Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Piano Forum What are reknown pianos for sound, touch and longevity?

Hey

.. i just want to know what pianos are known for being really, really good, you know the kind that are used in concert halls, that sort of thing.

Thanks

At least in the United States, the statistics show that Steinway & Sons was chosen by 98% of soloists during the 2005-2006 concert season.

Here's the link:

http://www.steinway.com/steinway/artist_roster/2005-2006box_score.pdf

Are you piano shopping or just seeking info?

Please advise.

Cella,

Your subject line (regarding sound, touch and longevity) and the body of your post (usage in concert halls) are not necessarily the same question.

Pianomadam -- could you explain what types of financial and other incentives and inducements enter into the decisions that have lead to such dominance of Steinway & Sons in concert halls. I suspect there is more to the decision than merely comparing and contrasting a Steinway D to the myriad other choices available to a concert hall's search committee.

Clavierman:

If a concert artist wanted a non-Steinway piano, do you really think the local X dealer would not be happy to supply the piano? How long do you think it would take for them to deliver the piano, free of charge (probably less than an hour?)...to get some exposure?

Regarding your other question, ask the concert halls, not me.

".......could you explain what types of financial and other incentives and inducements enter into the decisions that have lead to such dominance of Steinway & Sons in concert halls."

Before the great World Wars, it's my understanding that both M&H and Steinway were basically "neck and neck" with regard to quality and market presence. Due to shortages that world wars create, both companies suffered and barely survived. After World War II, Steinway made a brilliant marketing decision and began giving away pianos (primarily to well known artists and concert halls). Hence, they captured a dominant market share and virtually became a household word in the decades to follow.

Here we go again.

PianoMadam, your selective misuse of facts is really tedious, not to mention tendentious. Dealers who continually flirt with the line that separates selling from providing information risk two things. The first is that they risk bringing the brand they represent into disrepute on the forum. You certainly do that for Steinway among most people on this forum with functioning brains. The second risk is that you will be moderated.

Jollyroger: Please quote your source for "its my understanding that..."

PianoDad: How am I misusing facts? Has what I said offended you? How so? Statistics are statistics...they don't lie.

Please look up the word tendentious.

You know as well as I that the C&A program cannot be read as a pure signal of quality yet you continually sweep all controversy away with the proverbial wave of the hand, as though the 'fact' (however measured) speaks for itself. You have obviously never read that wonderful old book, "How to Lie with Statistics."


Cella,

Many pianos that are reknowned for their quality (measured in many ways) often are NOT in concert halls in any great number.

I have never seen a poster harm the Steinway name more than Pianomadam has.

The only explanation I can fathom is Pianomadam is a sock puppet of a competing brand.

Now there's a thought!

Poor Cella. A first-time poster with a simple question, and no answer yet. Here's my layman's quick answer. You'll find that most concert halls use one or more of the following, with Steinway and Yamaha being the most common. Someone with more first-hand knowledge will hopefully confirm and/or correct this list, and maybe add a word about European halls. There are a few other brands that are just as good - but rarely used by concert halls as far as I know.

Steinway
Bosendorfer
Yamaha C7 or S series
Kawai (Shigeru series)
Fazioli
Mason and Hamlin

Pianomadam -- Is it really "the local [Steinway] dealer" that makes it financially possible to supply Steinways to 98% of those concert halls, or Steinway & Sons itself?

Hey Sir, it's not so simple a question. Cella's second sentence

conditions the main question,

So, if you give the short list of makes that dominate concert halls (oh, and what counts as a concert hall????), have you also given a list of all the pianos that are "really, really good." ?

As you say, there are many fine brands that have little presence in major concert venues, though they may be heard in smaller and less commercial spaces. but then you have undermined the implicit assumption buried within Cella's question.

When PianoMadam jumps on the dominant Steinway C&A presence like a fly on fresh manure the fireworks are predictable. :p

RE: At least in the United States, the statistics show that Steinway & Sons was chosen by 98% of soloists during the 2005-2006 concert season.

--------------

Steinway is chosen because that is what is available in most concert halls by S/S marketing, Pianomadam. Period.

I hope that others that are reading now and later realize that this is just spin on buying a Steinway. Are they nice? Yes. Does what they present for the concert stage have to do with what they offer for the home piano...maybe/maybe not...read below.

Just because a concert pianist likes to play a Steinway Concert Grand within the concert hall, it does not mean that there are not comparable pianos in the 6 ft range for your home that would be just as satisfying as what a Steinway 6 ft grand might be, or even something BETTER suiting for your taste, once they are explored.

What you read from PM was Steinway 'marketing' Steinway.

Search these pianos:
Steingraeber
Bosendorfer
Mason and Hamlin
Bluthner
Forester
C. Bechstein
Grotrian
Estonia
Schimmel
Yamaha
Kawaii
Charles Walters
edit - didnt mean to leave off Sauter!

....and a slew of others in no particular order. Just do a search from the above page.

Many of them are also suited for the Concert Hall as well as their 6 ft pianos (etc) for the home.

Do I like many Steinways? Yes.

But after exploring other makes "I" might choose another for the concert hall, and for my home.

LL

In Europe Bechstein and Bluthner are used too.


P.S. Welcome to the forum Cella.

P.P.S.
Amazing with all the dealers about that the Steigerman (Premium Series - naturally)hasn't been subtly woven into the thread yet. Somewhere in China one is probably being used in a school concert hall

"You know as well as I that the C&A program cannot be read as a pure signal of quality..."

These statistics have nothing to do with the C&A program. Notice that it says "soloists"


"Many pianos that are reknowned for their quality (measured in many ways) often are NOT in concert halls in any great number"

---That's correct. But the soloists still don't choose them! Isn't that amazing! Listen, I'm not saying that there is not other fine pianos out there that are equal to Steinway, all things considered. I'm just saying that when it comes to distinguishing the nuances of sound and touch, there is none other that is more qualified at doing so than the professional pianist.

"In Europe Bechstein and Bluthner are used too"

---do you have documented evidence of this, outside of your own observation? I'm not harping on you, but just trying to get the facts straight.

You are simply touting a prepared Steinway advertisement.

We've been over this in so many other threads. All you ever do is repeat prepared Steinway advertisements as though they are fact, and you ignore all the manipulations that went into making those advertisements.

By selecting which venue qualifies as a concert hall you can generate any percentage you want to. That's one of the basic rules of 'How to Lie with Statistics.'

Your use of the word "choose" is a great example of deception. If one is a Steinway Artist one is no longer free to choose on a case by case basis.

And if a concert hall already has a piano in it, it would take a mighty finicky 'artist' to overrule the venue and 'order out' instead, especially if they had to pick up the tab themselves.

At some risk, I'm now going to behave like the departed Larry.

PianoMadam, you are simply a shill. If you were any good at it, this might be more fun.

"If one is a Steinway Artist one is no longer free to choose on a case by case basis"

Again, this is not about Steinway & Sons Concert & Artist program. This is about soloists who perform at the major concert halls across the country. By the way, yes they are free...they just won't be a concert artist for Steinway anymore if they do choose another piano. Would you expect Tiger Woods to work for Nike if he started wearing Adidas sneakers?


"And if a concert hall already has a piano in it, it would take a mighty finicky 'artist' to overrule the venue and 'order out' instead, especially if they had to pick up the tab themselves"

---this is conjecture. I work in the piano business and I know how eager Steinway competitors are to get recognition for their product. Believe me, Steinway competitors would not charge the artist.


"PianoMadam, you are simply a shill. If you were any good at it, this might be more fun"

--Great to hear from you, PianoDad. I normally enjoy your posts. I have nothing against you despite this little spat. I hope you stick around.