2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments.
Over 100,000 members from around the world.
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Advanced Piano Tricks
Advanced Piano Tricks
(ad)
Pianoteq
Steinway Spiro Layering
(ad)
Wessell Nickel & Gross
PianoForAll
Who's Online Now
45 members (brennbaer, bimzdbear, Amelia Squires, blueviewlaguna., Boboulus, CentauriB, AprilE, An Old Square, 8 invisible), 879 guests, and 503 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
J
Janiceb Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
My teacher suggested taking the level 9 music history course. It's $499.00 I am predominantly interested in gaining knowledge rather than passing an exam. Does anybody have any input into this particular course or can you suggest an interesting alternative?

(ad)
Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,619
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,619
"The level 9" course doesn't tell us much. Does it have a name?

Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 49
J
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
J
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 49
Level 9 music course...
Never heard of it. Sounds made up.

Here you go, I'm sure you'll learn more than you wanted to.
It's free and actually pretty decent.


Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
J
Janiceb Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
Sorry....RCM level 9 music history course. I left out a very important part of this question!
https://www.rcmusic.com/learning/digital-learning/music-history-9

Joined: May 2015
Posts: 9,535
Gold Subscriber
9000 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 9,535
I would look at this 60 hr online course. I believe it is free if you don’t need a certificate

https://www.coursera.org/learn/introclassicalmusic


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
"I never dreamt with my own two hands I could touch the sky" - Sappho

It's ok to be a Work In Progress
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
J
Janiceb Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
I have looked at the Coursera one and yes it is free. Has anyone taken either of these?

Joined: May 2015
Posts: 9,535
Gold Subscriber
9000 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
9000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2015
Posts: 9,535
Originally Posted by Janiceb
I have looked at the Coursera one and yes it is free. Has anyone taken either of these?


I know some here have taken a courses thriry class, not sure about musical history. You might use the search function to search for’Coursera’.


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
"I never dreamt with my own two hands I could touch the sky" - Sappho

It's ok to be a Work In Progress
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 122
C
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
C
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 122
Hi. I would agree with JonnyIssieBangie that the Yale University Course on Listening to Music is very Good. All lectures are available free via YouTube? I have listened to quite a few and have found I have learnt a lot. It discusses how music was organised throughout history. how different instruments are used in music, music theory such as the differences between harmony and melody and much more. Certainly one to consider watching particularly as free.


Working on Faber Adult Piano Adventures AIO Book 2

Playing on a Rolands HP 505 Digital Piano
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,627
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,627
500 bucks for a music history course?! I would never pay that much.

If I were looking for non-free options I would rather buy a real printed book like this one:
https://www.amazon.com/Listening-Western-Music-Craig-Wright/dp/1305587014

Coincidentally, the author is prof. Craig Wright from Yale, the same one as in the video above.

Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 2,636
S
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Feb 2019
Posts: 2,636
Originally Posted by Janiceb
My teacher suggested taking the level 9 music history course. It's $499.00 I am predominantly interested in gaining knowledge rather than passing an exam. Does anybody have any input into this particular course or can you suggest an interesting alternative?

It depends if you want to pass RCM 9 or 10 level exam. If I am not mistaken it is a requisite. If you are not interested in the exam itself and are considering only for you own education, there are pros and cons.

The level 9 and 10 history are really a mix of various elements. There is a lot of memorization included as for example you need to know at least some basic facts and specific dates about the life and compositions of a number of composers. The exam covers various topics like being to provide description and musical characteristics of given pieces, knowing the definition of basic musical terms (ostinato, ritornello, .....), having some basic knowledge of forms (sonata, rondo, ....), life and compositions of some musicians, general evolution of music.

The pros is that it gives you a vernacular and some basic understanding of above topics. The question is just that outside of your personal interest in such topics, it will not contribute much to your piano progress per se. Of course it is important to know what is a rondo, or a ritornello as it helps to understand how pieces are written.

The main cons (outside the price) is that it involves a lot of memorization which frankly speaking is practically useless for an amateur. For example it really is of little value to know at what exact date Bach was named Cantor in Leipzig (1723). There is also very little probability that you will remember all of that after you pass the exam. So a lot of the effort will be lost soon thereafter and a lot is now readily available online.

The other main con is that to a large extent it is quite superficial. In other words studying one or 2 baroque pieces and knowing a few facts about them wont give you an indepth knowledge of the baroque compositional technique. It is good to know what figured bass is, but you need to practice using it to really understand what it is.

History can be easily acquired by simply reading good music history books. For the other topics it is more difficult as it is really a compilation of various topics. For example Understanding a sonata mouvement involves a number of elements, harmony, form, rythmic components, ....

400 box is in the same time a lot and not so much, depending on your financial situation.

Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,966
1000 Post Club Member
Offline
1000 Post Club Member
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,966
My favorite music history / education courses are from Robert Greenberg. Entertaining, sometimes cheesy, but always very good.

- website: https://robertgreenbergmusic.com
- discounted courses at https://www.thegreatcourses.com
- or subscription service at https://wondrium.com


We are the music makers,
And we are the dreamers of dreams.
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
J
Janiceb Offline OP
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
J
Joined: Feb 2020
Posts: 9
Thank you everyone for taking the time to respond. In particular, Sidokar, that is exactly what I was looking for. Groove On: I will look into your suggestions. Re: Coursera: I have a general idea what this will be about and it could be useful.

Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,272
7000 Post Club Member
Offline
7000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 7,272
I can second the courses on the Great Courses which are taught by Robert Greenberg, I like those a lot. Look for courses on sale, you should be able to get them for less than $50 IIRC.

You might also check Udemy, not because I know they have a course, but because I've seen lists of their course offerings and I would guess they have them.

Re free vs. for-pay, you might see how the curriculum is set up before deciding. The Great Courses are easy to use, you get an app and it's easy to keep track of where you are in the course. I've never used Coursera but it has a good reputation, and I would guess they have a similar infrastructure.

Beyond that, I wouldn't want something where I have to go hunting down things, poking around YT to find the next one etc.

Good luck! Maybe if you start a course and like it, come back and give us a report!


Started piano June 1999.
Proud owner of a Yamaha C2

[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
[Linked Image]
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,619
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,619
Originally Posted by Janiceb
I have looked at the Coursera one and yes it is free. Has anyone taken either of these?
I took the Yale one out of curiosity, after having studied up to Mozart in the "Grout" book (Grout was recommded here by "Kreiser", a PW teacher who has always advised excellently). The Yale course is basically the one the professor teaches over an entire semester or two, condensed into something like 6 lessons. It is open to anyone, so even those who had no theory comes in, and he scrambles to cover that. In the discussion section, those of us who had some background were trying to help students who were hopelessly lost.

I highly recommend the book I have "A History of Western Music" (Burkholder, Grout, Palisca)

If you are doing this for RCM then get a hold of the syllabus. You could even get the sample practice exams if you are going that route. I'd not want to go at that (exam) level myself, because getting in the history is much more intering, but that exists. Is't Music History divided into three exams and three period or something like that for RCM?

fwiw, when I was doing history via the book, I supplemented with the Internet. If it starts with the earliest music being in Mesopotamia, I looked up documentaries on Mesopotamia. If they introduced the Ancient Greeks' (?) bull lyre, I found a replicated bully lyre, and somedoby playing it (Lament of Seikolos). A historical drama of Louis XIV, and so on. It can pull you in with fascination and "So they thought they were teaching us history in school?"

Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,658
2000 Post Club Member
Offline
2000 Post Club Member
Joined: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,658
Does it need to be online? The RCM book itself is $50.


Lisa
Chief Cook & Pot Scrubber @ Cunningham Piano Club 🎹
Cunningham Studio Grand & Yamaha CLP645

“There is in all times a secret union of kindred spirits. Bind closer the circle, that the truth of art may shine forever clearer, spreading joy and blessing through the world.” R. Schumann
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,117
Gold Subscriber
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
Gold Subscriber
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2010
Posts: 3,117
Originally Posted by keystring
.....

I highly recommend the book I have "A History of Western Music" (Burkholder, Grout, Palisca).....

fwiw, when I was doing history via the book, I supplemented with the Internet. If it starts with the earliest music being in Mesopotamia, I looked up documentaries on Mesopotamia. If they introduced the Ancient Greeks' (?) bull lyre, I found a replicated bully lyre, and somedoby playing it (Lament of Seikolos). A historical drama of Louis XIV, and so on. It can pull you in with fascination and "So they thought they were teaching us history in school?"

I took two semesters of music history at our local college. The book we used was the one referenced above. In addition to the text, we were required to buy/rent and listen to an online compendium of the pieces (many of them, at least) referenced in the book. The Burkholder book is not cheap, nor is the online service, but the inflated cost of textbooks is pretty typical for college texts.

It's a big book (1200 pages), and a good book, one you can keep on your reference shelf for the rest of your life. I had heard the author/publisher was coming out with a condensed version, but I don't see it offered on Amazon. You could read it on your own and listen to the examples, but it would take a lot of discipline to do it right.


[Linked Image]
Yamaha C3X
In summer, the song sings itself. --William Carlos Williams

Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,619
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 18,619
Originally Posted by Stubbie
Originally Posted by keystring
.....

I highly recommend the book I have "A History of Western Music" (Burkholder, Grout, Palisca).....

fwiw, when I was doing history via the book, I supplemented with the Internet. If it starts with the earliest music being in Mesopotamia, I looked up documentaries on Mesopotamia. If they introduced the Ancient Greeks' (?) bull lyre, I found a replicated bully lyre, and somedoby playing it (Lament of Seikolos). A historical drama of Louis XIV, and so on. It can pull you in with fascination and "So they thought they were teaching us history in school?"

I took two semesters of music history at our local college. The book we used was the one referenced above. In addition to the text, we were required to buy/rent and listen to an online compendium of the pieces (many of them, at least) referenced in the book. The Burkholder book is not cheap, nor is the online service, but the inflated cost of textbooks is pretty typical for college texts.

It's a big book (1200 pages), and a good book, one you can keep on your reference shelf for the rest of your life. I had heard the author/publisher was coming out with a condensed version, but I don't see it offered on Amazon. You could read it on your own and listen to the examples, but it would take a lot of discipline to do it right.

Stubbie, there was also an on-line service that came with the book with purchase. I forget the details. There was a quizz you could take after each chapter, and I think also access to the listening examples. I forget if there was a fee, or if it was included with purchase for the first year.

Nowadays with the Internet it is less necessary. In the olden days, students would have to scrounge to find such examples. For example, I like listening to different renditions of a same piece of music, esp. performed in different periods of time (early recordings). I loved hearing the Lament of Seikolos, by googling, when I got to that chapter. To my surprise, the other day I was watching a documentary about ancient civilisations, and a snatch of music came up - I recognized the Lament.


Here's a bit of free history for the OP. wink
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seikilos_epitaph

and


Joined: May 2021
Posts: 77
C
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
C
Joined: May 2021
Posts: 77
I would second the recommendations of Robert Greenberg's courses (Great Courses). He has a lot and he's a very engaging speaker. You can probably get a hold of all of them through your local library.


Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
(ad)
PianoDisc

PianoDisc
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad)
Mason & Hamlin Pianos
New Topics - Multiple Forums
CM Repertoire Suggestions
by iloveminis - 01/24/22 11:00 PM
Help needed for Chopin Raindrop Prelude
by JpnGrl2021 - 01/24/22 09:01 PM
Fast (? Alberti) base
by Moo :) - 01/24/22 07:29 PM
Need advice on repertoire for a solo concert
by xtype10 - 01/24/22 02:44 PM
The secondhand market in the UK
by AndyG123 - 01/24/22 08:58 AM
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
Forum Statistics
Forums42
Topics211,332
Posts3,163,727
Members104,151
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers

Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | MapleStreetMusicShop.com - Our store in Cornish Maine


© copyright 1997 - 2022 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5