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Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Not enough 'dotting' of the dotted rhythms in the first section of Chopin's Fantaisie in F minor.

Most people don't even not-dot them enough; they play them as though they were flat-out triplets.

I know that some people think that's what the dotting means....

I agree, and I would extend that to almost any dotted rhythm.

There are baroque composers who intended a triplet rhythm when using the notation.

Louis-Claude Daquin's Swiss Noel is an example. It clearly is not intended as 4 against 3.

http://forums.pianoworld.com/ubbthr...core-extract.html#lg=3019622&slide=0

Last edited by Sweelinck; 05/12/21 03:25 AM.

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I do the asynchronized hand thing, mostly because I am almost always playing something romantic and I'm trying to curb it because it has a schmaltzy tendency. But I have noticed I tend to do it when I want to add emphasis but don't want to do it through volume.

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Originally Posted by Orange Soda King
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Not enough 'dotting' of the dotted rhythms in the first section of Chopin's Fantaisie in F minor.

Most people don't even not-dot them enough; they play them as though they were flat-out triplets.

I know that some people think that's what the dotting means....

I agree, and I would extend that to almost any dotted rhythm.

Prokofiev's Montegues and Capulets gets this treatment alllll the time. Those crisp dotted rhythms get dulled out to a soft triplet.

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Obviously this isn't a piece that I think too many people have studied since the turn of this century - but listening to the few recorded interpretations available of one of my favorite pieces, the MacDowell Piano Concerto No. 2 in D minor, almost everyone makes the same mistake.

MacDowell, almost completely literally, copies a motif from the end of the opening cadenza of the Saint-Saëns Piano Concerto No. 2 in G minor, and places it in the middle of the first [of three] cadenzas for the piano.

Sanroma holds the notes, which are written with fermatas, to let you know, that Saint-Saëns was the source of inspiration for the motif. (See 1:22)



Watts on the other hand... (See 1:36)



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I believe certain composers and their pieces in the less-played repertoire ought to be re-examined.
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Pianists who overpedal classical music (e.g. Mozart). It drives me nuts!


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Originally Posted by twocats
Pianists who overpedal classical music (e.g. Mozart). It drives me nuts!

Hehe, in a similar vein, pianists who overpedal Bach drive me to drink! Literally and figuratively!

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Pianists who play too loud while they accompany a soloist.

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Originally Posted by Joseph Fleetwood
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by Joseph Fleetwood
I'm doing a dissertation on this for my DMA....

How about that, folks!! thumb

I've yet to defend it.... or even write it yet, let's see how it turns out! I'm backing it up with a recording of Liszt and Rachmaninoff done in the old style. This could either be very good or turn out extremely badly......

No I'm remaining positive......

Ugh what have I got myself into....

I believe Chopin wrote or said something like that rubato should be done by the right hand with the left hand as conductor.


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Originally Posted by Sweelinck
I believe Chopin wrote or said something like that rubato should be done by the right hand with the left hand as conductor.

That left hand better be dang good.


Only in men's imagination does every truth find an effective and undeniable existence. Imagination, not invention, is the supreme master of art as of life. -Józef Teodor Konrad Korzeniowski
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It's quite liberating (and enjoyable) to play as Chopin commanded, the RH roaming free like a bird (as it were) while the LH plays in strict time, the two hands only meeting up very occasionally, like long-lost relatives finding each other across the oceans via FB. (I'm not on social media, but I've been reliably informed that does happen).
That of course, is the impression one wants to give in his Berceuse.

The only problem is that Chopin himself never played like that. After all, we know that he didn't realize he couldn't keep time in his own Mazurkas, so almost certainly, his LH was following his RH like an obedient dog, even though he thought it was off the leash and trotting along to its own strict beat.....


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It drives me nuts to listen to Bach that is bereft of emotion. I don’t know how people decided that Bach should be played like a computer.

Here’s how Bach prefaced the Inventions (not sure who did the translation though):

Quote
Forthright instruction, wherewith lovers of the clavier, especially those desirous of learning, are shown in a clear way not only 1) to learn to play two voices clearly, but also after further progress 2) to deal correctly and well with three obbligato parts, moreover at the same time to obtain not only good ideas, but also to carry them out well, but most of all to achieve a cantabile style of playing, and thereby to acquire a strong foretaste of composition.

I’m pretty sure Bach had emotions 😀 And people from the Baroque era were not robots. Feel free to disagree.


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In the following article, the author uses the term "contrametric rubato" for when the left hand stays at least close to strict time, and "agogic rubato" for when all parts participate in the rhythmic liberty. The author uses the term "splitting the hands" for decoupling the timing of the left and right hands for notes scored on the beats, and suggests that may have grown from contrametric rubato, which the author traces back to at least 1596.

https://scholarship.claremont.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1123&context=ppr


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People who argue about how to play Bach on the piano.

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