Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Tuner-Technicians Forum Bleach Old Ivory Keys?

I seem to remember reading somewhere that it's
possible to bleach old ivory key tops to get
them back to near white.

Anyone know anything about this?

I believe it required a certain ratio of bleach and water, and maybe some sun?

I stock hundreds of old ivory key tops for sale in our online store, but invariably people want the lighter shades. Lighter shades are hard to come by.

Sun does a lot. I once stuck a keyboard that was pretty yellow in the afternoon sun for several months, and that turned it pretty much to what we think of as ivory, but not as white as keys were originally bleached.

I think hydrogen peroxide will bleach them pretty white, but I don't know a formula. Chlorine bleach might do it too, but leaves a residue. The downside is that any water solution will warp the ivory.

Also the yellowness tends to be on the surface, so you can sand down to where it is whiter. The downside of that is that if you sand a new front to an old back, the colors may not match any more, and neither of them will match the other keys.

After experiencing all of these downsides and more, I've become one of those who really appreciates the virtues of plastic keytops.

I buy Hydrogen peroxide locally at the chemist it has on the label 40 volume (12%). Applied directly to a keyboard out in the sun (which I have quite a lot of here)every 1/2 an hour or so. And then only over a matter of a few days if really bad. Brought in and cut down with 400 grit paper and buffed. The last bit harder to do if you only have loose keytops.

I'm basically with Brian Lawson on this one. You need concentrated hydrogen peroxide, not the usual drugstore/household type. You can layer a white cloth dampened with it over the keys and put it in the sun. Really it's not in principle much different from what people are doing to whiten their teeth these days.

Note, concentrated hydrogen peroxide is not a safe substance to handle. Educate yourself on the dangers and proper handling procedures.

Regards,

Rick Clark

Frank,

I say just buy an old elephant trophy, hack off the tusk, and sell NEW ivory!

The only problem with that idea is that piano keys were bleached when they were new. You would still have to go through the bleaching step.

Pardon me for visiting, but I was told that you use a paste of Borax and peroxide, and leave it in the sun

To use a paste seems to be unnecessarily messy, whereas with peroxide, just swab directly onto the ivories.

Some thoughts from a Piano Tech in Angier,NC concerning yellow ivories.
First, I use full strength commercial chlorine bleach(grocery store variety) in a small container and simply place all my scavenged, yellowed ivories in the solution for about 20 minutes in full sunlight. Then the ivories are removed and allowed to dry. The secret to prevention of warped ivories is in the drying process. Ivory are very similar to wood in that it is porous and readily absorbs moisture. The moisture itself does not seem to harm the ivory at all.(I have totally immersed,baptist style,ivories for 36 hours in order to release them from the wooden keys and have had little or no problem with the ivories afterward) The problem comes as the ivory dries--ie. if one side dries faster than the other, then it cups toward the dry side. To prevent cupping the ivory either has to be turned frequently while drying in the sun, or allowed to be dried standing on edge so as to allow like air-movement on both sides. Should an ornery piece still want to cup, simply place the ivory piece cup-side-down on a moist paper towel for several hours. It will straighten nicely! Don't leave it over night on the moist towel, or you will have a reverse problem. Should you experience a little residue feel or smell, rinse quickly with cool water and dry immediately.
Concerning the virtues of plastic keys---they don't yellow in 75-100 years, they deteriorate in 30. For those aggressive piano players out there, who play 'til they sweat. Have you noticed the slick keys with plastic? Ivory continues to play with the same feel throughout, probably due to its ability to absorb moisture.

I mix 1 part Hydrogen peroxide (40%),1 part ammoniac,4 parts water (be cautious ).If you have real summer sun,in a day You will have them snow-white.It works also with a UV lamp.It bleaches (a bit)even if You let them inside.
But You have to sand and polish them after that (as have been said,ivory works almost like the wood-so You will have the fibers coming up).

Excuse me for asking but can the bleaching process be done with the keytops already glued to the keys. I just got a used grand with real ivory and i'd like to bleach it myself. One fellow said to take the action out and leave it in the sun. I'd like to use the hydrogen peroxide and leave it in the Hot Houston sun for a day. will this cause the key tops to come loose.

Thanks everybody for your input

DearList-

I have frequently used the peroxide available at beauty supply stores. After applying the solution ( with keys and action on the bench ) set up a high UV flourescent grow light a few inches above the keys for at least overnight. I worry about hot direct sunlight. Then reapply and use more light if necessary until the color is as you like it. Sand lightly with 600 or so wet dry and this should work well.

Regards-

David

Thanks brown!

Does 600 grit sandpaper give a little more grain/grit feel to it rather than using 0000 steel wool?

Hey Wayne Gregory!
Thanks for the tips. Question---can you still salvage the wooden keys to re-top them with plastic? or will the water/chemical mess up the wood?

Dear Jazzpianoguy-

I usually don't use steel wool as it can have greasy residue and if any fibers come off and get wet they can discolor the ivory. Merle Sanford is in your area and she is the real expert.

Regards-

David

Try lightening ivory w/the gel sold for whitening teeth. It can be applied to key-tops that are still on the action and placed under a flourescent light w/a 'grow light' element or some other sunlight replicating bulb. I don't like to use actual sunlight because the heat can get so intense.

I have seen 100 year old celluloid keytops that look perfectly fine. Good quality plastic will definitely outlast ivory. Ivory can yellow, hollow, crack, chip or come unglued faster than plastic deteriorates.

0000 steel wool and 600 grit paper are roughly the same.

If the bleach/peroxide and sun are not getting results the ivories may have been put on with wood glue, crazy glue or even contact cement. As ivory is translucent the white wafer glue helps to prevent this problem.

That is why when replacing a keytop using another type of glue, you should paint the bare wood white first.