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I'm a little mortified that someone would say the MTNA certification is like a GED. I don't see any relation.

I know nothing about the particular certificate in question, but I think John's point was that as a GED (thanks for the explanation, folks!) has a sort of equivalance to something else (a high school certificate, I gather), so the MTNA certification is meant to be roughly equivalent to one or more of the university-based courses.

We have some similar accreditation systems here - one, for example, requires tertiary qualifications, or a specialist teaching qualification from one of the music exam bodies, or something they call "proven record of teaching" which usually boils down to exam results over a long period of time.

Let's all hit the www.mtna.com site to check out the requirements for certification either through 1) college diplomas or 2) self directed study in the private domain.

It's a really big project in many areas of study and performance - it is not something you ace unless you are incredibly well prepared.

I have huge respect for anyone holding NCTM's through MTNA. (Nationally Certified Teacher of Music).

It's signifies true diligence to music study and teaching.

I'm amazed more MTNA teachers don't know enough about the certification program and what it means.

Stanny, I'm with you. Mortified! That must have a root in morde/death, because I'm not sure I have the correct definition in mind, but I can hear my mother saying she was "mortified" and it meant greatly embarrassed, beyond greatly embarrassed. More than a "run in your stocking", or "your slip showing", "mortified" was the worst possible situation, like "being caught with your pants down".

There's no reason to be mortified at all.

You can either obtain a degree in music, then apply for the NCTM, or use plan B, which is what Betty is encouraging. It is precisely analogous to the GED, except that it's at the collegiate level, not secondary school level.

By the way, Betty, you can be MORTIFIED about this:

The proper site is MTNA.ORG not MTNA.COM

PS When I first started even thinking about NCTM 20 years ago, the requirements were FAR LESS RIGOROUS. Teachers recently certified are certainly demonstrating much higher levels of competency than when the certification first began.

To address the original post, I think people view the merits of teachers on:

a) Gut Feeling
b) Reputation

You can get all the degrees and certifications you want, but it's been my experience that the general public weighs Gut Feeling and Reputation above all else.

I understand what MTNA is trying to do (raise the level of teaching and professionalism), but until the general public embraces it on the level of something like ASE, I don't see the point for me personally.

(For those who are seeking recognition for their own personal enrichment, I do see some value. I agree with the GED parallel. It's a certificate that's roughly equivalent to an undergraduate emphasis in piano pedagogy.)

Thank you, John!

"By the way, Betty, you can be MORTIFIED about this: The proper site is MTNA.ORG not MTNA.COM"

Ijust really disagree with the GED guys. Let's read AMT columns about certification and read the website to find out what it is about.

I appreciate the folks who feel that a teacher can be a good teacher without the academic diplomas, some of us missed those opportunities.

To me that was a really big challenge to acquire the experience and informational paths to become good enough to teach, and then to earn a reputation that speaks well enough of my teaching efforts. Without mentors and MTNA programs at the chapter level I would be a lesser teacher.

It takes exposure to other teachers and exchanging ideas and giving encouragement to our peers that we face and pace our teaching challenges.

I'm a believer of what we give away comes back to us. I've been a receiver and a giver for a long time and it just makes the piano teaching world better to have great and dependable resources among our fellow musician - teachers.

I've read all the information and have been familiar with MTNA Certification for several years. I also helped write the curriculum for a certificate program at the university where I taught.

I believe very strongly that an academic diploma is not necessary to be a good teacher. I also believe very strongly in the value of MTNA and it's various programs.

But I also think it's very important that it's the education and support that makes you a better teacher, not the certificate. The certificate itself, like any other diploma, is worth very little. I believe that about my own diplomas, all of which have resided in a box in the corner of my closet since the day I received them.

And don't worry, it's not just MTNA certification. I'm wary of public school teaching certificates, Suzuki, Orff-Schulwerk, etc... I'm an equal-opportunity Credential Skeptic.

I really enjoy your comment: "I'm an equal-opportunity Credential Skeptic."

Certainly your credentials/diplomas deserve a hanging file in the filing cabinet, if not the elevation to a frame!

No? Oh!

Absolutely! I meant to mention the idea of simply following another path. Thanks for adding that.

I like this:

I'm another skeptic. I've met morons with certificates and degrees, very fine people without them.

(And fine teachers with degrees, certificates or both…)

Wow, this topic has generated a lot of discussion. Thanks for the
insights.

It seems that the general public has never heard of MTNA, although
they've certainly heard of a college degree. I've even met many music
teachers who have never heard of MTNA. Maybe it's more active in some
regions than in others.

Thus, my concern is that when someone is shopping around for a piano
teacher, they will automatically skip over someone who doesn't have
the credentials they recognize. Even worse, they may view that person
as a fraud.

I'm also concerned that musicians with a college degree look down on
those without one, no matter what certifications they may have. But
that's a general issue, and probably not one to worry about.
Although, it may make it difficult to work in certain places.

I do firmly believe that one can learn anything one chooses without
taking college classes. The information is freely available. And
certainly, there are many idiots with degrees.

I did take a look at the online courses mentioned before. I find it
hard to justify spending that kind of money on theory and history,
which I'm already well-acquainted with.

So confusing.

And that's the biggest problem. Certification becomes useful when it's necessary for a job (as in public school teaching or emergency medical technicians), or when the public knows to look for it (ASE Certified Mechanics, Board Certification for Physicians, Board Certification for certain legal professionals, etc...)

Oddly enough, MTNA seems to spend more time educating teachers about NCTM Certification than it does educating the general public. I personally hope that will change.

Are you saying that someone with certification has demonstrated proficiency above and beyond that of someone with just a degree?

But, you have degrees, so it's probably not necessary for you.

Very true! If I was not degreed, I'd almost definitely seek certification.

In my experience, parents ask for these two things when looking for a piano teacher:

1) How much do you charge?

2) Where do you live?

Very, very rarely do I hear other questions. Maybe except for "Do you teach CM?" (CM is the state exam system in California)

Regarding MTNA Certification, it is pretty much useless in California. The MTNA chapters in California are not very active compared to MTAC, which has basically cornered the market in California.

i know this is an old post, but can anyone clarify the difference between mtna certification and active membership?
also, their active membership requires membership in an affiliated association. what are you members of/what would you recommend. I'm in California, if that helps with suggestions.

thanks!

Mrs. Camels- you don't have to be a member of MTNA to apply for certification. MTNA is the national association. Each state has its own state affiliation. For California, it's CAPMT (California Assoc. of Pro. Music Teachers). I don't have a chapter within 60 miles, so I haven't been able to attend those meetings. Being an active member of MTNA just means that you've paid your dues. MTAC is completely separate from MTNA. As I understand it, California is the only state that has 2 different professional music organizations. Yes, MTAC does have the "market" on the professional music teacher, but I think there's room for both organizations. I am a branch president of MTAC and just took the MTNA cert exam recently. I have a college degree in music but felt that the cert exam was a personal growth opportunity too good to pass up. As I am awaiting the test results, I feel that pass or fail, it was a very worthwhile process.

I just want to say I finished all the requirements for certification and now I'm just waiting on the results !

I have a Bachelor's and Masters in Piano, but I didn't learn a whole lot through all of that about TEACHING piano. The certification process has helped alot!

Even though it's true that the NCTM after your name might not mean much to students or parents of students, simply going through the process, thinking about the different philosophies of teaching, how to teach certain students, deal with specific issues, etc. is VERY beneficial =)