2017 was our 20th year online!

Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 3 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Shop our online store for music lovers
SEARCH
Piano Forums & Piano World
(ad)
Petrof Pianos
Petrof Pianos
(ad)
Best of Piano Buyer
 Best of Piano Buyer
(ad)
Faust Harrison Pianos
Faust Harrison 100+ Steinway pianos
Who's Online Now
54 members (AlphaBravoCharlie, ebonykawai, Cheeto717, bobrunyan, D959, 3B43, Animisha, 17 invisible), 464 guests, and 314 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad)
Estonia Pianos
Estonia Pianos
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 1 of 2 1 2
Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
#3013522 08/13/20 05:58 PM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Hello Pianoworld, I am a new PW member here.

Last few months I am looking 7 feet grand piano for my living room,
I am not a pianist, but my hobbies is listen music and HiFi, have 2 kids both play piano
for many years, they enjoy music and like to play piano, attended piano competition every year.
They play and practice classical music almost every day - like Baroque, Classic, romantic.

Current I have 2 offers from authorized dealers for below 2 options.

1) Bosendorfer 214VC - made in 2018 - in show room for 10 months Asking 94K USD + Tax

2) NYC Steinway & Sons Model B - 1 year in show room, another Brand New In Box, Same Asking 105k USD + Tax

Kids try few times at the showroom, both piano performances very well. Totally different characters
hard to judge which is better. Borsen has a unique European touch and tone, like singing. NYC SS we are
very familiar with,  they are everywhere on Music hall, stage or teacher studio.

Since it is a big investment in my life, Just wondering do you have any comments for these 2 great
pianos? also wondering current asking price is good or still have space can negotiable,
Bosen 214VC is new model, do you have any comments compare with old 214 or 200, any new design ?

I heard some good comments on Hamburg SS Model B, sadly we don't have any chance to try here.

Thank you for all your comments, have a wonderful day. Cheers

(ad int) Petrof Pianos
Petrof Pianos
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013535 08/13/20 06:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 330
L
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
L
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 330
I can’t speak to the Steinway Model B

However, I have played a Bosendorfer 214VC & thought It Magnificent

The price looks Good, particularly if It’s not a Conservatory Series

If it were Me, & I viewed Them equally, I’d take the 214VC, simply because It’s more rare

I love Rare & Wonderful Things


~Lucubrate


Bösendorfer 280VC
Steingraeber 130

“First say to yourself what you would be; and then do what you have to do.“ ~Epictetus
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013552 08/13/20 07:04 PM
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 447
O
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
O
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 447
Both are exceptionally well crafted pianos, but with that kind of budget I'd strongly suggest that you look at other options as well. Limiting yourself to those two particular pianos in choice would be a mistake, I think.

Make friends with a good technician in your area and browse local offers of other pianos in the same ballpark in terms of size and manufacturer reputation. Lower your ceiling to 80k for a piano and take the remaining money to spare for travel and a technician.

With 80k as a budget I'd probably buy the Vienna Musikverein D 274 (https://www.klavierland.at/unsere-i...9i4-33e8a4f7-6aba-45ed-b7d3-c91761749e6f).

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013553 08/13/20 07:06 PM
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,045
6000 Post Club Member
Offline
6000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 6,045
At that price for the Steinway, which is pretty close to the full tag price, I would insist on being flown to the New York City factory where you could select from several of them with a tech on standby. You may need to wait a while to do this, because of the conditions the country is contending with at this moment.

That’s a decently discounted price for a 214VC (CS version) or a massively discounted price for a regular 214VC.

At this strata of piano, and in that size and price range, you can significantly expand your search field to include many other fine choices both slightly above and slightly below this price range. It’s a matter of how much time you want to spend doing the search...

If it were me, I’d look at everything in the top three groupings of Larry Fine’s Pianobuyer “Map of the Market” as a new or less than 10-year-old used piano, and probably also try some very high end rebuilds.

Also, unless you’re doing a factory selection among three or more of the same model with a tech present, I would definitely not advise buying a piano right out of the box. It’s better to get one from a service oriented dealer who has had it on the floor being frequently tuned and the regulation and voicing touched up, and a few hours of playing time, to work out the kinks and start the break in process.


Pianist, teacher, apprentice technician, internet addict.
Piano Review Editor - Acoustic and Digital Piano Buyer
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Lucubrate #3013555 08/13/20 07:11 PM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by Lucubrate
I can’t speak to the Steinway Model B

However, I have played a Bosendorfer 214VC & thought It Magnificent

The price looks Good, particularly if It’s not a Conservatory Series

If it were Me, & I viewed Them equally, I’d take the 214VC, simply because It’s more rare

I love Rare & Wonderful Things


~Lucubrate


Thanks Lucubrate, great comments, actually 214VC always on my heart for some reason.

Since kids will play piano not me, my boy like S&S Model B, my little princess enjoy on 214VC.
also consider S&S very strong and aggressive marketing here. personal I did't like.
my boy not enjoy on lots of European piano like Fazioli, Bosen, C.Bechstein

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
OE1FEU #3013557 08/13/20 07:24 PM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by OE1FEU
Both are exceptionally well crafted pianos, but with that kind of budget I'd strongly suggest that you look at other options as well. Limiting yourself to those two particular pianos in choice would be a mistake, I think.

Make friends with a good technician in your area and browse local offers of other pianos in the same ballpark in terms of size and manufacturer reputation. Lower your ceiling to 80k for a piano and take the remaining money to spare for travel and a technician.

With 80k as a budget I'd probably buy the Vienna Musikverein D 274 (https://www.klavierland.at/unsere-i...9i4-33e8a4f7-6aba-45ed-b7d3-c91761749e6f).
Thanks OE1FEU for your great comments, make sense
This is our first grand piano, lots of home work need do before make the decision.
That D274 just gorgeous.

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013558 08/13/20 07:30 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 27,934
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 27,934
I strongly recommend not making rarity a reason for selecting a piano as has been suggested. Choose a piano for things like touch, tone, appearance, price.

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
pianoloverus #3013565 08/13/20 07:57 PM
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 424
D
Platinum Subscriber
Full Member
Offline
Platinum Subscriber
Full Member
D
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 424
Originally Posted by pianoloverus
I strongly recommend not making rarity a reason for selecting a piano as has been suggested. Choose a piano for things like touch, tone, appearance, price.
+1
These are very different instruments with designs intended to produce the sound the makers are after. Bösendorfer makes exquisite pianos. For me, I prefer Steinway tonal characteristics for daily use compared to Bösendorfer. This in no way is a slight against Bösendorfer; they are sublime. My point is that it really depends on your preference, as you will have read hundreds of times here.

Last edited by dhull100; 08/13/20 07:57 PM.
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013577 08/13/20 08:50 PM
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 330
L
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
L
Joined: Jun 2020
Posts: 330
Originally Posted by Micromega
Thanks Lucubrate, great comments, actually 214VC always on my heart for some reason.

It’s a Great Piano

Have fun piano shopping

Keep Us posted on whatever You decide!


~Lucubrate


Bösendorfer 280VC
Steingraeber 130

“First say to yourself what you would be; and then do what you have to do.“ ~Epictetus
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013604 08/13/20 10:40 PM
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 142
K
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
K
Joined: Apr 2020
Posts: 142
I personally prefer Bösendorfer for its tone but that’s just me. Even though it’s your children who play the piano, since you are the one making the purchase and eventually be left with whichever ones you end up with once the children grow up and move out, so you should weigh in your preference also. Good luck!

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
K8KT #3013617 08/14/20 12:14 AM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by K8KT
I personally prefer Bösendorfer for its tone but that’s just me. Even though it’s your children who play the piano, since you are the one making the purchase and eventually be left with whichever ones you end up with once the children grow up and move out, so you should weigh in your preference also. Good luck!
Thanks K8KT for your great comment - Yes I may consider to learn play piano now -

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
terminaldegree #3013620 08/14/20 12:27 AM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by terminaldegree
If it were me, I’d look at everything in the top three groupings of Larry Fine’s Pianobuyer “Map of the Market” as a new or less than 10-year-old used piano, and probably also try some very high end rebuilds.

Also, unless you’re doing a factory selection among three or more of the same model with a tech present, I would definitely not advise buying a piano right out of the box. It’s better to get one from a service oriented dealer who has had it on the floor being frequently tuned and the regulation and voicing touched up, and a few hours of playing time, to work out the kinks and start the break in process.

Thanks terminaldegree for you great suggestions and comments - I will definitely check more piano house and local private sale base on Larry Fine’s Pianobuyer “Map of the Market” .

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013740 08/14/20 09:24 AM
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,541
j&j Offline
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,541
I’ve never had the opportunity to play a brand new SS B but I agree with your little Princess that the Bosendorfer 214VC is sublime. I think the price on the Bosie seems significantly better but that probably shouldn’t weigh too much on the final selection. I must say your children are incredibly blessed to have such a supportive parent. Best Wishes on your search.


J & J
Estonia L190 Hidden Beauty
Casio Privia PX-330
Life is too short to not have a great piano.
[Linked Image]
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013845 08/14/20 02:39 PM
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,527
S
3000 Post Club Member
Offline
3000 Post Club Member
S
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 3,527
This is an interesting situation and I've been enjoying popcorn while reading. We have a parent who doesn't play piano, but apparently is willing to invest a considerable sum in his two children who do play, considering two high end seven foot pianos and asking our advice on what to buy. The options are a NY Steinway B or Bosendorfer 214VC. It's a post guaranteed to get attention on this forum.

My thoughts on this may be a little tongue in cheek. If the children are younger, buy the Steinway B. The kids are younger so they won't care which one you get after the first week. To your friends and family Steinway is the best. Americans know Steinway and maybe Yamaha, but they've heard Steinway is the best. If you buy the Steinway then you've bought the best as far as anyone not a piano player knows (and many pianists think S&S is the best too). That's the way to be a good Dad.

If the kids are older and therefore more advanced the Bosendorfer may be worth considering. I've played a 214VC, it was a wonderfully expressive instrument. I've also played a number of new Steinway Bs and they varied. None was a spectacular instrument, but they were mostly good and serviceable instruments with one exception. That one had weak bass and was destined to be sold for a future as furniture. I have played S&S Bs that were wonderful instruments, they just weren't new.

The problem here is that Dad doesn't play and therefore has to rely on children to make a judgement. The OP hasn't stated the ages of his children, so my advice would be to pick whatever piano the older child selected. That will be an easier sell to the younger sibling. If it was me I probably would buy a Kawai GX2, but since I do play I selected what I wanted when I was in the piano market, though I couldn't afford either of the instruments you are considering.


Steve Chandler
composer/amateur pianist

stevechandler-music.com
http://www.soundcloud.com/pantonality
http://www.youtube.com/pantonality
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
j&j #3013848 08/14/20 02:43 PM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by j&j
I’ve never had the opportunity to play a brand new SS B but I agree with your little Princess that the Bosendorfer 214VC is sublime. I think the price on the Bosie seems significantly better but that probably shouldn’t weigh too much on the final selection. I must say your children are incredibly blessed to have such a supportive parent. Best Wishes on your search.

Thanks j&j for your great comments, Yes like you mentioned my little princess very enjoy on Boise 214VC with Debussy and Bach.
My boy play more focus on Liszt, Chopin and some classic pieces, his teacher has NYC S&S Model B.
Since have 2 kids, boy and girl, the decision will be very hard.
PW is such great place to discuss music and instrument, I will keep share my story on my piano hunting. have a wonderful weekend.

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Steve Chandler #3013931 08/14/20 06:46 PM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by Steve Chandler
My thoughts on this may be a little tongue in cheek. If the children are younger, buy the Steinway B. The kids are younger so they won't care which one you get after the first week. To your friends and family Steinway is the best. Americans know Steinway and maybe Yamaha, but they've heard Steinway is the best. If you buy the Steinway then you've bought the best as far as anyone not a piano player knows (and many pianists think S&S is the best too). That's the way to be a good Dad.

If the kids are older and therefore more advanced the Bosendorfer may be worth considering. I've played a 214VC, it was a wonderfully expressive instrument. I've also played a number of new Steinway Bs and they varied. None was a spectacular instrument, but they were mostly good and serviceable instruments with one exception. That one had weak bass and was destined to be sold for a future as furniture. I have played S&S Bs that were wonderful instruments, they just weren't new.

The problem here is that Dad doesn't play and therefore has to rely on children to make a judgement. The OP hasn't stated the ages of his children, so my advice would be to pick whatever piano the older child selected. That will be an easier sell to the younger sibling. If it was me I probably would buy a Kawai GX2, but since I do play I selected what I wanted when I was in the piano market, though I couldn't afford either of the instruments you are considering.

Thanks Steve Chandler for your awesome comments and suggestion, very good point and totally agree.
Your experience on Model B - new and used - it is true, we try 4-5 model Bs on difference dealer, they are all varied, some difference is huge.

Yes, since S&S marketing and some program, most kids think S&S piano is the best piano on earth, special in North America here,

We have some positive experience with Kawai, they are great Piano on the marketing. We also looking Shigeru Kawai SK-6 at Kawai dealer,
unfortunately, they don't have this model in show room can try. Since Covid-19, may need waiting 3 months.

Have a good weekend !

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Micromega #3013979 08/14/20 09:29 PM
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 39
S
Full Member
Offline
Full Member
S
Joined: Jun 2019
Posts: 39
pre-covid I traveled a fair amount and stopped by piano stores when could. Lots of fun trying so many instruments.

Agree with others that S&S B vary, while Bosendorfer seem more consistent. Store-to-store, city-to-city. New pianos.

If I had to buy sight-unseen, that would be a key factor. But the last new S&S Model B I played was, simply awesome. That was in February, and I still think about it.... Ahhh... now I'm thinking about it again! What a fantastic instrument.

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
stemPianist #3014026 08/15/20 01:25 AM
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
M
Junior Member
OP Offline
Junior Member
M
Joined: Aug 2020
Posts: 19
Originally Posted by stemPianist
pre-covid I traveled a fair amount and stopped by piano stores when could. Lots of fun trying so many instruments.

Agree with others that S&S B vary, while Bosendorfer seem more consistent. Store-to-store, city-to-city. New pianos.

If I had to buy sight-unseen, that would be a key factor. But the last new S&S Model B I played was, simply awesome. That was in February, and I still think about it.... Ahhh... now I'm thinking about it again! What a fantastic instrument.

Thanks stemPianist for sharing your comments, good news is S&S B have more Pianos in local Piano store you can try - some OK, some So So. still not find spectacular ONE.
Bosie 214VC only has one at store - great tone, no other choice for same model, we try 200, and compare with 214VC, we like the sound from 214VC.

Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
K8KT #3014266 08/15/20 02:37 PM
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 12,167
Platinum Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Offline
Platinum Subscriber
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Joined: May 2001
Posts: 12,167
Originally Posted by K8KT
I personally prefer Bösendorfer for its tone but that’s just me. Even though it’s your children who play the piano, since you are the one making the purchase and eventually be left with whichever ones you end up with once the children grow up and move out, so you should weigh in your preference also. Good luck!

You know this statement brings up a good thought. I have known a lot of young players over the years and, even the very fine players, have their taste change as they mature. This includes their favorite composer, the way they approach playing, their favorite color and snack foods, and yes - their favorite piano.

On the other hand, there is always the element in each of us that likes what we know. I yearn for some of the meals my mother served when I was a child. She was a good cook, but it was not "haute cuisine" and someone else might think the food unremarkable, but it is what I grew up with. (Come to think of it, I feel the same way about a Philly cheesesteak).

Anyway, my 2 cents,


Rich Galassini
Cunningham Piano Co.
Phila., Pa.
(215) 991-0834 direct
rich@cunninghampiano.com
Visit our Online Store
The Science Channel documents our piano restoration
Re: Borsendorfor 214VC NYC Steinway & Sons Model B your comments
Rich Galassini #3014319 08/15/20 05:44 PM
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,355

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
5000 Post Club Member
Offline

Platinum Supporter until Feb 18  2015
5000 Post Club Member
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 5,355
Originally Posted by Rich Galassini
On the other hand, there is always the element in each of us that likes what we know. I yearn for some of the meals my mother served when I was a child. She was a good cook, but it was not "haute cuisine" and someone else might think the food unremarkable, but it is what I grew up with. (Come to think of it, I feel the same way about a Philly cheesesteak).

Anyway, my 2 cents,

This resonates with me in a couple of ways. It's a little tangential, but I'm in an odd mood today.

Next week will mark 3 years since Mrs. Retsacnal passed. That in itself is hard to believe, but cooking is one of the little things I miss. She was an excellent cook--and I enjoyed cooking with her too (of course), of any and all sorts of cuisines--but it's the basic staples that one tends to miss the most. She could make fried rice like nobody's business (I think I've mentioned before that she grew up in Jakarta)! Sadly, we realized after she was gone that her fried rice recipe went with her. To be more specific, there was no recipe...she just made it. I assumed that she had learned it from her mother, but, although my mother-in-law is an excellent cook, she didn't know the recipe, and hers is not the same. I asked around amongst her friends, to see if any of them had it, but none did. That was a little surprising, because often for potluck gatherings, they'd specifically ask her to bring fried rice. Anyway, c'est la vie.

The second way it resonates with me is that when you spend some time abroad, you start to miss the simple things back home, generally food related. For example, you don't miss steak and lobster, but crab cakes. You miss that cheesesteak sandwich, or a burger with fries. Pepperoni pizza! Pulled pork BBQ. The simple stuff that tastes like home. Years ago, when I worked in Switzerland, I can't tell you how many times treking about in Europe with my expat friends, when it was time to eat, we'd start making polite excuses to just go to McDonalds (or the French clone named "Quick"), because when you live there and can eat European food every day, sometimes you just want a cheeseburger. Sometimes on a Saturday, we'd catch the train to Bern, just because there was a bonafide Pizzahut not far from the train station. The French Canadian guys I worked with missed something called Poutine, and when I finally had a chance to try it I could see why! Ironically, reversing the Atlantic crossing, I also miss simple childhood favorites from Germany: Wurst, Wiener Schnitzel, Spätzle and Spezi!


So, where can I get a Philly cheesesteak for 2¢ ? wink



Kindness is the language which the deaf can hear and the blind can see
~Mark Twain
Page 1 of 2 1 2

Moderated by  Ken Knapp, Piano World 

Link Copied to Clipboard
(ad)
Pianoteq
PianoTeq Karsten Collection
(ad)
Piano Life Saver - Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
Download Sheet Music
Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Practice schedule
by Pilotryan - 09/18/20 09:34 AM
Pedal curve?
by MacMacMac - 09/18/20 05:59 AM
achieveable "bucket list" pieces
by Lingyis - 09/18/20 04:05 AM
What are these chords
by ManishP - 09/18/20 03:39 AM
What's Hot!!
News from the Piano World
3,000,000+!
------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums RULES & HELP
-------------------
ADVERTISE on Piano World
Forum Statistics
Forums41
Topics201,691
Posts3,004,131
Members98,581
Most Online15,252
Mar 21st, 2010
Please Support Our Advertisers


Faust Harrison 100+ Steinways

Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver

 Best of Piano Buyer

PianoTeq Bechstein
Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Virtual Sheet Music - Classical Sheet Music Downloads



 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
| Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter |


copyright 1997 - 2020 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission
Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.4