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Hello everyone.

Before I ask you your opinion on those wooden keys models, I have to tell that I own an MP 6 and I'm more than happy with it. I 've also played an MP 7 (first edition) for some time and I think it's excellent as well. I don't know if there is any serious difference to MP7 SE.
The differences between MP6 and MP7 are minimal for not highly advanced piano playing IMHO. Both pianos are fantastic Midi Controllers and all piano sounds (especially the electric ones), with some editing, are up to par with some of the best sampled vsts (I have a lot of VST experience). I never liked Pianoteq.
MP7 has much much better organ sounds and controls (that's why the action has more of the lighter keys, otherwise the feel is similar) but I'm no organ player, so MP 6 is great for me.

Now I'm thinking of buying used, one of the models with the wooden action (for a more real piano experience) and as far as I know they have very similar - and even better- midi capabilities to MP6.
So I'm looking for MP 11, MP 11 SE and MP 10.
I bet MP 10 must be very similar to MP 6 soundwise but with a wooden action, and I would be very happy with it. I also know that the MP11 has an improved sound engine (similar to MP7). I don't know if MP 11 SE is so much better. Triple sensor is not something- I think- I will ever care about for the blues - rock - pop style I play.
There is also a price difference on the current used market, between MP 10 (around 1000 euros), MP 11 (around 1300) and MP11 SE (around 1500) I don't know if it's really worth it.

Has any of you first hand experience on comparing some of these models (more than just playing them once)? What are the differences between MP 11 and MP 11 SE? And what about the action feel and overall engine function between MP 10 and the newer models? Any opinions please?

Thanks in advance

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Take a look here: https://www.digitalpianoreviewguide.com/kawai-mp11se-review/

Major improvements are the SK-EX, EX and SK-5 samples, a new pedal unit.


Kawai: NV5 | MP11SE
Pianoteq 7 Pro | Garritan CFX Full | Vienna Imperial | Keyscape Full | Ravenscroft 275 - Modern U - Model D - AG | Minigrand
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Thanks Tyr for your opinion. I ve seen that review. Not a very helpful first hand experience. I would say that it's very generic

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Actually this video replies my question regarding MP11 vs MP11SE in a cool way.



So...now the question is if MP 11 is so superior to MP 10 to justify a 400 euros difference on the used market. Especially for a satisfied MP 6 user. Any ideas?

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The action is significantly different between the MP10 and MP11, the latter of which uses the Grand Feel 1, and is widely regarded as one of the best you can find in a slab today.

The MP10 also had an older sound engine, UPHI, compared to the MP11 and MP11SE.

It all depends on what you like in the end, but periodically I works not go for a used MP10 at $1000, if an MP11 we're available for $3-400 more.


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Hello,

Originally Posted by tedsorvino1
... a satisfied MP 6 user...

So -- it escapes me why you would want to change at all?

Cheers and happy further research,

HZ

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I never said I will change HZPiano. I want to add and eventually I may change.
I mean the MP6 is much more portable for gigs etc. and has excellent Midi capabilities.
And yes Gombessa I think MP11 is the one for me.
If in time I realize that MP 11 does everything I need it to do and I haven't got any need to carry MP6 around I may sell it, otherwise it will always be a perfect back up instrument.
Thanks for your reply

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One action is not better than the other (RM3 vs. GF1), and it all comes down to personal preference.

From my own experience, I preferred the RM3 action in the MP10 over the GF1 action; which I found light-fluffy-bouncy.

As for the sound engine, no, I was not happy with the MP10’s on-board piano and used Pianoteq exclusively.

I am not sure if the MP11/SE uses Kawai’s current sound engine (CA99\NV10) which is superb (I’m not a fan of Kawai’s older engines).

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Thanks Pete14 anyways but I have to admit that a bit lighter is better for me - especially near the post- since I love wurlitzer pianos which in general tend to favor lighter keys. As you realize I disagree with your taste on the other fields as well. But it's your opinion and I do appreciate it. Cheers.

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The MP11SE carries the same (HIXL) piano voices like the Soundmode voices on the NV and CA Series.

I had the VPC-1 which has the RM3 action and i prefer the GF action. Everything feels light when coming from heavier actions.

Last edited by Tyr; 09/14/21 10:59 AM.

Kawai: NV5 | MP11SE
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What I understand Tyr is that there is a significant price difference on the used market for the SE (MP 11 or 7), since they are the current kawai stage piano models and they are quite newer. The main reason is better on board sound engine, which will anyways be obsolette very very soon and the optical pedal doesn't do any difference to most players. So I seriously doubt it that this price difference really worths it at the moment.
Of course it's not wrong if somebody has more money to spend it on the SE.

Last edited by tedsorvino1; 09/14/21 11:25 AM.
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Originally Posted by tedsorvino1
What I understand Tyr is that there is a significant price difference on the used market for the SE (MP 11 or 7), since they are the current kawai stage piano models and they are quite newer. The main reason is better on board sound engine, which will anyways be obsolette very very soon and the optical pedal doesn't do any difference to most players. So I seriously doubt it that this price difference really worths it at the moment.
Of course it's not wrong if somebody has more money to spend it on the SE.

Sound-wise, the main difference between the MP11 and the SE is the addition of the (highly lauded) SK-EX sample to the same HI-XL sound engine. The MP11 has the slightly older Concert EX as its main/default sample (though some prefer that one).

One thing to note, the 3 pedal unit was a bit of a sore spot for me and other owners of the MP11. Not going to lie, it was a bit of rubbish, and not known for its performance or reliability. I experienced some creaking and notchy travel on mine, and many others reported failures with their units that required replacement by Kawai. I'm REALLY glad Kawai updated it for the MP11SE with its excellent 3-pedal optical unit. If you don't use the pedals, then that's one thing. But I would say the new unit is a much-welcomed reliability upgrade.


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Thanks Gombessa for the info. I use the FP 10 from the early 10s for simpe sustain, along with a cheap one for soft (or the odd sostennuto hold) on my MP 6. I have no problem with those. I seriously doubt that the original FP 30 are worse for my playing. Maybe SK-EX is great. I don't know, can't tell...but still..300 -500 euros?

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I have played some amount on the MP10 and own the MP11 (never tried the MP11SE).

In my subjective opinion, there are noticeable differences between the two. BTW I only care about the acoustic piano sounds and have little interest in the other features/sounds/MIDI etc. as I use it mainly for silent practice, in some form say substituting for my acoustic grand (I do occasionally use the on board recorder, though).

To my ears, the improvement in acoustic piano sounds on the MP11 makes this one the clear winner. I was considering purchasing at the time an MP10 as it neared the end of its manufacturing cycle but I was a little hesitant with its piano sounds which were not as convincing (to me) as I would have liked. Then the MP11 was introduced and this concern of mine was greatly alleviated to the point of no longer being an issue.

The second very obvious difference (as Pete14 mentions above) pertains to the keyboard touch (RM3 vs GF1). I concur that the key feel on the MP11 is certainly lighter and a little bouncier, while the one on the MP10 is "meatier", i.e. heavier and with more inertia if that makes any sense. I know you said it was not important to you, but the MP11 does have the triple sensor (2 on the MP10), and it does make some amount of difference to me. I found that I could adapt to both keybeds, with the feel of the MP10 being probably closer to that of my acoustic grand. This one certainly comes down to personal preference.

The MP11SE has the same keyboard (GF1), but with additional piano samples (also as above) however I have never tried this model so cannot compare. One non-negligible advantage on this model would be the pedal unit which gets rid of the analog potentiometers found on previous models in favour of an optical unit. I did experience a failure of my original MP11 pedal unit, but Kawai stepped in and provided an identical replacement free of charge which has since been working flawlessly.

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Thanks Kanadajin. Very informative opinion.

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Originally Posted by tedsorvino1
What I understand Tyr is that there is a significant price difference on the used market for the SE (MP 11 or 7), since they are the current kawai stage piano models and they are quite newer. The main reason is better on board sound engine, which will anyways be obsolette very very soon and the optical pedal doesn't do any difference to most players. So I seriously doubt it that this price difference really worths it at the moment.
Of course it's not wrong if somebody has more money to spend it on the SE.

The 3-Pedal unit alone is worth the money. The godawful Fatar Crap Pedal Unit made me return the VPC1.


Kawai: NV5 | MP11SE
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I don't disagree with your experience Tyr, but the newer pedal can be easily found for around 150 euros. And if we 're talking about a price difference of 150 euros between the two models then the SE is a winner. But usually that's not the case in the used market.

What I've figured out so far is that the SE is quite superior, with all the original superb features plus more models and a great modern pedal. And if can be found around 1500 euros really worths the money.
The older MP11 is still really good and worths its 1200-1300 euros if you don't mind less piano models and a not so great triple pedal.
And the MP10 is much older and weaker as a sound engine and midi controller, with a nice heavier action similar to VPC and may not really worth its 900-1000 usual price.

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The newer pedal is incompatible to the VPC1 and MP11SE predecessors. That's why i bought the MP11SE instead. I think it's quite difficult to find a used MP11SE for less than 1700€


Kawai: NV5 | MP11SE
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Originally Posted by tedsorvino1
Hello everyone.

Before I ask you your opinion on those wooden keys models, I have to tell that I own an MP 6 and I'm more than happy with it. I 've also played an MP 7 (first edition) for some time and I think it's excellent as well. I don't know if there is any serious difference to MP7 SE.
The differences between MP6 and MP7 are minimal for not highly advanced piano playing IMHO. Both pianos are fantastic Midi Controllers and all piano sounds (especially the electric ones), with some editing, are up to par with some of the best sampled vsts (I have a lot of VST experience). I never liked Pianoteq.
MP7 has much much better organ sounds and controls (that's why the action has more of the lighter keys, otherwise the feel is similar) but I'm no organ player, so MP 6 is great for me.

Now I'm thinking of buying used, one of the models with the wooden action (for a more real piano experience) and as far as I know they have very similar - and even better- midi capabilities to MP6.
So I'm looking for MP 11, MP 11 SE and MP 10.
I bet MP 10 must be very similar to MP 6 soundwise but with a wooden action, and I would be very happy with it. I also know that the MP11 has an improved sound engine (similar to MP7). I don't know if MP 11 SE is so much better. Triple sensor is not something- I think- I will ever care about for the blues - rock - pop style I play.
There is also a price difference on the current used market, between MP 10 (around 1000 euros), MP 11 (around 1300) and MP11 SE (around 1500) I don't know if it's really worth it.

Has any of you first hand experience on comparing some of these models (more than just playing them once)? What are the differences between MP 11 and MP 11 SE? And what about the action feel and overall engine function between MP 10 and the newer models? Any opinions please?

Thanks in advance

It seems to me that you already know the answer. The new keyboards are overpriced and sound the same as the old ones. Why bother even asking?


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Originally Posted by tedsorvino1
So...now the question is if MP 11 is so superior to MP 10 to justify a 400 euros difference on the used market. Especially for a satisfied MP 6 user. Any ideas?

You need to make up your mind first! You're either satisfied or not. If satisfied, no need to change it, and if not then change it!


Kawai MP7SE, Yamaha MOTF XF6, Yamaha WX5, Yamaha Pacifica 112v
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