insightful comment as a whole! I'm already going against my promise to avoid commenting on pianists I know, but...Fazioli was not the problem. I played an hour after Ming in the prelims in Sydney a few years ago, and he was overall in great command of the instrument, in his Granados, Mendelssohn/Rachmaninoff and whatnot. See around 1h 15 min into this clip:


https://youtu.be/IlBFqDJ1OZ0


Edit: I believe he chose instrument himself here? In Sydney it was a lottery, sort of. In the finals, pianists could choose what they wanted, having played all four instruments in previous rounds. Most finalists picked Fazioli (not the winner though) so that comp was a big success for Fazioli. They worked on that piano for 2-3 years. Wouldn't be surprised if they did the same for this competition.
Posted By: javierstucke Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 09:11 PM
Originally Posted by fnork

...Fazioli was not the problem. I played an hour after Ming in the prelims in Sydney a few years ago, and he was overall in great command of the instrument, in his Granados, Mendelssohn/Rachmaninoff and whatnot.

Edit: I believe he chose instrument himself here? In Sydney it was a lottery, sort of. In the finals, pianists could choose what they wanted, having played all four instruments in previous rounds. Most finalists picked Fazioli (not the winner though) so that comp was a big success for Fazioli. They worked on that piano for 2-3 years. Wouldn't be surprised if they did the same for this competition.


Interesting. When I've played Faziolis, my reaction is usually 'this might be the best piano I've ever played, so why don't I sound my best on it?' It was like driving a Ferrari having only ever driven automatic transmission. Once you get comfortable with it, though, I can see why it's so highly regarded. Not my preference though. Looking forward to how other competitors sound on it.
Posted By: Ken Iisaka Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 09:35 PM
Originally Posted by javierstucke

Interesting. When I've played Faziolis, my reaction is usually 'this might be the best piano I've ever played, so why don't I sound my best on it?' It was like driving a Ferrari having only ever driven automatic transmission. Once you get comfortable with it, though, I can see why it's so highly regarded. Not my preference though. Looking forward to how other competitors sound on it.


Yes, Fazioli pianos, particularly the new ones are sensitive and transparent instruments that leaves no room for blemishes or carelessness. It's quite an adjustment to make from most other pianos.

It takes a more deliberate approach to playing, but one is rewarded with greater control of the tone.

I have never driven a Ferrari, but I own / owned several high performance sport cars. The cars I like are those which let me become one with the car. The pianos are the same.
Posted By: Ken Iisaka Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 09:38 PM
Here's the scoreboard so far:

Yamaha: 4
Yangtze: 2
Fazioli: 1
Steinway: 1
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 09:47 PM
The standouts today for me were Yemelyanov and Shishkin. The others had good things about their playing, but I don't think they were on the level of these two. Shishkin also stood out by being the only person NOT to play Appassionata in his group (and no one really delivered on this, IMO). On that note, I'm looking forward to hearing a few people play Mozart and Haydn tomorrow as opposed to big middle period Beethoven.

Anyway, lots of extremely solid playing overall today.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 09:50 PM
Four years ago, I was very hung up on the pianists playing with good tone (it's from my Matthay indoctrination). This time, I'm not interested so much in that.

But, I will say that a few have sounded forced, and the voicing of one of the piano brands may be contributing to that. But, the player and the listener's ears make the tone, along with all of the equipment in between. 😁
Posted By: javierstucke Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/18/19 10:12 PM
Wu Yuchong

I like Yuchong's playing a lot. Also know him a bit from NY - thoughtful guy, and thoughtful playing. There's something to be said for his relaxed posture and trademark oversized suit! He has very few impulsive, extraneous motions at the keyboard and doesn't lunge forward with tense shoulders in difficult passages like so many others.

BACH Bm Bk2
I appreciate the dialogue between voices very much. He heard the call and response element in the prelude, and phrases breathed well. The fugue was less successful. He lost the independence of voices at times - he's play certain sections like melody and accompaniment texture. I also found it a little wandering - sure, fugues have an itinerant quality compared to a sonata or a rondo, but there needs to be a purposeful direction. Fugues are hard though. How many convincing fugues do you hear in competitions?

BEETHOVEN 31/3
I'm partial to pianists who pay attention to voicing, and Yuchong is ALWAYS voicing his chords. This instantly makes his Beethoven a pleasure to listen to - but it's helped even more by his wide range of characters, his timing - he uses his control of touch to articulate phrases of varying lengths - 32 bars, 16 bars, 8, 4, 2, whatever, plus plenty of Beethovenian nested phrases and interjections and subito pianos. Sounded a little nervous in the exposition, but everything is uphill from there. Second and fourth movements balanced the "bounce" of the fast notes with the direction and purpose of the hypermeter. Third movement is singing and filled with sentiment without being sentimental. Besides missing the repeated F in bar 2 (it's a hard piece to start), I was totally convinced by this performance. He SHOWED me details in every moment, which shows that he's listening, and thinking. Very intelligent performance.

LISZT La Leggierezza
Engaging performance. Brilliant when he needs to be, but always attentive to texture and the creepy-crawly inner voices. Perhaps some would want more show, but I appreciate the restraint here. He's not playing for a mosh pit, but always find the art in the work - even in virtuoso pieces.

CHOPIN Thirds
The voicing in the opening couple bars sounded a little thin, but the thirds filled out nicely us the scale. Phrases a little rushed at times (he could have let them settle even more), but there were many characters on display. I was hearing music at all times, not just fast/hard notes. A very respectable performance.

RACHMANINOFF DMaj Etude 39/9
I don't have a lot of experience listening to this particular etude. Maybe others have more interesting reaction. I thought it was a great choice after the Liszt/Chopin, really showed his range. A commanding performance.

TCHAIKOVSKY
Polka - that was pretty sexy. I like his ornaments. He really showed off his extensive palette of touches here. He has a range of non-legatos. His slurs are always precise. He's dry when he needs to be - crisp at the ends of gestures to give the dance some flair, and he handles his legato/lyrical playing is just the right amount of swooning. Great sense for climax too - he saved his loudest, most bravura moment for the forte passage right before the last piano utterance. Gave the whole work a nice arc.
Theme and Variations - Yuchong's awareness and ability to control the the linear element in a given texture - the line that is always unfolding somewhere beneath the pianistic usually-treble elements - makes him uniquely suited to the theme and variation form. The chorale variation had an elegant simplicity simplicity, but I think there's more tragedy in it than he found. In general though, he showed in this piece alone - and in the whole round - his ability to capture a variety of moods.

I like Yuchong's balance of reason and emotion. His playing is organized and articulate, but still yearning. He has passion, but is never overflowing with it (which is what others love, and I have little patience for, in Trifonov). He's never mannered, but there's plenty of nuance. The crowd whooped and hollered a bit too, so I think he just made some fans. I hope we hear him again.

Javi
Posted By: Ken Iisaka Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 12:26 AM
Oops, entered wrong data:

Yamaha: 3
Steinway: 2
Yangtze: 2
Fazioli: 1

so far
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 12:56 AM
I don't remember if the 1st round requirements at the last TC were the same as this year, but I'm finding the requirements constricting in terms of presenting an enjoyable overall program(although that may not be a consideration for the judges in this round) and avoiding piece repetition.

Three Op. 57s and two Op. 31s, several La Campanella's with probably more to follow, (I'm guessing) the same 5 or 6 Chopin Etudes, and some IMO less than stellar Tchaikovsky pieces. Although requiring three etudes by three different composers may be a good way to judge the pianist's skill, I think it makes for a disjointed program for the listener.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 01:54 AM
I think there was a Mozart concerto as part of the semis previously, no? Also, I'm wondering if finalists play their concertos one after the other? This proved to be rather taxing for some finalists last time, Redkin for example.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 01:57 AM
On a sidenote, it's a small world...two days before the competition start, one of the jurors gave a recital over here. Guess who was asked to review it by one newspaper? Behind a paywall I'm afraid, and in Swedish, but:

https://m.facebook.com/story.php?st...otif_id=1560853010421206&ref=m_notif
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 02:33 AM
Originally Posted by fnork
I think there was a Mozart concerto as part of the semis previously, no? Also, I'm wondering if finalists play their concertos one after the other? This proved to be rather taxing for some finalists last time, Redkin for example.


Oh wow, I didn't even notice that they axed the Mozart Concerto requirement. I thought that was very telling last time (especially for people like Lucas Debargue and George Li), so it's sad to see it go. And yes, here's hoping that they mix up the final performances so that people don't have to pay two killer concerti back to back. I remember that Lukas Genusias had to do Tchaikovsky 2 and Rach 3 back to back without an intermission - yikes.

I guess in terms of repertoire this edition isn't as hellish as other competitions - 2 solo recitals and 2 concerti. Compare that with Cliburn, which is 3 recitals, a quintet, and 2 concerti.
Posted By: javierstucke Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 04:29 AM
Queen Elisabeth is pretty wild. Not as much music as Cliburn, but a real pain in the neck:
Round 1 - 25 minutes including a classical sonata and 4 Etudes (Chopin, Liszt, 1 early 20th century, 1 late 20th century)
Semis: Two 30-35min free choice programs (the jury chooses one!), then a commissioned work and a Mozart concerto
Finals: 10min commissioned concerto + free choice concerto
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 09:54 AM
Originally Posted by javierstucke
Queen Elisabeth is pretty wild. Not as much music as Cliburn, but a real pain in the neck:
Round 1 - 25 minutes including a classical sonata and 4 Etudes (Chopin, Liszt, 1 early 20th century, 1 late 20th century)
Semis: Two 30-35min free choice programs (the jury chooses one!), then a commissioned work and a Mozart concerto
Finals: 10min commissioned concerto + free choice concerto

Not to mention that the commissioned work is given to the finalists only AFTER the semis are over. Meaning that they have about ten days to get it ready for performance. It's a fascinating idea, and I wonder why more competitions aren't trying something similar. This sort of time limitation shows what a pianist can and cannot manage out in the real world, where it's not unheard of to learn pieces in short time. A note on Queen Elizabeth in that regard: in the last one, Alberto Ferro MEMORIZED the commissioned concerto piece.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 10:40 AM
I noticed that this is a male dominant piano competition, both the jury and the competitors.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 10:45 AM
Ovnchinnikov shaking his head after Gadjiev's Tchaikovsky variations.
Posted By: tinyking12345 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 12:12 PM
Here are the piano scores 😅
12 Steinway
8 Yamaha
2 fazioli
2 yangxi river
1 shigeru
Posted By: NobleHouse Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 12:44 PM
Originally Posted by tinyking12345
Here are the piano scores 😅
12 Steinway
8 Yamaha
2 fazioli
2 yangxi river
1 shigeru


Interesting...
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 04:06 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
I noticed that this is a male dominant piano competition, both the jury and the competitors.
In the competition only 2 out of 25 are female. I don't know what's typical for this competition or other competitions but my guess is few are as one sided as this year's Tchaikovsky.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 05:04 PM
Heard the last part of Alexandre Kantorow, which was played well on a Shigeru Kawai.

I don't know much about him, how was the rest of the program?
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 06:16 PM
Steinway is hosting the Medici live cast on their site (and it seems to work better from there).

https://www.steinway.com/news/featu...iMbaHnqLK_PqPHc-q1o5SrR6gGWC7UqWzib6rQFc
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 07:26 PM
Mighty fine Mozart from Mao Fujita (Sonata in C Major, K. 330)!
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 07:29 PM
I like Fujita's music!
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 08:58 PM
Little activity here today. Any particular performances today that stood out? The little I heard of Kantorow was very interesting. Curious to hear more of him. Heard most of Gugnin's round which kept my attention until Liszt - clear and distinct voicing in Bach, and great control in Beethoven. The leggerio left hand and little pedal in the normally pedal-drenched opening theme of the rondo theme was a tad unusual but interesting. In Liszt he had a small but noticeable memory slip and things didn't go as well for the rest of that Etude, and on top of that, he cheats in a difficult octave passage towards the end. Nevertheless, excellent pianism as expected otherwise. The Liszt was one of few obviously virtuosic pieces in that program (the other Etudes weren't), so let's see what the jury ruling will be.
Posted By: AssociateX Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 09:01 PM
There is an active discussion going on over on the Pinano Discord server on this competition. I loved Fujita's Mozart albeit his animated facial expressions reminded me of Lang Lang-. The standing ovation was well deserved.

Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 10:00 PM
Gugnin's Liszt was disappointing but I really liked his op25#1 even though I agree it is a technically easy piece he played it quite beautifully.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 10:21 PM
Some highlights today based on what I had time to watch:

Gugnin - excellent and thoughtful. I agree with Martin about the pedaling in the Beethoven (could have used more) and the issues with Liszt, too. It wasn't a gigantic memory lapse, he just repeated a passage and got right back on. On the other hand, I thought his Dumka was the best of those offered so far. I hope he passes because of his great musicianship, but others did play more consistently than he did.

Tarasevich-Nikolaev - solid from start to finish, and it was nice to hear some Mozart for a change (even if he looked a little dour while playing it). The etudes were all excellent.

Yashkin - finally an Appassionata that delivered! No slowing down in hard passages, lots of intensity, no faking.

Kopachevsky - solid, but it didn't really thrill me. The Haydn was nice, though.

Mao Fujita - awesome! He nailed the hardest Book I P/F and had s great spirit about everything else in his playing. A very nice breath of fresh air.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 10:31 PM
Another note - it's nice to see Ovchinnikov enjoying himself as he listens to the contestants. Heartwarming in this supremely stressful environment.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 10:31 PM
Oh yeah, forgot to mention the Dumka, agreed, very well thought out. Getting *slightly* tired of hearing the da-da-DA-DA-DA section by now, but hey, this is the Tchaikovsky competition and we've all signed up on hearing heaps of Dumka's in the first round. Btw, Shishkin's Tchai choice seemed rather refreshing to my ears!
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 11:09 PM
Do the rules stipulate starting with Bach + Classical sonata? Haven't listened to everyone but that seems to be what everyone is doing? And the Etudes seem to be more or less in the same order, right? (Chopin-Liszt-Rach) As I said, haven't heard everyone but that seems to be the pattern. They've decided to be rigid all the way, it seems. I do understand that there are merits to this approach, just pointing it out, and...it's generally difficult to make an artistically interesting whole out of this. But that's the normal story with first rounds. Many pianists dread them, me included.
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/19/19 11:39 PM
Just listened to Fujita and was quite impressed. His Bach crisp, rhythmic and clean and Mozart beautifully phrased and played. He is clearly a major contender here.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 12:08 AM
Originally Posted by fnork
Oh yeah, forgot to mention the Dumka, agreed, very well thought out. Getting *slightly* tired of hearing the da-da-DA-DA-DA section by now, but hey, this is the Tchaikovsky competition and we've all signed up on hearing heaps of Dumka's in the first round. Btw, Shishkin's Tchai choice seemed rather refreshing to my ears!


I absolutely hate the Dumka probably as much as I hate Islamey but enjoyed his performance. You also would think that the audience would know when to clap at the end by now!

Looking forward to tomorrow for Kenny Broberg and Malofeev. The solid ones for me now are Yemelvanov, Shishkin, Fujita, Tarasevich-Nikolayev, Mun, and Yashkin.
Posted By: theProject Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 12:54 AM
Pinano Discord admin here. Sorry to everybody who tried to join earlier today and got interrogated by our rather zealous automated security guard. (In truth, we had a banned user create an absurd number of alt accounts a few months ago which tried the patience of all the moderation staff and we haven't turned off the alt-ID bot since.) We're having some lively discussion during the performances, hope you can join and I promise the bot won't bite again. smile

My thoughts so far: Yemelvanov, Shishkin and Fujita have sounded the most convincing so far - especially Shishkin, for me.
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 03:48 AM
Been following Malofeev for quite a while. An extraordinary talent and am eager to hear him tomorrow.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 11:46 AM
I love that Hamburg Steinway's treble.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 01:18 PM
Go tinyking12345!
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 01:59 PM
Some thoughts on what I was able to watch from the first session:

Broberg - solid, musical, and well-delivered. My only qualm was that the programming in general was lyrical until the Liszt and I would have liked more contrast in repertoire.

Smith - sort of middle of the road for me. Again, everyone is so solid, him included, but I didn't feel much of a connection to his performance.

George Harolino aka tinyking12345 - awesome! Another standout among the young players, and he totally delivered in the Beethoven. Both he and Malofeev are laureates of Matsuev's "Grand Piano" competition (aka Tchaikovsky junior). He's played here before and it shows.
Posted By: scriabinfanatic Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 02:11 PM
For me the highlight of this morning's performance was Harliono's Beethoven. A few wrong notes but with that kind of vitality who cares. Broberg was good but not as rousing as Harliono I don't think, and I didn't care for his repertoire picks as much. I just hope he makes it to the next round because he has Medtner's 'Night Wind' on his second round list OMGOMG!
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 02:17 PM
George Harliono totally delivered in "Harmonies du sour," also. That etude gets poo-pooed around here for some reason: it's really difficult to pull off, interpretively, and the rolled chords are murder for small hands.

So, shall all of us who have encouraged tinyking12345 share in the success? 😆
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 04:41 PM
I used to think some pieces were so great I would never get tired of hearing them but the Appassionata is getting unbearable.

OTOH Malofeev's third movement is incredibly exciting at supersonic speed...I think the fastest I've heard. But if I remember correctly? it's marked Allegro ma non troppo so it could be argued he's not doing what Beethoven wrote.
Posted By: scriabinfanatic Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 04:52 PM
Holy Winter Wind, Batman!
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 04:52 PM
That Appassionata 3rd mvmt, my goodness...someone should've handed out a speeding ticket to Malofeev. Insanely gifted boy, but it's not a horse race, and as we could see, there was no way to speed up in the final presto. He completely slayed the Winter Wind Etude, his facilities at the keyboard are absolutely amazing.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 05:04 PM
Yes this is not a horse race. But I think they might advance him. Though I don't care to hear him anymore.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 05:16 PM
Oh, I think that kind of playing will be too irresistible for the jury (and they might be right). 😆
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 06:13 PM
As the commentators said, I don't think it would have been possible to have two more different recitals if they tried. Malofeev brought the browdsword and Sara brought the scalpel. Each were stunning in their own ways, but Sara's attention to detail was incredible. Malofeev has the best technical facility **imaginable** but I sometimes wish he would try to create excitement in ways other than speed and fury.

We're clearly in the "matter of taste" stage of the competition. All of them are so high level that it really comes down to personal preference, and not a single competitior has had sub-par performance.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 06:25 PM
My semifinal druthers list is Brobert, Daneshpour, Fujita, Harliono, Malofeev, Shishkin, and Yemelyanov. That's not hearing the last two in the first round. I like a few others, but feel less strongly at this point.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 06:36 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
As the commentators said, I don't think it would have been possible to have two more different recitals if they tried. Malofeev brought the browdsword and Sara brought the scalpel. Each were stunning in their own ways, but Sara's attention to detail was incredible. Malofeev has the best technical facility **imaginable** but I sometimes wish he would try to create excitement in ways other than speed and fury.
I think Malofeev should have at least played one piece other than the Bach that was not over the top virtuosic. For example, a less virtuosic Tchaikovsky than Dummkopf. I don't remember what he played in the China competition but I do remember that it was not stop virtuoso rep. OTOH I'm sure the choice of possible rep for these competitions has been endless discussed and dissected by his teachers and others who know far more than me what will have the best chance of giving him the best result.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 06:46 PM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Brendan
As the commentators said, I don't think it would have been possible to have two more different recitals if they tried. Malofeev brought the browdsword and Sara brought the scalpel. Each were stunning in their own ways, but Sara's attention to detail was incredible. Malofeev has the best technical facility **imaginable** but I sometimes wish he would try to create excitement in ways other than speed and fury.
I think Malofeev should have at least played one piece other than the Bach that was not over the top virtuosic. For example, a less virtuosic Tchaikovsky than Dummkopf. I don't remember what he played in the China competition but I do remember that it was not stop virtuoso rep. OTOH I'm sure the choice of possible rep for these competitions has been endless discussed and dissected by his teachers and others who know far more than me what will have the best chance of giving him the best result.




I agree on his rep choices. His strong point now is his technical facility, similar to George Li in the last competition. I'm sure that's Malofeev will get something, and quite possibly at least one of the top three prizes.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 06:49 PM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I'm sure the choice of possible rep for these competitions has been endless discussed and dissected by his teachers and others who know far more than me what will have the best chance of giving him the best result.


In general, over-reliance on first impressions is lazy or just plain stupid.

However, first recitals create a certain buzz and momentum that can be unstoppable. (Reminds me of Alexei Sultanov's Cliburn win.)
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:04 PM
Nice to hear the G# minor P/F, it's one of my favorites from Book I.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:20 PM
George Li had a greater variety of strengths, to me, comparing to Malofeev. He played Beethoven op 111 with conviction, and his Campanella wasn't all about speed. Although Malofeev is prodigious like no other competitor, I'd prefer if he wasn't placed in the very top, based on some very worrying tendencies from his playing today. Then again, if this is the Olympics among piano competitions, it's a safe bet that he'll go far in this competition.

On a sidenote: after the previous Tchaik competition, he came with Gergiev/Mariinsky and various winners of the competition (including George Li) to Gergiev's festival in Mikkeli here in Finland. I was told that his encore, after some performance (with orchestra probably) was the entire first part of Rite of Spring...mad! He must've been 13 or so back then!
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:40 PM
Btw, someone went over the rep choices for the finals. Here you go:

23x Tchaik 1
3x Tchaik 2

1x Beethoven 4
1x Beethoven 5
1x Brahms 1
1x Brahms 2
1x Liszt 1
4x Prok 2
7x Prok 3
1x Rach 2
3x Rach 3
4x Rach Paganini



...so, overall Russian-heavy on the free concerto choice, but refreshing with few Rach 2-3s and nice that a few picked "that scoundrel Brahms", to quote Tchaikovsky...
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:40 PM
As expected, the last two have also been overall solid. I feel that the similarity is that they both started to relax into their programs somewhere after their sonatas. Nice playing from both, but some competitors were already confident from the first note.

Anyway, my guess:

Yemelvanov
Shishkin
Yashkin
Broberg
Fujita
Daneshpour
Malofeev
Harolino
Tarasevich-Nikolayev
Mun
Melnikov
Yang? Either him or Ming Xie.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:45 PM
When exactly are results announced?
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:49 PM
Probably in 2 hours?
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 07:55 PM
I'm hearing elsewhere that it should be in around an hour. I imagine that whoever that gets to play at 1pm tomorrow would like to know about it ASAP, heh
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 08:28 PM
I guess the Mozart concerto round got eliminated because of adding all the windy people to the competition. Or since one of the Russians had a bad memory slip in Mozart last time (but I'll get into trouble posting that sentiment). 😆
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 08:58 PM
Results soon. Semis start in 11 hours, my god. I don't envy semifinalists 1-3...
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 09:11 PM
14 semifinalists and Malofeev and George Harolino out? Very surprising.

Nonetheless, some of my top picks got in. Good luck to Kenny Broberg and Sara Daneshoour.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 09:23 PM
IMO the jury did a good job.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 09:27 PM
Where's the full list?
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 09:30 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
IMO the jury did a good job.


I agree. Also, the lack of a Mozart Concerto round makes it plausible for two more contestants in the semis, which is fair given this level.

Competition is definitely on the right track, IMO!
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 09:31 PM
Originally Posted by fnork
Where's the full list?


Yemelyanov
Shishkin
An
Gugnin
Gadjiev
Kopachevsky
Melnikov
Kantorow
T-N
Fujita
Broberg
Daneshpour
Geniushene
Kim
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 10:09 PM
Good to see some pianists I felt positively about passing. Out of those I heard, I personally am unsure about Melnikov, T-N and Gadjiev. Curious about Broberg, Kantorow, Yemelyanov and Gugnin.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 10:48 PM
But there's a whole bunch I haven't heard yet. Time to catch up!
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 10:55 PM
Just watched Malofeev and although I've rooted for him he didn't have the musicality I was hoping he'd exhibit. Clearly astounding technique beyond the other contenders but I already knew that. There's a YouTube video of him at 13yo playing the Lutoslawski variations with Matsuev and one can see it's easier for him. I still have a few more of today's players to watch and I liked Sara D. but I can't get how beautiful Fujita's Mozart was yesterday out of my mind.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/20/19 11:36 PM
Yeah, I'd say that Fujita and Sara are the most special for me. Good to see that the jury is favoring Music over brute force technique.

Another tidbit - it seems that everyone who DIDN'T play Appassionata or Waldstein passed. Be brave about Haydn and Mozart, people!
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:30 AM
I just checked the programs for the semi-finals. The only rep requirement is at least one work by a Russian composer from a list of around 10 composers. The rest of the program is the choice of the pianist.

Total number of Classical pieces=0, total Baroque pieces=2, total pieces by Debussy/Ravel=1. To some extent I have noticed this kind of programming in other competitions but perhaps not to such a great extent.

Can someone explain why you think the pianists chose such few works in these three groups? There are MANY works by Scriabin, Rachmaninov, and Prokofiev. Is it assumed that the jury may favor works by Russian composers or just considered correct form to play Russian works in the Tchaikovsky Competition?
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:44 AM
Also only one contemporary work on any of the semi-finalist programs.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:53 AM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I just checked the programs for the semi-finals. The only rep requirement is at least one work by a Russian composer from a list of around 10 composers. The rest of the program is the choice of the pianist.

Total number of Classical pieces=0, total Baroque pieces=2, total pieces by Debussy/Ravel=1. To some extent I have noticed this kind of programming in other competitions but perhaps not to such a great extent.

Can someone explain why you think the pianists chose such few works in these three groups? There are MANY works by Scriabin, Rachmaninov, and Prokofiev. Is it assumed that the jury may favor works by Russian composers or just considered correct form to play Russian works in the Tchaikovsky Competition?


Russian audiences, no matter how generally knowledgable, prefer late-romantic literature? I know that was said to be an issue Feltsman battled when he first returned there to give concerts after coming to the US.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:54 AM
Contemporary music seems to have been massively underrepresented in this competition, even by normal competition standards. Peter Donohoe did program a Tippett sonata when he took part, but overall, it's really rare in Tchaik with modern music.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 01:25 AM
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I just checked the programs for the semi-finals. The only rep requirement is at least one work by a Russian composer from a list of around 10 composers. The rest of the program is the choice of the pianist.

Total number of Classical pieces=0, total Baroque pieces=2, total pieces by Debussy/Ravel=1. To some extent I have noticed this kind of programming in other competitions but perhaps not to such a great extent.

Can someone explain why you think the pianists chose such few works in these three groups? There are MANY works by Scriabin, Rachmaninov, and Prokofiev. Is it assumed that the jury may favor works by Russian composers or just considered correct form to play Russian works in the Tchaikovsky Competition?


Russian audiences, no matter how generally knowledgable, prefer late-romantic literature? I know that was said to be an issue Feltsman battled when he first returned there to give concerts after coming to the US.
But the jury who decides the winners should be more open to non-Russian music I would think, and only three of eleven jurors are Russian.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 01:57 AM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
But the jury who decides the winners should be more open to non-Russian music I would think, and only three of eleven jurors are Russian.


I'm speculating that because the audience is so large and potentially enthusiastic that the competitors and their teachers take that into account. But, you're right, the jury is probably not so easily swayed.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 03:01 AM
I agree that more contemporary music would be welcome, but there is actually a nice range of underplayed repertoire in the next round (as far as competitions go, at least): Medtner Night Wind, Boulez Incises, Bach Art of Fuge, Rach Chopin, some rare transcriptions (Grieg Peer Gynt??!???), and some Scriabin miniatures. I remember one of the candidates in 2015 played Messiaen, not to mention Debargue's Medtner.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 04:49 AM
That's all great, to see that rep getting played, just saying that comparatively speaking, this competition overall has much smaller representation of lesser-performed or modern stuff. You could find two or three competitors from the last Cliburn who had more new/obscure rep than from all of these semifinalists. Then again, given that this competition is celebrating Tchaikovsky and his legacy, it's nothing strange that we're getting all of these familiar Russian war horses. It's funny how many of us perhaps aren't necessarily that crazy about Tchaik 1st concerto, yet here we are, following the competition that is guaranteed to give us more performances of it than is healthy to listen to in two days.

My quibble starts when programs end up too one-sided - Tarasevich-Nikolaev's semi program for ex consists of Rach op 16, one Etudes-Tableau, and Prokofiev 6th sonata.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:02 AM
I really enjoy listening to Yemelyanov. Hope he can make the finals.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:05 AM
Someone should make statistics on how often early-day performers pass vs evening performers. I've done that for other competitions and have often found that early-day performers were less likely to pass overall.

I'm reminded by studies done in court cases where more severe punishments were given out if decisions were made right before lunch and not after lunch. Hungry, impatient jurors make different decisions than content ones, I suppose.

I'm also reminded by a study made with, I believe, jurors from the Chopin competition, who were asked to listen to ten recordings of a Chopin mazurka and rank them. Except, there was one recording that was played twice. Not only did no juror notice, but they also gave different scores to the two identical performances!

Things to keep in mind perhaps, when considering the subjective business of judging a music competition.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:09 AM
Emelyanov didn't seem to be playing at his full capacities, at least in Tchaik-Feinberg which is frightenly difficult to pull off. Corelli sounded better from what I heard. I wonder how much sleep he had last night...
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:17 AM
Does the hall lack air conditioning? I vaguely remember someone telling me that none of the halls in Russia have AC but I'm not sure if that's correct or why it's so. So many of the contestants look like their taking a shower during their performance.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:30 AM
Shiskin playing Chopin Mazurkas and Scherzo. I would prefer more creative programming.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:38 AM
The Mazurka set didn't really speak to me at all, I think they're overall more intimate pieces than exemplified in this reading. And the so-called "countess scherzo" feels a bit out of place here to me here. I understand the need to include rep from previous competitions, in this case the last Chopin comp, but it's refreshing to see that quite a few pianists actively avoided it. Broberg isn't playing any rep he did at either Cliburn or SIPCA from what I can see, same goes for some other frequent competition-goers.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 11:44 AM
I liked his Chopin, actually. It's refreshingly to have somehing aside from etudes. As for Broberg, much of his semis programis from Cliburn - Bach and Barber, not to mention Rach Paganini in the finals. I don't think anyone here is playing something publicly for the first time.

Will watch Yemelyanov later today.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:07 PM
My bad on Broberg, hadn't looked carefully enough. Gugnin does no rep from his last competition, so that would've served as a better example. Of course, most people play things they've done for years (though I was told of one competitor who was out in the first round who learned most of his rep in the months before the competition - didn't work in his favour, obviously), but some avoid repeating rep from previous competitions more than others.

Shishkin is doing great things in Rach. Not liking all of the mannerisms, but great control overall. Good that opinions differ about his Chopin! I just find the Scherzo rather uncomplicated interpretatively/musically, compared to so many other things.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:51 PM
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Does the hall lack air conditioning? I vaguely remember someone telling me that none of the halls in Russia have AC but I'm not sure if that's correct or why it's so. So many of the contestants look like their taking a shower during their performance.


The hall was renovated about 10 years ago. My understanding is that it has some sort of ventilation system of holes in the floor under each seat on the orchestra level.

p. 354, left column
http://www.akutek.info/Papers/NGK_AYL_HM_Moscow_State_Conservatory.pdf
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 12:57 PM
Overall very strong performance by Shishkin. Those who go earlier in the prelims are usually at an advantage since they can just get it done and prepare for the next round, versus those who go at the end and have only a day or two to get ready for the next concert (in addition to keeping their prelims program warm). The etudes and the Sonata were the best, IMO. My issue with the sonata had to do more with the piece than his performance - with the cuts, it doesn't make too much sense (particularly the last movement), but in the full version it makes sense as a terrible piece. I dunno.

An is doing great on the etudes so far. Curious to hear Rach-Chopin, which I've actually never heard live.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 01:12 PM
Excellent performance of the variations - a somewhat strange piece. I'm reminded of Rach's story of leaving out variations if he felt the audience wasn't into it. Seems that the audience doesn't really care for the piece, several are nodding off.

This piano sounds extremely brittle in the upper register.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 02:24 PM
Gugnin is dragging one of Chopin's finest melodies in the first mvt of 3rd Sonata. Other than that it is a good performance.

2nd mvt middle part gets the same dragging. Let's see how the jury will react.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 03:14 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
Gugnin is dragging one of Chopin's finest melodies in the first mvt of 3rd Sonata. Other than that it is a good performance.

2nd mvt middle part gets the same dragging. Let's see how the jury will react.
You'll never know if the jury agrees or disagrees with you. If they don't pass him to the next round it could be for many different reasons, and if they pass him to the next round it could still be they agree with you.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 03:48 PM
That Chopin sonata...while it took a while to get used to the dragging, I'd just say that it came across as a completely individual reading, whereas oftentimes when I hear it at, say, the Chopin competition, some performances are hard to distinguish from others. Not here. Moreover, the contrapuntal clarity, though sometimes overdone on expense of the longer line, was almost unrivalled in any live performance I've heard. Late Chopin is generally full of counterpoint, but much of it gets blurred out by excessive pedal use, etc. Found things to disagree with in this performance, but overall it was super insightful to listen to.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 04:07 PM
Gugnin was the best of the first session today, IMO - perfect repertoire choices (not oppressively Russian like some of the other ones coming up), nice contrasts, and everything was masterfully played. I share Martin's reaction about the Chopin and feel that way about the Prokofiev, too - he had a unique reading of both sonatas and owned it. Huge improvement over the prelims, so hopefully the concertmaster and principal cellist will actually learn the solos in the slow movement of Tchaikovsky Second if he makes it to the finals...

An spent way too much time on a quite simply inferior piece and the Brahms seemed tedious and a little mechanical thereafter. Shishkin was probably the most consistent of the group notewise, but I might have liked a little more warmth overall. He's still one of my favorites, though.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 04:16 PM
"Oppressively Russian", haha, suitable terminology in this context. Very much hoping to hear some Tchaik 2 in the finals!
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 05:17 PM
Interesting fact:

All except two in the 24-and-under group were cut.

All except two in the 25-and-over group passed.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 06:59 PM
Babayan told a friend that he didn't even start marking the semis of big competitions until he was 24-25, so it makes sense. That's kind of the sweet spot unless you're insanely gifted.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 07:18 PM
Yeah, it tends to be the case that the pianists that are young and do go far sometimes cannot match the playing of their somewhat older peers. We've got the young Japanese guy from the Cliburn (not the most recent one but the one before that) whose Tchaik 1 unfortunately wasn't up to standard, and then of course, there was THE-NAME-THAT-SHOULD-NOT-BE-MENTIONED also passing to finals there and not really pulling it off.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 07:20 PM
I remember reading not to program Schumann because every jury member might have their own favorite interpretation. That said IMO this Carnaval might not convince them.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/21/19 09:15 PM
Likely/unlikely finalists from today's performers? I'd see finalist spots for Shishkin, Gugnin, possibly Gadjiev. Less sure about Meknikov, Kopachevsky, Yelemeyanov (a shame, he's an excellent musician) and An. Let's see.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 12:08 AM
I thought Gugnin was the star of the day.

I was less enthralled with Shishkin (due to the program), but I would like to hear his concerti. Anybody know what he plans on doing for that round?

Completely unimportant, musically, but culturally significant is that pianist under 30 have little use for neckties, apparently. (Especially since the Great Hall is hot. 😁)
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 12:57 AM
Originally Posted by fnork
Likely/unlikely finalists from today's performers? I'd see finalist spots for Shishkin, Gugnin, possibly Gadjiev. Less sure about Meknikov, Kopachevsky, Yelemeyanov (a shame, he's an excellent musician) and An. Let's see.


Shishkin, Gadjiev, and Gugnin sounds accurate.

What I'm really interested in tomorrow's session is how Fujita's program will come across since he's playing two of the same pieces that Gugnin did (Chopin and Prokofiev). My guess is that he'll have a more straightforward interpretation. Sara's program looks the most diverse (Boulez, Bach, Chopin, Prokofiev) and Kenny's all depends on how the Night Wind sonata will come across.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 09:56 AM
Aren't they going to play Mozart concertos?
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 11:02 AM
No Mozart concerti this time.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 12:25 PM
Wow, that Prokofiev Sonata by Tarasevich was stunning! I think he'll make it to the finals
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 12:35 PM
Tarasevich seemed extremely secure in his rep, from the bits I heard. I'd be surprised if he didn't pass. Kantorow is more my kind of guy in terms of rep choices though, thought his Brahms was terrific. Funny how I initially wondered how Brahms would come across in a competition dedicated to a composer that strongly disliked his music, but when you think of it, that second sonata really has quite a bit of these heroic gestures, and a plethora of octave passages, which almost bring to mind various Tchaik things. They were extremely different composers, but some of the rhetorics/gestures in this early Brahms opus isn't miles away from Tchaik.
Posted By: scriabinfanatic Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 01:09 PM
Anyone else see Kopachevsky's haircut and think "Richard Clayderman?" I think his recital pieces were kind of in backwards order...he starts out with a showstopper performance of Carnival (really good) and ends up with a few of those cute little numbers from Peer Gynt (except that the "In the Hall of the Mountain King" transcription was definitely not the same one published in the "Everybody's Favorite Piano Pieces" book I played from when I was little).
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 01:43 PM
It's Grigory Ginzburg's transcription. Matsuev often plays it as an encore. Also felt doing that suite was rather out of place.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 02:21 PM
Thoughts so far:

T-N - very solid and well delivered, as expected. I don't see how he won't pass and/or win a top prize (and he made a smart move of programming Beethoven in the finals). My biggest qualm is that his whole vibe from headshot to performance is "dour, dark Russian pianist." Is that really what Classical music needs now? The last winner had that feeling, too.

Fujita - bright and brilliant as per his preliminary round. Also as expected, his interpretations were perhaps more straightforward but nonetheless expertly done. He brought out some things in the Prokofiev I've never heard before, particularly in the last movement.

Broberg is nailing his recital now. I wouldn't be surprised if they let seven people into the finals as opposed to six.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 03:03 PM
Broberg is totally involving throughout, not least in Medtner, which is held together very well. That piece is weird pianistically in the sense that nothing feels unplayable when you start working on it, and in fact, I could barely find a single passage in the 1st movement that didn't fall under the fingers quickly. But it's insanely taxing to convince with musically, keeping the bigger picture in mind, not to mention memorising it. I know many pianists that quickly came to regret learning it, because this is one of those pieces where once you learned the notes, you've still only done less than 10% of the work. Broberg had an amazing sense of pace, brought out inner voices I hadn't heard before, and used the full dynamic range at his disposal. I also didn't notice a single moment where he felt insecure or lost focus or forgot something. I did tune out in the last 8 min or so though. In any case, an outstanding achievement.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 03:04 PM
Overall I find today's performances more engaging and solid.
Posted By: scriabinfanatic Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 03:07 PM
Well Broberg's Night Wind did not disappoint! Very well thought out, some interesting rhythmic and articulation emphasis that I've not heard before in the piece and really appreciated, he never got bogged down in the difficulty...I really enjoyed that performance.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 05:04 PM
Memory slips in Bach might cost Daneshpour.
I was not impressed by the Barcarolle.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 05:29 PM
Bold programming and plenty of powerful artistry on display here. Unfortunately, the slips in Bach came very untimely, and while I loved the Prokofiev overall then the slowed-down ending felt somewhat anti-climactic. Would love to hear more of her but given the insanely high level today, I am unsure if she'll pass. Unfortunately.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 06:11 PM
Originally Posted by fnork
They were extremely different composers, but some of the rhetorics/gestures in this early Brahms opus isn't miles away from Tchaik.


The second Brahms concerto always reminds me of Tchaikovsky 1. There's something in the sound. Maybe it's all the B-flats... grin
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 06:21 PM
Fujita
Nikolayev
Shishkin
Kantarow
Genuishene
?
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 06:25 PM
Originally Posted by fnork
Bold programming and plenty of powerful artistry on display here. Unfortunately, the slips in Bach came very untimely, and while I loved the Prokofiev overall then the slowed-down ending felt somewhat anti-climactic. Would love to hear more of her but given the insanely high level today, I am unsure if she'll pass. Unfortunately.


Agree overall. If you're going to play Bach again, you kinda have to slay it. I like the connection that she was trying to make between Boulez and Bach (hyper-intellectual, well-crafted, etc.), but it unfortunately didn't come out and probably went over everyone's heads. She's a great artist but just had a bad day and got spooked, it seems.

Kenny's Medtner was top-shelf. I honestly didn't care for the piece, but the performance was incredibly detailed, always under control, and expertly done.

Anna Geniushene played beautifully and had lots of power in the Prokofiev. I'm not really a fan of the Schumann but she made it work.

I think the for sure finalists are Shishkin, Gugnin, T-N, and Broberg. Probably Geniushene, too. I hope Fujita will make it, but if he doesn't we'll definitely see him in the next Chopin competition. I do have a feeling that they might allow one more person in.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 07:25 PM
Originally Posted by scriabinfanatic
Anyone else see Kopachevsky's haircut and think "Richard Clayderman?"


Probably easier to live down than Shishkin's "glamorous" photos from a few years back.

Seriously though, if Shishkin does win, it will prolong the ping-pong match between the Tchaikovsky and the Chopin that's been going on for the last few years.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 07:55 PM
Very ambitious program by Kim. I give props to anyone who has the guts to play Petrushka in public (having screwed it up myself). I'd say that his recital was about the same level as Fujita, Geniushene, Gadjiev, or Melnikov. It's just too hard to pick.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 08:23 PM
Especially brave to program that piece right after Chopin op 25. He seems to have lost some precision and beauty of sound as Stravinsky progressed, the last movement wasn't so flawless. But a strong performance overall, it seems. Damn hard to go down to 6 finalists...
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 08:30 PM
Yes this year is different. Still we are not talking about top 3 prizes. Any suggestions?
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 08:44 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
Yes this year is different. Still we are not talking about top 3 prizes. Any suggestions?


I think Shishkin could win.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 08:51 PM
Yemelyanov
Shishkin
An
Melnikov
Kantarow
Broberg
Fujita

Seven as predicted, but some surprises here.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 09:04 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Yemelyanov
Shishkin
An
Melnikov
Kantarow
Broberg
Fujita

Seven as predicted, but some surprises here.


Yes but still I can live with that. I can't name anyone with confidence instead of those selected.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 09:41 PM
Didn't expect to see Yemelyanov there, but not unhappy about it, quite the opposite. Curious to see how Broberg and Kantorow will do in the finals. Can't imagine doing Tchaik 1 and then immediately move on to Brahms 2nd...less excited to see Melnikov pass, he hasn't stood out musically to me.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 09:58 PM
Good list, I think. I really wanted Shiskin, Broberg, and Fujita.

At the end, can Malofeev still get a "jury whippersnapper, er, discretion award" (or does that come just from the semifinalists)?
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 10:37 PM
There was the Moscow Critics Award last time, so he might get that.

All in all, still a good list and the competition has some great players in the finals. I'll have to go back and rewatch Kantorow, Yemelyanov, and Melnikov. It might even be Broberg for the win at this point. He played Rach Pag in Houston a few weeks ago and according to a friend in the orchestra, he was on fire. Anyway, the consolation prize for me is hearing Brahms 2 in the finals. Should be a nice foil to all the Russian rep.
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/22/19 11:06 PM
I liked Fujita the most so far although they're all quite accomplished. I'm disappointed with Malofeev because one finds much more musicality in his youtube performances perhaps he was off his game. Maybe he was severely reprimanded for getting only second place in China. He seemed all technique here although he does have the best in the competition that is the foundation one builds upon. I will listen again to some more of today's performances.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/24/19 03:05 AM
The schedule for the finals are up, and oh boy a few people are in for some punishment:

Tuesday
Yemelyanov - Prokofiev 3 and Tchaik 1
Shishkin - Tchaik 1 and Prokofiev 3
An - Rach Paganini and Tchaik 1

Wednesday
Melnikov - Tchaik 1 and Rach 3
Kantorow - Tchaik 2 and Brahms 2

Thursday
Fujita - Tchaik 1 and Rach 3
Broberg - Rach Paganini and Tchaik 1

My initial reaction is that Kenny is at an extreme advantage going last and also not playing 2 massive concerti like the others. He's done in under an hour, has the longest time to rest before his performance, and has played both of these pieces many times before. An is playing the same program but I doubt the judges will remember his performance by then.

What on earth is Kantorow doing? I went back and watched his recitals again - solid player, good at Brahms, imaginative playing, but that's nearly two hours of the most punishing music imaginable with no intermission. This is what torpedoed Lukas Genusias last time. Hopefully the orchestra will be fresh and ready for a challenge and the string soloists will learn their parts. The hardest movement in the Brahms is actually the finale, it takes so much control to keep it light and by that point you're almost totally spent after the massive movements that precede it.

Also, jury prizes have been awarded to the two top semifinalists who haven't advanced, Kopachevsky and Kim.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/24/19 02:59 PM
medici.tv is running this "service announcement" today:

"This weekend, the #TCH16 website saw an overwhelming amount of traffic. After just the first week, we've surpassed the viewing record from the previous edition of the competition and have already hit 10 million views from 180 countries! We are amazed at this unprecedented enthusiasm and thank you sincerely for this incredible show of support.

Because of the extremely high demand on our servers, some of you may have had difficulty tuning in to certain videos. We apologize for this inconvenience and are doing everything we can to ensure that the stream remains accessible to everyone. Thank you again for your support and patience!"

Fewer pages of comments around here this time at Piano World, though. But, quality makes up for quantity. 😁
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 01:24 AM
I saw that, too - pretty incredible! They'll probably top 15 million views for the whole thing, which is amazing for classical music. As a general observation, it's fantastic that we get all of this wonderful music for free to enjoy over and over again. The level is unbelievably high this cycle.

Had some time over the weekend to go back and watch some of the performances I skimmed through, and the only finalist spot I see as questionable is An. Yemelyanov played a fantastic recital, IMO. The piece he opened with was lovely and I want to learn it. Sure, the transcription was a little sloppy in places, but that piece is a monster and he mostly managed to keep it under control tempo-wise (and it had a great "March of the Toys" feeling). The fugue of the Barber was incredible and I actually liked it more than Kenny's. I'm excited to hear him again tomorrow.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 12:41 PM
That's great! It probably has a large TV audience as well. It's a pity all the concertos are typical competition pieces. Tchaikovsky 2 and Bartók 2 would have made a nice change.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 02:26 PM
We're actually getting a Tchaik 2 tomorrow.

The bloodbath resumes in 30 minutes...
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 06:40 PM
A confused start to Rhapsody from An!
Posted By: tinyking12345 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 06:55 PM
Poor guy was obviously expecting to start with the Tchaikovsky!
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:00 PM
Originally Posted by tinyking12345
Poor guy was obviously expecting to start with the Tchaikovsky!

That was what I thought too. He didn't look too happy after that either.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:02 PM
On the online program listing the Tchaikovsky was listed first!
Posted By: tinyking12345 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:02 PM
It will be a shame if it affects the jury's decision... I sat next to him at the opening ceremony, really friendly guy!
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:03 PM
The announcer also said the Tchaik was first. Poor guy, I wonder how such a horrible miscommunication happened. I'm sure he feels horrible, you could see how confused he looked when the Rach started.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:06 PM
That is very strange. It would be very unfair if the jury's decision is affected by this. You could see how surprised he was when they started playing Rach.
Posted By: tinyking12345 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:07 PM
On the contrary, I think the fact he dealt with the situation so well can only be commended by the jury,
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:08 PM
Also, I'm getting really bored of hearing this Tchaikovsky concerto now. It's gonna be nice to hear the second concerto tomorrow.
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:08 PM
He should have just come in with the opening chords of the Tchaikovsky. smile
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:12 PM
Originally Posted by tinyking12345
On the contrary, I think the fact he dealt with the situation so well can only be commended by the jury,

I hope so. It would be a shame if he came in last place. I think he is one of the most interesting musicians of this competition.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:13 PM
I am not happy with An's syncopated playing trying to bring out the melody line.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:17 PM
@tinyking12345 Congratulations on your competition experience: you deserved to be a semifinalist, whatever the jury thought!

I'm not sure "the show must go on" applies in An's case to such a miscommunication. 🤔
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:18 PM
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
@tinyking12345 Congratulations on your competition experience: you deserved to be a semifinalist, whatever the jury thought!


I agree, that Appassionata was stunning!
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:29 PM
Unfortunately An seems to be affected by this situation.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:30 PM
Originally Posted by Vilhelm Moqvist
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
@tinyking12345 Congratulations on your competition experience: you deserved to be a semifinalist, whatever the jury thought!


I agree, that Appassionata was stunning!


Same! Really stellar performance and we're all looking forward to hearing more from you.

Of the performances today, and An's unfortunate situation aside, I think Shishkin is the clear standout. Yemelyanov was great and solid but he was clearly playing the long game in terms of stamina and conserving his energy (rightfully so, given the task at hand). I felt that he maybe held a little too much back, particularly in the Prokofiev. Shishkin was clearly in it to win it and played to the rafters without breaking a sweat. It was by far his best performance of the entire competition.

One of my former teachers told me that Ian Hobson related an anecdote that after so many years of trying competitions and getting 2nd/3rd that it was just "his turn" when he got the top prize in Leeds. Maybe it'll be the same for Shishkin this time.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:31 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
Unfortunately An seems to be affected by this situation.

The audience didn't sound too happy with his Rach. I think that might have affected him too.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 07:33 PM
An pushing the tempo in last mvt!
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 08:49 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
We're actually getting a Tchaik 2 tomorrow.

The bloodbath resumes in 30 minutes...


Oh of course. I just looked through assuming everyone was doing Tchaikovsky 1, and no.2 would be their second concerto. This is great!
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 10:31 PM
Wow! That's going to be a classic with An. It's obvious he was expecting the Tschaikovsky and boom he's a second behind in the Rachmaninoff. He obvious wasn't too happy and upset before he got back to business. I'd say he did a great job recovering. Notice he shakes the first violinist hand before the conductor. He get's my respect.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/25/19 11:43 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
An pushing the tempo in last mvt!


I felt that it was too fast--there is the consideration of what the winds can keep up with in the last mvt. of the Tchaikovsky.

I wouldn't have faulted him for stopping the conductor and demanding a restart with the correct concerto first--the orchestra should have had it in their folders. Of course, some smarty judge or two would say, "A great artist doesn't let a little thing like that bother him." 😁
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 12:09 AM
There's a famous incident when Pires, expecting a different Mozart concerto for a concert (with no prior rehearsal), pulled the D-minor rabbit out of her memory hat. But An's situation is a little different.

Posted By: newport Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 01:01 AM
and Rubinstein said once he was forced to play Chopin 1st from memory on the fly instead of the 2nd (the conductor said they only had the score for the 1st, sorry)
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 11:43 AM
Slipped Disc has an article explaining what happened. The announcer did say Tchaikovsky was first and then corrected himself in Russian saying Rachmaninoff:

https://slippedisc.com/2019/06/tchaikovsky-pianist-is-derailed-by-false-announcement/

For those who missed it, here's the video, which begins after the announcement:

https://tch16.medici.tv/en/replay/final-with-an-tianxu/
Posted By: pianoloverus Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 11:58 AM
I guess most concert performers have some funny/horror stories after they've been playing for a while. Harriet Wingreen, the former pianist for the NY Philharmonic who unfortunately passed away recently after retiring in her late 80s, told me that her music was blown off the music desk by air conditioning so she missed her entrance in some piece. The conductor was angry with her after the performance but she told him off haha!
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 12:17 PM
They might schedule a repeat performance of the Rhapsody.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 01:50 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
They might schedule a repeat performance of the Rhapsody.

Where did you hear this?
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 02:00 PM
Originally Posted by Vilhelm Moqvist
Originally Posted by Hakki
They might schedule a repeat performance of the Rhapsody.

Where did you hear this?


I can totally see this happening. Gergiev issued a personal apology to Narek Hakhnazarayan (cello winner in 2011) who was the victim of a racist remark by Mark Gorenstein, the conductor of the finals orchestra, so it's very possible that he'll intervene to let him perform again to smooth things over. Can't have the Tchaikovsky competition without drama, etc.

Super excited for my favorite "terrible twos" today (as in terribly difficult).
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 02:02 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Originally Posted by Vilhelm Moqvist
Originally Posted by Hakki
They might schedule a repeat performance of the Rhapsody.

Where did you hear this?


I can totally see this happening. Gergiev issued a personal apology to Narek Hakhnazarayan (cello winner in 2011) who was the victim of a racist remark by Mark Gorenstein, the conductor of the finals orchestra, so it's very possible that he'll intervene to let him perform again to smooth things over. Can't have the Tchaikovsky competition without drama, etc.

Super excited for my favorite "terrible twos" today (as in terribly difficult).


Which two concertos are you referring to?
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 02:08 PM
Tchaik 2 and Brahms 2.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 02:16 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Tchaik 2 and Brahms 2.

Yeah, those two are scary. I wonder how he's going to pull it off.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 02:50 PM
The the most cringeworthy orchestral mistake I've ever come across was at the 2018 Dublin International Piano Competition. At the end of the cadenza in the first movement of Prokofiev 2, the orchestra came in early. Such a place to mess up! Luckily the pianist won, so it was ok in the end.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 03:37 PM
Orchestra is in formal suits today.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 03:40 PM
Probably speaks to the difficulty of the orchestra parts to Kantorow's concerti...
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 03:49 PM
Melnikov is going fine in Tchaikovsky. He might get an applause after 1st mvt.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 03:54 PM
Nope. He chose to be cautious.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 04:01 PM
Great playing so far!
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 04:20 PM
I was hoping he would go for the ossia cadenza tbh, but his playing of this cadenza is really awesome.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 04:21 PM
Tchaik went better, IMO. The Rach feels rushed.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 04:22 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
Tchaik went better, IMO. The Rach feels rushed.

Maybe slightly rushed yeah. Not a big fan of how he played the opening melody either, His Tchaik was solid though.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 04:50 PM
Well not an exciting performance.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 05:03 PM
I really liked him.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 05:16 PM
According to the Competition's FB page, An was offered the chance to perform his concerti again (by unanimous jury consent) but refused. Yikes.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 05:20 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
According to the Competition's FB page, An was offered the chance to perform his concerti again (by unanimous jury consent) but refused. Yikes.


Huh?! Why would he refuse?!
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 05:29 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan
According to the Competition's FB page, An was offered the chance to perform his concerti again (by unanimous jury consent) but refused. Yikes.

Gosh.I wonder how the jury will react to him refusing. Very weird decision by An.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 05:43 PM
Originally Posted by MikeN
Originally Posted by Brendan
According to the Competition's FB page, An was offered the chance to perform his concerti again (by unanimous jury consent) but refused. Yikes.


Huh?! Why would he refuse?!


That's what everyone is wondering. If he played again and it didn't go well, he would be out fair and square. I guess he gives him a chance to claim Pogorelich status so he can control the narrative if he doesn't get a prize from yesterday's performance.

Meanwhile, what a BREATH OF FRESH AIR Tchaik Second is. Both the orchestra and Kantorow sound awesome.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 05:54 PM
Finally someone who is playing from his heart. Thanks to Kantorow.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 06:04 PM
This concerto is actually very beautiful, very underrated compared to the first concerto.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 06:11 PM
Criminally underrated. Whenever a pianist says he's learning "the Tchaikovsky concerto", I ask them which one. I already know their answer, but perhaps it helps some of them to remember that there actually are other concertos by Tchaikovsky for the piano...and that brilliant Concert Fantasy, op 56.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 06:25 PM
Out of the competitors that have played so far Kantorow is for me without a doubt the winner.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 06:30 PM
See, he's not my cup of tea. Very nice playing though.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 06:39 PM
Even if he doesn't win IMO he might be another Lucas Debargue.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 07:15 PM
The audience loved it too, it seems. First standing ovation of the finalists.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 07:17 PM
Matsuev clapped with the audience as well.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 07:22 PM
I am absolutely speechless after that performance. The Tchaikovsky was wonderful, powerful, melodic, magisterial, and the orchestra played with incredible sensitivity. The Brahms was doubly so - literally everything you could ask for from that piece and more. Just when you think the level can't get any higher, you get something like this. If they're truly only judging on the finals as Barry Douglas said yesterday in his interview, Kantorow is clearly the winner by miles. What's also astounding is that Kantorow and Debargue have the same teacher - I think her rates are about to go up big time.

...and the An Tianxu issue is causing a major blowup on social media.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 07:27 PM
Admittedly I tuned in and out tonight (gotta practice myself occasionally!) but everything I heard by Kantorow was mind-bogglingly good, refined, communicative; full of both finesse and power. Especially astonishing considering how massive those two concertos are, but he seems to have owned them. Must go back and listen to all of this properly soon.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 07:57 PM
https://slippedisc.com/2019/06/tchaikovsky-fires-[censored]-final-official/

Is this the announcer that we all wathced throughout the competition? Was there another announcer today?
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 08:18 PM
Here is the explanation from competition site.
https://tch16.com/en/news/304.htm
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 08:20 PM
You know, I had a bit of a funny feeling about Kantorow early on, that he would be the Lucas Debargue "dark horse" of this competition.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 08:29 PM
Yikes, this situation is just getting worse and worse.

I thought it was the same announcer today as it was during the entire competition but I might be wrong?
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/26/19 08:32 PM
Originally Posted by Hakki
Matsuev clapped with the audience as well.

He clapped after Melnikovs performance too.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 12:52 PM
I'm really impressed by Emelyanov. Having heard Prokofiev 3 so many times, he reminded me of what I saw in the piece thirty or so years ago. That is the highest praise I can give to any musician.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 01:09 PM
I just heard Kantarow. From the first note of the Tchaikovsky, he sounded extraordinary.
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 03:36 PM
This Tchaik is not Mao's best performance imo.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 03:56 PM
I love the way Fujita smiles when he plays!
Posted By: Kenny Cheng Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 04:14 PM
I have been following Fujita. Not the best for Fujita today.
Posted By: Hakki Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 04:18 PM
Below my expectations so far.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 04:40 PM
I don't know if I've ever heard a Rach 3 where soloist and orchestra were so in sync. Also, Fujita was so comfortable with the concerto, all the textural balancing was superb and I can't think of one time he wasn't sympathetic to an orchestral solo. It was almost frightening!

A stark contrast to Kantarow who was very big, very exciting, but seemed like he might go off the rails in a few places while also falling out of sync with the orchestra from time to time.

I'd be curious to know how they sounded in hall.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 04:41 PM
There were a lot of good things about that performance, particularly in the Tchaikovsky. For me, it was the best of the Tchaikovsky 1sts (or maybe tied with Shishkin). It had a great dance feeling in the outer movements that none of the other performers really captured, and the second movement was lovely. The Rachmaninoff was a little light and I would have liked a bigger sound in some places, but that's what I sort of expected after his seminal round. Awesome fingers and an overall beautiful tone quality throughout.

Kantorow is still the best by far, though. I rewatched it again last night and liked it even more.

Another observation: everyone is absolutely fantastic at playing with the orchestra (and Fujita was spot on the whole time in this respect). This is sort of what undid Debargue last time, but you can tell that everyone playing here has done this many times before.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 04:56 PM
Originally Posted by MikeN


A stark contrast to Melnikov who was very big, very exciting, but seemed like he might go off the rails in a few places while also falling out of sync with the orchestra from time to time.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 04:59 PM
I enjoy Fujita's clarity, warmth, and ease. The Rachmaninoff 3rd seemed TOO easy, which might work against him. Personally, that kind of playing is my cup of tea, though.

I'm having a sinking feeling that the aggregate jury decision will be something (out of left field) like:

1. Melnikov
Tie 2a. Shiskin, 2b. Emelyanov
Tie 3a. Kantorow, 3b. Broberg
4. Fujita
5. An

Let's hope Broberg kills. 😁

Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 05:23 PM
What happened there? grin
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 05:49 PM
Broberg is killing it right now.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 06:32 PM
Well that was fun!
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 06:38 PM
Bravo Broberg. Really, there's not much more to say.


I'd be happiest with

1. Broberg
2. Kantorow
3. Shishkin
4. Fujita

Very difficult decision. My earlier (worst case) prediction wouldn't surprise me. 😆 I hope we don't get a bunch of shared medals, and the case of those coming in 3rd and 4th being the best.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 06:40 PM
I don't see how there can't be ties like last time, so here's my purely uneducated guess:

1. Kantorow
2. Shishkin/Yemelyanov
3. Broberg/Melnikov
4. Fujita
5. An

Broberg was great, if a little interpretively strange at times. I felt that he made some decisions for the sake of doing something different from the other competitors as opposed to finding a real musical reason. Whatevs, it's the Tchaikovsky Competition and the level is already so high.
Posted By: lesecret Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:01 PM
I think that’s actually a good decision. How many of the juries are really going to be listening with fresh ears the second time? It’s nice of Matsuev to make that offer but a second performance wouldn’t really level the competition but just to appease the competitor. Actually I think all the media firestorm and injustice is going to help An in his career much more. And there’s always the next competition (or other competitions) for someone that young and talented.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:05 PM
Originally Posted by Brendan

Broberg was great, if a little interpretively strange at times. I felt that he made some decisions for the sake of doing something different from the other competitors as opposed to finding a real musical reason.


Nah, it worked! (I know what you mean. 😆)

Has the Tchaikovsky ever tied gold? They have a habit of tying silver with no gold awarded, I recall.
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:15 PM
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
Originally Posted by Brendan

Broberg was great, if a little interpretively strange at times. I felt that he made some decisions for the sake of doing something different from the other competitors as opposed to finding a real musical reason.


Nah, it worked! (I know what you mean. 😆)

Has the Tchaikovsky ever tied gold? They have a habit of tying silver with no gold awarded, I recall.


They have. Most famously John Ogdon and Ashkenazy in 1962. Also Krainev and Lill in 1970.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:22 PM
Originally Posted by johnstaf
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
Originally Posted by Brendan

Broberg was great, if a little interpretively strange at times. I felt that he made some decisions for the sake of doing something different from the other competitors as opposed to finding a real musical reason.


Nah, it worked! (I know what you mean. 😆)

Has the Tchaikovsky ever tied gold? They have a habit of tying silver with no gold awarded, I recall.


They have. Most famously John Ogdon and Ashkenazy in 1962. Also Krainev and Lill in 1970.


Silly me, that's right of course! I was hung up on recalling Eugene Fodor being "robbed" of a violin gold in 1974.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:30 PM
Originally Posted by lesecret
I think that’s actually a good decision. How many of the juries are really going to be listening with fresh ears the second time? It’s nice of Matsuev to make that offer but a second performance wouldn’t really level the competition but just to appease the competitor. Actually I think all the media firestorm and injustice is going to help An in his career much more. And there’s always the next competition (or other competitions) for someone that young and talented.


I agree with you on An's situation. Another crack might have backfired, and you really can't undo what happened. Best to respectfully decline and be (publically) gracious.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:49 PM
14 million views, wow. Announcement now.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:54 PM
6: none
5: none
4: An Tianxu and special prize for self confidence and bravery (?)
3: Melnikov, Broberg, Yemelyanov
2: Shishkin, Fujita
1: Kantorow

About right, IMO.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:56 PM
Hooray for Kantorow!!!
Posted By: Vilhelm Moqvist Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 07:56 PM
I think the jury got it right this time. I was worried Kantorow wasn't going to win, so I am very happy with this.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 08:06 PM
I think they were right on the money overall. Would've liked seeing Broberg higher, though doing the Rach Pag is certainly a bit risky in a high-caliber competition like this. Note that the Rach Pag performances got 3rd and 4th prizes, respectively.

...though...also remember that Trifonov won with a somewhat lightweight choice, the Chopin 1st. His teacher Babayan discouraged him from doing Rach 3, which he wanted. Turned out quite ok for him in the end.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 08:11 PM
Agree completely. A lot of people were rooting for Kenny, but look at it this way - he got a top prize in the most difficult competition imaginable. If his final round wasn't up to the level of his solo stuff, I don't think it detracts from his overall package.

It's really great for Kantorow - the first French winner in the history of the competition and his finals program clearly stood out from the rest of the competitors. Lowenthal told me once that too many competitors playing the same pieces in a competition likely cancel each other out, and I think that applied here. His teacher must be over the moon with two top prize winners in the past two cycles.
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 08:26 PM
It's nice to see the dark horse win. He played remarkably! As I said, not my thing but one immediately hears poetry in his playing and I think an artist with that sort of charisma/magnetism is very much in demand today. I'll be following his career with great interest.

I think I've finally warmed to Broberg. His voicings remind me of Katsaris and Horowitz and the like. Yet, where with Katsaris accepting the mannerisms is the price of entry into his art and, of course, with horowitz the entire narrative and character of the piece reforms around him whether one likes it or not, Broberg has this way of doing what one might consider distracting with another pianist in a way that, for me at least, doesn't at all disrupt or distract or detract from the musical narrative and it makes for an exciting rediscovery of whatever he's playing. Hope I hear him in a hall near me.
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 08:41 PM
I would have rearranged things a tad, but I'm basically happy. I think conductors will continue to like working with Kenny.

I'm surprised that the jury "got" Fujita--what he's all about and after, pianistically.

It was high-qualilty playing, a high-quality jury, and a terrible announcer. 😁
Posted By: scriabinfanatic Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 09:16 PM
Haha @ Broberg exaggeratedly mouthing "Rachmaninoff?" to the conductor and then grinning before his performance!
Posted By: MikeN Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 09:17 PM
Originally Posted by scriabinfanatic
Haha @ Broberg exaggeratedly mouthing "Rachmaninoff?" to the conductor and then grinning before his performance!


Oh, THAT'S what that was. ha
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 09:33 PM
I think Kantorow will be one of the greatest stars of his generation. Congratulations to him.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 09:51 PM
Originally Posted by scriabinfanatic
Haha @ Broberg exaggeratedly mouthing "Rachmaninoff?" to the conductor and then grinning before his performance!

Hilarious moment!!!
Posted By: newport Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/27/19 11:45 PM
Originally Posted by fnork
Originally Posted by scriabinfanatic
Haha @ Broberg exaggeratedly mouthing "Rachmaninoff?" to the conductor and then grinning before his performance!

Hilarious moment!!!

That's unfair advantage in my opinion. Is that allowed?
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/28/19 03:49 AM
Criticizing the piano result, Norman Lebrecht, to coin a phrase, is full of mud:

https://slippedisc.com/2019/06/breaking-tchaikovsky-piano-winner-is-french-but-the-result-is-cheesy/
Posted By: johnstaf Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/28/19 09:44 AM
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
Criticizing the piano result, Norman Lebrecht, to coin a phrase, is full of mud:

https://slippedisc.com/2019/06/breaking-tchaikovsky-piano-winner-is-french-but-the-result-is-cheesy/


I wouldn't expect anything different from that bitchy gossip columnist.
Posted By: Orange Soda King Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/28/19 03:38 PM
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
Criticizing the piano result, Norman Lebrecht, to coin a phrase, is full of mud:

https://slippedisc.com/2019/06/breaking-tchaikovsky-piano-winner-is-french-but-the-result-is-cheesy/


His grapes are sour, lol.
Posted By: PeterPun Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/28/19 06:24 PM
I've never understood the obsession some people have with Malofeev tbh. His appassionata was more than enough to send him out of the competition.
Posted By: Brendan Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/28/19 08:53 PM
Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
Originally Posted by WhoDwaldi
Criticizing the piano result, Norman Lebrecht, to coin a phrase, is full of mud:

https://slippedisc.com/2019/06/breaking-tchaikovsky-piano-winner-is-french-but-the-result-is-cheesy/


His grapes are sour, lol.


The only reasons to read SD are to find out which obscure musician died recently (maybe I'll show up on there...), when someone cancels, Yuja Wang outfit updates, obscure conductor appointments, Gergiev bashing, and complaining about rigged competitions. It's the Drudge Report of classical music (and no offense to Drudge, who has a higher standard of reporting than SD). I think Sokolov refused a critic's award because it had previously been given to Lebrecht.

Anyway, thanks to all of you for a fun megathread on this competition. See you next year for Chopin 2020...
Posted By: kbrod1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/29/19 01:18 AM
I've been following him as well as other Russian prodigies for some time. I too was disappointed with how he performed here. He has extraordinary talent and technique but needs to develop more musically. He had the best technique but was way out of his league musically speaking. Fujita was way way ahead of him and only 3 years older.
Posted By: ElaineAllegro Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/30/19 01:01 AM
P.S.

Grand Prix: Alexandre Kantorow

Audience Prize: Mao Fujita

Pianists rule!!!

Both Galas are available to view on demand - and there were many changes from 1st to 2nd Gala so both are well worth watching.

Gala #1, in Moscow:
https://tch16.medici.tv/en/replay/#filter?round=winners-gala-moscow

Gala #2, in St. Petersburg:
https://tch16.medici.tv/en/replay/#filter?slug=winners-gala-saint-petersburg
Posted By: shirlkirsten Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/30/19 05:05 AM
In my opinion, Kantorow deserved the Gold and the Grand Prix.. an exceptional pianist in every round. That Brahms 2 today, mvt. 3 (at the Gala) was magnificent and moving.
Posted By: fnork Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/30/19 11:57 AM
Originally Posted by Brendan
I think Sokolov refused a critic's award because it had previously been given to Lebrecht.

Indeed:

https://www.gramophone.co.uk/classi...d-previously-been-won-by-norman-lebrecht

http://orpheuscomplex.blogspot.com/2015/09/lebrecht-sokolovand-sokolovs-wife.html?m=1
Posted By: WhoDwaldi Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/30/19 04:21 PM
Originally Posted by ElaineAllegro
P.S.

Grand Prix: Alexandre Kantorow

Audience Prize: Mao Fujita

Pianists rule!!!



Wow, that's great. Puts Kantorow in that Trifonov firmament! I'm pleased for Fujita, as well.

American cellist Zlatomir Fung won gold, the second since Nathaniel Rosen in the 70s. That's a really big deal in the US string world.
Posted By: dumka1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 06/30/19 05:30 PM
Thanks for this thread, it drew my attention to the competition and I ended up listening to quite a few performances on medici. I also followed a Russian-language Tchaikovsky competition forum, which was quite interesting... In both good and bad ways smile Most members there raved about Kantorow (and loved Broberg and Mao), so they were not rooting for Russian pianists exclusively, which was nice...
Posted By: cmb13 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 07/01/19 03:13 AM
Originally Posted by dumka1
Thanks for this thread, it drew my attention to the competition and I ended up listening to quite a few performances on medici. I also followed a Russian-language Tchaikovsky competition forum, which was quite interesting... In both good and bad ways smile Most members there raved about Kantorow (and loved Broberg and Mao), so they were not rooting for Russian pianists exclusively, which was nice...

Same. I wouldn’t have otherwise known about it at all. I read the history, and learned about the Van Cliburn win during the first competition.
Posted By: dumka1 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 07/01/19 12:45 PM
Originally Posted by cmb13

Same. I wouldn’t have otherwise known about it at all. I read the history, and learned about the Van Cliburn win during the first competition.


I already mentioned this very interesting (if a bit overdramatic at times) book: Moscow Nights: The Van Cliburn Story-How One Man and His Piano Transformed the Cold War
by Nigel Cliff.

A great read, I couldn't put it down. I think you'd enjoy it now that you know more about the competition. It also provides quite a bit of information on the Soviet political context at the time (in a very accessible and exciting way).
Posted By: BeeZee4 Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 07/07/19 08:34 PM
Rewatching the Finals on Medici TV. Agree with all the Alexandre Kantorow is the deserved winner. An amazing and prodigious display of technique and interpretation as well as the physical stamina to perform 2 difficult concerti, one of which is rarely played at the competition level. Actually the Brahms is not frequently performed as well, with those 4 movements taxing the memory banks. Kantorow acquitted himself quite well in a marvelous performance, reminiscent of Emil Gilels, which I wonder was on the minds of the jury. His Brahms No. 2 is a touchstone of the recorded versions. I would have preferred a more sustained moment after the 3rd movement before launching into the 4th, it was almost like an "segue" into the rondo. But nitpicking. All in all kudos to Alexandre, who I hope will have a wonderful career, much like his father, the noted conductor and violinist Jean-Jacques Kantorow..
Who knows, would love to hear a recording of father and son doing all the Brahms violin sonatas!
Posted By: Orange Soda King Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 07/07/19 11:52 PM
I'm listening to Kantorow's Brahms 2 again, also. It's just outstanding. Wow.
Posted By: johnlewisgrant Re: 16th Tchaikovsky Competition - 07/08/19 02:48 AM
I found the slow movement of Brahms 2, but not the (difficult) last movement!
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