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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Seeker #2958550 03/19/20 05:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Seeker
Originally Posted by wouter79
My teached offered to switch to online lessons.

But we're currently working on tension issues which IMHO requires physical contact to point out the problem spots at the moment they occur.

I've been able to work successfully through ZOOM on tension issues with students. It can be done if the camera angles are adjusted. No, I cannot adjust a student's hand/arm/body position with physical touch that way, but I can, and have, successfully modeled those things on camera.
[/quote]

Given what it took at this lesson, I'm very sure it won't work with me. Can't speak about others but the tensiion issue is much harder than it may look superficially. For me at this point, it's either cancel the lessons and also stop playing, or continue lessons and playing. At this moment I prefer continue playing.


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958687 03/19/20 06:20 PM
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My teacher offered the alternative of a FaceTime lesson and I declined it- is this the wrong to do☹️

Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Wayne2467 #2958689 03/19/20 06:30 PM
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Originally Posted by Wayne2467
My teacher offered the alternative of a FaceTime lesson and I declined it- is this the wrong to do☹️


I will be trying my first online lesson in a couple of weeks as I only take a lesson every 4 weeks or so. There are so many people losing their jobs and incomes that I would like to continue to support my teacher even though online lessons may not be as beneficial. But I am looking forward to the lesson and maybe it will turn out to be fine. Going online saves me a lot of travel time. I’m trying to stay optimistic.



Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Wayne2467 #2958691 03/19/20 06:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Wayne2467
My teacher offered the alternative of a FaceTime lesson and I declined it- is this the wrong to do☹️


I cancelled my lessons feeling that it wasn't the right thing to do under the circumstances, but I'm trying to help get her set up on Skype.

Yes, I do think it's wrong not to take this as an alternative as I would imagine that for the majority of piano teachers if all their pupils cancelled it may create severe hardship. Personally I'll happily take a reduction in the lesson efficiency and effectiveness and help support my teacher through this time.

If however I felt that cancellation of lessons wouldn't create financial problems for my teacher then I would have no problem cancelling.


I'd be a far better pianist if I spent the time I'm on this forum playing my piano instead.
Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
AndyOnThePiano #2958692 03/19/20 06:37 PM
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Originally Posted by AndyOnThePiano
Originally Posted by Wayne2467
My teacher offered the alternative of a FaceTime lesson and I declined it- is this the wrong to do☹️


I cancelled my lessons feeling that it wasn't the right thing to do under the circumstances, but I'm trying to help get her set up on Skype.

Yes, I do think it's wrong not to take this as an alternative as I would imagine that for the majority of piano teachers if all their pupils cancelled it may create severe hardship. Personally I'll happily take a reduction in the lesson efficiency and effectiveness and help support my teacher through this time.

If however I felt that cancellation of lessons wouldn't create financial problems for my teacher then I would have no problem cancelling.


I’m definitely reconsidering after reading the comments on here- 👍

Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
PianogrlNW #2958694 03/19/20 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted by PianogrlNW
Chrispy, The video you posted is informative but is geared towards teachers and students who will be using online lessons regularly. I do not own an IPad tripod holder and not planning to buy one for the few online lessons.

Can someone please explain where to set up the IPad without the need for additional equipment?



A lot of people use imaginatively positioned music stands. It all depends on what you have to hand, maybe a camera tripod, mic stand or even re-appropriated cardboard boxes and sellotape.

If you google 'skype piano lessons' and then scroll through the images you may see something you can copy. I've even seen an ipod hung over the edge of the piano lid to look down onto the keyboard.


I'd be a far better pianist if I spent the time I'm on this forum playing my piano instead.
Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Wayne2467 #2958697 03/19/20 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Wayne2467
Originally Posted by AndyOnThePiano
Originally Posted by Wayne2467
My teacher offered the alternative of a FaceTime lesson and I declined it- is this the wrong to do☹️


I cancelled my lessons feeling that it wasn't the right thing to do under the circumstances, but I'm trying to help get her set up on Skype.

Yes, I do think it's wrong not to take this as an alternative as I would imagine that for the majority of piano teachers if all their pupils cancelled it may create severe hardship. Personally I'll happily take a reduction in the lesson efficiency and effectiveness and help support my teacher through this time.

If however I felt that cancellation of lessons wouldn't create financial problems for my teacher then I would have no problem cancelling.


I’m definitely reconsidering after reading the comments on here- 👍


Sorry if I came across as a bit 'strident'. I didn't mean to be, but when I re-read it I realised that it could be read that way ....


I'd be a far better pianist if I spent the time I'm on this forum playing my piano instead.
Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958701 03/19/20 07:06 PM
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I had a lesson today by Zoom. My teacher is no tech wizard, but in the last week she's learned how to do it and it worked. Not as good as in person, but a valuable and fun lesson.

Years ago I took some online lessons on organ with a guy who had sophisticated setup with an overhead camera so you could see his keyboard. Our setup today was about as primitive as you can get, but it works just fine.

Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958708 03/19/20 07:56 PM
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If we can do it, we should support our teachers, especially for those really need this income and other sources are lost. It is kinda part of the ‘paying it forward’. I am sure I will cobble together a camera tripod and bits we have at home to make it work. Like PianogrlNW says: saving travel time.


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
jjo #2958774 03/20/20 01:32 AM
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Originally Posted by jjo
Our setup today was about as primitive as you can get, but it works just fine.


I had my first facetime piano lesson yesterday and the set up included a chair, a footstool and some books with a carefully balanced ipad to get the right angle laugh

I have been learning French over skype for the last couple of years so I have become very comfortable with online lessons. Piano online is of course a little different, but I don't think I am losing much by not being in the room with the teacher. If anything I can see there will be a lot less chit chat and more work. And as I said before, the time saved driving to my lesson and finding a parking spot is a nice bonus.

This might also be a good time to start that theory work with my teacher, that I have been putting off, needed for my next grade.


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958775 03/20/20 01:51 AM
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I'm curious to know from people who are doing online lessons and have just a one camera setup (both teacher and student for example). Do you each have the camera looking at the other's keyboard? What do you do if either of you needs to point to something in the music (presumably you could not see this accurately if the camera view was zoomed out to entire keyboard view)? Is it just a matter of swivelling the camera round? And do you both have copies of the notation?

And how do you find the audio works if you both play at the same time? My teacher likes to play along in the treble as you play and it seems like there might be delays which could be disconcerting.


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
scirocco #2958788 03/20/20 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted by scirocco
'm curious to know from people who are doing online lessons and have just a one camera setup (both teacher and student for example). Do you each have the camera looking at the other's keyboard? What do you do if either of you needs to point to something in the music (presumably you could not see this accurately if the camera view was zoomed out to entire keyboard view)? Is it just a matter of swivelling the camera round? And do you both have copies of the notation?

And how do you find the audio works if you both play at the same time? My teacher likes to play along in the treble as you play and it seems like there might be delays which could be disconcerting



I only had the one camera angle so my teacher could view my full keyboard and my hands. I didn't need to see her keyboard, but I am sure if she wanted to show me something specific she could have just swung her camera around. Yes the teacher needed to have the same books I was reading from, but I also sent her pdf copies of a few pages she might not have had (turns out she did).

In my lesson yesterday we did an analysis of a fairly complex piece. We were able to track each others comments/questions by the bar/measure numbers. As an example she would say ''here the notes in this bar make up a diminished chord'', I would be playing the same notes and I could hear her play exactly what I was playing. I believe that Zoom is best for the sound quality, but I was using facetime and that worked well enough that I have no complaints.

One thing, not everyone will find is that their piano and the teacher's piano are in perfect tune. This might be distracting for some.


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958852 03/20/20 09:39 AM
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For my lesson yesterday, I used Zoom on my cellphone and placed the phone towards the right, against the cheek. Teacher used her phone as well in the same position. Seemed to work fine smile


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
scirocco #2958863 03/20/20 10:01 AM
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Originally Posted by scirocco
I'm curious to know from people who are doing online lessons and have just a one camera setup (both teacher and student for example). Do you each have the camera looking at the other's keyboard? What do you do if either of you needs to point to something in the music (presumably you could not see this accurately if the camera view was zoomed out to entire keyboard view)? Is it just a matter of swivelling the camera round? And do you both have copies of the notation?

And how do you find the audio works if you both play at the same time? My teacher likes to play along in the treble as you play and it seems like there might be delays which could be disconcerting.

I prefer to use laptops for online piano since it's easier to get the angle right, but ipads and phones work well too. I ask students to set up the camera off to the side, slightly above the keys so I can see what their hands are doing, and far enough away from the piano if possible so I can also see their upper body and face when I talk to them. I've used a sturdy music stand (the Manhassat ones), small tables that are easy to put away once done, and even propping up on a bunch of thick books to get the height just right. Currently I have a nice cart for audio equipment that hubby added casters to that I can wheel into position when it's time to teach.

I use Zoom for the calls, which I really prefer to Skype. There is a setting in the audio settings of Zoom that each person will have to uncheck the "Automatically adjust microphone" option, but once you do that it will stay that way, so minimal setting up is needed for subsequent lessons. I also allow for an extra 15 minutes between lessons at first so that if we have any technical problems, we can extend the time to compensate.

I pay for Zoom so I get some extra sound options, and it also allows me to have a "waiting room" so that if a student connects early, they don't jump in on another person's lesson accidentally. I let the next person in once the other leaves the meeting. Another neat feature of Zoom is that it allows recording, so a student can go back and rewatch the lesson.

For my part, I do have a two-camera set up, one with the side view described above, and another for overhead which helps if I'm demonstrating lateral rotation and fingering. I also use a separate microphone, but most of the time the microphones on laptops or phones work well enough (especially Apple products, I've noticed).

And yes, we each have a copy of the score. I use file sharing like Dropbox or Google Drive to give students any paperwork I'd normally hand them. They can also scan their theory work and put in the shared folder for me to look over. Every once in a while if I need to point at something in the score, I just take the music and hold it up to the camera.

Let me know if you have any other questions or need advice with your setup!


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
wouter79 #2958904 03/20/20 11:42 AM
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Originally Posted by wouter79

During the lessons, the situation is quite controlled, just you , the teacher and the piano. If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy.


I would strongly advise against this as a form of effective control. It's good to try to limit contact and be aware of what you are doing, but most of us are unaware of how often we touch our faces or how minimal contact with surfaces need to be to transmit the disease.

It may be worth watching something like this to see what we can't see with our own eyes: https://youtu.be/WpL3eKjaxDg


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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958915 03/20/20 12:08 PM
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As for looking at music together, if one of you has the music in question on your computer, you use the Zoom "share" feature so you can both be looking at the music at the same time.

Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Gombessa #2958918 03/20/20 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by wouter79

During the lessons, the situation is quite controlled, just you , the teacher and the piano. If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy.


I would strongly advise against this as a form of effective control. It's good to try to limit contact and be aware of what you are doing, but most of us are unaware of how often we touch our faces or how minimal contact with surfaces need to be to transmit the disease.

It may be worth watching something like this to see what we can't see with our own eyes: https://youtu.be/WpL3eKjaxDg



I think you may have the wrong like there?

Re the original quote above "If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy": That seems pretty obvious, if you are both healthy you would be OK, but that is *assuming* you are healthy and that might not actually be the case.

Clearly having online lessons is safer, if you do have a face to face lesson though you can improve the chances of avoiding infection by other steps as well like:
Wearing face masks (which protects the other person more than yourself),
Leaving the windows open before, during and after the lesson.
Not using the piano (and ideally not going into the piano room) before the lesson and again not until the next morning. This is the easier alternative to sterilising everything.
Trying to avoid both touching any of the surfaces. Any the piano teacher can't avoid touching like perhaps door handles etc. clean both before and after the visit.

All of these things will help, but not entirely eliminate the risk.

Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
gwing #2958919 03/20/20 12:15 PM
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Originally Posted by gwing
Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by wouter79

During the lessons, the situation is quite controlled, just you , the teacher and the piano. If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy.


I would strongly advise against this as a form of effective control. It's good to try to limit contact and be aware of what you are doing, but most of us are unaware of how often we touch our faces or how minimal contact with surfaces need to be to transmit the disease.

It may be worth watching something like this to see what we can't see with our own eyes: https://youtu.be/WpL3eKjaxDg



I think you may have the wrong like there?

Re the original quote above "If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy": That seems pretty obvious, if you are both healthy you would be OK, but that is *assuming* you are healthy and that might not actually be the case.

Clearly having online lessons is safer, if you do have a face to face lesson though you can improve the chances of avoiding infection by other steps as well like:
Wearing face masks (which protects the other person more than yourself),
Leaving the windows open before, during and after the lesson.
Not using the piano (and ideally not going into the piano room) before the lesson and again not until the next morning. This is the easier alternative to sterilising everything.
Trying to avoid both touching any of the surfaces. Any the piano teacher can't avoid touching like perhaps door handles etc. clean both before and after the visit.

All of these things will help, but not entirely eliminate the risk.


I don’t see how not going into the piano room before and after is effective, as the virus can live on plastic and wood for nine days.

Last edited by dogperson; 03/20/20 12:17 PM. Reason: Typo

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Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
dogperson #2958924 03/20/20 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by dogperson
Originally Posted by gwing
Originally Posted by Gombessa
Originally Posted by wouter79

During the lessons, the situation is quite controlled, just you , the teacher and the piano. If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy.


I would strongly advise against this as a form of effective control. It's good to try to limit contact and be aware of what you are doing, but most of us are unaware of how often we touch our faces or how minimal contact with surfaces need to be to transmit the disease.

It may be worth watching something like this to see what we can't see with our own eyes: https://youtu.be/WpL3eKjaxDg



I think you may have the wrong like there?

Re the original quote above "If you don't touch your face during the lesson and wash your hands before and after, it should be ok assuming both are healthy": That seems pretty obvious, if you are both healthy you would be OK, but that is *assuming* you are healthy and that might not actually be the case.

Clearly having online lessons is safer, if you do have a face to face lesson though you can improve the chances of avoiding infection by other steps as well like:
Wearing face masks (which protects the other person more than yourself),
Leaving the windows open before, during and after the lesson.
Not using the piano (and ideally not going into the piano room) before the lesson and again not until the next morning. This is the easier alternative to sterilising everything.
Trying to avoid both touching any of the surfaces. Any the piano teacher can't avoid touching like perhaps door handles etc. clean both before and after the visit.

All of these things will help, but not entirely eliminate the risk.


I don’t see how not going into the piano room before and after is effective, as the virus can live on plastic and wood for nine days.


I had understood 12 hours was pretty safe but I see more information is now available:

"But how long can the new coronavirus linger on surfaces, anyway? The short answer is, we don't know. A new analysis found that the virus can remain viable in the air for up to 3 hours, on copper for up to 4 hours, on cardboard up to 24 hours and on plastic and stainless steel up to 72 hours. This study was originally published in the preprint database medRxiv on March 11, and now a revised version was published March 17 in The New England Journal of Medicine."

That said it isn't a black and white thing - there is no magic interval where suddenly after that time has expired all the viruses will die. As they are exposed on the surfaces (particularly if the windows are open and there is good air circulation) some of the viruses will be dying So even if they haven't all completely died off you will, by not entering the piano room for an interval, have reduced the number of viable viruses and hence the chance of infection.

Last edited by gwing; 03/20/20 12:41 PM.
Re: Anyone cancelled their piano lesson ?
Serge88 #2958940 03/20/20 01:05 PM
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Two of maybe kids started piano lessons through a zoom class right before this. It was a challenge to figure out how to see the keys well. I ended up getting an adjustable laptop stand where the angle and the height adjust and placed the laptop to the side at an angle. The first lesson I kept it far enough away to see their face still which for a kid is less then an adult. It worked ok but it was hard for the teacher to hear them talk so I will try closer. Another teacher gave me the idea to use two devices and turn the sound and microphone off one so there is no interference. I might try that with one to the side for the hands and wrists and one on the stand to make speaking easier and to see the face too.

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