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joe3701 Offline OP
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So it says that the new Clavinova 700 series has a binaural Bösendorfer Imperial sampled on there, however the AvantGrand N1X and Nu1X say it's only the CFX that is binaurally sampled?? What's up with this? Do you think Yamaha will release an update or new version of the AvantGrand that has the Bösendorfer Imperial binaural samples or no? Is this possible?

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The CLP700 is released after the N1X... it is natural to have some more advanced points on the CLP700 (binaural Bösendorfer, phrasing control by acceleration measures...). The difference can even augment 3 years later with the CLP800 since Yamaha doesn’t seem to change often their hybrids.

What puzzle me is that the N1X didn’t take the UI and functions of the CLP600 which did exist when the N1X was launched.

Last edited by Frédéric L; 11/13/20 02:53 PM.

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Originally Posted by joe3701
What's up with this?

Yamaha couldn't put into the AvantGrands a sample that they didn't yet have.

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joe3701 Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Frédéric L
The CLP700 is released after the N1X... it is natural to have some more advanced points on the CLP700 (binaural Bösendorfer, phrasing control by acceleration measures...). The difference can even augment 3 years later with the CLP800 since Yamaha doesn’t seem to change often their hybrid.

What puzzle me is that the N1X didn’t take the UI and functions of the CLP600 which did exist when the N1X was launched.

In terms of the long term "investment" in possibly purchasing an AvantGrand, it almost makes me wonder if it would be better off to just get a midrange Clavinova 700 series and just trade and upgrade it every few years? I still haven't made a decision. You would think for the price of the N1X, they would make the software/computer aspect of it upgradable so that as soon as new sounds or technology is available you can just insert a new chip or card or firmware. I'm surprised they haven't made this a reality for such an expensive product.

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Originally Posted by clothearednincompo
Originally Posted by joe3701
What's up with this?

Yamaha couldn't put into the AvantGrands a sample that they didn't yet have.

Or could they?

Back to the Future, hello?

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The original AvantGrands also didn't have the CFX sample when they were launched, and those never got updated even though most of Yamaha's line up eventually included them.

I don't think it's realistic to expect to expect tone updates for these DPs, as expensive/premium as they may be. You get what you get.


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Originally Posted by Gombessa
The original AvantGrands also didn't have the CFX sample when they were launched, and those never got updated even though most of Yamaha's line up eventually included them.

I don't think it's realistic to expect to expect tone updates for these DPs, as expensive/premium as they may be. You get what you get.

I'm almost certain 95% of the price of the AvantGrand is the acoustic action. It's really a shame you can't pay to upgrade the CPU part when updated technology comes out. It'll be what...... 7 years before another AvantGrand lineup gets released?

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Originally Posted by joe3701
I'm almost certain 95% of the price of the AvantGrand is the acoustic action.

I'm almost certain that 50% of the price is profit. But I'm willing to believe that 95% of the other half is the acoustic action ...


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Originally Posted by QuasiUnaFantasia
Originally Posted by joe3701
I'm almost certain 95% of the price of the AvantGrand is the acoustic action.

I'm almost certain that 50% of the price is profit. But I'm willing to believe that 95% of the other half is the acoustic action ...

That's what I meant to say! Ha! I agree!

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There isn’t enough concurrency to make incentives for Yamaha to upgrade its models. Then you will keep its non binaural Bösendorfer.

When there will be enough concurrency (Kawai NV10, NV11... Casio RGP for Real Grand Piano...), perhaps Yamaha will make a move.

Note : the Yamaha Montage was sold without Bösendorfer, and it was added afterward, but the Montage had already a flash ram to store it.


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Business economics don't work this way ...
Originally Posted by joe3701
I'm almost certain 95% of the price of the AvantGrand is the acoustic action.
The selling price need not be the cost of parts, labor, shipping, inventory, and overheads ... plus a markup for every party involved.
No, there's much more to it. Demand, style, prestige, and competition ... these have a lot to do with the selling price.

Note also that someone here pointed out a full grand action available for under $2000. That's a lot less than 95% of the price of an N1X.

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Originally Posted by Frédéric L
... concurrency ...

Competition?


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Originally Posted by QuasiUnaFantasia
Originally Posted by Frédéric L
... concurrency ...

Competition?
Yes, competition. Sorry, the nearest phonetic word of my french « concurrence » was not relevant.

Last edited by Frédéric L; 11/13/20 04:28 PM.

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Originally Posted by QuasiUnaFantasia
Originally Posted by Frédéric L
... concurrency ...

Competition?

Dereliction?

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Currency!

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Are my English word mistakes reaching a critical mass ?


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Originally Posted by joe3701
I'm almost certain 95% of the price of the AvantGrand is the acoustic action. It's really a shame you can't pay to upgrade the CPU part when updated technology comes out. It'll be what...... 7 years before another AvantGrand lineup gets released?
7 years if we’re lucky. The N1X only came out a decade after the N1.


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Will the N2X be released in the next year or two?

Last edited by Burkey; 11/13/20 10:39 PM.

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Originally Posted by Burkey
Will the N2X be released in the next year or two?


N2 is the neglected middle child among the AvantGrands--and my personal favorite. I hate watching it die a slow death due to neglect.

If, and this is a very big if, Yamaha decides to update it in the "middle" of the AvantGrand refresh cycle, then it will likely get the latest voices.

Waiting for an updated N2 has been the perfect setup for disappointment for many people.

Last edited by redfish1901; 11/13/20 10:55 PM.
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Probably unlikely as the only aspect to change would be the sound engine and perhaps speakers, so unless they plan on doing that every Clavinova cycle there’s not much reason to (unless they need to boost sales due to 2020).

I emailed Yamaha UK last week to ask if the N1X would get any updates for the new binaural Bösendorfer voice and was told:

Quote
We are very sorry but we are not aware of any sample changes for the N1X at this time.

Last edited by OldTinho; 11/13/20 11:01 PM.

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