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+1 to the above 2 posts (well... The final words of post #1 were a bit over the top, but boy did they landed well.

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Originally Posted by Chris James
Originally Posted by maucycy
Originally Posted by Chris James
I think we'd all very much like to hear your rendition of the Chopin piece now. Your assertion that the piece is "far above me" is pretty crass (crude), but since I am an amateur I freely admit that there are doubtless better renditions out there. Of course I have only been regularly playing (for the first time in 20 years) for 10 months, so I expect I shall improve quite quickly over the next 10.
Where is your rendition of this piece, so we can set the "mark" towards which I should aim?

I will be more than happy to write detailed analysis why this is piece is too hard for you.
As I said - noone is expecting you (or any other amateur pianist) to play it on a uber-virtuoso level. However, this piece is too difficult for you, and as long as you will not be able to admit it before yourself and will just rebounce the ball, my (or anyone other help) will be pointless.
Eventually it's your decision whether you want to be a good pianist or not. By good I mean playing the pieces that are within your abilities (technically and musically), and that Nocturne is making you a lot of pain, which is just visually visible.

You are a moron. A condescending moron.

I could write a detailed analysis of why that is the case, but I doubt you would have the capacity to understand it.

Either post a video of you playing this piece or take your bullshit and shove it up your ass.

Look at your video topic.
Long brake or whatever is not explanation.

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I did try to edit my post to remove the swearing....happy for an admin to do that. Sorry to "lower the tone" and take things off topic.

This maurcycy troll has clearly pushed my buttons, spouting their ignorant, ill-informed nonsense.

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don't sweat the trolls. music is whatever you want it to be. no point in wasting time arguing with people too ignorant to understand that smile

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A few semi-random comments here, based on the discussion above:

- When criticizing how people play it's my opinion that this should be done very carefully, because even though the comment may be right in itself, the way it is presented may be really hurting. I know some people (even teachers) believe that making someone feel miserable is the way to make him improve but I personally don't believe in that. Especially when related to something emotional such as art, in this case music, an insulting comment may trigger a very deep and irreversible trauma.

- On the other hand, people should also learn accepting critique, even the harsh one. If you feel it's insulting, dishonest, ill-driven, baseless, just move on and ignore. I'm not the best example but I certainly think I've improved a lot over the years in just ignoring comments that I think are overly harsh and intended to hurt. And also, even in those comments sometimes there is truth.

- Never respond to (what you think is) insult with insults. The knee-jerk reaction is to do so, but believe me, you're always gonna sorry in the long term. I've made this habit to write an insulting reply to an insult, but not send it, just keep it in front of my eyes for a few minutes. And I always delete it then smile Breathe in before doing something silly. And believe me, the third-party witnesses know very well when someone insulted you (or not) and there's simply no need for you to try to reply in a way that is intended to show to those witnesses that you are right, they see.

- Always try to be cool smile Even if someone insults you.

- When someone says you can't play well, don't ask him to show if he can play better. I've never found this argument relevant. As they say: I don't know how to make a good cake but I know a good cake from a bad cake. Even if he hurted you with his comment, move on.

----

Sorry, didn't mean to sound like life coaching 🤣 Feel free to insult me for that 😛

Last edited by CyberGene; 09/17/21 10:31 AM.

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Well stated, CyberGene.

Originally Posted by CyberGene
- When someone says you can't play well, don't ask him to show if he can play better.

Worst case scenario, you end up on the internet as the next Fanchan meme wink


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+1 to this ...
Originally Posted by CyberGene
When criticizing how people play it's my opinion that this should be done very carefully, because even though the comment may be right in itself, the way it is presented may be really hurting. I know some people ...

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Originally Posted by CyberGene
- When criticizing how people play it's my opinion that this should be done very carefully, because even though the comment may be right in itself, the way it is presented may be really hurting. I know some people (even teachers) believe that making someone feel miserable is the way to make him improve but I personally don't believe in that. Especially when related to something emotional such as art, in this case music, an insulting comment may trigger a very deep and irreversible trauma.

Well, what happened here is that someone used their controversial interpretation of Chopin to win an argument about low-end digital pianos on the Internet. That backfired as expected and...

Quote
- On the other hand, people should also learn accepting critique, even the harsh one. If you feel it's insulting, dishonest, ill-driven, baseless, just move on and ignore. I'm not the best example but I certainly think I've improved a lot over the years in just ignoring comments that I think are overly harsh and intended to hurt. And also, even in those comments sometimes there is truth.

- Never respond to (what you think is) insult with insults. The knee-jerk reaction is to do so, but believe me, you're always gonna sorry in the long term. I've made this habit to write an insulting reply to an insult, but not send it, just keep it in front of my eyes for a few minutes. And I always delete it then smile Breathe in before doing something silly. And believe me, the third-party witnesses know very well when someone insulted you (or not) and there's simply no need for you to try to reply in a way that is intended to show to those witnesses that you are right, they see.

...lead to lots of insults (means one lost the argument) paired with...

Quote
- Always try to be cool smile Even if someone insults you.

- When someone says you can't play well, don't ask him to show if he can play better. I've never found this argument relevant. As they say: I don't know how to make a good cake but I know a good cake from a bad cake. Even if he hurted you with his comment, move on.

...with a typical fallacy, meaning losing the argument on a second front.

I've seen convincing interpretations of simpler classical works on folded actions by professional pianists (who without any doubt used real grand pianos to practice them), but I've yet to see Rach 16,4 done well on a P-45 or the like. And the latter is the topic of this thread.


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For anyone curious to hear the performance in question, it's at http://forum.pianoworld.com/ubbthreads.php/topics/3147115/chopin-nocturne-op-48-no-1.html (and I posted my own comments about it there)

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Originally Posted by CyberGene
I don't know how to make a good cake but I know a good cake from a bad cake.

Oooh! Did someone mention cake? Mine's a whacking great slice of Victoria Sponge please. Don't skimp on the buttercream. And none of your gluten-free rubbish neither - I want to be able to swallow it without having to chew 100 times.

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Mmmmmmmmmmm. Cake.


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At our age, cakes are not for eating. They are for reminiscing over on those days when others are eating them in your company and watching you visibly drool.
Reminiscing can, too, have serious consequences.


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I guess you've not been to my local bake shop, eh?
Their cakes are for eating. And I see the consequences every time I look down.
Originally Posted by peterws
At our age, cakes are not for eating. They are for reminiscing ...

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Originally Posted by MacMacMac
I guess you've not been to my local bake shop, eh?
Their cakes are for eating. And I see the consequences every time I look down.
Originally Posted by peterws
At our age, cakes are not for eating. They are for reminiscing ...

I know! But like so many things I like now, they don't necessarily like me. But Bakewells or Christmas cake (anything wi marzipan on or in it) are both my passion and poison unfortunately.
'S no good. I'll have to start smoking. But what?


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Originally Posted by EssBrace
Originally Posted by CyberGene
I don't know how to make a good cake but I know a good cake from a bad cake.

Oooh! Did someone mention cake? Mine's a whacking great slice of Victoria Sponge please. Don't skimp on the buttercream. And none of your gluten-free rubbish neither - I want to be able to swallow it without having to chew 100 times.


Taking a page out of Steve Martin’s can’t fail simple procedure for becoming a millionaire, Step 1 - get a million bucks. For good cakes, substitute liberally step 1 ) get a good cake or failing that, 1B) marry someone who knows how to make good cakes, failing those, take a page out of macmacmac’s solution ...... eerily similar to George Carlin’s segment on strange expressions “ man that REAlly takes the cake! .... where do you take a cake? .... down to the bakery to visit all the other pastries.


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Originally Posted by AmPianistComposer
I currently own a Yamaha P-45 (four years old) and I'm currently working on Rachmaninoff's moment musicaux, Chopin's polonaise, and some Liszt etudes...

Do you think this piano meets the requirements?
Lately, I have been feeling that this piano is not performing up to the mark (not receiving the right sound and touch response that I expect).
I've worked on different ways to improvise my technique, but I still don't see a change.

What do you think?
Should I upgrade to a new one? Any tips?

I've lately been considering the Yamaha Clavinova and Kawai Concert Artist series.
Maybe-
=> Yamaha clp 785 or 795gp
OR
=> Kawai ca99

It would be helpful if you could also provide insights on which of the two mentioned are better too! smile

Thanks!
AmPianistComposer

At your level, I would'nt be happy if I didn't have access to a REAL acoustic piano. As a piano teacher I'd never recommend intermediate/advanced students to use a digital piano as their main practice instrument - only if a real piano is out of the question - and in some cases it is for various reasons, then at least one would definitely benefit from having with a more premium digital piano such as a KAWAI ES920/ Roland FP-90X etc. (or a console digital with better wooden action if taking the piano out is never your intention. HOWEVER again due to the size of these things an acoustic would be always preferable!)

From your post I get the feeling that the P-45 hinders your development as a pianist musician and as such you do more harm then good to yourself even if you invest the time to practice. I played the Roland P-125/45 series. You need an upgrade pronto.

I never had a student that stuck on an entry level keyboard for so many (4) years... usually students upgrade their keys between 1-2 years on average (depends on personal progress, practice time, other factors etc.) from starting out with the the entry keyboard (most often than not a portable 5 octave) to an actual weighted hammer action (acoustic/digital) piano .

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Originally Posted by Chummy
At your level, I would'nt be happy if I didn't have access to a REAL acoustic piano. As a piano teacher I'd never recommend intermediate/advanced students to use a digital piano as their main practice instrument.
[...]
I never had a student that stuck on an entry level keyboard for so many (4) years...

It's kinda amusing how with the very little information provided by the OP everyone is making up a story in their mind. From your perspective you're seeing a advanced piano student, who is stuck for four years on a toy digital piano as their practice tool.

I don't think that is the case.


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Originally Posted by JoeT
Originally Posted by Chummy
At your level, I would'nt be happy if I didn't have access to a REAL acoustic piano. As a piano teacher I'd never recommend intermediate/advanced students to use a digital piano as their main practice instrument.
[...]
I never had a student that stuck on an entry level keyboard for so many (4) years...

It's kinda amusing how with the very little information provided by the OP everyone is making up a story in their mind. From your perspective you're seeing a advanced piano student, who is stuck for four years on a toy digital piano as their practice tool.

I don't think that is the case.

Too many music teachers have hardly set finger on a digital. And too many acoustic pianos are hard and dangerous places to learn on.
D'ya think I'd trade in my ES110 for a B1 now? Having played both there's just no comparison!


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If you're going to get a digital piano, try other brands besides Yamaha. Some Yamaha actions are heavy and you make like the action of a Kawai, Roland or Casio better.

Re: the digital vs. acoustic debate:

My first 15 years of practicing piano were spent playing on a late 1980s Yamaha digital with primitive weighted action, and I turned out OK smile

Then again, I didn't try playing any pieces as difficult as the ones OP mentioned!

And I guess I still don't... so maybe I didn't turn out so OK after all. But I have fun and keep playing anyway.

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Originally Posted by JoeT
It's kinda amusing how with the very little information provided by the OP everyone is making up a story in their mind. From your perspective you're seeing a advanced piano student, who is stuck for four years on a toy digital piano as their practice tool.

FORE!

This thread certainly has developed a variety of story lines, least among them remains the OP’s initial and seemingly sincere inquiry. I think it would be nice to hear from them but since they as protagonist so far have filled a cameo role .... amusing? ....i dunno but given the subsequent ebbs and flows of dialog, once birthed, threads apparently can and do spin and wind and go on as though of their own volition sans OP. An antagonist just now giving voice to having derived some imagined amusement is probably on par for this particular course.


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