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Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560091
09/10/03 09:58 PM
09/10/03 09:58 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 95
California
E
Eileen Offline OP
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Eileen  Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 95
California
I am heartbroken. Was sightreading through the Waldstein the other day, fell in love during the first movement. However, I got to the third movement where there is a trill in the right hand (3-4 moving to 1-2) with sustained notes in the same hand. Now I can do this but not with an octave span. My hand just will not reach. I am not sure I can overcome this handicap to learn this sonata.

Anyone have any ideas? Other than giving up and buying a CD.

Eileen

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Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560092
09/10/03 10:04 PM
09/10/03 10:04 PM
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,918
Chicago, IL USA
Palindrome Offline
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Palindrome  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 3,918
Chicago, IL USA
Buy that CD, listen very closely, and you'll hear some notes dropped from those trills!


There is no end of learning. -Robert Schumann Rules for Young Musicians
Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560093
09/10/03 11:05 PM
09/10/03 11:05 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 95
California
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Eileen Offline OP
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Eileen  Offline OP
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Joined: Sep 2002
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California
I will do just that! any particular CD you recommend?

Eileen

Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560094
09/10/03 11:33 PM
09/10/03 11:33 PM
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 98
Berkeley,CA
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Irock1ce Offline
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 98
Berkeley,CA
Gilel's is quite good.. along with Ashkenazy and Richard Goode..

Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560095
09/11/03 05:22 AM
09/11/03 05:22 AM
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 227
United Kingdom
Badger Offline
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Badger  Offline
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 227
United Kingdom
Brendel cool


"There's nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself."
--Johann Sebastian Bach
Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560096
09/11/03 06:22 AM
09/11/03 06:22 AM
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 215
Anchorage, Alaska
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Karen Bretz Offline
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Karen Bretz  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 215
Anchorage, Alaska
I just got Cziffra's on the aura label. Also on the disc is the Bach-Busoni Prelude and Fugue in D Major and Carnival. Delightful all around. I've listened to it three times already as I work in the wee hours of the morning. Cziffra's Waldstein has a wonderful tone and subtlety. Interestingly, the author of the liner notes comments that "this is without a doubt a Waldstein conceived by one who approached Beethoven through Liszt." Puts a different twist on things.

Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560097
09/11/03 05:17 PM
09/11/03 05:17 PM
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 704
Belgium
Nunatax Offline
500 Post Club Member
Nunatax  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 704
Belgium
Or Abdel Rahman El Bacha smile


Some can tell you to go to heck in such a manner that you would think you might actually enjoy the trip, but that is far more polite than civil - JBryan
Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560098
09/11/03 07:50 PM
09/11/03 07:50 PM
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 461
Australia
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starmender Offline
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Posts: 461
Australia
This is a sonata that I don't play or teach.- I was put off as a student by the way my fellow students played the opening bars, and I have never got over it. However I have had a look for you.

My EMB urtext has pedalling marked under these passages, suggesting that the melody on top of the trill is just "thrown at" staccato. I suggest a measured trill where you miss out the 'a' when you are actually playing the upper note. Certainly with small hands that seems the best way to fake it, and fake it you must.

Or....(sound of creaking wheels) there may be another way to divide the hands up.

It seems a pity to not play the sonata because of this passage. Do you plan to perform it, or is it just for you?

Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560099
09/11/03 08:05 PM
09/11/03 08:05 PM
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 95
California
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Eileen Offline OP
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Eileen  Offline OP
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Posts: 95
California
It is just for me......but I am something of a perfectionist. I am going work on the other movements in total and spend some time just taking these few lines apart in different ways to see if I can come up with a creative solution between dropping a note or so, creative pedaling and throwing the notes on top I hope to cobble together an acceptable solution.

I love Beethoven and other than a few passages that require larger hands, the notes seem to fall pretty easily under my fingers.

Eileen

Re: Beethoven's Waldstein Sonata #560100
09/11/03 10:16 PM
09/11/03 10:16 PM
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 139
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Kbsue Offline
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Kbsue  Offline
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Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 139
To add to what has already been said, a piano faculty at a univ. once told me that you can drop the trill momentarily to play the top melody. And that the sonata fits well enough for small hands. It just requires stamina.

(of course, I then asked him to teach it to me, and he goggled and looked outraged, because it was too difficult for me then.... and anyway I had almost nil exposure to Beethoven at that time - Fur Elise. You can imagine how apoplexed he was! um, well.)

But whatever you do, I think maybe keep the trill very even (shape the trill if you must) to create an illusion of continuity, though you probably know it already!! It's the continuity of phrasing and breath that propels the music...


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