Piano World Home Page Forums Restricted and Archives The Coffee Room Is it just me or has Kwanzaa become too commercialized?

The dominant culture doesn't celebrate itself, JB. The melting pot itself just IS! It's the rutabagas, and carrots and parsley and meatballs which seem to need to celebrate their uniqueness before being totally blended in the stew.

(Feel free to laugh at my Campbell's soup metaphor! )

Let's look at it another way.

WhiteAngloSaxonAmerica no longer has to bear the ignominy alone, of promoting tits and ass ogling competitions under the pretext of recognizing inner feminine beauty!

Ariel

Why not?

You mean that the "what would I do to make this a better world" essay type competition was all BS? I guess the irony of it went by me while I was waiting for the swimsuit competition.

As an aside, my hero is Dr. Ben Carson, a world-renowned African-American neurosurgeon at Johns Hopkins. Why is he my hero? Because he had an absolutely **itty childhood, growing up in the crime ridden projects of Baltimore but seemed to rise above it all on pure guts and determination. If you get a chance read his book.

Jack Frost,

Apologies for attributing your post to Larry. I think I may have caught a glimpse of your hat on the avatar and thought it was Larry. Guess my first instinct ( )at agreeing with a conservative was right?

Jim Crow, segregation, past discrimination were all about exclusion. Affirmative action, black themed events, programs, holidays are all about inclusion. There is a huge difference and I think that Ariel has said it very well.

My head reels from the profundity!

kathy--they're saying they're, oh so "Special!"

Also, I think that Kwansaa is a tad disingenuous. If you really want to know what blacks think about themselves in general and black women in particular take the "A" train to Harlem. Let yourself be serenaded by 20,000 dBs of black culture coming from a boom box that will describe in graphic detail the hopes dreams and ideals of current black society.

Afirmative action is inclusionary. :rolleyes:

Tell that to the Asian kid who is not admitted to school because they've already got their "quota" of Asians. Tell that to the young white male, who is denied promotion, regardless of his work record, because more diversity is needed in the workplace. Tell that to the nurse who is not hired for the job, because a less qualified male nurse applied for the same job, and the hospital has decided to become more gender concious.

Some of the greatest harm is done in the name of the greatest good. Y'all may not realize it, but you are laying the foundation for the next Civil War, or perhaps the second American revolution, with policies that run counter to the founding ideas of competition, and merit.

Jolly-- you may be right, but the trigger for the hypothetical war will be economic. How do you align your view of competition and fairness with the latest tax cut, where the richest tiny % received the most money?

Nina

The richest tiny % pay most of the taxes. This so-called "tax cut for the rich" actually took enough people off the tax rolls to make it so that the majority of Americans now pay no net income tax. How much more of a tax cut can we give them?

a myth perpetuated by liberal propoganda.. maybe.

So we celebrate and accept the very worst aspects of Black cultural expression and denigrate those who try to boost the positive aspects through the Kwanzaa celebration???

Jolly-- you may be right, but the trigger for the hypothetical war will be economic. How do you align your view of competition and fairness with the latest tax cut, where the richest tiny % received the most money?

Well, you have to ask yourself - who paid the taxes in the first place? How do you give a tax cut to someone who didn't pay any taxes to begin with?

Of course the richest tiny% got the most money back. They paid the most in. John Doe pays in 30K in taxes, gets back 600$... Jim Doe pays in nothing, gets back 50$.... who profited the most?

This "tax cuts for the rich" is a line of crap from the Democrats that I cannot for the life of me understand why people can't see through. The money the government takes from you in taxes is YOUR MONEY, not the government's. If they give some of it back, it should go back to the one who paid it in in the first place. Otherwise, you have a situation of "from each according to his ability, to each according to his need". And I don't know about you, but I will fight that to the death.

Now that's a heckuva societal judgement!

The very worst? Excuse me, but I beg to differ...

Not I.

So we celebrate and accept the very worst aspects of Black cultural expression and denigrate those who try to boost the positive aspects through the Kwanzaa celebration???


Here is the true story of the origin of Kwanzaa, and the man who started it. I await your comments.


Just make sure you\'ve read it and allowed it to sink in before you respond.

Larry, thanks for the fascinating article. I was not aware of the origins of Kwanzaa, other than to know it was of recent vintage. It would appear to me that the celebration has readily transcended its shady origins (or at least its shady founder) and become something that is meaningful and of value to a large number of people.

It would be interesting to know which other holidays have origins that are not consistent with their present day expression. I was told that you ran a long post about the origins of Thanksgiving. Since that predates my joining this forum, I missed it and could not find it looking back. I would love to read it if you can point me in the right direction.

By the way, I am no fan of Al either.

Who couldn't see that coming. Much like L. Ron Hubbard making up the religion Scientology and now people finding something of value in that sham as well, huh Mr. Frost?

All holidays are made up! They weren't here for us to discover.

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I stronly urge anyone who reads the article to also click the button (at the bottom of the article) "View Comments". Lot's of interesting support and rebuttals there. Including Bush's Official Kwanzaa message (posted by someone else):

PRESIDENT BUSH'S OFFICIAL KWANZAA MESSAGE

I send greetings to those celebrating Kwanzaa.

Kwanzaa celebrates the traditional African values of unity, self-determination, collective work and responsibility, cooperative economics, purpose, creativity, and faith. From December 26th to January 1st, people of African descent gather to renew their commitment to these seven principles, known as Nguzo Saba, and give thanks for the blessings of family, community, and culture. Kwanzaa is also a time for Africans and African-Americans to honor their common heritage by participating in events based on early harvest gatherings called matunda ya kwanza, or first fruits.

As individuals and families join together during Kwanzaa, their joy enriches communities in the
United States and across the globe. By uniting people of diverse backgrounds and beliefs, this holiday promotes mutual understanding and respect. These universal principles inspire us as we work together for a future of freedom, hope, and opportunity for all.

Laura joins me in sending our best wishes for a memorable Kwanzaa, and for peace, happiness, and success in the coming year.

GEORGE W. BUSH

And you think this illustrates presidential support for the holiday?

Bwhahahahahahahahahahahaha!

Son, Bush is a politician. I bet you he probably will shake your hand, or kiss a baby at a campaign stop.

You don't alienate potential voters, unless you have to.