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Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #2859342 06/16/19 07:24 PM
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Thanks for the update TylerMorgan1, I'm glad to read that the replacement instrument is working correctly.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.
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Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
Kawai James #2859391 06/16/19 10:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Kawai James
Thanks for the update TylerMorgan1, I'm glad to read that the replacement instrument is working correctly.

Kind regards,
James
x


Hey James, thanks for your input to this thread and all the others. Your comments really helped convince me that a Kawai was a good choice, and I’m having a ton of fun with my MP11SE. It’s such a solid instrument, and it’s awesome to know that the people that work at Kawai are passionate enough to have a presence on a site such as this. Thanks again!

Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #2859395 06/16/19 10:54 PM
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Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.
Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #3033809 10/09/20 11:26 AM
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Now, how about V2 of this topic?!

I just got a brand new MP11SE myself, and I seem to have my own version with the static; when I'm playing a note!

I'd been noticing that something had been off with the sound of the MP11SE. I'd been playing with headphones and noticed that there seemed to be some static on the headphones (I use headphones exclusively.)

The static is, naturally, most noticeable when both sliders are maxed out; so there being some static isn't completely surprising even if disappointing. The issue is the behavior of the static.

At max volume, the baseline static is *almost* nonexistent; it's difficult to hear. But you can hear it loud and clear when you play a note; and it cuts out pretty abruptly shortly after playing a note. It's a kind of odd sound-ing static too; a bit soft. It sounds a like "pink noise," except slightly "off"in a way hard to describe. The static occurs mostly on the lower pitched notes, and is louder when playing above piano.

At first, I thought it might be a piano effect, or something, so I started testing all the instruments. It occurs on all instruments that can reach sufficiently low enough pitches, including the Marimba/Xylaphone, as well as the EP's. The static sound is the same for all of them, though the loundness depends on the instrument.

I made sure to test with all processing off; Reverb, as well as piano simulations and what not off. No effect. Tried different headphones, no effect. Different power socket, as well as a surge protector with a transformer socket, no effect.

Also, I tried playing with the equalizer, to see if I could isolate the frequency. Couldn't do it, actually. Suppressing the lower pitches altered the sound of the static, making it sound higher pitched, while tried to use a peak shape to isolate the frequency had no real affect aside from distorting the MP11SE sound in general.

Also, since it's associated with lower pitches, it seems to favor the left ear in terms of balance.


I'm not sure what to make of it; my Korg D1 doesn't have this issue, so I wouldn't expect the MP11SE to either. Pink noise sounds like an odd issue to have. Any thoughts?

Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #3033830 10/09/20 12:08 PM
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Is the static you can hear in these two recordings what you hear. I have other recordings from the MP11SE where the static is almost inaudible and a good salesperson could convince me that there was none. But these two recordings make it very clear.

Schumann - Album Leaves

I think it is this recording where it stands out the most.

Schumann Der Dichter Sprichts

These two recordings were done straight to the USB stick on the MP11SE itself.

Last edited by KevinM; 10/09/20 12:10 PM.
Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
KevinM #3033845 10/09/20 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by KevinM
Is the static you can hear in these two recordings what you hear. I have other recordings from the MP11SE where the static is almost inaudible and a good salesperson could convince me that there was none. But these two recordings make it very clear.

Schumann - Album Leaves

I think it is this recording where it stands out the most.

Schumann Der Dichter Sprichts

These two recordings were done straight to the USB stick on the MP11SE itself.
It's similar to that, but less severe. In particular, it really heard much when playing the notes instead of being omnipresent.

You gave me an idea though; I recorded an MP3 directly off the MP11SE, then from my computer played it back on the same headphones using a USB headphone DAC. The noise is still there, but it's much less audible given similar volume levels. This makes me suspect the issue is the internal headphone amp. Sadly, I don't have good quality speakers - or a speaker amp - I can hookup to the MP11SE to test.

My guess is that each instrument has it's own amp or attenuator for each instrument, then other for the main volume line. And then a headphone amp. That's probably where the noise is coming from.

Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #3034140 10/10/20 12:18 PM
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Quick update: I performed two more tests with interesting results:

I plugged the Audio-Out from my Korg D1 into the audio in on the MP11SE, and then listened in using the headphone port on the MP11SE. What happened is this:

When idling, the headphones were quiet. When a note was played, the static noise would suddenly appear. The static would last longer than the note, with only a little decay on the static itself. Then, suddenly, the static would die, as though an amp was switching off. Perhaps in the Line-In amps on the MP11SE only trigger when input is detected? Either way, the strength of the effect was dependent on the master volume slider on the MP11SE. Increasing the Korg D1 output and lowering the volume on the MP11SE created a consistent hiss, but not the transient noise effect, meaning that this is very much product of the MP11SE. Note that the Korg D1's output get's absurdly loud, so at normal listening levels you can't hear any static when using the Korg D1 by itself over headphones.

I outputed the MP11SE to a Berhinger 204HD interface, and used that for amplification instead. At high Master Volume levels, the noise effect while playing was still there, but by lowering the master volume at using the Audio Interface as an amp, the effect went away and the audio quality for the pianos seemed to improve; there seemed to be less muffling on the MP11SE's internal piano sounds. The catch was that the 204HD is kinda a crummy amp, so it introduces a lot of persistent static itself.

I'm curious if the Kawai James would be willing to comment, if it's not too much of a bother. I'm wondering if some of the internal amps on the MP11SE are wired only to run when there's a certain level of input/output? Otherwise, maybe there's some sort of resonance effect in the analogue amp circuits...?

Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #3034202 10/10/20 03:09 PM
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Something I noticed by accident; if you lightly tap the chassis there's a burst of static from the audio-outputs - particularly from the left-hand side of the unit. Vibrations making noise on audio channels isn't special, but this seems to be a bit excessive. I'm wondering if there's a loose connection somewhere internally.

Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
Narroo #3034282 10/10/20 09:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Narroo
Something I noticed by accident; if you lightly tap the chassis there's a burst of static from the audio-outputs - particularly from the left-hand side of the unit. Vibrations making noise on audio channels isn't special, but this seems to be a bit excessive. I'm wondering if there's a loose connection somewhere internally.


You don't have to wonder. That's caused by either a loose contact, or a faulty (vibration-sensitive) component, or a faulty trace or solder-joint on one of the printed-circuit boards.

Not your problem -- Kawai's problem.


. Charles
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PX-350 / microKorg XL+ / Pianoteq
Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
Charles Cohen #3034397 10/11/20 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Charles Cohen
Originally Posted by Narroo
Something I noticed by accident; if you lightly tap the chassis there's a burst of static from the audio-outputs - particularly from the left-hand side of the unit. Vibrations making noise on audio channels isn't special, but this seems to be a bit excessive. I'm wondering if there's a loose connection somewhere internally.


You don't have to wonder. That's caused by either a loose contact, or a faulty (vibration-sensitive) component, or a faulty trace or solder-joint on one of the printed-circuit boards.

Not your problem -- Kawai's problem.
Knew it!

I thought I was going crazy. I'd bought this to replace a Korg D1, which cost me $500 new, and this was 5x the price. I couldn't put my finger on it, but the piano sounds seemed to be worse on the $2,500 instrument, but I couldn't immediately articulate why. After some investigating I began notice all this weird noise behavior, which didn't seem right.

I sent an email to Kawai support the other day. Let's see what they say. Hopefully this isn't due to them rushing units out to satisfy high COVID demand.

Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
TylerMorgan1 #3034437 10/11/20 10:28 AM
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I had static on my new Yamaha PSR7000. A replacement headphone socket sorted the issue.


Instruments: Current - Kawai MP7SE; Past - Kawai MP7, Yamaha PSR7000
Software: Sibelius 7; Neuratron Photoscore Pro 8
Stand: K&M 18953 Table-style Stage Piano Stand
Re: Kawai MP11SE Headphone Static?
Narroo #3034679 10/12/20 01:23 AM
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Hello Narroo,

Originally Posted by Narroo
I sent an email to Kawai support the other day. Let's see what they say.

I can confirm that we received your message (via the Kawai Global website).

This message will be forwarded to Kawai America, who will investigate this matter.

Kind regards,
James
x


Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 & occasional rare groove player.
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