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I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
#3051726 12/01/20 05:08 PM
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I just registered again because I couldn't logon to my old profile. I was on here about 15 years ago seeking buying advice and ended up buying a 1970's Baldwin SF-10. I have now moved from Illinois to California and sold my SF-10 rather than moving it here. I'd really like to have a Steinway B but when looking at asking prices I remember why I ended up with a Baldwin last time. I haven't yet seen any SF-10's for sale here in Southern California, though. These are the pianos I've played that have intrigued me so far:

1. 1995 Steinway B - $50,000 at a Steinway dealer (after negotiation);

2. 2004 Steinway B - $78,900 at a Steinway Gallery - they wouldn't negotiate price;

3. 2012 Steinway B - $84,900 at a Steinway Gallery - I haven't tried to negotiate yet;

4. New Mason and Hamlin BB - $74,500, but I haven't tried to negotiate yet (I think the other M&H dealer said he would order one for around $67,000)

5. New Mason and Hamlin AA - $53,000 (after negotiation);

6. 2018 Mason and Hamlin AA - $46,000 at a M&H dealer (after negotiation);

I know the AA's aren't 7' but the bass was almost as impressive as other 7 footers. I haven't yet decided whether I'm willing to pay this kind of money for a piano, but I'd like to know if anyone has thoughts on how far off any of these prices are. I feel like a really good SF-10 could be had for half these prices or less if one would just appear, right?

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051742 12/01/20 05:53 PM
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Looking on PianoMart for NY Steinway B pianos in the US, less than 20 years old, they range in price from $44k to $95k, depending on age.
There is a listing on there (in California) for a year 2000 SF-10 on there for an almost suspiciously low price, FWIW.


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051746 12/01/20 06:09 PM
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You could try contacting Robert Estrin at https://livingpianos.com/. I think he used to have some rebuilt large Baldwins, although looking at his website now it seems like he sells mostly new pianos. He also sells M&H. I don't know anything about the quality of his rebuilds.

I assume you checked the latest SMP prices for the BB and AA. The BB SMP in satin ebony is 86K and in polished ebony it's 84K. So even the lower offer you got is not 30% off SMP. OTOH I don't know what typical discounts on Masons in your area are.

I am puzzled by the fact that Estrin posts prices for some of the new pianos he sells online. I thought this was either frowned upon on possibly not legal but maybe I'm misinformed.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 12/01/20 06:13 PM.
Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
pianoloverus #3051751 12/01/20 06:29 PM
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Thanks terminaldegree. That SF-10 looks nice for the price, but it is about a 7 1/2 hour drive from me. I might think about going to look if I can't find anything suitable closer to me.

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051756 12/01/20 06:39 PM
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piannoloverus, thanks. Yes, I have looked at the SMP prices. Just wondering if anyone had real world experiences to relate. I hadn't been able to play a new M&H until I moved to CA. I really liked all 3 of the AA's I played. The voicing on the BB I played was too bright for me, but I've only been able to find one to try. The prices for new or almost new M&H are definitely more attractive than Steinway. But it's still a lot of money. Maybe this is a bad way to think about it, but one thing I am considering is that, since none of my children play, they will probably need to sell the piano when I am gone. A Steinway might be easier to sell and fetch a lot more $ in 30+ (hopefully) years.

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051758 12/01/20 06:40 PM
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Do you have a favorite yet? Or top few?

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051773 12/01/20 07:18 PM
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This 2001 B is out very near you. Have you seen this ? He says he's open to a bit of negotiation on the price too.

https://orangecounty.craigslist.org/msg/d/trabuco-canyon-steinway-grand-piano/7216588214.html


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
dhull100 #3051775 12/01/20 07:25 PM
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This list was narrowed down from all of the ones I've played, but I haven't narrowed it down to a favorite one. I also played some new Steinway B's, Steinway D's, a new M&H CC, a new Baldwin 7', a Grotrian, a Petrof, a few Bosendorfers, a new Shigeru Kawai, and a new Yamaha C7X. Sorry I can't remember all of the exact models. Some of those were eliminated because of price. One thing I'd like to do before deciding is try a M&H BB that is voiced to be less bright.

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051776 12/01/20 07:31 PM
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Hi Dave, yes I saw that on CL, and I had thought about contacting him, but I haven't done it yet. I would rather buy from a dealer with a warranty, but if he is willing to negotiate it is worth looking at it. Thanks.

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051786 12/01/20 08:12 PM
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I don't know how much a dealer warranty is worth, especially on a used piano. If that one on Craigslist checks out with a tech, it seems you will be saving at least $10k off any price a dealer would give you, and I doubt a dealer would do $10k of warranty work if needed. If it is a single owner, even better. I'd definitely jump on checking out that Craigslist B, looks like it could be a very nice piano for quite a bargain.


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
Emery Wang #3051888 12/02/20 06:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Emery Wang
...and I doubt a dealer would do $10k of warranty work if needed.
If a dealer gives a warranty and the piano's issue meets the warranty's conditions, he has to do the warranty work irregardless of the cost.

Last edited by pianoloverus; 12/02/20 06:17 AM.
Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3051942 12/02/20 09:42 AM
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HeathH- Welcome Back!

Have you tried an Estonia L225? The price with a bit of negotiation would be quite reasonable and you could just love the singing voice. Best Wishes on your search.


J & J
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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
terminaldegree #3051979 12/02/20 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by terminaldegree
There is a listing on there (in California) for a year 2000 SF-10 on there for an almost suspiciously low price, FWIW.
Actually, $12,500 for a private sale twenty year old SF10 isn't all that unusual. I found a beautiful twenty year old private sale SF10 for our church a few years ago for only $10,000.


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3052010 12/02/20 11:52 AM
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Hi J&J, No, I have not tried the Estonia. I will try to check it out.

Carey, you are probably right. I sold my SF10 last December for $9,000. It was almost 30 years older than that one, but it was still very nice.

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3052193 12/02/20 07:58 PM
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More questions to follow I'm sure. I have an appointment on Saturday at a piano store with a bunch of used Baldwin and Steinway grands and on Sunday to see the 2001 Steinway B on CL.

Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3052589 12/03/20 07:23 PM
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I hope the seller of the B isn’t impacted by the current wildfire. I heard the whole area is under evacuation right now. Damned fires.


-Bill L. - former tuner-technician
Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
pianoloverus #3052597 12/03/20 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Emery Wang
...and I doubt a dealer would do $10k of warranty work if needed.
If a dealer gives a warranty and the piano's issue meets the warranty's conditions, he has to do the warranty work irregardless of the cost.

Sorry, pianoloverus, I disagree with you here...

I don't think you can force a dealer to honor a dealer warranty, if for some reason they choose not to. In fact, it has been my experience that you can't make anyone do anything they do not choose to do willingly.

Yea, you could take legal action and take them to court, but lawyers are very expensive and probably not worth the cost.

However, most reputable dealers would honor their dealer warranty; but any warranty is only a piece of paper unless the dealer is willing to honor it.

Rick


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
Rickster #3052634 12/03/20 08:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Rickster
I don't think you can force a dealer to honor a dealer warranty, if for some reason they choose not to.

A used piano would give a dealer many reasons not to honor an expensive repair, I would think. Exclusions may even be spelled out in the fine print, and I bet it's the expensive items you'd be worried about that are excluded.


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3052669 12/03/20 10:42 PM
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It sounds like it's too bad you didn't keep and ship your SF-10!


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Re: I'm back and looking for another 7' grand
HeathH #3054167 12/07/20 06:20 PM
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I pulled the trigger this morning on the 1995 Steinway B from a local Steinway dealer. The dealer is taking care of a couple of cosmetic things and believes it could be delivered to me shortly before Christmas. This is what I really wanted in 2003 when I bought my SF-10, but I just couldn't get my head around paying (even used) Steinway money then. Since then, even the used ones have only gotten more difficult to reach. I finally decided to just do it while I'm still working with decent income. My musical ability does not justify such an instrument, but hopefully it will inspire me to become better in my old age. I remember being inspired by the SF-10 when I got it home and experienced tonal color I hadn't in the showroom. From the time I have spent with this B so far, I already love it's more mellow tone. I can't wait to hear what it has in store for me. My sincere thanks for all of the advice.

Heath

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