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Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996598 06/29/20 07:26 AM
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CG, why not using WordPress? I never heard about github.

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
pold #2996599 06/29/20 07:37 AM
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Originally Posted by pold
CG, why not using WordPress? I never heard about github.

GutHub is basically a frontend to a Git-based project system and git is version control system, it's used for open-source projects to allow for multiple people to commit source code changes, etc. I decided to use it because it contains the source code I wrote for the Teensy controller that is the main board for my project, it's the one that has a MIDI library and a USB and it's also the one that scans sequentially through the PCB-s that I designed and those PCB-s deal with translating the analog proximity information from the sensors into digital binary signals.

Since people may improve both the software code and the PCB designs, the best way is to have version-control system, so that any change/improvement/fix by any person will be stored and traced into the git log. This is the way open-source projects work. In a static blog such as Wordpress I can put a lot of information but it will be a static one, what I put there and other people won't be able to collaboratively contribute to the project.

Besides GitHub can automatically create GPLv3 open-source licenses for the project.

Last edited by CyberGene; 06/29/20 07:39 AM.

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Currently: Yamaha N1X, DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX
Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996626 06/29/20 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Originally Posted by pold
CG, why not using WordPress? I never heard about github.

GutHub is basically a frontend to a Git-based project system and git is version control system, it's used for open-source projects to allow for multiple people to commit source code changes, etc. I decided to use it because it contains the source code I wrote for the Teensy controller that is the main board for my project, it's the one that has a MIDI library and a USB and it's also the one that scans sequentially through the PCB-s that I designed and those PCB-s deal with translating the analog proximity information from the sensors into digital binary signals.

Since people may improve both the software code and the PCB designs, the best way is to have version-control system, so that any change/improvement/fix by any person will be stored and traced into the git log. This is the way open-source projects work. In a static blog such as Wordpress I can put a lot of information but it will be a static one, what I put there and other people won't be able to collaboratively contribute to the project.

Besides GitHub can automatically create GPLv3 open-source licenses for the project.

nice to know that, thanx

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996686 06/29/20 01:07 PM
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I think what you've achieved is sort of the "Holy Grail" of "digital " pianos.

Bravo!

Perhaps you should patent it and sell it to Kawai?

I'm a saxophonist first. They are "Swiss Cheese Cones," so their "Holy Grail" is to shut them up while practicing. Yamaha makes it's "Silent Brass" mutes for trumpet and other closed system brass instruments.

I'm toying with several methods to achieve this. Any snappy ideas?

- Jeff


"Music Is Inherently Evanescent. Once You Play It, It's Gone In The Air" ~ Eric Dolphy

Selmer Mark VI Tenor Saxophone (1973), Selmer Mark VI Alto Saxophone (1956), Yamaha YSS-62 Soprano Saxophone (1987), Yamaha WX5 Wind Synth (2013), Kawai 11, Casio PX5S, Roland VR-09, Hammond E-112 (1969).
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
Skyscrapersax #2996693 06/29/20 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Skyscrapersax
Perhaps you should patent it and sell it to Kawai?
They have a patented piano like that, the NV10 wink And I own the Yamaha counterpart, the N1X, so the big sharks cannot be challenged by me. But at least it’s a good hobby for handy people smile


My YouTube, My Soundcloud
Currently: Yamaha N1X, DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX
Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996729 06/29/20 03:04 PM
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
Originally Posted by Skyscrapersax
Perhaps you should patent it and sell it to Kawai?
They have a patented piano like that, the NV10 wink And I own the Yamaha counterpart, the N1X, so the big sharks cannot be challenged by me. But at least it’s a good hobby for handy people smile

Yamaha and Kawai definitely not.

M&H or Steingraeber perhaps.

PianoDisc or QRS (Story & Clark), especially the latter, would be very interested too.

I think this project has potential beyond just hobby for handy people (without dismissing that, as many have said, also in response to my earlier comment).

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996738 06/29/20 03:38 PM
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Well, there are many ways to skin a cat, I'm sure anyone looking to get into the field has a number of different techniques to pursue.

Also, prosecuting a patent is one thing, enforcing it and building out a business based on it is an entirely different level of commitment/effort.

For a hobbyist, it makes a ton of sense to publish it and open source the idea and actually advance and enrich the field (and establish prior art in the process).


Yamaha P-85, P-105, CP50, Kawai MP11 || Kawai NV-10
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
Gombessa #2996749 06/29/20 04:05 PM
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Publishing a patent means formulating a set of assertions that none other have applied. I suspect that the DIY here share too much similarities with of AventGrand and Novus that it could be difficult to write such sentences.

A patent is typically written like 1/ An apparatus which has (such little characteristic), 2/ an apparatus like describe by 1/ which has (An other little characteristic)... etc.

The more specific sentences (like 2/) may not protect you enough if the other product is too different (doesn’t share all characteristics). On the other way, the less specific sentences will have more chance to have been already made by a previous system and can’t be protected. This explains the gradation of sentences from the less specific one (1/ a device with a grand piano action which act as a MIDI controller), to more specific ones (2/ a device describe by 2 where the key movement us capture by an optical sensor, 3/ a device describe by 2 where ...)

A patent is interesting if we can describe by word something 1/ which hasn’t been done, 2/ where we have some incentive (a monopoly) too avoid this to be done by others.

Last edited by Frédéric L; 06/29/20 04:12 PM.

Yamaha CLP150, Bechstein Digital Grand, Garritan CFX, Ivory II pianos, Galaxy pianos, EWQL Pianos, Native-Instrument The Definitive Piano Collection, Soniccouture Hammersmith, Truekeys, Pianoteq
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996758 06/29/20 04:22 PM
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Patent is out of the question.

I don’t want to underestimate my own creation and I believe it’s the most complex and interesting thing I’ve ever created (and I doubt I will ever do something as fun and good again) but frankly I haven’t done anything so special or finished. It’s just a niche DIY project which makes it a bit unique but there’s nothing special or innovative in it. I’ve seen hobby projects that are depressingly more complicated in both mechanical and electrical aspect smile With that in mind an open source project is the best thing.


My YouTube, My Soundcloud
Currently: Yamaha N1X, DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX
Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996814 06/29/20 07:41 PM
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Interesting... Any ideas on the sax mute?

What does your creation weigh?

I didn't know that Kawai / Yamaha had similar creations. I own the MP11.


"Music Is Inherently Evanescent. Once You Play It, It's Gone In The Air" ~ Eric Dolphy

Selmer Mark VI Tenor Saxophone (1973), Selmer Mark VI Alto Saxophone (1956), Yamaha YSS-62 Soprano Saxophone (1987), Yamaha WX5 Wind Synth (2013), Kawai 11, Casio PX5S, Roland VR-09, Hammond E-112 (1969).
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996834 06/29/20 08:58 PM
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@CG: glad for your honest and realistic view about your excellent project. Patents and so forth are unrealistic for this case. I'm a biomedical researcher in academia (sensory neurophysiology from intracranial arrays of electrodes), and although sometimes me and my team develop pieces of software and hardware that surpass many commercial solutions, making into a business requires a level of commitmment that is simply not practical. In my field, the current trend is open-source...

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996846 06/29/20 09:45 PM
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A sax mute is a totally different topic.

And it's off-topic for this forum.

Have a look at "electronic wind instruments" with saxophone fingering.

Maybe https://www.akaipro.com/ewi-usb

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996891 06/30/20 12:20 AM
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One more vote for the GitHub repo, mostly because I'm interested in seeing your code smile

Last edited by Chrispy; 06/30/20 12:20 AM.

Now learning: Chopin C# minor Nocturne (posth) and C minor Prelude (big chords), Mozart Sonata in C K. 545
Instruments: Yamaha N1X, Kawai ES110, Roland GO:PIANO
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2996908 06/30/20 02:05 AM
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Originally Posted by CyberGene
They have a patented piano like that, the NV10 wink And I own the Yamaha counterpart, the N1X, so the big sharks cannot be challenged by me. But at least it’s a good hobby for handy people smile

I am convinced they can be challenged by your project, CyberGene, at least technically. Open source can be very powerful, and both in software and hardware there are great projects that surpassed in many ways commercial alternatives. Git/Github is a good choice. I am looking forward to your repository. I could also help with some aspects if needed.


Yamaha P-115 -> Kawai CA-58 -> Kawai K-300 ATX3
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2998481 07/04/20 04:02 AM
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I would also like to add a vote for seeing this on github! I've been checking in every now and again to see if any code is being released. I have some projects in the works and seeing more details on how you've implemented things would be really helpful.

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2998482 07/04/20 04:10 AM
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👍🏻


My YouTube, My Soundcloud
Currently: Yamaha N1X, DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX
Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2998553 07/04/20 08:28 AM
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And I have a question. I guess in part I can answer that from the pictures, but I'd like the full one. Would this project be non-invasive enough to be performed on an actual grand without jeopardizing the needs of the acoustic? I'll bet is much better than the QRS or PianoDisc MIDI strip which they put under the keys..... and I'm thinking of doing it that way, rather than building a separate instrument....

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2998559 07/04/20 08:44 AM
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The only “invasion” to the action are the two long threaded screws (not sure about the English name) that hold the hammer stop rail. They required drilling holes in the wooden rail that holds the whippens:
[Linked Image]

Just two holes on each side, not a big deal but you can avoid even that if you create a cabinet to slide the action inside and the cabinet itself has stop rails for either the hammers or the shanks.

The rectangular aluminum frame that holds the sensors and the PCB-s is held by the existing screws of the hammer base rail, I only removed the washers, so the frame acts as washers:

[Linked Image]


My YouTube, My Soundcloud
Currently: Yamaha N1X, DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX
Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2998586 07/04/20 09:50 AM
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Thanks Cybergene for the quick response and the high resolution pictures! Just FYI, I think the name of the "long screw" is "threaded rod" or less likely "long bolt" (I am not native speaker either, even though I live in the USA).

Everything sounds great, but I have two more questions:

1) if the action is inside the grand and it is used to make sound by hitting the strings, the stop rail is unnecessary, right? In one use case, I just would like to capture the MIDI of an acoustic performance....

2) it looks like there is a lot of electronics in the way of the action, which may be a problem for a technician doing regulation. Since you yourself now are a technician doing regulations :-) can you comment on that? If the amount of electronics is indeed a problem, could be the L-shaped aluminum rail holding all the cards in front of the action be replaced with hinges? Those hinges could be normally kept in position by some short flat aluminum rails at the ends (making the L into triangles), but then they could be "unlocked" and moved when needed? Or is removing the front of the frame with all the cards, when needed, not a big deal anyway?

Thanks,
Davide

Re: CyberGene's DIY hybrid MIDI controller is finally here!
CyberGene #2998595 07/04/20 10:09 AM
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You don’t need the stop rail if you will be using the keyboard inside a working piano with strings.

I don’t have the original piano, only got the action but I believe it would slide inside the piano with no modifications, depending on how high the front panel is for the action to slide beneath.

The entire frame with everything I created can be detached by unscrewing 5 screws total. Two on each side + 1 in the middle. Those are screws that hold the front wooden rail that holds the hammer bases. I haven’t used all the screws though (there are two more on that rail to still hold it when I remove my frame; I don’t want for the wooden rail to become loose). Here’s a picture of the frame with everything:
[Linked Image]

Last edited by CyberGene; 07/04/20 10:10 AM.

My YouTube, My Soundcloud
Currently: Yamaha N1X, DIY hybrid controller -> Garritan CFX
Previously: NU1X, ES7, MP6, CA63, RD-700SX, CDP-100, FP-5, P90, SP-200
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