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#596013 06/26/03 12:07 AM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 9
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evilhui Offline OP
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I am a new member. I have just started piano for four month. i can sightread 90% well. I have superb memory. But my only concern that when I am playing with both hands, I can only play for some easy music. Whenever i started a new piece. I tend to use right hand first for half an hour to memorise, then left hand to memorise for an hour. But when it comes together, i slow down but cannot reach the stardard of fast note as i go along.
I have many questions instead of this.
1) Is there a need to practice scales??
2) As for a beginner, many of the teachers in other forums have suggested half an hour daily, but is it enough if you are a prefectionist and really keen in piano??
3) Which kind of pieces use staccato to play well?
4) Which pieces (according to grades) are used for exam mostly and scored distinction?
5) If your piano teacher did not give you any remark, how do you know you are improving or not?
6) Can we practice through memory without using piano?
7) As for the expert, how do you improvise effectively?
8) What type of pieces (e.g. allegretto)are played when going to other grades ?
9) How do you rate yourself in piano?
10) When starting a new piece, which way you start up with?
11) If you are bored with your teacher's pieces, which classical pieces would you choose as a beginner??

#596014 06/26/03 06:13 AM
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I cannot begin to answer all your questions since it would take the rest of the day. As far as playing with both hands, your brain is doing twice the work as with one hand so naturally you will go slower when you put the hands together. It's like trying to concentrate on two things at once, it takes time to master this but don't try to speed it up. Speed should come naturally if you just concentrate on all the other things -- accuracy, smoothness, etc.

If you like classical music there are numerous simpler pieces you can start on. I began with Bach's Minuet in G. Then I started Beethoven's Sonatina in G and Clementi's first sonatina. These are very pleasant pieces that sound good and are fun to learn. I still play them to warm up.

You will know you are improving by what you hear. You do not need your teacher to tell you if the music is gradually sounding better and better. You are the best person to judge your own progress.

Welcome to the forum and I hope you find as much pleasure in this wonderful instrument as I have.

#596015 06/27/03 01:39 AM
Joined: Jul 2001
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evilhui, Welcome!
I cannot answer all your questions but I can respond to some of them:
1) Is there a need to practice scales??
There is a need to practice going from white key to white key, white to black, black to black, black to white with most of the fingers. In this regard, scales can be useful. If you ask me the objective of scale practice should not be perfection of the scale per say, although that may be a by-product of attentive practice. It also helps breed familiarity with the different keys. Just my humble opinion.

2) As for a beginner, many of the teachers in other forums have suggested half an hour daily, but is it enough if you are a prefectionist and really keen in piano??
I say practice as much as you want and have time for but you may find that after so many hours you will get tired and it best to stop at that point because the forward momentum of attentive practice will wane and your continued practice could become counter-productive.

5) If your piano teacher did not give you any remark, how do you know you are improving or not?
Next time you see your teacher ask him/her. Tape yourself occasionally. Be aware of how you feel when at the keyboard.

6) Can we practice through memory without using piano?
I cannot do this very well. Some people can.

10) When starting a new piece, which way you start up with?
I like to read through at least part of the piece to see what "I get from it", what is my first impression, what feelings and images does it conjure up. I also like to read or look through the piece to see if there are sections that will require technique that I've yet acquired. I'll then make myself some exercises for that section. I'm just becoming more aware of the importance of harmonic analysis so I would start doing this too, just so I'll know. I recently went to a master class by Daniel Barenboim and he said that we may or may not get an answer by analysis but the simple fact of asking and searching the music will change the way you play even if you don't come to any conclusions! So then I would start from the beginning to work on fingering, phrasing, ease of execution. For certain tricky sections I may work hands separately. I would sing the different voices. Eventually I will try to wean myself from the page. I may work some sections by not looking at keyboard to solidify the kinesthetic sense. HOPEFULLY, by the time I arrive at the sections that required technical development I'll have what I need for them. Otherwise I work on those sections until I can finish the piece. It may take me a while.

11) If you are bored with your teacher's pieces, which classical pieces would you choose as a beginner??
Brahms Lullaby because of the associations I have with it. Otherwise that's a very good question that I'll leave for someone else.

Best of luck to you.


"Hunger for growth will come to you in the form of a problem." -- unknown
#596016 06/27/03 09:45 AM
Joined: Jan 2003
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evilhui,

Welcome to the forum, and good luck with your piano studies.

I am not a professional pianist or a teacher, but please let me comment on a couple of things.

I'm not sure what you mean by "..sightread 90% well." The definition of sight-reading is playing a piece of music by sight the first time you see it, and sight-reading well is one of the most difficult things to do. Most people can sight read pretty pieces that are at a level or so below the difficulty of the music they are studying for their lessons.
Also, a good memory is very helpful in playing the piano, but the trouble you are having playing two hands together is most likely because you have not developed your coordination. Don't worry about that. It will come in time. Also, instead of memorizing right hand, then left, then both hands together - and by the way it is natural and necessary to have to slow way down when you put both hands together - you might try learning a small section of the right hand, then the same section left, then put them together. Do the same with the next small section, etc.

Now on to your questions:
1) Knowledge and practice of scales are important because piano repertoire is loaded with scale passages. Also, on a theoretical level, it will reinforce your knowledge of the different keys - C maj, D minor, etc.

2) The amount of time you practice is not as important as how you practice and how efficiently you practice. I suspect 1/2 hour is probably adequate for you, but you can certainly practice more as long as you do not experience pain in your arms, hands, wrists, back, or too much fatigue.
An experienced teacher - which I am not - will be able to tell you more about what the ideal time - if there is such a thing - a piano player with 4 months of lessons should practice. It is important not to overdue it physically or mentally, though. Piano is a physical endeavor where you are using real muscles, and the wrong practice/playing technique or overuse can cause real damage.
One more note about practicing: I am a firm believer that it is very important to try to practice every day - of course you can take a day off here and there. Some people to practice every other day, and try to compensate by doubling the time on the days they practice. This doesn't work.

3) I don't quite understand this question. If you mean which pieces can develop your staccato playing technique, there are a lot. At your level your teacher might be starting you with some exercises or etudes for staccato, or some more basic pieces. Study them well and listen to your teacher. Sorry, I can't think of anything more inspirational than that. smile

5) You should always have open communications with your teacher about your progress both overall and regarding specific aspects of your playing. This will become more important as you move out of the beginner stages, but developing and maintaining a line of communication is important even at the stage you are at. Remember that communication is a two-way street. If you have questions about your overall progress or about how you play staccato (for example), you should ask. Some teachers, unfortunately, are less than outgoing, but I find that if you always ask questions, the teacher may eventually anticipate your questions and volunteer feedback.

6) You can study music away from the piano, both with and without the score, but it is not the same as practicing. Learning how to do this is useful, and develops your memory. I wonder why you ask this though. Are there days you don't have access to a piano?

10) It depends on the piece. At the beginner level, you may want to do what I said before: small sections hands separately. Repetition is key to learning any music well. As you move out of the beginner stages, there are a number of ways to begin a new piece of music, from reading the score through away from the piano, listening to a recording of the music, trying to identify the sections that will require the most work, etc.

11) There are a lot of reductions and simplified classical pieces that are published for the beginner level. Also, although you may find it difficult, try reading through some of the pieces in Bach's Anna Magdalena Notebook, Minuet in G - as another poster said.

That's all I have time for now.

Most of all, be consistent in your practicing, but don't try to rush your progress because you can't. Learning the piano takes a bit of patience, so don't get frustrated. Enjoy what you are learning.

#596017 06/27/03 03:59 PM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 123
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Hi Evil, glad to have you on the show. I'm intrigued by your buffet of questions. Ordinarily I'd be aghast, but it's Friday today...

1) Need to practice scales - there probably is a need, because I don't practice them and can't play too well.
2) Practice time - I like 1.5 hours daily. I'm still trying to find my way around during the first half hour.
3) Staccato pieces - the one that comes to mind is Gavotte by Gossec. It's one of the few pieces I can think of where both bass and treble are primarily staccato. On the other hand, there are a lot of pieces where the bass is staccato, often in a strict 1-2 rhythm. E.g., Ellemenreich's Spinning Song, Bach's Musette in D, most ragtime pieces.
4) Exam pieces - Check out the ABRSM website for a syllabus. For any other org like RCM or MTAC, you have to buy the syllabus. Argh.
5) Tracking improvement - I don't think my teacher said much about that either. My favorite test of improvement is, how much more are you enjoying playing, and listening to your own playing?
) Practice memory w/o piano - I personally would advise against this. However, I am the opposite of you - I play primarily by ear, and don't sight read well at all.
7) Improv - Not an easy skill to pick up. Over time you will notice patterns in music - chord progressions and so forth. The best advice I can give you is to start learning to play pop and jazz by ear. How to do that? Keep practicing....
8) Higher grade pieces - On occasion you will see a piece titled 'Allegretto'; however, it is actually a tempo, not a type of piece. Right now you're probably seeing a lot of pieces that take up half a page or so, and have goofy titles like 'Fred Goes Shopping.' Eventually you'll see much longer pieces with less descriptive titles, such as 'Prelude/Etude/Sonata Op.98, No.542'. There will be a lot more notes per measure, a lot more tempo/volume markings, and a lot more words in Italian.
9) Rating myself - Probably a grade 6 on the RCM 10-grade scale.
10) Starting a new piece - If at all possible, I 'cheat' and listen to a MIDI or MP3 version. Then I try sight reading the first few measures. Then I give up and move on to another piece. I've started dozens of pieces this way and finished about two so far.
11) Beg. classical pieces - Try an Anna Magdalena Bach notebook compilation, featuring pieces by the Bach Bunch (and possibly others). Not too difficult to play, and fairly entertaining.


Disclosure: adult self-teacher ~RCM 8. ~~ Must - Get - Off - Everquest ~~

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