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Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
Duaner #3050702 11/28/20 11:48 PM
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On an upright, I target the top of the pin. On a grand, it is the side closest to the keyboard. It will kindof travel around the pin/bushing area by itself and starve the joint between pin and wood so further application is possible.

I don't have a number (I've never used a tool to measure) - just when the pin moves easily with a short lever and then the pitch doesn't move around. Of course - the string/bearing friction can complicate the situation, especially with older wire.

Ron Koval

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Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
piano411 #3051363 11/30/20 05:28 PM
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Originally Posted by piano411
Again, my point is that crazy glue is not a general maintenance approach to piano technology....


...As long as owners and technicians accept that crazy glue is palliative care, I am fine with its use...
The fact that you use the term "crazy glue" so frequently suggests you come to this discussion with a closed-minded attitude right from the start. Other people are treating it as a tool of the trade - to be used when indicated and used judiciously. There's more than a little disrespect when you use the term "crazy glue", because you're implying that these many highly skilled and experienced techs who use it are crazy for doing so. Have you not considered that you are the outlier and that you have failed to incorporate something into your viewpoint?

Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
ando #3051373 11/30/20 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ando
Originally Posted by piano411
Again, my point is that crazy glue is not a general maintenance approach to piano technology....


...As long as owners and technicians accept that crazy glue is palliative care, I am fine with its use...
The fact that you use the term "crazy glue" so frequently suggests you come to this discussion with a closed-minded attitude right from the start. Other people are treating it as a tool of the trade - to be used when indicated and used judiciously. There's more than a little disrespect when you use the term "crazy glue", because you're implying that these many highly skilled and experienced techs who use it are crazy for doing so. Have you not considered that you are the outlier and that you have failed to incorporate something into your viewpoint?

+1


Jean Poulin

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Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
accordeur #3051378 11/30/20 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by accordeur
+1
+1

Last edited by David Boyce; 11/30/20 06:00 PM.
Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
Duaner #3051385 11/30/20 06:07 PM
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Crazy glue is how that glue was marketed when I started using it. The term stuck. I didn’t market it that way, but I think the intent was that the product was crazy good. Not that people are crazy for using, it like you seem to imply. In any event, its just a word.

As I have state many times before, crazy glue is a part of my approach to piano technology, but under very limited circumstances and conditions. I don’t think it should be used when traditional means of nondestructive methods apply. It is used more often than it should be, because experienced technicians don’t seem to know that there are other ways of properly dealing with the situation.

If piano manufactures ever being recommending using crazy glue on their pianos, instead of using centuries old approach to proper piano maintenance, I’ll reconsider the warning. The warning is based on the fact that once the crazy glue is in there, there is no getting it out and there is a limited amount of times it can be used.

Remember, none of the technicians that advocate the use of crazy glue, told that Baldwin poster that they should even mess around with a crazy glue soaked pin block. Why? Because they know once the glue is in there, the next step is to replace the wood.


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Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
Duaner #3051716 12/01/20 04:33 PM
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Hmm. "limited times it can be used" also applies to larger and longer pins... You seem to consistently ignore the posts relating to the "less is more" approach which allows for documented multiple applications over decades of use.

"Once the glue is in there, then the next step is to replace the wood" - I've not seen any evidence to support this.

Not sure which "Baldwin poster" you are writing about in relation to dealing with a pin block? I don't read all threads, just ones that pique my interest.

Ron Koval

Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
piano411 #3051727 12/01/20 05:14 PM
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Originally Posted by piano411
Crazy glue is how that glue was marketed when I started using it. The term stuck. I didn’t market it that way, but I think the intent was that the product was crazy good. Not that people are crazy for using, it like you seem to imply. In any event, its just a word.

Literally nobody is buying what you just said there. You meant it as a term of derision, and you know it. If you were interested in a mature discussion, you'd call it CA like everybody else.

Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
Duaner #3051743 12/01/20 05:59 PM
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RonTuner, the traditional, time-tested method of longer/bigger pins is intended to get the maximum life out of the pinblock as possible, while also maintaining a new pinblock feel throughout the duration of its use. Depending on how often the piano is tuned, the pinblock can last for centuries using this standard method of maintaining pianos. The use of crazy glue, if we are being optimistic, we are talking about decades. There is a big difference.

Crazy glue changes how the pin feels and responds. There is no realistic way of getting those chemicals out of the wood so that it again responds like bare wood. There are no manufactures that recommend that tuners use crazy glue to tune and work with their pianos. No museum curators that I know of would use crazy glue on their collections. So far, I don't hear concert technicians saying that it is their standard approach on concert instruments.

I'm willing to test your claims that crazy glue can be used over-and-over again. In my experience crazy glue seals the wood. After its first use, its repeated application is unpredictable. There is a point where, it doesn't penetrate. You disagree. So, I'm happy to put your claims to the test and put actual numbers to it.

I'll think about how to do this some more. You don't seem to know what in/lbs you are dealing with. I guess you are using 3-6 drops. You listed what brand you are working with, so I can test that. You seem to put the drops in the same location. I'll have to reread your posts to see what you are claiming.


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Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
RonTuner #3051777 12/01/20 07:54 PM
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+1 to what Ron said.

Last edited by accordeur; 12/01/20 07:58 PM. Reason: +1 waas for Ron. Not the troll.

Jean Poulin

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www.actionpiano.ca
Re: Pins all glued...can they be "re-glued" later?
Duaner #3051817 12/01/20 10:53 PM
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Centuries?

Peter Grey Piano Doctor


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