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Re: Duplex Scale
Ed McMorrow, RPT #3014407 08/15/20 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Ed McMorrow, RPT
BDB, When I showed a piano with my FTDS technology at a Piano Technicians Convention; Ed Sutton, the Technical Editor of the PTG Journal took one look at it and said, "Now that is something new!"

Mr. Sutton is on record in earlier commentary published in the Journal of having a very dim view of recent piano patents.
That reminds me of what one of my friends told me that Roger Sessions would say to the composer when he heard a premiere that he did not think much of: "Well, you've done it again!"


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Re: Duplex Scale
Ed McMorrow, RPT #3014408 08/15/20 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Ed McMorrow, RPT
I will enforce my patent rights.
I suspect you will not have to. Some things just are not worth stealing.


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Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3014409 08/15/20 11:13 PM
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McMorrow,I simply asked for a description of what IS the invention. As it looks to me to be Steinways invention.

But if you feel the need to provide a person attack instead of a description. Then I can only conclude one thing....
-chris


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Re: Duplex Scale
Chernobieff Piano #3014449 08/16/20 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by Chernobieff Piano
McMorrow,I simply asked for a description of what IS the invention. As it looks to me to be Steinways invention.

But if you feel the need to provide a person attack instead of a description. Then I can only conclude one thing....
-chris
This stuff is par for the course on the technician's forum, but surely you can show a little restraint and decorum in this section of the forum. It's quite off-putting to see all the carping, professional rivalries and insults and personal slurs. Nobody's buying it - even if you insist that it's a fact-finding mission.

Re: Duplex Scale
BDB #3014516 08/16/20 10:03 AM
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I think BDB is off his meds again. His snarkmeter has been pegging for several days now.


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Re: Duplex Scale
Chernobieff Piano #3014530 08/16/20 10:40 AM
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Chris the Patent examiner disagrees with you. He is paid to find ways to disagree with me. Again, if you can't read any differences then I subject you can't comprehend text well and/or can't understand how transverse and longitudinal modes in piano strings couple.


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Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3014534 08/16/20 10:49 AM
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Ando,
I asked a simple question. What is the invention? Maybe you can help?

Also Ando, can you explain how the McMorrow Duplex controls the production of heterodynes? And does polytetrafluorethylene behave as a
Fessenden mixer?

Thank You,
-chris


Chernobieff Piano Restorations
"Where Tone is Key"
Lenoir City, Tennessee U.S.A
www.chernobieffpiano.com
grandpianoman@protonmail.com
Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3014539 08/16/20 10:57 AM
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Quote
Chris, Again, if you can't read any differences then I subject you can't comprehend text well and/or can't understand how transverse and longitudinal modes in piano strings couple.

McMorrow,
I've generously given you ample opportunity to explain your invention. Instead you chose to insult my comprehension abilities. Is that your idea of self promotion? To knock down others?
-chris

Last edited by Chernobieff Piano; 08/16/20 10:59 AM.

Chernobieff Piano Restorations
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Re: Duplex Scale
BDB #3014752 08/16/20 11:23 PM
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Originally Posted by BDB
Originally Posted by Ed McMorrow, RPT
BDB, When I showed a piano with my FTDS technology at a Piano Technicians Convention; Ed Sutton, the Technical Editor of the PTG Journal took one look at it and said, "Now that is something new!"

Mr. Sutton is on record in earlier commentary published in the Journal of having a very dim view of recent piano patents.
That reminds me of what one of my friends told me that Roger Sessions would say to the composer when he heard a premiere that he did not think much of: "Well, you've done it again!"

My brother once had to make a speech from the visitors ata lodge he attended. One is expected to say something about the food. At that particular place it was really bad so Bob said: "The food was (longish pause)......... what we have come to expect".


Currently working towards "Twinkle twinkle little star"
Re: Duplex Scale
PhilipInChina #3014836 08/17/20 09:23 AM
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As Editor of the Piano Technicians Journal, Mr. Sutton asked me to write an article describing my Fully Tempered Duplex Scale for publication. I did so and it was published.


In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: toneman1@me.com
Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3014895 08/17/20 02:21 PM
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I have read the article once before, and I just read it again. Are you saying that by making the strings longer (for the pivot) and using plastic (for the string rest) is the invention?

I think what is also confusing Ed, is that in the article, you admit that when the Steinway Duplex is done correctly ( the two you came across) is not what is done by the factory today? So no chiming when done correctly, and chiming when made incorrectly as in today. Doesn't this indicate that Theodore had it right and when his instructions are followed no chiming? Thus his invention already took care of the problem you're claiming to solve?
-chris


Chernobieff Piano Restorations
"Where Tone is Key"
Lenoir City, Tennessee U.S.A
www.chernobieffpiano.com
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Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3014997 08/17/20 08:52 PM
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The Steinway Duplex Scale patent of 1872 is #126,848

My Fully Tempered Duplex Scale is #9,117,421

When the duplex string segment from the capo or agraffe to the string rest in front of the tuning pin is in a whole number relationship,(tuned) as regards speaking length with the struck speaking length, many noises are created. From examining early Steinway pianos with the patented technology, it is obvious they started to detune them right after the first few pianos with the feature. So in my and many others opinion, Theodore was wrong about duplex tuning.

So Chris, do you like duplex scales in pianos? Do you think they "work"?


In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: toneman1@me.com
Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3015015 08/17/20 10:33 PM
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The Steinway patent shows fractions not whole numbers. I believe it was the rear bar that the Steinway company later changed because of ease of manufacture and time.Mason and Hamlin stayed true to the original i think.

I have heard pianos with and without a duplex and both can sound very nice. So i was on the fence until recently. Todd Scott RPT came over and tuned the Duplex on a Baldwin I had in the shop. We used amplified military headphones to compare before and after. Once the rear duplex was tuned in properly, it really increased the sustain. So ever since, i have been studying this a little more in detail when i have time.
-chris


Chernobieff Piano Restorations
"Where Tone is Key"
Lenoir City, Tennessee U.S.A
www.chernobieffpiano.com
grandpianoman@protonmail.com
Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3015137 08/18/20 09:51 AM
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If the front duplex is 1" and the speaking length is 2"; the front duplex is in a whole number relationship with the speaking length.

The rear duplex would be better named an aliquot because it is coupled to a bridge.

Maintaining an "in-tune" relationship with the speaking length of the rear duplex segment is difficult. A change in humidity will shift the relationship.

So Chris what do you make of Theodore's claim that he was "harmonizing" the longitudinal modes and the Transverse modes?


In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: toneman1@me.com
Re: Duplex Scale
Faiz #3015176 08/18/20 11:17 AM
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Ok, I think i get it now. Your saying Steinway had the right idea in establishing the segments into proportions to enhance the sound.
However, although his layout may enhance the sound, it also introduces noises. Your invention focuses on eliminating those noises. Is that correct?
-chris


Chernobieff Piano Restorations
"Where Tone is Key"
Lenoir City, Tennessee U.S.A
www.chernobieffpiano.com
grandpianoman@protonmail.com
Re: Duplex Scale
Chernobieff Piano #3015329 08/18/20 08:11 PM
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The only thing Theodore got correct in the Duplex Scale patent was the importance of the tuning pin end string termination to function as a pivot.


In a seemingly infinite universe-infinite human creativity is-seemingly possible.
According to NASA, 93% of the earth like planets possible in the known universe have yet to be formed.
Contact: toneman1@me.com
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