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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
Chernobieff Piano #3040804 10/29/20 06:28 PM
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Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
I'm finding that the Mason and Hamlin AA (one of my favorites) has a serious flaw. There are not enough bolts to support the pinblock in the field. And the pinblock goes quite far in front of the pins unsupported. With the flange cast at a steep angle, the strings pull the pinblock down and cause the pins to hit the front of the hole. I was able to fix this by adding 6 more screws closer to the agraffes.
-chris
Your post makes it sound like this is a flaw in Masons of today . Only some posts later do you say that this is for a Mason over 100 years old!

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
pianoloverus #3040888 10/30/20 12:06 AM
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Originally Posted by pianoloverus
Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
I'm finding that the Mason and Hamlin AA (one of my favorites) has a serious flaw. There are not enough bolts to support the pinblock in the field. And the pinblock goes quite far in front of the pins unsupported. With the flange cast at a steep angle, the strings pull the pinblock down and cause the pins to hit the front of the hole. I was able to fix this by adding 6 more screws closer to the agraffes.
-chris
Your post makes it sound like this is a flaw in Masons of today . Only some posts later do you say that this is for a Mason over 100 years old!

Has this been noted in any recent production of M & H? If not, I find this post quite strange as surely this problem has been fixed in 120 years. Since it did not have a resonator, it was made prior to 1900.


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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
Chernobieff Piano #3040962 10/30/20 07:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
I'm finding that the Mason and Hamlin AA (one of my favorites) has a serious flaw. There are not enough bolts to support the pinblock in the field. And the pinblock goes quite far in front of the pins unsupported. With the flange cast at a steep angle, the strings pull the pinblock down and cause the pins to hit the front of the hole. I was able to fix this by adding 6 more screws closer to the agraffes.
-chris

You're a clever technician

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041211 10/30/20 09:54 PM
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So I went to try out the piano.
I thought it was probably in a good shape - the keys seem to respond pretty well and action felt even and fairly good. It produced nice sound and felt like a newer piano.

But the piano was not in its best shape to fully appreciate what it can do. So I am a bit unsure now.
The piano was out of tune and what I felt was that it was nice but nothing really special. I tried a couple of pianos that just gave me a real special beautiful rich tone and this one was definitely not one of those pianos.

But then I am not sure if it is just not prepared well enough to show what it can really do. The seller is still working to receive the report of the repairs/work. But the seller said it was done with all authentic Steinway parts and there is a kind of signed seal to show the approval from Steinway. I am debating whether I want to go back and try it one more time to see how I feel about it. The owner said the piano hasn't been tuned during the past few years.

On the other hand, I went to a store and tried a Seiler that was really impressive. It is tad bit larger than what I am hoping for (6'2") and it was Indonesia-made so the price was very good, too. This one had a really beautiful tone and I enjoyed playing it a lot. I also tried a Germany-made Seiler (7"?) which made glorious sounds too. I have zero experience or knowledge of Seiler pianos but they were both very very nice. And these were new pianos (I think) and the store owner is willing to discount the 6'2" one to match my budget ($20K). I guess I probably should start a new thread for asking this question, but what are these pianos like?

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
GC13 #3041212 10/30/20 09:57 PM
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Originally Posted by GC13
Based on what I've seen, $26k for a Steinway M that has been refurbished well is not a bad deal. Yes, you can find used very nice M&H's, Baldiwn's, etc. at a better price point, but a Steinway does usually bring more money just because of the name. Just make sure it checks out!

Thanks. It seems like the seller may be willing to negotiate the price a bit more too. I am not sure the exact amount, but he suggested that he can make it to lower 20K - maybe 22K? It seems like the family's children used to play the piano and they haven't done so for a few years and now they are thinking it is time to get rid of it.

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041226 10/30/20 11:33 PM
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We’re not talking about grandma’s old spinet here. We’re talking a $20K+ piano. For the kind of money the seller is asking, I’d expect them to have the piano tuned for those considering the purchase. I’d tell the seller straight-up, “You're asking $26,000 for this piano but you won’t put $200 into it so it’ll sound it’s best for those considering buying it?”

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
jakedaniel #3041231 10/31/20 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by jakedaniel
We’re not talking about grandma’s old spinet here. We’re talking a $20K+ piano. For the kind of money the seller is asking, I’d expect them to have the piano tuned for those considering the purchase. I’d tell the seller straight-up, “You're asking $26,000 for this piano but you won’t put $200 into it so it’ll sound it’s best for those considering buying it?”

Exactly!

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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041237 10/31/20 12:56 AM
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A piano discounted to $20,000 that you don’t love still costs you $20,000 snd you may never love it. Don’t try to talk yourself into it because it MAY be a good deal, or because it is a Steinway. Keep moving.


"Music, rich, full of feeling, not soulless, is like a crystal on which the sun falls and brings forth from it a whole rainbow" - F. Chopin
"I never dreamt with my own two hands I could touch the sky" - Sappho

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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
jakedaniel #3041272 10/31/20 06:50 AM
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Originally Posted by jakedaniel
We’re not talking about grandma’s old spinet here. We’re talking a $20K+ piano. For the kind of money the seller is asking, I’d expect them to have the piano tuned for those considering the purchase. I’d tell the seller straight-up, “You're asking $26,000 for this piano but you won’t put $200 into it so it’ll sound it’s best for those considering buying it?”

Took the words out of my mouth!

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
violarules #3041293 10/31/20 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by violarules
Originally Posted by jakedaniel
We’re not talking about grandma’s old spinet here. We’re talking a $20K+ piano. For the kind of money the seller is asking, I’d expect them to have the piano tuned for those considering the purchase. I’d tell the seller straight-up, “You're asking $26,000 for this piano but you won’t put $200 into it so it’ll sound it’s best for those considering buying it?”

Took the words out of my mouth!

We're all thinking the same thing. Calenadariel, the Steinway may be a really sweet piano and you may be able to get a real deal on it if you want a Steinway, but you may need to check in to having an independent technician inspect it for you. You also want to make sure you have a concert-level technician check it out. You might be able to talk the seller into investing in good tuning and some voicing/regulation to see what the potential of it is. It just depends on how much you're willing to pursue it and what the seller is willing to do.

On the other hand as other's have said, there are many excellent, comparable pianos by other manufacturer's that don't command the higher price tag that a Steinway does. In my experience, I've noticed that the price of used Steinway core pianos (it needs a complete rebuild) can often be has high has the used value of comparable Baldwin, M&H, Yamaha, & Kawai models that are in excellent condition. That's one reason why a Steinway has a higher value. It can bring more money when they have been rebuilt expert technicians.

Last edited by GC13; 10/31/20 08:06 AM.
Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041353 10/31/20 12:04 PM
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Pass.

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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041354 10/31/20 12:08 PM
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Originally Posted by calenadariel
But then I am not sure if it is just not prepared well enough to show what it can really do. The seller is still working to receive the report of the repairs/work. But the seller said it was done with all authentic Steinway parts and there is a kind of signed seal to show the approval from Steinway. I am debating whether I want to go back and try it one more time to see how I feel about it. The owner said the piano hasn't been tuned during the past few years.

On the other hand, I went to a store and tried a Seiler that was really impressive. It is tad bit larger than what I am hoping for (6'2") and it was Indonesia-made so the price was very good, too. This one had a really beautiful tone and I enjoyed playing it a lot. I also tried a Germany-made Seiler (7"?) which made glorious sounds too. I have zero experience or knowledge of Seiler pianos but they were both very very nice. And these were new pianos (I think) and the store owner is willing to discount the 6'2" one to match my budget ($20K). I guess I probably should start a new thread for asking this question, but what are these pianos like?

Sounds like that's not your Steinway.
Here's the brand profile and US market pricing information for Seiler:
https://www.pianobuyer.com/brand/seiler/


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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
terminaldegree #3041358 10/31/20 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by terminaldegree
Originally Posted by calenadariel
But then I am not sure if it is just not prepared well enough to show what it can really do. The seller is still working to receive the report of the repairs/work. But the seller said it was done with all authentic Steinway parts and there is a kind of signed seal to show the approval from Steinway. I am debating whether I want to go back and try it one more time to see how I feel about it. The owner said the piano hasn't been tuned during the past few years.

On the other hand, I went to a store and tried a Seiler that was really impressive. It is tad bit larger than what I am hoping for (6'2") and it was Indonesia-made so the price was very good, too. This one had a really beautiful tone and I enjoyed playing it a lot. I also tried a Germany-made Seiler (7"?) which made glorious sounds too. I have zero experience or knowledge of Seiler pianos but they were both very very nice. And these were new pianos (I think) and the store owner is willing to discount the 6'2" one to match my budget ($20K). I guess I probably should start a new thread for asking this question, but what are these pianos like?

Sounds like that's not your Steinway.

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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
BruceD #3041359 10/31/20 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by BruceD
Originally Posted by jakedaniel
We’re not talking about grandma’s old spinet here. We’re talking a $20K+ piano. For the kind of money the seller is asking, I’d expect them to have the piano tuned for those considering the purchase. I’d tell the seller straight-up, “You're asking $26,000 for this piano but you won’t put $200 into it so it’ll sound it’s best for those considering buying it?”

Exactly!

+1


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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041370 10/31/20 12:41 PM
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A buyer can't reasonably be expected to guess how an out-of-tune piano will sound after it is tuned.

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
johnstaf #3041378 10/31/20 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by johnstaf
A buyer can't reasonably be expected to guess how an out-of-tune piano will sound after it is tuned.

Yes, or if it will even hold a tune!


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Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041593 11/01/20 12:18 AM
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Thanks for the candid and cool-headed advice. This really helped me to see the situation without getting strangely emotional about the process.
I think I will pass on this Steinway and keep searching. I actually have tried a few more pianos this week and I found a few pianos that really feel great and sound wonderful. So I don't feel like I need to settle or force myself to consider this option.

Re: Steinway Model M concerns?
calenadariel #3041680 11/01/20 07:40 AM
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Originally Posted by calenadariel
Thanks for the candid and cool-headed advice. This really helped me to see the situation without getting strangely emotional about the process.
I think I will pass on this Steinway and keep searching. I actually have tried a few more pianos this week and I found a few pianos that really feel great and sound wonderful. So I don't feel like I need to settle or force myself to consider this option.

Good move! Shopping around and considering all your options is the key. That will always settle the issue in the heart and mind.

The name Steinway always grabs attention because of their brand recognition and the inexperienced buyer always expects a Cadillac of a piano, however, there are plenty of them out there that have not been maintained properly. Sellers often think the piano should demand top "Steinway" dollar, just because it's a Steinway without being willing to invest in the work to bring it up to that level. But I guess this can actually be said of any piano make from one end of the spectrum to the other.

Keep us posted on how your search is going.

Last edited by GC13; 11/01/20 07:44 AM.
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