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#627188 - 09/11/05 02:30 PM Bridle Straps  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Zormpas Offline
500 Post Club Member
Zormpas  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Monterey, Ca
My 1918 Hobart M. Cable upright lost a bridle strap last nite - the only surprise here is that the straps have lasted this long considering the handling/work this instrument has been getting. Time to install new ones...

But, I'm a bit confused.

Reblitz states:

"Cork-tipped bridle straps are very popular and easy to install, but in many pianos they interfere with the backchecks because the tapes are stiffer where they come out of the catchers than the original tapes were, making precise regulation of hammer checking difficult..."

And

"In actions with catchers that don't have holes, spring-clip bridle straps may be used".

I knew the latter, but based on the former paragraph, and my own engineering sense, wouldn't it make more sense to use the spring clip strap regardless? It would put the tape back through the hole where it was originally - allowing a bit more flexability where is apparently a desireable thing. Although I'm quite sure the corks work OK, they (the corks) seem a bit "fake" to me as well.

I'm going to discuss this with my tech as I'm about 2 hours of work shy of finally being ready for pitch raise and tuning (and won't tackle this job 'til afterwards), but thought I'd ask the techs here at PW as well.

Please advise...


-Zorba
"The Veiled Male"
http://www.doubleveil.net
1918 Hobart M. Cable "H"
"No-one would knowingly provide Franz Liszt with a mediocre piano." -E. M. Good
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#627189 - 09/11/05 04:56 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
John Delmore Offline
Full Member
John Delmore  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
Shreveport, LA
Well, I guess you could do what I found in the Brinkerhoff I'm working on: reattach the bridle strap with a Band-Aid. Really, I'm not kidding. Someone had done that!!! (Not a tech, I hope!! Maybe I'll post a picture later on) In a 1918 anything that had never been reworked, (where you're going to replace all of them) I think I'd go ahead and use glued straps--save the corks for quick, one-off fixes.


John Delmore
PTG Associate Member
"You don't have a Soul. You ARE a soul. You have a body."...C.S. Lewis
Bienvenue!: http://louisianaskyline.net/forums/index.php?
#627190 - 09/11/05 10:38 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 53
vin mrykalo Offline
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vin mrykalo  Offline
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Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 53
Kansas
Yes, clip-on straps are problematic. Get the "plain" straps installed properly.


Vince Mrykalo RPT MPT
UK Piano Technician
#627191 - 09/12/05 10:53 AM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Zormpas Offline
500 Post Club Member
Zormpas  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Monterey, Ca
Ok, you guys are convincing me - but tell me; what is the problem with clip-ons? Are they like clip-on earrings; they hurt, slide around and fall off?


-Zorba
"The Veiled Male"
http://www.doubleveil.net
1918 Hobart M. Cable "H"
"No-one would knowingly provide Franz Liszt with a mediocre piano." -E. M. Good
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#627192 - 09/12/05 12:50 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
John Delmore Offline
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John Delmore  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
Shreveport, LA
Are you the sort of guy that would wear a clip-on tie? If you've put as much work into the instrument as it sounds like you have, go ahead and do it right. And your tech will appreciate it if you fix the bridles *before* the pitch raise/tuning!


John Delmore
PTG Associate Member
"You don't have a Soul. You ARE a soul. You have a body."...C.S. Lewis
Bienvenue!: http://louisianaskyline.net/forums/index.php?
#627193 - 09/12/05 02:39 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,970
RonTuner Online content
1000 Post Club Member
RonTuner  Online Content
1000 Post Club Member

Joined: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,970
Chicagoland
Quote
Originally posted by Zormpas:
Reblitz states:

"Cork-tipped bridle straps are very popular and easy to install, but in many pianos they interfere with the backchecks because the tapes are stiffer where they come out of the catchers than the original tapes were, making precise regulation of hammer checking difficult..."

And

"In actions with catchers that don't have holes, spring-clip bridle straps may be used".
Ok, it depends on how much work you want to do, how close to original you want it to remain.

The clips are harder to work with, and have the potential for getting loose.

The corks are easy, and have the potential for getting loose.

When sized and installed correctly, there shouldn't be the problem with the corks that Reblitz writes about.

Do you really want to unglue the backstop/butts to reglue them as they were? I've seen them in all different configurations, and in all reality their primary purpose is to keep the action together when the action is lifted out of the piano... they shouldn't have too much of an influence on performance. (unless there are some other problems...)

#627194 - 09/12/05 06:19 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Zormpas Offline
500 Post Club Member
Zormpas  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Monterey, Ca
Quote
Originally posted by John Delmore:
Are you the sort of guy that would wear a clip-on tie? If you've put as much work into the instrument as it sounds like you have, go ahead and do it right. And your tech will appreciate it if you fix the bridles *before* the pitch raise/tuning!
HA! Back in "the day" the few times I felt compelled to wear the "male burqa", the necktie, I most DEFINATELY wore clip ons! That was before I renounced such atrocities forever - you won't catch this kid in a necktie (or a burqa for that matter)! laugh

But... on the other hand neither my lovely wife of 21 years nor myself would be caught dead in clip on earrings! eek


-Zorba
"The Veiled Male"
http://www.doubleveil.net
1918 Hobart M. Cable "H"
"No-one would knowingly provide Franz Liszt with a mediocre piano." -E. M. Good
#627195 - 09/12/05 06:25 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Zormpas Offline
500 Post Club Member
Zormpas  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Monterey, Ca
Quote
Originally posted by RonTuner:
Do you really want to unglue the backstop/butts to reglue them as they were? I've seen them in all different configurations, and in all reality their primary purpose is to keep the action together when the action is lifted out of the piano... they shouldn't have too much of an influence on performance. (unless there are some other problems...) [/QB]
As I found out when I lifted the action out for the umpteenth time and that stupid strap had failed! laugh Nope, I'm not particularly desirous of diassembling the darned backstops to redo this - OTOH, I'm just anal enough that I might anyways... shocked


-Zorba
"The Veiled Male"
http://www.doubleveil.net
1918 Hobart M. Cable "H"
"No-one would knowingly provide Franz Liszt with a mediocre piano." -E. M. Good
#627196 - 09/12/05 10:28 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 2,014
Keith Roberts Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Keith Roberts  Offline
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Joined: May 2004
Posts: 2,014
Murphys, Ca
Make sure you get the right size cork. Then put a drop of CA glue around it and it won't come loose.

kpiano


Keith Roberts
Keith's Piano Service
Hathaway Pines,Ca
#627197 - 09/13/05 10:38 AM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
John Delmore Offline
Full Member
John Delmore  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
Shreveport, LA
Male burqa--I love it!! I don't wear them either, except to the occaisional funeral. Hmm, come to think of it, our choir vestements DO resemble a burqa without the headgear. Somehow, though, I don't think the Taleban would approve of Episcopal Red!!

Anyhoo, seems to me that CA on cork would be a nightmare for the next tech.


John Delmore
PTG Associate Member
"You don't have a Soul. You ARE a soul. You have a body."...C.S. Lewis
Bienvenue!: http://louisianaskyline.net/forums/index.php?
#627198 - 09/13/05 11:46 AM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Zormpas Offline
500 Post Club Member
Zormpas  Offline
500 Post Club Member

Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 616
Monterey, Ca
What about hot melt? It seems to stick fairly well, but chisel off fairly easily - maybe not as easy as hide glue, but fairly close.

As for the "male burqa", I'd much rather wear a real burqa than a necktie. Its one of my crackpot ideas - the more men who refuse to wear the cursed things, the sooner they'll end up on the scrap pile of history where they belong!


-Zorba
"The Veiled Male"
http://www.doubleveil.net
1918 Hobart M. Cable "H"
"No-one would knowingly provide Franz Liszt with a mediocre piano." -E. M. Good
#627199 - 09/13/05 12:32 PM Re: Bridle Straps  
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
John Delmore Offline
Full Member
John Delmore  Offline
Full Member

Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 373
Shreveport, LA
I ran this by the PTG list, and, so far, it seems a universally bad idea to use CA on cork. One said pressure fit was enough. Another said to use "Aileen's Tacky Glue", just a wipe on the back. I'm not familiar with Aileen, but it's said to peel off easily. Either way, if you go with cork, be sure to get the right size. But for heaven's sake, no CA!

I'm with you on retiring the noose!


John Delmore
PTG Associate Member
"You don't have a Soul. You ARE a soul. You have a body."...C.S. Lewis
Bienvenue!: http://louisianaskyline.net/forums/index.php?

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