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Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977422
07/24/07 06:45 PM
07/24/07 06:45 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
loveschopintoomuch Offline OP
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loveschopintoomuch  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
Well, we have a club of three, so far. I cannot get through the 17th prelude without my arms pleading for mercy. If I do ignore their cries, I have to take 3 650 mg Tylenol and bathe myself in Bengay. All my clothes are permanently "perfumed."

I also don't understand this relaxation thing. Hershey was kind enough to give us some tips...but even he admitted that when he was tense, he also sufferred pain. What chance do we have?

When I was learning my prelude, I was fine because there was no pressure. But now that I have 2.5 months to polish it...the stress is starting. I love when people tell you to flop your arms down on the keyboard like two dead fish. Sure, and my playing will be equally as smelly.

Mike: The prelude that is given an 8 is really a 6 to me, and the 7 is like a 9!!

Yes, misery does love company and frustration enjoys friends.

Regards,
Kathleen


After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891
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Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977423
07/24/07 10:42 PM
07/24/07 10:42 PM
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,559
Roswell, Georgia
N
NancyM333 Offline
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,559
Roswell, Georgia
I'm with you, Kathleen, on the whole relaxation thing. I'm back from three weeks away from the piano, and I immediately tried to play all my pieces at the dynamic level and speed I did before I left. Bad idea--I'm now with a sore forearm again. My teacher keeps saying relax, arms like dead fish; I keep reading to relax, let the weight of the arm take over; however, nothing helps me actually do it. Maybe a botox shot is my next course of action!

I love this waltz but already learned it. I look forward to hearing it from you all. I am very, very behind on my Prelude #15, so I'd better spend most of my time on that.

Nancy


Estonia 168
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977424
07/25/07 02:08 PM
07/25/07 02:08 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
loveschopintoomuch Offline OP
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loveschopintoomuch  Offline OP
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
Hi Nancy:

Hope you had a great vacation. smile

As far as relaxation, I've started making myself a pina colada [Linked Image] right before I practice. But now I have to wait until after 12 because I heard that drinking before noon indicates one is an alcoholic. laugh

They do say a drink a day is good for you, right? I haven't noticed an improvement in the relaxation angle that much, but...it seems I don't care that much anymore. thumb

Perhaps a much better idea would be what someone suggested at while ago. That we build our muscles by doing some weight lifting, like those 2-3 lb. barbells. It's worth a try. What do you think?

Kathleen


After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977425
07/25/07 02:09 PM
07/25/07 02:09 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
loveschopintoomuch Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member
loveschopintoomuch  Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
Hi Nancy:

Hope you had a great vacation. smile

As far as relaxation, I've started making myself a pina colada [Linked Image] right before I practice. But now I have to wait until after 12 because I heard that drinking before noon indicates one is an alcoholic. laugh

They do say a drink a day is good for you, right? I haven't noticed an improvement in the relaxation angle, but...it seems I don't care that much anymore. thumb

Perhaps a much better idea would be what someone suggested at while ago. That we build our muscles by doing some weight lifting, like those 2-3 lb. barbells. It's worth a try. What do you think?

Kathleen


After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977426
07/27/07 09:48 AM
07/27/07 09:48 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
S
Stacey E Offline
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Stacey E  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
Can I join up on this study group? I just downloaded the music and am ready to start!
Thanks, Stacey

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977427
07/27/07 11:50 AM
07/27/07 11:50 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Peyton Offline
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Peyton  Offline
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Posts: 2,958
Maine
Stacey,

Hey, you bet! It will be nice to have some new insites/questions etc.


"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977428
07/30/07 03:45 PM
07/30/07 03:45 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,290
Toronto
Starting Over Offline
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Starting Over  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,290
Toronto
I'm back from vacation now too so I can resume working on this. I only have the first page memorized and can't really play it yet - no time to practice during July.

Lot's of martinis though! And beer. :b:


Buy some good stock and hold it till it goes up, then sell it. If it don't go up, don't buy it.
Will Rogers

[Linked Image]
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977429
07/30/07 05:55 PM
07/30/07 05:55 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
S
Stacey E Offline
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Stacey E  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
Okay, here goes my first question:
I don't have any of the alternative trills written out, it just gives the tr marking above the note. So, what do I play - the first one is over the "E" in the bass on the first line and another one over the "E" in the bass on the second line.

And then (I should probably know this but don't) what's a little wiggle mark above the note. It's over an "A" about four lines down in the treble. I'm thinking this mean to play the bass & treble like an arpeggio very quickly, can't remeber the correct term? Oh, do I ever need a teacher - ARRGGG!!!

I've just started so I'm working on the first Lento. (?) part and am not moving on the the Sostenuto yet.

Thanks for any advice.

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977430
07/30/07 06:06 PM
07/30/07 06:06 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
S
Stacey E Offline
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Stacey E  Offline
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Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
Never mind on the squiggle part - I just found the term. It means upper mordent, so it would be played aba instead of a full trill. And when the squiggle has a vertical line through it, it means a lower mordent and would be played aga.

Really wished I payed more attention when I had all those lessons as a kid.

Stacey

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977431
07/30/07 06:12 PM
07/30/07 06:12 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
S
Stacey E Offline
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Stacey E  Offline
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Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
Okay, last post on this for now. I just found a table written by bach's father that is helpful on some of the notation used for these markings. Thought I would share the link in case anyone else struggles with this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Tableofornaments750.jpg

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977432
07/31/07 06:28 AM
07/31/07 06:28 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Peyton Offline
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Peyton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Stacey...I'm not positive but I'm not sure all of those notations would be accurate for the Romatic era music?

I'm doing the trill E-F,E-F, E-F, E using 3-1 then the D# and E using 4-5. I think there was a discussion of this earlier in the tread.


"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977433
07/31/07 07:31 AM
07/31/07 07:31 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
S
Stacey E Offline
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Stacey E  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 81
Chicagoland Area
Well, that complicates things. I thought that marking were standard for classical music, no matter what the era was. If they aren't, I'm REALLY in trouble. The ones I thought I knew I still stuggle with sometimes - but then if they can change with the style of music - YIKES!

I did see the above discussion, but not having the alternate trills printed on my music made it hard for me to know exactly what was being talked about. Maybe I need to think about buying the music others are working from.

thanks for the info, I'll give that a try.

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977434
07/31/07 09:53 AM
07/31/07 09:53 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Peyton Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Peyton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Stacey...Hey...I haven't had lessons in YEARS. I just remember when playing Bach the notations were very odd. I was playing some of the Goldberg variations and really needed a special book to explain the notations.

I know that the trill I posted up above is correct however.


"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977435
09/24/07 05:35 PM
09/24/07 05:35 PM
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,290
Toronto
Starting Over Offline
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Starting Over  Offline
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Posts: 1,290
Toronto
Time to bump this thread back up...

How is everyone doing? Is everyone (anyone) still working on this music? I've got it pretty well memorized now and working pretty well except for the last part - the Dolce(?) That’s the part with the arpeggio melody in the left hand. It’s easy to play HS but the trick will be getting it together. The second part gave me the most trouble early on what with those tricky 7 on 2s but surprisingly, it's the Sostenuto that I've really struggled with the most. That was the part I thought would be the easiest when I first read through this music… but how strange the change from major to minor… (to borrow a phrase from Mr. Porter).

This is a beautiful Waltz and I’m looking forward to recordings.


Buy some good stock and hold it till it goes up, then sell it. If it don't go up, don't buy it.
Will Rogers

[Linked Image]
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977436
09/24/07 07:10 PM
09/24/07 07:10 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Peyton Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Peyton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
I tried recording it this morning. No way close.... I'll do one section OK and mess another up. Then the other OK and mess the first section up.


"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977437
09/24/07 07:56 PM
09/24/07 07:56 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
loveschopintoomuch Offline OP
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loveschopintoomuch  Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
This is so completely weird!! I was thinking about this study group just this morning and wondering if anyone was still "out there."

What a pleasant surprise to find it bumped up, and Starting Over and Peyton still hanging in there. Congratulations to both of you.

Starting Over: your news is so super. You've been going it all alone. I admire your determination and "staying power." Please do record when you feel ready.

Peyton: You certainly know better than I that it will come in time.

Things haven't changed with me. I have not been playing it because every single free moment I have has been devoted to Chopin's #17th prelude. If I had a nickel for every hour, I think I could take a cruise, first-class! And just recently I have enrolled in the "Real Beginners for #48.1 Nocturne."

SO MUCH MUSIC, SO LITTLE TIME!

Oh, I'm also trying some improv with Chopsticks!

If only this waltz were a bit easier, I might be tempted to take on both of them. I just love it, and I hate to be a quitter. Well, I'm not really a quitter, since I hardly even started...first page, that's it.

I hope both of you (and any others out there...Mke White, I think) will continue to keep this thread on the first page. Maybe we can get others interested.

Cheers to you both,
Kathleen


After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977438
09/27/07 01:52 PM
09/27/07 01:52 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Peyton Offline
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Peyton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Well, here is my first rough recording. http://www.box.net/shared/eitzky2540 Even though I say I'm going to keep working and polish it blah blah blah I'll probably do my usual and let it go. But I'll be optimistic and hope to keep going on it.

I would appreciate any thoughts on where I need to work. I know there are some wrong notes but I'm most concerned with the interpretation. Over-all it feels heavy handed and doesn't seem to convey the dreamy quality I feel in this piece. I think I may be going too fast also.

Recording today was as tough as always. In fact I ended up pasting in my ending after countless mistakes. I'm sure this happens to others when you feel you are finally going to make it all the way through and then mess up the very end. I just didn't have the patience to do it all over again so just did the ending and pasted it in. You can hear the click and there is a double note.


"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977439
09/27/07 06:20 PM
09/27/07 06:20 PM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 1,360
San Francisco Bay area
Rosanna Offline
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San Francisco Bay area
Peyton, I enjoyed listening to your recording.

I tend to agree with your self assessment of the piece. It's a bit fast. The interpretation feels more upbeat and energetic than the way I think of the piece. (E.g. you played the 2nd and 3rd beats on the left hand - a la bar 17 - with fair amount of staccato.) To me, the piece is more melancholy and soulful - may be due to the minor key. But now that you have practiced it technically, it's certainly easier to slow it down and add to the character. The playing is very clean.

I relate to letting a piece go before it's well polished. So much music to play out there and I am not discplined enough to stay with one for a long time.


[Linked Image]
Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977440
09/27/07 08:22 PM
09/27/07 08:22 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,958
Maine
Peyton Offline
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Peyton  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Maine
I agree with you...and this will give me the incentive I need to keep working!! Thanks.


"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com

Re: NEW - Study Group for Chopin's Waltz, Op 34 #2 #977441
09/30/07 11:42 AM
09/30/07 11:42 AM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
loveschopintoomuch Offline OP
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loveschopintoomuch  Offline OP
4000 Post Club Member

Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 4,701
Illinois
Rosanna has raised the time-honored question. confused

How can we instill in ourselves the importance to really finish/polish a piece before starting another? This drives me crazy, for I also lack the self-discipline that this requires. I immediately want to start on another piece when I know in my heart of hearts that I have so many that are orphans. frown

Then I get an attack of guilt and spend about three weeks trying to give them that glow, but then my new pieces suffer, and I have to almost start from the beginning with them. eek

It's like a nightmare, and I often feel as if I am drowning and even worse...that I REALLY don't know how to play that well. bah

Can anyone come up with a practice schedule that a lazy person (like me) can stick to? One that will allow time to polish a few pieces but still give us time to attend to our newer ones. I usually practice about 3 hours a day, but since I learn so slowly (or my music is a bit over my head) I have to spend about 45 minutes on each new piece. Whatever time I have left, and it isn't much, I pull out my older ones. But by that time, my mind is already tired and I really can't concentrate that well. :rolleyes:

What to do? What to do? help

Kathleen


After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891
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