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How do you teachers deal with the loss of GREAT, AWESOME, FANTASTIC, STUPENDOUS piano students when they:

1) move a different city far far away,

2) move on to a different piano teacher, or

3) quit piano altogether?

Wow you really feel this way?

I'm a student at the present moment, changed teachers and the last teacher I had ... when I mentioned changing teachers was quite defensive, telling me that I was one of his keener students that practiced and worked really hard. When I made a move he was surprised ...

I hoped that he would be more supportive than defensive. There are teachers out there that encourage change ... mine (the current) is one of them he said "I wont get offended if you see me for six weeks and decide that its not working for you ..."

I never thought that it would really feel like a great loss, maybe finacially (there goes a stable student) but I never thought that teachers would really feel sad about losing their students.

Do you still keep in contact with the students you have lost? How would you feel if in a year or two they gave a call back to tell you how they are going musically ...?

Rebekah,
Yes, that is how we feel! He was probably just hurt and/or surprised, and that's why he was defensive. Perhaps he didn't feel as though you weren't progressing with him, and so wondered why you were changing.

Many teachers invest a lot more than one lesson time per week into their students. I feel that the students that I have for a period of time become friends (in a teacher/student sort of way), and I care very much for them. Sometimes we can sense when it's time for a change, but many times students will quit out of the blue for many reasons.

It's not easy to deal with, but generally I try to be understanding of their situation (I do try to find out a reason why). I let them know that I do understand, and that there are no hard feelings. They are always welcome to come back should things change. Most often they don't return, however. I generally don't keep in contact with students unless they are still in the area, then I will usually see them around town. The ones who move, I try to help them find a teacher in their new location by giving them pointers on what to look for and a list of teachers to start from.

And for those who quit piano (or voice), I really try to get to the bottom of why they are quitting. If they have been making great progress and seem to enjoy lessons, then usually it's other things that are vying for their time. This is always tough. I let them know just how good they are and I encourage them to keep playing or singing even if they're not taking lessons. What more can you do?

AZN,

Don't think "Lost", think "Elsewhere". I had a student who studied theory and counterpoint with me and then became a Presidential Scholar at Thornton (USC) before dropping out to pursue a career in acting. Now, I have no doubt that someday he'll return to his music in some way or another. He loved his instrument, he loved learning, he loved performing. Lost? No, for now he's just "elsewhere". Sometimes you just can't teach music; other times, there's no stopping it.

Maybe we should as teachers try to convince ourselves that everyone is just passing through? That is the reality of it.

Would our students believe that we are genuinely interested in their future and in them as people? Would they be so quick to take off for other places and not look back?

My appreciation to the people who do part from our studios gracefully and with acknowledgment of what has been accomplished together.

in many ways the parting can be celebrated - and that feels best all around when it is genuine and sincere.

Better not to slam any doors on your way out!

Roy Rogers and Dale Evans (theme song) "Happy Trails to you, until we meet again" is being sung to me by my brain as I finish up this post.

Audiation is such a habit with me. It comes from inner resources and is a message from many, many years ago, from subconscious me, to the conscious level. (Amusing to me.)


Betty

I almost CRY when this happens! It is SO frustating when I've built up a really close relationship with a student, and that student is forced to move. I live in South Florida, and it's a rather unstable area as far as putting down roots is concerned.
That almost never happens to me until after high school, which almost has to happen if a student is going away to school. My best adult student, who became a close friend, studied with me for about 20 years. Her friends kept saying, "You still need piano lessons?"
My average or below average students drop out a lot every year. I keep trying to "beat the odds" by finding ways to help them progress faster, but I find that if I'm working with slower children, for instance, parents tend to assume I am only an "average teacher" even if their kids are doing average or above average work with very little practice.

But it's when the really good ones move away that it's hard for me not to get really down.

Betty, I like the way you say, "until we meet again". I always try to smile (sometimes this is easier than others!) and say something encouraging when a student quits, knowing there's a very good chance I'll see him/her again (at church, at the music store or library), and I want to keep the possibility of a future relationship open. Right now I have four students who are relatives of students who had quit years ago. And I played for the wedding of a former student this past summer (the wedding program listed me as "piano teacher of bride").

Sometimes the students themselves return to lessons after a break of several months or even years--I always welcome them back (if I have room for them in my schedule). I think life's too short to burn bridges!

This is really fascinating to hear. You see with my teacher I left him because I felt he wasn't teaching in accord to my wishes and desires. He kept very strict to teaching from an exam board and that was it. As a vocal student (I see a different teacher for voice) I performed a lot more and learned many different skills (ensemble work, stage persona, different genres, etc) ... as a pianist I felt all I was learning was to satisfy some exam board and hence I felt as though there was a lot to music than and exam board.

I mentioned this to my piano teacher twice, one lesson just mainly talking and doing less playing. He didn't understand me. So I thought enough was enough ... I mentioned change and he grew very defensive. When I made the move the turned out quite surprised.

I didn't understand, I lost the love I once had ... I didn't practice as I did normally for weeks ... I thought it would be obvious.

Anyways ... I wonder if its a good idea to give him a call after I finish my major music exams to thank him ...

Rebekah.L,



Quote: "Anyways ... I wonder if its a good idea to give him a call after I finish my major music exams to thank him ..."

That's a nice thought!

Betty

My last piano teacher was a French war bride and the mother of seven. She was the only decent piano teacher I ever had and I had her for far too short a time almost forty years ago. I'd begun learn to play at five, from "church ladies" and learned to play from hymnals. I had no theory, no classical, no scales. And I wanted to play Chopin. I wasn't God's gift to piano teachers by any means. I was a moody restless kid afflicted with "senioritis" and in the throes of a first love affair. She nursed me through it all, the first Chopin and the first love affair, and I all I did was disappear to off to college. I got to see her once more about twenty years later. The meeting meant a lot to both of us. I wish she were still around. Now she could teach me so much.

Rebekah, just for sake of discussion, how many others of your teachers bowed to your desires on how to teach? Is it that you view music teachers as somehow different, and that rather than teaching the subject in a logical, straight forward fashion, building concept on concept, technique on technique, we should bend to the individual student's "wishes and desires?" Do you think this would be ethical conduct? I ask because generally it is the parent who has hired us, and who pays us, and to whom we owe accountability. How do you view the role of the student in the learning process? I'm not asking these questions to be cantankerous, but rather to gain further understanding of contemporary student attitudes.

I remember when I moved on from my first good piano teacher. She was excellent, but I was in high school and starting to go beyond what she could teach me. I think she was truly hurt when I left, and she didn't take it very well. I think I was one of her best students and I can imagine it was difficult to see me leave.

It's hard not to get emotionally involved in your students, isn't it?

Yes, it is. I still do, but I've learned to keep a slight separation because there will eventually be a time when they leave. It protects me, and it also makes that time much easier on the student. I can handle it better when a student says they want to quit by thanking them for the time they did spend with me and encouraging them to continue in playing music. It's never easy, but this helps me.

It's fine by me if they are moving on to bigger and better things. Every Summer I have good students who are going off to study music at university. Of course I am sorry that I won't be teaching them any more but I am glad to have took them as far as I have. They are ready for the next step which is great.

I did have a fantastic student who quit last week. She is 17 and a very advanced pianist. Unfortunately she has decided not to take music as a career option because her interests lie in science instead. Her grades in science have slipped because of the many hours she spends on her music. Something has to give and we have decided that it is more important for her to focus on her academic studies for this year. I am saddened by this because I think she might be making the wrong choice. However, there is only so much you can do and she will not be talked out of it. Thankfully this situation is quite rare.

Hmmmmm.

I just realized that perhaps many students think of piano lessons as simply renting your time for which they have to be present in order for you to bill them for it. You are a once a week happening, if they choose to see you.

Only when they are present with the piano teacher does the teacher's place exist in their life.

Any reason is justification for ditching the piano teacher, no conscienceness of the relationship, nor of the accomplishments of the partnership together. No remorse.

The thought that one teacher is as good as another.

The piano teacher has usually made a total commitment to working with this student and hopes to deliver music education way beyond the student's expectations.

In most cases, I could say, the student has no idea of the vast, missed opportunities for taking this musical relationship, and dropping it on it's head, an act of destruction.

When leaving, leave the door slightly ajar if you cannot leave it totally open. Treat others as you would like to be treated: "a golden rule" that fits all occasions, no?

Yes, indeed, I'm biased. Music has been everything to me in my life. Should it not be shared with others who can and do feel the same?

Betty

Betty,

I truly think that being "ditched" for any other piano teacher is most likely to happen to us if we are the only teachers students have ever had.

I don't know about your experience, but I hear horror stories from most of the students who come to me from other teachers. Not always, but most of the time.

Or people are somewhat pleased by what they have experienced before coming to me but express a great suprise at how differently I teach and how much faster they are progressing.

The most frequent exceptions to what I said above are students who move here from other parts of the county, because some have *had* to leave fine teachers simply because of relocating.

Regardless, there is no question in my mind that many if not most people think that one teacher is pretty much the same as any other. Here are just a few things that continue to shock me when I get students from other teachers:

1) After years of lessons, little or no ability to read bass clef, and still playing in 5 finger positions.

2) Sustain pedal is used backwards, with the pedal not raising as the new sound is struck/played, resulting in eather an endless series of burps or a complete blur (because once down, the pedal is kept down).

3) A huge amount of emphasis has been placed on block dynamics and graduated dynamice, but not one word has ever been said about how to play one hand louder than the other, or how to bring out a melody.

There's a lot more. Obviously if students who come to me with such problems make no progress under me, it's logical to assume that the former teacher(s) may have been OK or good, perhaps excellent, but were not listened to. But when I get cooperation and see these problems straightened out rather quickly, I have to assume that the other teacher(s) were not teaching well.

Now, the biggest problem is that *if* we are the first teachers, if we are working with people who have no more than average ability and at best put in a very limited amount of practice time, if such students progress reasonably well, but only reasonably well, people tend to assume that WE are, at best, average teachers. It is not unless they move to other teachers who do not have the same passion and put in the same amount of time as we do that they discover, usually too late, that they HAD good teachers and gave them up as if they were nothing special.

I think this is just the way the world works. Nothing to be done about it!

So, Gary D, very interesting.

You are saying beginners cut their teeth on us in learning about themselves and the instrument they are exploring?

Are you saying that helping them through the "underpinnings" of music study is also our job?

I understand your comments here - I'm just wondering how to improve the outcome without all the effort on my part - by getting message through effortlessly. (Is that impossible?)

I have interviewed students who have had several teachers before and when listing their previous experience, they don't remember the teachers name (neither do the parents), they don't remember how long they studied. (Big clues, which I interpret as a "dark cloud - storm coming" kind of warning. Also, they don't play very well, and "everything" needs improvement.

I used to thrive on this kind of challenge. And, I do have a substantial amount of patience. But, I sure would like more joy in my teaching life and that happens when the student is pleased to be here, ready to learn, and is willing to do the work.

I'm still a believe that music is important for everyone to participate in.

There is wisdom in what you've said because I've always been treated well by the students who have gotten past their second year. And, probably for you too, the exceptional one's remain in your heart and you in theirs far into the future.

Being an idealist by nature, I would love to see people knowing the basics in respect and effort in entering study in art forms. A genteel "Miss Manners" could teach proper etiquette for piano students and families instead of our studio policies trying desperately to set structure and preventing chaos, confusion, and disaster.

I'm dreaming! Hopeless you say - this is the way the world works. Nothing to be done about it.

I'm beginning to believe it!

Betty

Oh, Betty - I saw this message when I was at work today and couldn't reply - but I want to assure you, NOT all students think that way!

In fact, this thread has been fascinating to me, from an adult-student perspective, because one of the things I struggled with (initially) is feeling like my teacher is SO important to me, but I'm just "one of 60-70" students. I only have ONE piano teacher, but he has tons of students - so why would he think about me beyond the hour we're working together? And I've worried (in the past) that I'm just "part of his job".

I feel really really lucky that I found the teacher I did, and feel like he is a great influence, inspiration, and just very positive person in my life.

To me, it feels like - in a weird way - piano lessons are helping me become the person I was meant to be, or the person I was - but lost in all this "grow up and get a job" business. It's awesome. And to be clear, it's definitely NOT in a therapy-like way (we sometimes talk a little at the end of the lesson, but we're very focused on the music!)

I think there's alot of reasons, both about how music lessons work, how individual teaching works, and about his personality (and mine) but it's been an awesome experience so far, and I'm just so incredibly grateful for what I'm getting from it.

It might sound crazy, but I think it's going to be a big help in making the life changes I want and need to make, and it's already been a big help in getting me less depressed (though I still struggle) than I was previously. I've had people that I work with tell me I seem like a different person.

Anyway, I didn't want to sound crazy. Just wanted to offer you up a different perspective on how some students feel!!!

Saerra,

I'm so glad you can speak well of your teacher and of your musical experiences together.

The top-notch way that you feel that you gained form music study in your life, at this time, is what I would like to see as "normal".

You are not crazy, just enthusiastic and grateful - and I love your perspective and hope that it continues for you as enlightening and productive.

Thank you so much!

Betty

Betty,

I had never thought to put it that way, but I think there is much truth in that, for *some* beginners. In addition, what we really have to cope with, when working with children, is the attitudes of the parents, because many times the children like us and would prefer to stay with us, but decisions are made for them. Nothing gets me down as much as gifted children who obviously like me and work well with me but whose parents are clueless.
I'm not sure what "underpinnings" means, but it is left to us to try to educate parents and adult beginners about what we think is important and the fact that you just can't find that from any teacher. Some people will get it, some won't.
Yes. Two weeks ago I started a little girl. The mother asked me when I am going to start "doing theory and writing" the way "Dr. P did it", the last teacher. The little girl did not know how to read a single note. "Dr. P" went through the Alfred Prep books, and there are some good ideas in that series, but there are really big dangers too. They are very rigid about staying in five finger positions a long time, and when only the positions are taught and there is a lot of drill combined with a lot of imitation, you see kids picking up the patterns but not reading notes at all. That's not Alfred's fault, but it's something to watch for when people use that series.

They were with "Dr. P" for over a year. And then quit. But didn't know how long ago they quit. When I asked *why* they quit, I got weird answers. I just smiled, as well as I could, while doing a fair bit of cussing in my head!
Yes. And I would say that there is something very crucial in making it through and past that second year. Those who get that far have a very good chance of continuing for a lifetime, while those who quit before one year has gone by are likely to move from teacher to teacher, always with excuses and always expecting miracles with no work and no commitment, or are likely to quit altogether. For the latter, there is always a good chance that they will start again later and will succeed, but with less than a year's lessons, they will be very little more advanced when they start again than if they never took lessons at all. In my opinion, one year of very little work and little interest is not enough to time to build anything important that can be used to good advantage later on.