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#49254 04/03/08 12:55 PM
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Innominato, there is a reason Mr. Wilson has not responded to Rob’s posts. Want to guess what that reason is? Do you know why law enforcement agencies do not discuss ongoing investigations on a public forum? This is a public forum, right?

I thought we were going to give this thread a rest? You must be restless laugh .

Best regards,

Rickster


Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel
#49255 04/03/08 06:23 PM
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I have answered to your statement, explaining to you why it would, in my eyes, not work.

If you had not made the statement, I would have given no answer.. smile

Frankly do not think that anyone can tell me that I have been too hard.

I just notice that he could have intervened, and he chose not to, seeking the closure of the thread instead.

And please don't tell me that he was not able to do so.


"The man that hath no music in himself / Nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds / Is fit for treasons, stratagems, and spoils." (W.Shakespeare)

Kemble Conservatoire 335025 Walnut Satin
#49256 04/03/08 06:40 PM
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Hi Innominato,

I just re-read my post above and it may have sounded a little sarcastic and rude. If it did to you as well, I apologize; it is not my nature to be rude or a smart ellick.

On the other hand, if you were to call Scotland Yard and ask them some questions about an ongoing investigation or pending litigation, you would probably not get a response from them either.

I think there is more to this situation than anyone on this forum realizes and it is none of my business.

Also, quite frankly, you are free to say or write anything on this forum you wish. However, along with freedom of speech comes responsibility for what we say.

Best regards,

Rickster


Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel
#49257 04/03/08 07:21 PM
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Look, guys. PW is a wealth of information for pianists and piano buyers.

But we are NOT the Lord Protectors of All Pianodom. I'm a little concerned that we're beginning to see ourselves as a bit more important, and entitled, than we truly are.

This is an internet forum. Nothing more. Lots of information and free advice, much of it worth what you paid for it. Some worth much less.

Let's not get carried away as if we have some duty to fulfill. Our only duties are individual - to be responsible in what we each say and do here. Not to dictate what others must do in order to be considered reputable.


Michael

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He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
#49258 04/03/08 07:59 PM
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Michael:
Quote
This is an internet forum. Nothing more. Lots of information and free advice, much of it worth what you paid for it. Some worth much less.
Hi Michael. I agreed with you earlier, however, I tend to disagree with your statement above.

To me, the Piano World forums are much more than just another internet forum; it’s a community of piano professionals, technicians, rebuilders, business people, piano players, piano teachers, piano lovers and music enthusiast as well as friends and foe alike.

Then again, maybe I’ve got it all wrong and you are right about it being just another internet forum, but I don’t think so. In fact, sometimes I wonder why I’m drawn to the PW forum so; I know I have better things to do with my time laugh .

You are right about one thing, though; we are responsible for what we say and write on these forums for better or worse.

Best regards,

Rickster


Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel
#49259 04/03/08 10:21 PM
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Rick, I see where you are coming from, and to a point i agree with you. But I have been part of several forums, and they all tend to see themselves in that same way - a community. And they are.

What I am saying is Piano World, while it certainly has value to its members and other readers, is not terribly unique in that respect. It is not unique enough to accord it special protective duties for the piano buying public.


Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
#49260 04/03/08 11:01 PM
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Mik - I agree with you. There have been topics on here where I know everyone has the best of intentions but we sometimes start to sound like we have appointed ourselves judge, jury, and executioner. I'm not pointing a finger at anyone, I'm just commenting on the tone threads can take.

We always need to be mindful of what we say, especially if it can be perceived that we might be trying to do damage to another individual or his/her reputation. I was an observer of an interesting legal action that occurred back in 2004..

In the coin collecting world, there are coin grading services. These services evaluate the condition of a coin, encapsulate it in plastic, and attach the appropriate grade to the coin. Naturally the value of the coin is tied to the grade. In this business, there are highly respected grading companies and there are those looked upon as 'bottom feeders'.

On the internet newsgroup rec.collecting.coins, the grading company 'ACG/Accugrade' was a hot topic, much like PSS is on PW. This went on for quite a while, until one day the individual posters were all served with notice that ACG/Accugrade was bringing suit against them in the state of Florida. To make a long story short, the lawsuit was eventually thrown out, but not before the individuals had to pay thousands each for their defense. During the course of the litigation, all of the posters pretty much stopped posting for fear of adding fuel to the fire. Some never came back. So the whole community suffered.

Rick is correct, nobody is going to give updates on an ongoing investigation on a public forum. And there is one going on. I've been contacted myself on this and quite frankly I feel absolutely terrible about this whole thing for a number of reasons. I never thought that moderating would ever involve something like this..

I don't think I would be talking out of turn to say I was told that today a second delivery attempt on the check was made and nobody was home. Notices have been left both times. If it is not delivered within a certain number of attempts it will be returned to Terry.

And that's the way it is from my perspective..

Ken


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#49261 04/04/08 11:47 AM
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I agree with both of you wink

We are not here to reform the world. But we are also not here to dismiss everything as not regarding us.

Fora like this one exist because people are naturally sociable, have a natural wish to help each other in various ways. Many discussions originate from this. If we just decided that "it is not our business", this forum would not exist.

Rickster, I was not requesting answers from the police, but from the one to whom the questions were addressed.
If the answers are not forthcoming, I register that.
Without animosity, without making comparisons with wars on the other side of the planet and without thinking that the Empire is ready to strike again and we must bi vigilant.
Just registering the facts.


"The man that hath no music in himself / Nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds / Is fit for treasons, stratagems, and spoils." (W.Shakespeare)

Kemble Conservatoire 335025 Walnut Satin
#49262 04/04/08 03:07 PM
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OK, folks. I think it's appropriate for me to say a few things at this point. This is not to be taken as some sort of "formal statement" or anything, but just as friendly "status report" and perhaps a polite admonition, to the good members of this forum.

As some of you know, I am an attorney. Terry has asked me to assist him in this. In reviewing the facts, I felt that it was something I could do in good faith. Terry and I have become friendly over recent months, and I believe my professional instincts are pretty good in judging situations like this. Because I am a regular participant in these forums, I feel I owe it to you to let you know that I am involved.

There are things that have been said here that are patently and demonstrably false. There are also things that have been said and done "behind the scenes" that are unlawful and improper. All of those things are being dealt with. Terry has not responded here because I told him not to. That is standard procedure ("advice of counsel" and so forth). Do not draw any conclusions, please, from that silence.

I believe I can speak for myself and Terry in saying that we both have great respect for the owner and moderators of this wonderful forum. It is a great resource, and most of the time, and in most respects, a fine and enjoyable community. On a personal level, I also have respect and affection for many, if not most, of the members here -- even those with whom I have vehemently disagreed.

I very much want to continue the good parts of my enjoyment of this forum, and I am sure Terry would say the same thing. That naturally will (and should) include occasional "controversy." Discussion, debate, even sometimes heated argument can be a good and productive thing. As long as it is civil, and doesn't resort to personal insults...or threats.

Ken and Frank do a very good job of monitoring and moderating these forums, and weeding out the inappropriate and unlawful stuff that sometimes takes place. I know that you all respect that. Please extend that respect to this matter, as well. Please know and understand that this is being handled properly.

As soon as it is appropriate to do so, and with the approval of the moderators, I will try to post a factual update and summary of the situation. Unfortunately, I can not do so at this time, due to ongoing matters.

I would respectfully request that (like Mr. Bill) folks just "chill" for a little while, and not draw too many conclusions at this point. Now, back to your regularly scheduled program.

Thank you,

Mark

#49263 04/04/08 03:54 PM
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Interesting admission that Terry needs help from an attorney.

I and many others have posted on this forum -- in response to the various reports and public evidence of (online) retailer malfeasance -- as objective, independent, uninvolved, third parties looking at the reported facts and allegations without conflict of interest. Others clearly have a personal interest, whether revealed until now or not.

Thanks for now confirming your relationship to Terry which, judging from the postings from the past year, appears already to have been in place formally or informally at the time of your piano purchase. It tends to put many somewhat lopsided forum discussions better into perspective.

I for one appreciate being informed, albeit belatedly, of this critical detail.

#49264 04/04/08 03:59 PM
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Journey,

What do you expect J. Mark to do? Publicly slam his piano dealer and now client? He had a very positive experience with PSS, and is a supporter. No big deal. Very few people here have no bias at all. Certainly not me.


Michael

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He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
#49265 04/04/08 04:14 PM
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Thanks Mark. I certainly have no problem with your relationship with Terry. Don't know why there would be a problem and how it would affect any discussions here outside of this topic.


Kawai RX2/Yamaha Digital YPG625
#49266 04/04/08 04:20 PM
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I have no expectations. Maybe I am one of those with no bias, casu quo direct interest, since I don't live, buy or play in the States and therefore cannot be a party or competitor or lawyer to all the intrigue with PSS and the craiglist players, etc.

It is just interesting to see what is driving some so-called objective, "real" discussions on this forum, once the various underlying relationships have been revealed, that is all. Shams.

Call me naive.

Birds of a feather.

Caveat lector.

#49267 04/04/08 04:35 PM
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J. Mark is not required to disclose that relationship to us. Although he and I disagree on every - er- many things, that he did come out and say this speaks to his integrity, IMO. I have no reason to believe anything he said regarding PSS prior was really influenced by this relatively new relationship, just by his successful transaction on his piano.


Michael

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#49268 04/04/08 05:51 PM
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Thanks, Michael, and you are entirely correct on all points. I've said enough on that topic and will say no more. As far as the underlying subject goes, I am functioning in a professional capacity from now on. 'Nuff said.

#49269 04/04/08 06:03 PM
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J. Mark, best wishes in your new professional capacity, I certainly do not have any problem with you assisting Terry.

I do hope that, when the time comes, you will post the, I'd say, eagerly awaited other version of the facts.


"The man that hath no music in himself / Nor is not mov'd with concord of sweet sounds / Is fit for treasons, stratagems, and spoils." (W.Shakespeare)

Kemble Conservatoire 335025 Walnut Satin
#49270 04/04/08 07:05 PM
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We'll get....

'The REST of the story! Good Day!'

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Michael

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He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
#49271 04/06/08 08:27 AM
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What evidence do you have that they had a business or personal relationship prior to the piano purchase? I have not seen any, but I don't read all threads. I also have no idea what J. Mark's firm name is.


Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'
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