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How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341244
06/26/06 11:32 AM
06/26/06 11:32 AM
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kenny Offline OP
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Looks like my 9 x 12 ft rug will be delivered AFTER the piano. frown

Back when I had my Baldwin 5 ft 8 in I figured out a way to install a rug under a grand with two people.

1. Roll the long edges of the rug in towards the middle so you can slide it under the lyre without the rug touching the two keyboard legs.
2. Slide rug towards toe of piano.
3. Let go of previous two curls so rug just rests against keyboard legs.
4 Roll up short side of rug under toe of piano so you can move rug under lyre to its final position.
5. Get on your hands and knees under one keyboard leg with your back against bottom of piano.
6. Push up till caster lifts one inch, this was no strain for me with the small grand.
7. While caster is up, have helper pull rug into position.
8. Repeat for other legs.

Now that was fine for a piano that weighed much less.
I expect this will be dangerous to try this with a piano that weighs 1080 pounds.

If so, what is the best way to do this?
Hire movers again?

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Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341245
06/26/06 11:36 AM
06/26/06 11:36 AM
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idaho
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teachum Offline
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With a strong back! Or you could rent a grand transporter or sweet talk someone into loaning you from the store. I'd ask the store you bought it from. When Alex replaced my leg on my Estonia he brought one with him from Seattle. Slick machine. It has hydraulic lifts in it and it just jack the piano up. Check into it.


You will be 10 years older, ten years from now, no matter what you do - so go for it!

Estonia #6141 in Satin Mahogany
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341246
06/26/06 11:39 AM
06/26/06 11:39 AM
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 1,046
San Francisco Area
Casalborgone Offline
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Your former method should apply to the larger piano. Your old piano may have weighed 1/3 less.

You can also lift one leg of the piano at a time standing while a helper slides the rug under the caster. You could have a second helper assist in the lifting at each leg. There is no absolute need to call in a mover for this sort of work, provided you and your helpers are in reasonably good physical condition,


Mike
Registered Piano Technician
Member Piano Technicians Guild
Not currently working in the piano trade.
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341247
06/26/06 11:41 AM
06/26/06 11:41 AM
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Posts: 7,051
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kenny Offline OP
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Thanks

So I assume you would:

1. Place it on the rug between a leg and the lyre
2. Raise that leg
3. Pull the rug under the leg
4. Put piano back down
5. Repeat for other two legs

Or is this some thing that lifts all 3 legs at once?

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341248
06/26/06 11:43 AM
06/26/06 11:43 AM
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kenny Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by Casalborgone:
Your former method should apply to the larger piano. Your old piano may have weighed 1/3 less.

You can also lift one leg of the piano at a time standing while a helper slides the rug under the caster. You could have a second helper assist in the lifting at each leg. There is no absolute need to call in a mover for this sort of work, provided you and your helpers are in reasonably good physical condition,
But this would be dangerous for the back because when lifting you should have your sholders over your feet.
To do this a person would have to *lean forward* eek so their feet are not near the wheel - othwise their feet will be in the way of the rug.

This is a concert grand

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341249
06/26/06 11:48 AM
06/26/06 11:48 AM
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Posts: 2,918
idaho
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teachum Offline
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idaho
Quote
Originally posted by kenny:
Thanks

So I assume you would:

1. Place it on the rug between a leg and the lyre
2. Raise that leg
3. Pull the rug under the leg
4. Put piano back down
5. Repeat for other two legs

Or is this some thing that lifts all 3 legs at once?
If you are referring to my post, Kenny - it lifts all three legs at once. You put it under the ribs.


You will be 10 years older, ten years from now, no matter what you do - so go for it!

Estonia #6141 in Satin Mahogany
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341250
06/26/06 11:50 AM
06/26/06 11:50 AM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 7,051
K
kenny Offline OP
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Quote
Originally posted by teachum:
Quote
Originally posted by kenny:
[b] Thanks

So I assume you would:

1. Place it on the rug between a leg and the lyre
2. Raise that leg
3. Pull the rug under the leg
4. Put piano back down
5. Repeat for other two legs

Or is this some thing that lifts all 3 legs at once?
If you are referring to my post, Kenny - it lifts all three legs at once. You put it under the ribs. [/b]
But then how do you get the rug under the piano with the jack in the way??

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341251
06/26/06 12:00 PM
06/26/06 12:00 PM
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 1,114
El Cajon, California
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Steve Ramirez Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by kenny:
Now that was fine for a piano that weighed much less.
I expect this will be dangerous to try this with a piano that weighs 1080 pounds.
Do you have any idea how much your Mason weighs? About as much as most 9 footers, 1,020 lbs according to the specs on the M&H website.

Maybe you're stronger than you thought. Just don't try it with a CC.

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341252
06/26/06 12:02 PM
06/26/06 12:02 PM
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 678
Herndon, VA
kokomo61 Offline
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Quote
But then how do you get the rug under the piano with the jack in the way??
Put the rug centered under the middle of the piano, (with both ends rolled toward the middle) and roll out enough to put the jack on top of the center of the rug.

Jack up the piano.

Roll out the ends.


Estonia 190, #6098
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341253
06/26/06 12:05 PM
06/26/06 12:05 PM
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idaho
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teachum Offline
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You just roll the piano clear out of the way, the thing is on wheels, put you rug down and roll it back.


You will be 10 years older, ten years from now, no matter what you do - so go for it!

Estonia #6141 in Satin Mahogany
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341254
06/26/06 12:08 PM
06/26/06 12:08 PM
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Posts: 7,051
K
kenny Offline OP
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Hmm.
I see.
Sounds good.

But I wonder if pianos are designed for 100% of their weight to be carried by one or two ribs in the middle of the piano.

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341255
06/26/06 12:17 PM
06/26/06 12:17 PM
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,557
Sandy Eggo, California
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OperaTenor Offline
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Sandy Eggo, California
Edit: I just noticed I'm basically echoing what others have already posted. shocked

Kenny, can you get at least two strong people to help you? If so, then what I'd do if it was me is lay out the rug under the piano such that you have it centered under the piano the way you want, with the ends that will go under the casters folded back but adjacent to the casters. Then with two people lifting, lift one leg at a time and pull the folded back rug under the caster.

Doing it this way should make it easier to place the rug the way you want it while minimizing the chance you'll have wrinkles in the rug after you're done.

IMO, if you roll it onto the rug, expecially if your floor is slick, the rug will move and bunch under the weight of the piano.

I also get the heebie-jeebies thinking about stressing the piano in an unintended direction by jacking it up.


Happiness is a freshly tuned piano.
Jim Boydston, proprietor, No Piano Left Behind - technician
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Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341256
06/26/06 02:52 PM
06/26/06 02:52 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 21,661
Victoria, BC
BruceD Offline
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Quote
Originally posted by teachum:
You just roll the piano clear out of the way, the thing is on wheels, put you rug down and roll it back.
Have you ever tried rolling a one-thousand pound piano onto a rug?

It won't happen!

Furthermore, the resistance encountered when the piano meets the rug could easily snap the leg. No grand piano was ever meant to be rolled into - or onto - an obstacle, which the rug would be.


BruceD
- - - - -
Estonia 190
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341257
06/26/06 03:11 PM
06/26/06 03:11 PM
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 3,458
Albuquerque, NM
Cy Shuster, RPT Offline
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The grand transporter has large wheels, which should go up onto a rug:
http://pljansen.com/serv09.htm

--Cy--


Cy Shuster, RPT
www.shusterpiano.com
Albuquerque, New Mexico
Director, PTG Norfolk 2016 Technical Institute
http://convention.ptg.org
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341258
06/26/06 03:36 PM
06/26/06 03:36 PM
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,242
Cape Cod
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Cape Cod
I see this is also the source for the Piano Horse which is another marvelous contraption.

Howard

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341259
06/26/06 04:25 PM
06/26/06 04:25 PM
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 4,983
boston north
lilylady Offline
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boston north
Is it possible to delay the delivery of the piano (heaven forbid) until the rug is delivered?

And then you won't have to deal with any of this?

R-


"Music gives a soul to the universe, wings to the mind, flight to the imagination, and life to everything."
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341260
06/26/06 04:31 PM
06/26/06 04:31 PM
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 26,695
Oakland
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BDB Offline
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If you can afford a CC, you can afford to have the movers back when you need them.


Semipro Tech
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341261
06/26/06 05:55 PM
06/26/06 05:55 PM
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idaho
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teachum Offline
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BruceD - You didn't read the thread, did you? Don't worry, I do that all the time.

You roll the piano ON the Grand Transporter, which as Cy pointed out has big wheels. All I know is when it was up on it, Alex said, now's you chance if you want to move it.


You will be 10 years older, ten years from now, no matter what you do - so go for it!

Estonia #6141 in Satin Mahogany
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341262
06/26/06 07:48 PM
06/26/06 07:48 PM
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 1,585
New York
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LJC Offline
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New York
Kenny, Its easy. You can do it all by yourself. Get out your car jack and get some big blocks of wood. Build up enough blocks so you dont have to extend the jack forever. Do one leg at a time. This is how I put the casters under my D. Just make sure the blocks are steady. Good Luck, Lee

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341263
06/28/06 02:32 PM
06/28/06 02:32 PM
Joined: Jul 2005
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England
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swingal Offline
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England
It took 3 men, two of them very strong to lift my Steinway 'A' to get it on the trolly for moving. This is a risky idea and if in doubt leave it out.

It's one thing having experience of heavy moving such as a large piano. But if you have to ask, I have to say you can make a mistake due to inexperience of such lifting.

It might be OK with some types of car jack but remember not to but too much weight on a small area of the floor if its wood.

Alan

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341264
06/28/06 05:18 PM
06/28/06 05:18 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 3,886
San Francisco
whippen boy Offline
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Get a spinet! :p (said with a twinge of envy)

Or maybe get a smaller rug? smile Or rugs...

The other (crazy) solution: cut slots in the rug for the wheels. Then you can have fun stitching the strips back in! laugh

OK, I have no helpful ideas. whome


M&H "A" at home
Bösendorfer Imperial
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341265
06/28/06 07:31 PM
06/28/06 07:31 PM
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Posts: 3,770
Hamilton Twp, NJ
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You don't need a car Jack. I got my Bosie 214(826lbs) onto a 13 X 8 rug with just one other person. You lift a leg and the other person slides the carpet under. You keep repeating until the carpet is centered.


G.Fiore "aka-Curry". Tuner-Technician serving the central NJ, S.E. PA area. b214cm@aol.com Concert tuning, Regulation-voicing specialist.
Dampp-Chaser installations, piano appraisals. PTG S.Jersey Chapter 080.
Bösendorfer 214 # 47,299 214-358
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341266
06/28/06 07:52 PM
06/28/06 07:52 PM
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Washington D.C. Metro
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What about the pad? Aren't you going to use a pad?

Getting a big rug onto a pad isn't easy, if you want the thing properly centered. Add a concert grand and you're in a heap o' trouble!!

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341267
06/28/06 08:04 PM
06/28/06 08:04 PM
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I'd pay the piano movers, but then I paid movers to reposition my 40 YO upright. Not because of the piano, but because the damage to floor, etc was just not worth it.

And what do you do if you've got 3 of your nearest and dearest to help and after it is all centered, the rug pad is hanging out of the edge?

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341268
06/28/06 08:59 PM
06/28/06 08:59 PM
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New York
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And what do you do if you've got 3 of your nearest and dearest to help and after it is all centered, the rug pad is hanging out of the edge?

Get out the box cutter.

Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341269
06/28/06 09:41 PM
06/28/06 09:41 PM
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Posts: 3,886
San Francisco
whippen boy Offline
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OK, two questions:

Just how thick is that rug exactly? If it is really thin, it shouldn't be a problem rolling across it.

Does this piano have those huge industrial casters that are so popular now, or those more standard little wheels?

If you don't already have them, maybe an upgrade to huge casters will help just such a situation?

PS: I'm thinking this is already a done deal, and here we are: debating! laugh For all we know he is happily ensconced on the rug, practicing merrily at the piano, oblivious to our ideas. confused laugh


M&H "A" at home
Bösendorfer Imperial
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341270
06/28/06 11:33 PM
06/28/06 11:33 PM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 123
Near Los Angeles California
kennnnny Offline
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Normally I don’t expose my casters till the 3rd date.
But I’ve had two glasses of wine, and you seem like a nice guy, and what's wrong with a little whippen? so . . .

Feast your eyes on my casters.
Sorry bout the "focus".

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

Here is the rug.

[Linked Image]

There is a substanital carpet pad under it and a 6mm layer of cork underlayment.


This is
Is the was
Of what will be
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341271
06/28/06 11:46 PM
06/28/06 11:46 PM
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 3,886
San Francisco
whippen boy Offline
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Thank you for sharing your casters, Kenny.

They are so big and shiny! 3hearts (in spite of the artsy "soft focus" shot!)

I didn't expect the rug photo - gosh! shocked

It looks so ruglike. [Linked Image]

Now I'm absolutely impressed.

I predict you will be able to slide the rug effortlessly under those casters.

Actually, your friends will do the rug sliding. You will supervise (with a glass of wine, of course)!


M&H "A" at home
Bösendorfer Imperial
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341272
06/29/06 12:23 AM
06/29/06 12:23 AM
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 123
Near Los Angeles California
kennnnny Offline
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WB
I just measured it the height of the rug.
Without the cork underlayment which arrives tomorrow, the padding and rug are 3/4 inch.

The 6 mm cork underlayment will add about 1/4 inch.

Total height of the system will be about an inch.

Here is the room . . . waiting . . . longing . . . listening for the truck.

I assume they will assemble the piano on the rug and not need to roll it onto the rug.

No?

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]


This is
Is the was
Of what will be
Re: How do you install a rug under a large grand piano? #341273
06/29/06 06:13 AM
06/29/06 06:13 AM
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 3,200
Marietta, GA
Les Koltvedt Offline
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Yes


Les Koltvedt
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