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#703726 - 05/19/08 05:04 AM Accordion as organ  
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 518
ROMagister Offline
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ROMagister  Offline
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 518
Bucuresti, Romania
I have some German folk pieces notated for accordion, they have a sign like a large circle cut in 3 horizontal bands, 2 dots in the center one and 1 in the upper. Sometimes they change to a lower dot etc.
Does this mean like a registration indication of 8' Principal, 8' Celeste, 4' Octave ?

Also: look at this Russian young virtuoso Vitaly Dmitriev on 'Bayan' (large button-only accordion):
Toccata BWV565 http://youtube.com/watch?v=WjJQwTKYfd4
Fugue BWV565 http://youtube.com/watch?v=UBmajjf5WKE

So, is the artistic difference between good accordion playing and a small organ using reed stops not so much ?
What other organ-like features do some best accordions have ? I see some sort of button couplers in the videos above.

#703727 - 05/21/08 11:51 AM Re: Accordion as organ  
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 246
Tom Tuner Offline
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Tom Tuner  Offline
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Posts: 246
Bainbridge, OH
The symbols are indeed for registration, they indicate which "switches" are to be on. These are actually controllers for sets of reed which may be octave, sub-octave, celeste, etc. I don't remember the specific resistration each symbol calls for. There aren't any couplers, just octave sets of reeds. Couplers would be mechanically difficult to employ and not much use on such a short keyboard.

#703728 - 05/23/08 01:19 PM Re: Accordion as organ  
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Tom Tuner Offline
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Tom Tuner  Offline
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Bainbridge, OH
As best I remember the upper sector of the circle represents the super-octave (4'), the middle is unison (8') and the bottom is the sub-octave (16'). Note that celeste ranks can be tuned either sharp or flat and sets of each may be found in the same instrument. The dot being to the left or right indicates this.
Accordeons really are free-reed organs. Like harmoniums the reed are winded from beneath and have leather flap valves on top of the reeds to allow the wind to pass only one way.

#1573723 - 12/10/10 02:31 AM Re: Accordion as organ [Re: ROMagister]  
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ROMagister Offline
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ROMagister  Offline
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Bucuresti, Romania
This young girl plays accordion with masterful control:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4OsWc_1bko

She changes registrations several time and in some, there must be some sort of physical coupler between buttons - some 'move on their own' when other buttons are pressed.

I also couldn't figure out whether the white/black pattern of buttons means naturals/accidentals like on a normal piano, or is a reminder of something else.

#1573793 - 12/10/10 07:14 AM Re: Accordion as organ [Re: Tom Tuner]  
Joined: Jan 2002
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mrenaud Offline
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mrenaud  Offline
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Posts: 1,337
Switzerland
Originally Posted by Tom Tuner
As best I remember the upper sector of the circle represents the super-octave (4'), the middle is unison (8') and the bottom is the sub-octave (16'). Note that celeste ranks can be tuned either sharp or flat and sets of each may be found in the same instrument. The dot being to the left or right indicates this.


According to Theodoro Anzellotti (a well-known classical accordionist who once gave an introduction at the instrumentation class of the conservatory of Basel where I studied composition), there's a difference between folk accordions and classical accordions in that the former have celeste ranks while the latter don't. Classical accordions have two 8' ranks, one normal and one within the cassotto (a device which damps some overtones and makes the sound a bit darker). The 16' rank is also usually placed inside the cassotto while the 4' isn't. Folk accordions usually (AFAIK) have no cassotto at all. The circles and dots appear in both classical and folk music and have the same meaning (except for the obvious differences in the 8' area), but they're often not given at all and the exact registration left to the peformer's discretion.

So, according to Anzellotti, the standard classical accordion has a treble side consisting of 16' and 8' ranks inside and 8' and 4' ranks outside the cassotto, and a bass side with 8' and 4' ranks (no cassotto) which can be switched between the traditional chord (Stradella) and single-note (free) bass modes.

Folk accordions OTOH have no cassotto, but have celeste ranks instead (the traditional French musette sounds relies heavily on those) and usually only a chord-bass.

So basically, you need to know what kind of accordion you're faced with.


I have an ice cream. I cannot mail it, for it will melt.
#1573795 - 12/10/10 07:16 AM Re: Accordion as organ [Re: ROMagister]  
Joined: Jan 2002
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mrenaud Offline
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mrenaud  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,337
Switzerland
Originally Posted by ROMagister
This young girl plays accordion with masterful control:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4OsWc_1bko

She changes registrations several time and in some, there must be some sort of physical coupler between buttons - some 'move on their own' when other buttons are pressed.


Yes, actually, there are doubled buttons for some notes to facilitate certain fingerings which would otherwise be awkward. These buttons are also physically connected to the same valve and move together when one is pressed.


I have an ice cream. I cannot mail it, for it will melt.
#1597009 - 01/13/11 10:33 PM Re: Accordion as organ [Re: mrenaud]  
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,934
TimR Offline
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TimR  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 3,934
Virginia, USA
I just bought an accordion.

Well, to be honest, I just bought another accordion.

However, this one is different. It actually works. (Accordion are made with organic products that deteriorate over time. The wax that holds the reeds on, and the leather and card board on the bellows, don't last that long. By the time you buy one in a thrift shop, it is generally unplayable and unrepairable. Don't ask me how i know.)

At any rate, I have five registration buttons for the keyboard. 16 foot, 8 foot, 16 + 8 foot, 8 + 8, and all three. The two 8 foot reeds are slightly detuned. I would call mine dry, but with a little more detuning it would be into the wet range.


gotta go practice
#1597032 - 01/13/11 11:32 PM Re: Accordion as organ [Re: ROMagister]  
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,940
Brandon_W_T Offline
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Brandon_W_T  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,940
Omaha, Nebraska
I've owned my share of accordions. 4 so far. Wish I still had one.


I cant recall what my first was, but it was a smaller button sized one. Maybe 15 buttons, and 12 base, or somewhere along those lines.


Then I had a 50s or 60s Titano full sized. Holy moly. That sucker was HEAVY! Loved it. Great rich full sound. 2 treble switches and single base bar.


Sold that a while later. I couldn't carry it, as it killed by back. (Im a double bass player, and hauling that sucker around ruins your back!)


Further down the line on craigslist there was an ad for 2 full sized antique accordions.

Antiques they were! Probably about 100 years old! (la tosca) Concertone was one, and the other one was galanti. Concertone was yellow and ivory, treble switch was a mechanizm under the keyboard you slid up. No base changers.

The other was black, with diamond studding and mother of pearl. Very beautiful. Worked alright.


Each when I first got them had about 1/3 or more of their reeds inside the bellows. Had to re-glue some of them.


_____
Sold those to a gentleman in town who buys/sells/repairs/collects accordions. He has on a wall in his living room on custom shelves, about 60-70 accordions!

Here is a link to his page-
http://stangalli.com/StanGalli/Welcome.html



And here are the 2 accordions I owned, but now restored to like new!-

http://stangalli.com/StanGalli/My_Albums/Pages/Piano_Accordions.html#9
http://stangalli.com/StanGalli/My_Albums/Pages/Piano_Accordions.html#4





______
Home -
1905 Story and Clark Art Case smile

--NEW!--- 1964ish Conn 640 vacuum tube theatre organ! (with leslie!) smile

Grandmas- New Hyundai petite baby grand

Church (the organ I practice on)-
1998 Bedient (Built about 45 minutes from me!) 2m/pedal 24 rank Cavaille-Coll style pipe organ

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