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#925112 - 07/13/05 08:16 AM Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 117
newstead Offline
Full Member
newstead  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 117
Dear Teachers,

I am an adult student working on Mozart Sonatas. I have dificulty with popular music because of the different rhythms.

Do you think this would be a good way to learn them:

Ignore the notes. Dispense with the piano. Concentrate on just the rhythm by tapping out the beat with the foot; then tapping out the rhythm with hands separate; then tapping out the rhythm with hands together.

Have you ever done this? Do you know any instructor that does this? Is this the way to learn rhythm?

Thanks.
Newstead

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#925113 - 07/13/05 09:58 AM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 115
derekrs Offline
Full Member
derekrs  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 115
Vancouver, Canada
I'm not a teacher, but here's what my teacher does: If i have a problem with a rhythm my teacher will count out loud while i attempt to play at a very slow tempo. Then we gradually increase the thempo. At home i also do that, though i use a metronome to aid in my counting. This way i can learn the rhythm and the notes at the same time.


"There are two golden rules for an orchestra: start together and finish together. The public doesn't give a damn what goes on in between." -- Thomas Beecham

My blog: pianotrek.blogspot.com
#925114 - 07/13/05 01:36 PM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 335
Rob Mullins Offline
Full Member
Rob Mullins  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Feb 2004
Posts: 335
LA CA
Hi,
A good drum class or two really helps with these kinds of issues. I have recommended to several students in these forums that they take drum lessons.
I started out as a drummer first, and learned the piano after I had been drumming for a few years. I found that the experience I had doing drum exercises and rhythmic sight reading helped me more than anything with figuring out the timing when playing the piano.
Timing amongst pianists is notoriously bad, so much so that it is a standard joke amongst jazz musicians because most pianists have such horrid understanding of rhythm.
If I were your instructor, we would have this cleared up in a month or two. I do hope you are working with a teacher on your music, it makes a tremendous difference in how well you will do and how fast you can move along correctly. I have a specific series of exercises that I mold to each student's tendencies, not every person has the same problem with timing, some are ok until they have to do triplets against 4/4, others are fine until they start pedaling and then they crash and burn.
My specific advice to you is 1. get a piano teacher that can play the pieces you like, 2. get a drum teacher that can show you rhythmic sight reading and hand/foot independence skills (drum set) and give yourself a few months. You will be amazed at how your problems will be solved.


Rob Mullins
www.planetmullins.com
Recording Artist and Jazz Piano Instructor
#925115 - 07/13/05 10:14 PM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 117
newstead Offline
Full Member
newstead  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 117
Dear Rob,

You say: "2. get a drum teacher that can show you rhythmic sight reading and hand/foot independence skills (drum set) and give yourself a few months. You will be amazed at how your problems will be solved."

Where do I find such a teacher?

I think what you are suggesting is something like what I am thinking about doing.

I do understand (At least I think I do) time signatures. Isn't that what drummers are looking at too?

Thanks for your suggestions.

I know that I will be a better sight reader if I can master the rhythm aspect better.

The notes are not holding me back...it's the timeing of the notes that confounds me much of the time.

Best to you.
Newstead

#925116 - 07/14/05 12:27 AM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Kreisler Offline
Kreisler  Offline


Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 13,837
Iowa City, IA
Yes!

Quote
Originally posted by newstead:
Dear Teachers,

I am an adult student working on Mozart Sonatas. I have dificulty with popular music because of the different rhythms.

Do you think this would be a good way to learn them:

Ignore the notes. Dispense with the piano. Concentrate on just the rhythm by tapping out the beat with the foot; then tapping out the rhythm with hands separate; then tapping out the rhythm with hands together.

Have you ever done this? Do you know any instructor that does this? Is this the way to learn rhythm?

Thanks.
Newstead


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed
#925117 - 07/20/05 01:27 PM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,925
John Citron Offline
3000 Post Club Member
John Citron  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,925
Haverhill, Massachusetts
I use derekrs' method plus one of my teachers had me walk and clap the rhythm to the walking. The feet act like a metronome, and your hands act as the individual notes you're trying to play against the beats.

Another thing that helps is subdividing the measures. Take each quarter note, for example, and count two beats to it. This way, for example a 4/4 piece will actually have eight beats to each measure. This by the way really helps with those dotted-eigth+sixteenth groups.


Nothing.
#925118 - 07/20/05 11:55 PM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 310
IgnorantHusband Offline
Full Member
IgnorantHusband  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 310
Pacific Northwest
I got no rhythm.. try as I might. My teacher has me stomping/marching and clapping to the two different beats. My kids have a good laugh... I work hard at it but still got no rhythm mad

#925119 - 07/21/05 10:32 AM Re: Is this a good way to learn rhythm?  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,925
John Citron Offline
3000 Post Club Member
John Citron  Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 3,925
Haverhill, Massachusetts
Quote
Originally posted by IgnorantHusband:
I got no rhythm.. try as I might. My teacher has me stomping/marching and clapping to the two different beats. My kids have a good laugh... I work hard at it but still got no rhythm mad
It takes time... LOL

Say your beats out loud if you're not doing that already as that will help too. Part of the rhythm thing is to listen to it. You can hear the pulse and then you'll begin to sense and feel it. Look for the little accents on the first and third beats for example, The can serve as landing and starting points. This is particularly helpful when you have lots of 16th notes and triplets.

Hope this helps,

John


Nothing.

Moderated by  Ken Knapp 

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