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Originally Posted by mmathew
For my own peace of mind, I sold my CA79. The dealer didn't even try to talk me out of it. In fact he gave more than half price plus hauled it away from my home conveniently. As tempting as it was for me to chose an NV10 as a replacement, I said out a loud NO to Kawai.

You are very lucky to have sold it.

I decided to resell my CA79 after discovering the serious software bugs, which prevent me from using the piano with serenity.

Unfortunately, a new lockdown here in Italy for several weeks has prevented me from finally getting rid of it, and unfortunately it is still in my house. As soon as the lockdown ends, I'm reselling it immediately, and I'm counting the hours and minutes for it to happen as soon as possible.

I have a great deal of anger at spending so much money on a tool with shamefully flawed software.

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If you were looking at the Nv10 as a real purchase possibility then you were never going to be happy with the Ca99.

I can't understand why someone would drop all that money on a high end piano with the intention to replace it shortly after at twice the price.

Last edited by InspiredByKawai; 04/16/21 05:10 PM.
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Originally Posted by InspiredByKawai
If you were looking at the Nv10 as a real purchase possibility then you were never going to be happy with the Ca99.

I can't understand why someone would drop all that money on a high end piano with the intention to replace it shortly after at twice the price.

I didn't plan on getting another piano when considering the CA99, it was afterwards when i came into some more money that i decided to get a hybrid.

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Okay so latest update, I've been to Bonners today to try out NV10 and N1X side by side for the third time now! I've decided on the Yamaha.

My CA99 apparently is fine and not faulty according to the technician who came round from Kawai as you all know... The chap at bonners said he doesn't deal with warranty that's kawai, so there's no way I'm getting a replacement piano if they've come to the conclusion it's not faulty (despite clear YouTube evidence it is). So im stuck with a faulty CA99 no one wants to look at or have. Luckily bonners will have it back as a trade in for a new piano of my choice, so that's fine.

So i just want to add to this forum my experience of Kawai, and in over 20 years of owning digital pianos I have never had any issues with customer service or faults or technicians until last year when I decided to buy a kawai product. Angry technicians (there's been other complaints apparently), faulty keys, months to raise issues and for anyone to come out (I was purposely ignored) yep Kawai have lost me as a customer, I was dead set on a NV10 but will not take the risk of purchasing one no longer.

This will be the last post from me about this, and unfortunately I don't reccomend Kawai as a company any more, if they want to screw me over they can take this as my response... This is a 100 per cent honest review of Kawai, i have a witness also who can confirm the treatment I've had with my CA99.

Good riddance.

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Originally Posted by mwf
Okay so latest update, I've been to Bonners today to try out NV10 and N1X side by side for the third time now! I've decided on the Yamaha.

My CA99 apparently is fine and not faulty according to the technician who came round from Kawai as you all know... The chap at bonners said he doesn't deal with warranty that's kawai, so there's no way I'm getting a replacement piano if they've come to the conclusion it's not faulty (despite clear YouTube evidence it is). So im stuck with a faulty CA99 no one wants to look at or have. Luckily bonners will have it back as a trade in for a new piano of my choice, so that's fine.

So i just want to add to this forum my experience of Kawai, and in over 20 years of owning digital pianos I have never had any issues with customer service or faults or technicians until last year when I decided to buy a kawai product. Angry technicians (there's been other complaints apparently), faulty keys, months to raise issues and for anyone to come out (I was purposely ignored) yep Kawai have lost me as a customer, I was dead set on a NV10 but will not take the risk of purchasing one no longer.

This will be the last post from me about this, and unfortunately I don't reccomend Kawai as a company any more, if they want to screw me over they can take this as my response... This is a 100 per cent honest review of Kawai, i have a witness also who can confirm the treatment I've had with my CA99.

Good riddance.

Thanks for the update. It's very puzzling that Kawai continually drops the ball like this... and you are fairly high profile as far as customers go, so it was in Kawai's best interests to resolve documented hardware issues on a flagship instrument.

A CA99 with sticky keys is simply not acceptable and the issue should have been resolved. I believe you are not the first person who has reported moving from Kawai to N1X after unresolved issues.

Your journey with digital pianos has been very eventful in the last few months. Looking forward to your updates and experiences with the N1X!

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Originally Posted by navindra
Thanks for the update. It's very puzzling that Kawai continually drops the ball like this... and you are fairly high profile as far as customers go, so it was in Kawai's best interests to resolve documented hardware issues on a flagship instrument.
I think you will find it is Kawai UK which is the problem. I had a similar experience four years ago and if you look through the threads you will find others who have suffered in this way, Elsewhere Kawai customer service seems to be ok.


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Originally Posted by Colin Miles
I think you will find it is Kawai UK which is the problem. I had a similar experience four years ago and if you look through the threads you will find others who have suffered in this way, Elsewhere Kawai customer service seems to be ok.

Hasn't UK been bourgeois the longest, I'd have thought their service in this sort of thing is tiptop.

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I no longer belong to this owner’s club, but I did for 6 months. I owned a CA79 rosewood. I sold it a couple weeks ago at a $1000 loss.

While I owned the ca79, I took my Casio PX870 to the repair center. The 870 had three lose keys which rattled a tad.... one more so than the other two. I took it in for service just shy of it’s one year warranty. It took darn near 6 months to have it repaired during these Covid times. I figured they would repair the 3 bad keys, but they ended up replacing the entire keyboard assembly, which sorta surprised me. It’s fine now, everything works great. I had the CA79 to play while the Casio was in the shop, so that worked out well.

My only issue with the Casio is the short key length, which I dislike very much, but I decided I’m going to live with px870 and it’s short keys a couple more years then reassess my piano situation.

So, why did I sell the CA79? Certainly not because of the action. It had wonderful action. No clicks or weird noises. Certainly no friction noises like poster mfw is experiencing. I loved the action! No software issues that concerned me. I sold it because for some reason that CA79 gave me tinnitus. I’d get this ringing muffled sense in my ears during and after playing. I’d feel it right to the core of my brain. I have no idea why that CA79 did this, but it did. Thankfully I don’t get that sensation from my Casio or a couple Yamahas I played during lessons. I’m also fine with an acoustic grand Kawai I play during lessons.

I’m 62 and spent a lot of years listening to loud music through headphones and some loud machinery here and there.

Unfortunately for me, that CA79 would bother my hearing. It’s a pity. Not only because of the 1k loss, but also because I figured the Kawai action paired with an Onkyo sound system would be the answer. For me it wasn’t.

Anybody else have an issue like that, where a particular type of DP sound causes hearing issues?

I’d like to play a Casio GP310, but I can’t find anyplace that has them available to play. One thing I learned... PLAY THE DP BEFORE BUYING! Call me crazy, but I like sound of my PX870. The GP310 with its full length wooden keys has my interest, but like I said, I’m gonna sit tight a couple more years.... Maybe. LOL

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@Muskellunge: I'm curious if that hearing problem you had with the CA79 was only with the SK-EX main piano sound, or with all the other variants and with the EX-based (much more clean sounding, IMHO) variants too.
And I'm curious if the problem was there with headphones too, or just with the DP internal speakers.

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There is one note on my ca-79 that rattles my skull on the left side. I think the note is D#5, but I have to have the volume full up and hit the key very hard. Strange thing is if I move my head a couple octaves to the left or right it doesn't happen. If I wear headphones it doesn't happen. If I sit on the floor under the piano, it happens with the bottom speakers as well. I don't blame the piano for this, I think it's me.


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For me it's G6

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MagicPiano,
That tinnitus hearing issue was definitely most pronounced from the SK_EX by far. I tried headphones a little with sorta similar results. But that may have been because my ears were shot at the time from listening through the speakers prior to trying the phones.The muffled ringing effect would last for hours after playing. I don’t think some of those overtones I heard in SK-EX had anything to do with it, but I do know I didn’t like them. Hitting the middle C, I’d here the next octave C ringing out. Same deal with other notes. Seemed a bit too much. Usually the default piano should sound best. I didn’t think so.

It’s other 3 or 4 piano sounds I just couldn’t find a pleasing balanced tone. In some, the bass notes sounded muffled while the higher notes were shrill. I just couldn’t find a nice balanced sound in any of its pianos None of the sounds moved or inspired me.

I didn’t even wanna play the thing because it would mess with my hearing too much. And like I said, the other piano sounds just didn’t seem balanced. I really only tried the piano sounds, never messed with the organs or others. I did try the harpsichord, but I found that to be weak and tinny. Very thin.

I’m not bashing Kawai here. I thought it had A+ action. For some reason, it’s sound didn’t work for me. This surprised me because I love the sound of a buddies Kawai upright and the Kawai grand I play during lessons. I was hoping the CA 79 could kinda sorta duplicate these in sound. It didn’t.

Even though I lost a grand, I was happy to sell it. I’m enjoying my PX 870 very much for now. Unlike the Kawai, it inspires me to play. This is a personal preference of course.

Again, this is only my opinion. Nothing wrong with the quality of Kawai from what I saw. People have different taste. Like they say, that’s why they make vanilla and chocolate.


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A bit off topic, but:

I bought a CA-79 in November. We love the action. We spend half the year in a cottage. I don't fancy the thought of moving this 160-pound piano back and forth every 6 months. I thought of buying a 2nd CA-79 for about 2 seconds (not that I can afford it), but the cottage is shut down and unheated for the winter, and it gets down to -40 degrees at times (central Alberta). I can't imagine the piano surviving that.

So, I'm wondering what "portable" has an action that is similar or usable that we might find acceptable? Roland's PHA-50 action (FP-90x) is the only one I've tried that might be OK, but I haven't tried it since before we ordered our CA-79.

What about the Kawai ES920 with it's updated RH3 action? Anybody familiar with it? The ES920 only weighs 37 pounds.


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Originally Posted by RickM
What about the Kawai ES920 with it's updated RH3 action? Anybody familiar with it? The ES920 only weighs 37 pounds.
The owners thread is here.

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@RickM the FP-90x is new, it was launched not 2 months ago. It's supposed to be an improvement on the FP-90. The acoustic piano sounds are completely synthetic, with some adjustable parameters, which may not be to everyone's taste but on the other hand you won't have any of the problems associated with sampling. It has an optional furniture stand that you can leave at the cottage.
People who have tried different iterations of Roland's models swear the action on latter models is often better even if the technical name is the same. That may have to do with the way it's integrated with the sound engine, however. I don't know how it all compares to other brands or models, but I think you should try one out.

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It makes alot more sense to get the fp90 because you've already got a kawai flavored one.

Check the action first though, that could be a deal breaker.

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Originally Posted by Muskellunge
MagicPiano,
That tinnitus hearing issue was definitely most pronounced from the SK_EX by far. I tried headphones a little with sorta similar results. But that may have been because my ears were shot at the time from listening through the speakers prior to trying the phones.The muffled ringing effect would last for hours after playing. I don’t think some of those overtones I heard in SK-EX had anything to do with it, but I do know I didn’t like them. Hitting the middle C, I’d here the next octave C ringing out. Same deal with other notes. Seemed a bit too much. Usually the default piano should sound best. I didn’t think so.
I don't know if it's the same feeling as yours but I never really liked how the middle C sounds with the SK-EX main piano sound. To me it's like the 3 strings in the original instrument were not well tuned between them. If it was an acoustic instrument I would definitely try a different tuning of the 3 strings for the C4 note, but unfortunately this is just a sample based digital piano, so if you don't like how the original acoustic instrument was tuned on some notes you can't do anything about it. But probably there are people out there who love how that C4 sounds...
Personally I use a customized EX warm/mellow variant as my default piano sound, because I like to have more dynamic range at disposal of my fingers to be able to put more "space" between the notes.
Quote
It’s other 3 or 4 piano sounds I just couldn’t find a pleasing balanced tone. In some, the bass notes sounded muffled while the higher notes were shrill. I just couldn’t find a nice balanced sound in any of its pianos None of the sounds moved or inspired me. [...]

I’m not bashing Kawai here. I thought it had A+ action. For some reason, it’s sound didn’t work for me. This surprised me because I love the sound of a buddies Kawai upright and the Kawai grand I play during lessons. I was hoping the CA 79 could kinda sorta duplicate these in sound. It didn’t.
IMHO no current digital piano (even in the top range) manages to give you the same (or very similar) sound and feeling of its acoustic counterpart. I think they are still far away, so they are not suitable to prepare for a Chopin piano competition but they are "enough" to learn to play piano or just to have fun. And the best thing is that you can play with headphones. Of course the hybrids can give you the same action of a grand, but the sound? No, they are not there yet...
Quote
Even though I lost a grand, I was happy to sell it. I’m enjoying my PX 870 very much for now. Unlike the Kawai, it inspires me to play. This is a personal preference of course.

Again, this is only my opinion. Nothing wrong with the quality of Kawai from what I saw. People have different taste. Like they say, that’s why they make vanilla and chocolate.
Of course... To each his own!

Moral of the story: never buy a digital piano without hearing it first how it sounds... laugh

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Originally Posted by RickM
So, I'm wondering what "portable" has an action that is similar or usable that we might find acceptable? Roland's PHA-50 action (FP-90x) is the only one I've tried that might be OK, but I haven't tried it since before we ordered our CA-79.

What about the Kawai ES920 with it's updated RH3 action? Anybody familiar with it? The ES920 only weighs 37 pounds.

Thanks for the replies thus far!

I'm hoping to find somebody who has played both the CA-79/99 (GF III action) and the new ES920 (RH3 action). I'll try the ES920 owner's thread too.

For me, action is everything. If the action isn't suitable, it's out. For example, it took me one finger and 5 seconds to eliminate the Yamaha P-515. I didn't even turn it on. I wouldn't want one for free no matter how good the CFX and Bösendorfer sound. That's me, no need to defend the P-515 if you love it (many many people do).

I'm not looking for new sounds, just a comparable action to the CA-79. In my city, I can get a ES920 for CAD$800.00 less than the F-90x. This morning my dealer said I could try out the next ES920 that arrives before he delivers it to the customer. That should happen in the next month or so.


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Originally Posted by entonio
@RickM the FP-90x is new, it was launched not 2 months ago. It's supposed to be an improvement on the FP-90.

I see my post was a bit unclear. It sort of looks like I said I tried the FP-90x in November. The PHA-50 action that I tried in November was in an LX-705, which where I live is the same price as the CA-79. The store didn't have an FP-90, and of course the FP-90x wasn't out yet. I have a pretty solid portable stand (not an "X" style), and as a 2nd piano we could probably get by with just the included DP-10 single pedal (I have another one of those already too).


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Oh, I imagined the one you had tried was the FP-90. What I was pointing out was that the FP-90x is supposed to be better than the FP-90. With so many pointing out that it's not only the action but also the way sound responds to it, I thought it expedient tp say that you really have to try the specific model you're looking to evaluate, even if a similar one may have the same nominal action.

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