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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Some things are like that: The best way to capture a thing with a single word sometimes is with a word that isn't exactly exactly right in a hyperspecific sense.

laugh

Hey.. I'm not trying to start a trend or anything; people have been saying "underrated" this way my whole life, both locally and online.

I've always found the overanalyzing of language evolution to be somewhat annoying. Imagine someone criticizing the use of "fantastic" to describe a good steak. I wouldn't want to live in that world.

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I got a whole list of pieces that are by my (very unimportant definition) underrated.

But I'll just give three examples:

Liszt wrote a chamber sonata "Duo Sonata" for violin and piano (I believe the S. number is 127), based on themes from Chopin's Mazurka Op. 6 No. 2.

Saint-Saëns's Piano Concerto No. 1 in D major is as fantastic as its successor.

And of course, who could forget? Liszt's transcription of Beethoven's Fourth Symphony. Liszt really makes those fingers work out from this lovely symphony.

I would mention MacDowell, but some people are probably getting tired of me bringing him up, so I'll let it rest for now. But that doesn't mean that I'm going to stop playing his music!


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I believe certain composers and their pieces in the less-played repertoire ought to be re-examined.
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Originally Posted by Mark_C
I agree that the title doesn't exactly exactly indicate what it's about, if we want to be real specific about the exact meaning of words.
Correct.

Originally Posted by Mark_C
But I don't agree that there was anything unclear about what was intended, I consider it broadly within the meaning of the word, and it looks like the replies 'got it.'
I don't think anyone said what was intended was unclear.

Originally Posted by Mark_C
And in fact, I can't think of a better single word to capture what was intended.
I think under performed is better. OTOH there's no need to use a single word. "Wonderful under performed works" is what this thread is about if one wants to be precise.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 04/13/21 05:48 PM.
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think under performed is better. OTOH there's no need to use a single word. "Wonderful under performed works" is what this thread is about if one wants to be precise.

I don't think so. I don't think that would capture it.

As I saw it, and as I think the replies seem generally to have taken it, it's not just "under-performed" but also (something like) "not recognized by that many people as being so great, and also not even known of to the extent that I think it deserves to be."

And, really, I can't think of a better one-word capture of it than how it was expressed here.

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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think under performed is better. OTOH there's no need to use a single word. "Wonderful under performed works" is what this thread is about if one wants to be precise.

I don't think so. I don't think that would capture it.

As I saw it, and as I think the replies seem generally to have taken it, it's not just "under-performed" but also (something like) "not recognized by that many people as being so great, and also not even known of to the extent that I think it deserves to be."

And, really, I can't think of a better one-word capture of it than how it was expressed here.
The OP didn't use one word so that's not an issue. The title of the thread used two adjective, wonderful and underrated. So the most precise title is wonderful underperformed works which is what most people thought of when they read the name of the post.

It would be interesting to have a thread about wonderful underrated works(in the sense of most people not rating them high enough). It might attract some of the Liszt or Macdowell super fans.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 04/13/21 06:08 PM.
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think under performed is better. OTOH there's no need to use a single word. "Wonderful under performed works" is what this thread is about if one wants to be precise.

I don't think so. I don't think that would capture it.

As I saw it, and as I think the replies seem generally to have taken it, it's not just "under-performed" but also (something like) "not recognized by that many people as being so great, and also not even known of to the extent that I think it deserves to be."

And, really, I can't think of a better one-word capture of it than how it was expressed here.
The OP didn't use one word so that's not an issue. The title of the thread used two adjective, wonderful and underrated. So the most precise title is wonderful underperformed works which is what most people thought of when they read the name of the post.

It would be interesting to have a thread about wonderful underrated works(in the sense of most people not rating them high enough). It might attract some of the Liszt or Macdowell super fans.


If you don’t think this thread elicited great choices, why don’t you start your own thread....but be careful to label it to only elicit the answers you want to see. 🙄


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
"I never dreamt with my own two hands I could touch the sky" - Sappho

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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
It would be interesting to have a thread about wonderful underrated works(in the sense of most people not rating them high enough). It might attract some of the Liszt or Macdowell super fans.

I do think this is what this thread is about though.

Specifically in the case of classical music, when a piece of music is largely underplayed for decades or centuries, it is IMO because history has organically deemed it to be unworthy of serious recognition within the classical music subculture. History itself is the judge, with which one is free to disagree. This is why I think these words are so interchangeable in this kind of context.

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Originally Posted by dogperson
If you don’t think this thread elicited great choices, why don’t you start your own thread....but be careful to label it to only elicit the answers you want to see. 🙄
I never said the choice weren't great(including the ones I made).

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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think under performed is better. OTOH there's no need to use a single word. "Wonderful under performed works" is what this thread is about if one wants to be precise.

I don't think so. I don't think that would capture it.

As I saw it, and as I think the replies seem generally to have taken it, it's not just "under-performed" but also (something like) "not recognized by that many people as being so great, and also not even known of to the extent that I think it deserves to be."

And, really, I can't think of a better one-word capture of it than how it was expressed here.
The OP didn't use one word so that's not an issue. The title of the thread used two adjective, wonderful and underrated. So the most precise title is wonderful underperformed works which is what most people thought of when they read the name of the post.

It would be interesting to have a thread about wonderful underrated works(in the sense of most people not rating them high enough). It might attract some of the Liszt or Macdowell super fans.

MacDowell superfans? Hah, I'm pretty sure I'm one of the only ones active who still can consider themselves a superfan of Edward MacDowell's music.

Liszt superfans are not a rarity, but MacDowell superfans are a rarity, because as chopinetto said, history has decided that MacDowell is no longer "good enough".

Even as I try to challenge that narrative, if Andrè Watts couldn't revive his music... who should I be to try to make the case myself?


Pianist-in-training who changes his signature...alot.
YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCApZEtefyPogkULpO9BSMmw

I believe certain composers and their pieces in the less-played repertoire ought to be re-examined.
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Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I think under performed is better. OTOH there's no need to use a single word. "Wonderful under performed works" is what this thread is about if one wants to be precise.

I don't think so. I don't think that would capture it.

As I saw it, and as I think the replies seem generally to have taken it, it's not just "under-performed" but also (something like) "not recognized by that many people as being so great, and also not even known of to the extent that I think it deserves to be."

And, really, I can't think of a better one-word capture of it than how it was expressed here.
The OP didn't use one word so that's not an issue. The title of the thread used two adjective, wonderful and underrated. So the most precise title is wonderful underperformed works which is what most people thought of when they read the name of the post.

It would be interesting to have a thread about wonderful underrated works(in the sense of most people not rating them high enough). It might attract some of the Liszt or Macdowell super fans.


If you don’t think this thread elicited great choices, why don’t you start your own thread....but be careful to label it to only elicit the answers you want to see. 🙄
I don't think Pianoloverus meant any harm. His idea for another thread is distinctly different from this thread.

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I pride myself on being the world's most pedantic pedant (- I don't put up with any panda that walks into a bar and eats shoots and leaves, when it only eats, shoots, and leaves like any panda would), but my sole (not soul) contribution to this thread (apart from this one, of course) is to introduce everyone to a wonderful underrated piece.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/bc/f5/f7/bcf5f7088e111391f0e7ae8273b0c437.jpg


"I don't play accurately - anyone can play accurately - but I play with wonderful expression. As far as the piano is concerned, sentiment is my forte. I keep science for Life."
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Originally Posted by bennevis
I pride myself on being the world's most pedantic pedant (- I don't put up with any panda that walks into a bar and eats shoots and leaves, when it only eats, shoots, and leaves like any panda would), but my sole (not soul) contribution to this thread (apart from this one, of course) is to introduce everyone to a wonderful underrated piece.

https://i.pinimg.com/originals/bc/f5/f7/bcf5f7088e111391f0e7ae8273b0c437.jpg
I'm not quite sure what to make of this poast.

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Originally Posted by Farazissimo
Liszt superfans are not a rarity...
I didn't make myself that clear. I was talking about those who think virtually every piece Liszt wrote is great although the majority of his pieces are almost never played IMO because they are not as good as the popular ones.

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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
The OP didn't use one word so that's not an issue. The title of the thread used two adjectives, wonderful and underrated....

At risk of taking this further down a path of pedantry (if you pardon the alliteration) grin .....he used a single word for that particular thing. "Wonderful" is separate. The kind of refinement or greater 'accuracy' that we might be looking for would only be in place of "underrated." What I meant was a different single-word substitute for underrated -- and I'm suggesting there isn't any better one, just worse ones.

Thank you very much. grin

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Bunte Blatter Op.99



Not necessarily among Schumann's least recorded works...but deserves to be at least Waldszenen level of popularity, surely.

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Originally Posted by chopinetto
Poulenc Novelette... So beautiful.


Novelette #3 is also beautiful





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PianogrNW
Thanks so much for posting novelette #3– it’s going on my ‘must play list’


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
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I don't know why this isn't played more often. Perhaps it is, but I hadn't heard of it until a couple of years ago. I find it hard to believe that this was composed in 1897.

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Originally Posted by johnstaf
I don't know why this isn't played more often. Perhaps it is, but I hadn't heard of it until a couple of years ago. I find it hard to believe that this was
Thanks for posting this piece which I had never heard. Dubal call this work "virtually unknown" in his book The Art of the Piano. For whatever reason, many or even most great pianists play little or no Spanish music. I never realized how great Albeniz is until I heard several separate live performances by Jose Ramos Santana of selections from Iberia in a 300 seat hall at the IKIF in NYC. I think there is something about Albeniz's exotic harmonies that are particularly enhanced in a live performance.

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^^ John, thanks for that. Indeed a lovely work that I haven’t heard before.

Last edited by CyberGene; 04/14/21 11:11 AM.

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